NorbertTheOpinionated

Legends Reborn Event is Diabolical

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Posted (edited)

Wow. Honestly, I have been angry about NCsoft's deceitfulness in the past, but at this point it is downright impressive. My hat is off to NCsoft for the Legends Reborn event in terms of how clever the design of it is. Please don't misunderstand. That doesn't mean I approve of it. I disapprove of it, but I am impressed how they tried to mask a pay to win event as a free to play event.

 

You want these "Resurgence Emblems" for rewards. In order to get Resurgence Emblems, you need to grind either the Unleashed Lord of Inferno boss, which is basically hard mode Lord of Inferno, or you can do Sacred Longui stage 4 and higher.

 

You do get rewards for levels 1-3 Sacred Longui and the regular Lord of Inferno, but you only get rewarded for those as daily quests once per day, AND you don't get Resurgence Emblems. You get a different currency called Legendary Orbs that you can't spend to get the same rewards as the Resurgence Emblems. Basically if you can't do the hard mode Unleashed Lord of Inferno or stage 4 sacred Longui,  you can go pound sand. The problem with that is that there is a huge power gap between stage 3 and stage 4 and a huge power gap between Lord of Inferno and Unleashed Lord of Inferno. For example:

 

Stage 3 Sacred Longui: 7,100,000 HP. 1 min Enrage timer. 1 min=60 seconds 7,100,000 damage require to kill/60 seconds = 118,334 DPS requirement to beat stage 3 Sacred Longui.

 

Stage 4 Sacred Longui: 236,000,000 HP. 3 min enrage timer. 3 min = 180 seconds. 236,000,000 damage required to kill/180 seconds = 1,311,112 DPS required to beat Stage 4 Sacred Longui.

 

For comparison sake, that is a difference of expecting you suddenly be 11 times more powerful to do 1 stage higher. (1,311,112/118,334 = 11.079)

 

As a side note, it also shows that NCsoft is willing to make another player insurmountably more powerful than you if the other player is willing to pay more money than you despite them saying that "no amount of money will give you an unfair competitive advantage over other players." That was an outright lie. (Shown below)

 

What percentage of the player base does 1.3 million DPS? Yes certainly SOME people do, but what %? Think about doing weeklies and F8 pugs and such on average. Most people don't do that much. The top 1 person might... maybe, maybe not, but the rest of them don't. What a joke. Give me a break. 

 

Think about how absurd that is though. Look at the rewards. You need to be able to do 1.3 million DPS so that you can get Resurgence Emblems so that you can buy... Grand Celestial Soul shields 1-3? If you do 1.3 million DPS, you don't need them, so whales don't need it, and everyone else, can't do it. *Facepalm* Who is your target audience for this event?

 

Make no mistake. It isn't about, "How good are you in terms of skill?" The rewards from this event don't flow based on that. It is a gear check. "How good is your gear?" In this game that translates to "How many hours are you willing to grind" or "How much money are you willing to pay to NCsoft?"

 

You CAN do the dungeon as many times per day as you want, but after the 1 time daily rewards, which only reward Legendary orbs, not Resurgence Emblems you only get rewarded for Unleashed Lord and Sacred Longui if you beat stage 4 though. Therefore, the only way to get Resurgence emblems it to basically be able to beat that enrage timer, which means you MUST be able to pull a certain amount of DPS, or you can't have the Resurgence Emblems. Therefore, all the Resurgence Emblem rewards are basically for people of a certain gear level or higher (which is WELL above average). It is a DPS check event where you only get rewarded for your effort if you've got good gear.

 

This is NCsoft trying to trick us again. It is creating a carrot on a stick by making an event with rewards gated behind a gear check, which encourages us to gear up to pass the gear check so we qualify for the rewards, but NCsoft has been using Koldrak to do DPS checks to get a pulse on how powerful the average player is. Then they crafted this event to try to twist our arms into grinding harder, or ideally pay money to meet the gear check. I can almost guarantee you they set the HP and enrage timer DPS requirement such that most people can't make it. So basically "This event is for paying customers," (or players who no-life it) except they don't want to say that. They want to get you to become a paying customer despite their "Truly free" business model claims (They trademarked it!) without realizing their underhandedness. They KNEW most people wouldn't be able to get resurgence coins and they designed it that way on purpose!

 

NCLauncherR_2018-11-23_20-30-28_zpsidlri

 

Blade%20and%20soul%20business%20model_zp

 

Joke is on them though. They think this is going to get me to pay them money or grind hard enough to gear up to meet this standard that they know is way above average based on their tests, but in reality, all it is going to get me to do is ignore this event. Rather than playing more, I will be playing less because of this... Haha. I am going to go watch anime, read manga, play other video games, play magic the gathering, go to church, go to movies, go to conventions, roleplay with friends, hang out with my girlfriend, go on dates, and go to work. There are plenty of other things to do. Make it fun and rewarding, or I'm not doing it. It back-fired on NCsoft. Think otherwise NCsoft? Why are we having to merge those servers? Hmm? Not the company line... the REAL answer - cause people are continuing to leave. Mmm hmm. We are down to 1 server (NA) folks. Honestly it is sad how NCsoft has ruined such a good game with broken promises regarding their business model and offensive monetization that you can see right there. Don't hide behind the developers and say, "It is Korea! We don't have the power." NO! The publisher has the power of monetization, and the monetization is largely why the game is falling apart. That lies squarely on NA. For example, B&S is monetized differently in Asia than in NA. The game itself, at its core, is a wonderful game.

 

Try being more generous (not in terms of money). Try making the game more fun or entertaining instead of trying to squeeze blood from a stone. You DO know what a supply and demand curve is right? The way a supply and demand curve is often depicted as a chart is often wrong I find. In my personal business experience I have found it to be exceedingly exponential. $1 difference in price can make a BIG difference in terms of how many sales you get. You have to lower the requirements/prices or people walk saying, "No sale."

 

Honestly, I bet NCsoft will let B&S go out of business before they try going with their original business model stated above in the screen shot given to us IN WRITING as the initial sales pitch that convinced us to start playing in the first place when the game first came out. Think that was a long time ago? The game is only 3 years old. They have NEVER just opened up their wardrobe and sold whatever outfit you want for say... $10 per outfit. They have NEVER tried that. Ever; in the history of the entire game. They have never actually tried their original business model they told us. It was a lie. WHY?! The outfits don't affect anything, and they are nearly infinitely reproducible! They make the game look better, which encourages other people to play it because they see outfits they like. They cost NCsoft next to nothing to sell them! Why are they so exclusive? You have literally hundreds of outfits. Thousands if you count accessories. They look good too! Make some money! Just sell them!

 

I'd like to say that people don't like "pay to win," but frankly, they do. That is why we have so much of it in all the games (not just NCsoft games). If people stopped paying to win then, they would come up with a different business model. The fact that the game is so pay to win is because YOU PEOPLE (the player base) keep paying for power / to advance. We like to blame NCsoft, but it is largely YOUR fault IF you pay NCsoft money for character advancement, and it will continue until you stop. Businesses sell what you are willing to pay for.

 

I don't pay NCsoft for power. I have paid WELL over double the price of a standard new premium Triple A non-discounted ($59.99) game to Blade and Soul for outfits though. There are plenty of others I would pay NCsoft for right now too, but they won't sell them. Beach Day, Fated Bond, Pure White Seductress, Wildfire, Red Rider, Corporate Climber, Tempting Fate to name a few.

 

A whale event disguised as a free to play event. I will give them credit for their creativeness though. Their trickery is almost impressive. Credit where credit is due. The craftsmanship of it is rather clever. How about this for an idea? Drop the trickery. Customers don't like it. Stop trying to be clever. Just keep the game fun so that we WANT to pour hours and hours into it because it is fun, not because we feel obligated to (that is a negative emotional feel), and offer good products for a good prices. Do you know how to make a game fun? If not, go hire someone who does. Maybe go hire some people from Nintendo or something.

Edited by NorbertTheOpinionated

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Thats why BnS is dieing.

- About 1 year after release first servermerge from formely 12 EU to 6 EU servers

- Another year later the second merge with 3 server remaining

- Another year later the third merge wit 1 remaining server

Do the math when they will shut down the last server ;)

 

And NC Soft wonders why players keep quitting. I came back after a break for about 4 month and found some fun to play again, but this event made me think about to finaly quit the game and never come back. 

I personaly dont mind that i might not get octa gems or tt soulshields, but i want that wings and even with full VT Gear im not able to get Stage 4 below 40% with this timer.

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IS a good point of view Norbert. the games are falling apart faster than I thought. Jonathan and Linxy left the game, the Heaven's Mandate & Cold Storage Antique Items joke in which we lost a lot of gold. the junk event we have now only for whales, now the Server Consolidation because the number of players is declining, today 5 min to find party for NS. I think that the people who are in charge of keeping the game alive are no longer up to what the players expect. Signal that they are just sitting laughing at the players thinking how to complicate the existence in the game to those who are not whales. but do not forget that the life of the game do not just whales, also imported the free players.
and it's funny how in these 3 years of game life they were corrupting their even game ideals and without additional advantages throwing their philosophy in the trash (Treasure Trove) is a clear example ... this game has become a class imbalance impossible to fix ..

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Zaikah   

Well me and my gf are VT geared and we can't enjoy the event. we have to find some other things to do while whales enjoy the event, even if they don't need tho, if you have enough power to clear those "challenging" dungeons, you don't need those rewards at all, maybe the wings.

 

correct me if i'm wrong, but are they trying to force us to catch up korean server? because of up-coming Temple of Sucession, archer class etc...? 

if yes, are they forgeting that korean players and NA players are completely diferent in terms of farm/play. Korean players are hardcore players and NA players are casual players,

most of NA players are VT geared, so VT geared players to BT players are like 95% of the players right now.

 

i really don't want to believe that they are doing it on purpose, an event only for 5% of players, i really want to believe that is just another silly mistake they made: release an korean event for NA players. 

 

well i hope they fix.

 

NERF THIS EVENT NCWEST.

 

 

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shpan   

The "Our Philosophy" section is actually a major yikes... as if anyone, including the developers, believe their business model matches that description.  Imagine designing this event and believing you stand by those words.  Not possible. 

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Grimoir   
5 hours ago, shpan said:

The "Our Philosophy" section is actually a major yikes... as if anyone, including the developers, believe their business model matches that description.  Imagine designing this event and believing you stand by those words.  Not possible. 

Technically...there are no paywalls.....everything can be gotten through playing the game. The only difference is time investment.

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Arohk   

I can't do 1.3m DPS and i already don't need TT 1-3 bagua because i got them from MSP. If it would offer 6-8 it would be more reasonable.

 

tried the Firelord again yesterday with a Pug,

 

wipe with 120m life left

wipe with 80m life left

wipe with 40m life left

 

used Chocolate, Soju and everything, couldn't make it.

 

❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ this event , seriously.

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oapjr   
3 hours ago, Grimoir said:

Technically...there are no paywalls.....everything can be gotten through playing the game. The only difference is time investment.

Check out the next phrase "no amount of money will give you an unfair competitive advantage over other players"

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, oapjr said:

Check out the next phrase "no amount of money will give you an unfair competitive advantage over other players"

Well, look not trying to defend them but I do have to say this and point this out for you. One simple question. What can you pay for aside from outfits that you can't get by normal means that gives you a advantage over someone else?

I don't want to spoil it for you but I will....Nothing. There is nothing you can buy using ncoins, hongmoon coins that other players can't get by investing time. The event has something for newcomers as well as 'whales'. Sorry, if you can't get those wings or the octagonal gems, but you can get other items by only doing stage 1 - 3 and desolate which help you gem up slightly, divine grace stones, decent enough outfit (even though its a recolor) and some pet packs / sacred vials. Now, many of you guys could really ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ and moan if the pet packs and vials needed the harder emblem to get then the easy one am I right?

Edited by Kitsune Takahashi

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Soloniel   
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, Darksilent said:

 I think that the people who are in charge of keeping the game alive are no longer up to what the players expect. Signal that they are just sitting laughing at the players thinking how to complicate the existence in the game to those who are not whales. but do not forget that the life of the game do not just whales, also imported the free players.

Oh no, you totaly wrong Darksilnet, they perfectly know what they are doing. "Burning bridge" strategy is what they do.

Edited by Soloniel

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Dlacik   
21 minutes ago, Kitsune Takahashi said:

What can you pay for aside from outfits that you can't get by normal means that gives you a advantage over someone else?

I don't want to spoil it for you but I will....Nothing.

That's not true. For example unity stones give significant stats boost but the only source of legendary skill stones (from sparkling ore box) was the trove. Also while you can get legendary radiance stones by combining superior and heroic stones, the amount of them you could get by this point as F2P player at this point is limited (because daily limit for CS/HM).

At this point as F2P player you simply cannot reach as high set bonus from unity stones as someone who got them from trove even if you played nonstop since awakening patch.

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Grimoir   
Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Dlacik said:

That's not true. For example unity stones give significant stats boost but the only source of legendary skill stones (from sparkling ore box) was the trove. Also while you can get legendary radiance stones by combining superior and heroic stones, the amount of them you could get by this point as F2P player at this point is limited (because daily limit for CS/HM).

At this point as F2P player you simply cannot reach as high set bonus from unity stones as someone who got them from trove even if you played nonstop since awakening patch.

Several clan members of mine got purples by combining just 2 blue stones, few of them got also legendary ones....its not hard and its not locked behind a paywall, it can be achieved in game aswel. Also trove did not give you much of the boxes, they were rare, and a jackpot of 60 boxes was even extremely rare so your argument about trove is completely invalid.

 

you can also buy CS / HM resets from cold storage merchant, or you can buy them by selling gold and getting hmcoins...

Edited by Grimoir

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Honestly I just don't understand the second tier of the event or the people who defend it. People who can clear it don't need the octa gems, don't need the shield pieces, and don't need the mats. The only thing they might want are the wings. NC advertised this as though all the rewards would be something all players could attain. Instead the majority of players are locked out of many rewards and those who can get the best items won't even care about them.

 

This is exactly why another server merge just happened and why I refuse to spend on B&S. The saddest part is that they didn't even give whale incentive to actually participate in the event as there have been many better looking wings from past troves and the like and nothing else will really be of interest to players who are geared. I'm honestly amazed that NC continues to up the ante when it comes to showing how out of touch they are with their own customers. I'll continue spending elsewhere and just enjoy this game for what it is until it's finally shut down.

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Dudes why you so unhappy here in the first place... Why you just can't relax and play... What u planning to achieve here... u unhappy as always, angry as always, but struck daily 14 hours anyway... You wrote a lot but I don't see your point...

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KyubeX   

Truly pay to win event? I've been playing this game for 3 years, and finaly can enjoy some content that only my main character can do. i hate the fact that everything is douable on alts. You litelary cant live without them, because farming on your main character doesn't worth anything. Let the old players who farmed a lot and the "p2w" players enjoy something finally. They always got f*ked by the events, because its worthless for them.

 

And yes, i did not read all what you wrote, because you are just angry for something, that you should not. I can totaly understand, because i hate their "p2w" style in the game, but as for this event, its totaly fine. Only thing is unfair the achivents on it, because some classes barely can do it, while others can do it easily.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Prototypemind said:

This is exactly why another server merge just happened and why I refuse to spend on B&S. ... I'm honestly amazed that NC continues to up the ante when it comes to showing how out of touch they are with their own customers. I'll continue spending elsewhere and just enjoy this game for what it is until it's finally shut down.

There. This. Right here. I didn't say it. You see this? Then we have plenty of apologists like this:

 

3 hours ago, KyubeX said:

but as for this event, its totaly fine.

 

10 hours ago, Grimoir said:

Technically...there are no paywalls.....everything can be gotten through playing the game. The only difference is time investment.

 

4 hours ago, Indifferent said:

You wrote a lot but I don't see your point...

This next part is meant to be read in the voice of Francis. Here is an example before you read it.

 

 

 

 

Hehe. Here we go: "The game is fine! It is totally fine! It's not pay to win because... of some... technical definition... ahh... that I have... that "pay to win" doesn't meet... and I conveniently ignore everything else in that philosophy NCsoft gave us IN WRITING. Let's see here. We're not going to sell power, gear, or permanent stat increases, so ... so we're not actually selling gems or anything in the Hongmoon store. Definitely not the materials you need to upgrade your gear. That's not selling power... umm... somehow. It's not selling gear... uhh... because... it is the items you need to turn in to get the gear, not the gear itself, so... so that doesn't count! Umm. Gems go in your gear so they don't count as gear... I think, and ahh... permanent stat increases come from the gear, but we aren't selling gear so yeah! That doesn't count either. Also, level 55 character vouchers aren't permanent stat increases because... umm... you can get there on your own, so that invalidates the definition... somehow... I'm I'm pretty sure. Yeah. You can swipe your credit card to hard cap gear, which would make you more powerful than someone who didn't, but that isn't giving them an unfair competitive advantage over other players because... reasons. You know, if we were playing chess, and you wanted to pay money to upgrade some of your pawns to queens without you having to actually get the pawns to the other side of the map first (cause you know... that... that actually takes effort), that wouldn't be paying to win. (The chess rule is called "promotion.") Promotion by paying instead of earning it by the game rules is fine! You understand right? No pay walls to hold you back is true because it is really more of a pay-slope that gets exponentially steeper until you can't climb it anymore, get frustrated and pay NCsoft money. It's not a pay-wall. It's a pay-curved-slope that goes to almost straight up, but it never reaches straight up, so it isn't a wall! There we go! There aren't any pay walls! It doesn't count technically! The 7,100,000 HP Stage 3 Sacred Longui to 236,000,000 HP Stage 4 Sacred Longui to be able to do 1.3 million DPS to get Resurgence Emblems isn't a pay wall. It's not. IT'S NOT! Customers on this forum in the past have repeatedly been leaving specifically for this stated reason, and we are down to 1 server, but... but you know... everything is perfectly fine! It's fine! No problems here. We might not have a game to play within another year or 2 because they might shut down the servers which would make you sad, and you might lose your characters, or not be able to get a queue for a dungeon if this keeps up, but NCsoft doesn't need to change a thing! It's all good! Being mad about a marketing campaign that lied to you IN WRITING isn't a legitimate thing to be mad about. It just whining! Yer just a whiner. I don't see your point."

 

<END FRANCIS> Thank you Francis.

 

 

 

 

Let me take their philosophy line by line. Remember that this is very significant because this is how they originally marketed the game to get people to start playing:

 

Blade%20and%20soul%20business%20model_zp

 

This is not skill based progression. It is time or money based progression.

There ARE pay walls. Sacred Longui 3 to 4 is one. Making a wall a slope doesn't mean it can't perform the same function slightly differently.

 

how%20hard_zpsj7pwm4rn.jpg

 

Gating content and power behind a grinding requirement that requires more hours and effort than graduating college unless you pay is a pay wall! Just because it can technically be overcome doesn't mean it isn't a wall. Walls have tops. They aren't infinitely high. They are still "walls" though.

 

Money WILL buy you an unfair competitive advantage over other players. Go into 6v6 unequalized battlegrounds if you don't believe me.

They LOVE pay to win. The game is pay to win. Here are today's specials in the cash shop:

 

dllhost_2019-04-12_14-18-32_zpscuhpspc5.

 

7 out of 8 of them are pay-for-power items.

There are cosmetics in the Hongmoon store, but if you look at the Showroom in game, they aren't selling even 10% of what they have to offer in that regard. For what reason? I have no idea, so they are going to sell cosmetics? Yeah technically, but... not really.

Selling convenience? I guess power without having to earn it by playing is convenient?

Consumables? Yeah. Ok. I guess that part is true.

Not selling power... no that is a lie.

Not selling gear ... no that is a lie. The master bundle is selling a soul in it. Selling gems is selling gear. Selling items that let you get the next stage of gear up is selling gear.

Not permanent stat increases... no that is a lie. Selling a level 60 character boost voucher is selling permanent stat increases. Just because you can get it by playing the game doesn't mean that it isn't still selling permanent stat increases. Does it increase your stats? Is it permanent? Is it for sale? Yes! Well then, it is selling permanent stat increases isn't it?

 

At this point, even if NCsoft dropped B&S like a bad habit, released a new game, and made more grand promises, I would immediately label them as lies, go on that forum, show them the B&S philosophy they marketed to us when they were trying to get us to play B&S and point out how that was full of lies, so their new game's claims are also probably lies too, and you shouldn't play the new game. They need to clean up B&S, not drop it and move on! Being offended by a marketing campaign that lied to you IN WRITING and broke their word... IS a legitimate thing to be mad about.

 

What is the point? NCsoft needs to change their business model so the game can be more fun, more entertaining, and start growing its player base again, sell cosmetics. Be transparent. Drop the corporate hyper greed. Drop the trickery and the arm twisting. Profit is good! Some money is good. You don't need "all the money." Corporate executives act like decent profit isn't good enough. Anything short of "all the money" isn't good enough.  Worry about making a good game first, and prioritize money second. If you do that, the money will follow. (Yes, you need to monetize the game somehow.) We've been playing B&S for years now. We have a new class coming up, as well as a graphics increase. At its core B&S is GREAT game that has a lot of trash piled on top of it by now. Let's scrape the trash off and polish the game. Let's not have the game "poof" on us a year after our new class, graphics increase and awakening. I like B&S. I don't want to see it go away. I want to see it get better, not worse. That's the point.

Edited by NorbertTheOpinionated

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9 hours ago, Dlacik said:

That's not true. For example unity stones give significant stats boost but the only source of legendary skill stones (from sparkling ore box) was the trove. Also while you can get legendary radiance stones by combining superior and heroic stones, the amount of them you could get by this point as F2P player at this point is limited (because daily limit for CS/HM).

At this point as F2P player you simply cannot reach as high set bonus from unity stones as someone who got them from trove even if you played nonstop since awakening patch.

That is pay to get ahead not pay to win as everything is obtainable by "investing time". Sure the rates suck on refining but I'm at the first set effect and I'm a free to play player. Also Unity 54 to boot tonight. Pay to win means something different for everyone but the general term is basically you pay for something no one else can obtain without paying for a unfair advantage which currently there isn't such a thing in this game to get off of it.

Complain about the success rate on refining, complain you can't do the event itself, but don't claim oh another p2w event, this game sucks.. Every event there is something for both the 'whales' and free players just know your damn limits.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Kitsune Takahashi said:

That is pay to get ahead not pay to win as everything is obtainable by "investing time". Sure the rates suck on refining but I'm at the first set effect and I'm a free to play player. Also Unity 54 to boot tonight. Pay to win means something different for everyone but the general term is basically you pay for something no one else can obtain without paying for a unfair advantage which currently there isn't such a thing in this game to get off of it.

Complain about the success rate on refining, complain you can't do the event itself, but don't claim oh another p2w event, this game sucks.. Every event there is something for both the 'whales' and free players just know your damn limits.

So if we are playing chess, and I pay $5 per pawn to promote the pawns to queens without putting in the work to earn it by getting the pawn across the field, and then hammer my opponent or out-perform them with those queens, that is not paying to win because I could have gotten it by just playing the game too? Why that isn't allowed in Grandmaster play. Would it not be unfair and paying to win?

 

Edited by NorbertTheOpinionated

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Grimoir   
3 hours ago, NorbertTheOpinionated said:

Not selling gear ... no that is a lie. The master bundle is selling a soul in it. Selling gems is selling gear. Selling items that let you get the next stage of gear up is selling gear.

Not permanent stat increases... no that is a lie. Selling a level 60 character boost voucher is selling permanent stat increases. Just because you can get it by playing the game doesn't mean that it isn't still selling permanent stat increases. Does it increase your stats? Is it permanent? Is it for sale? Yes! Well then, it is selling permanent stat increases isn't it?

With this sentence you jsut prove you are running out of arguments.....ok let me explain some things to you.

Mastery bundle - can be bought 1 time per account. Its a bundle meant as a head start for new players that can afford it. Its doesnt give you something you CANNOT OBTAIN in game, it shortens the time for them, you ge tthe exact same items by spending more time in game. This is not p2w.

 

The daily deals you screenshotted, were put in place so that players who do spend a bit and are short on something can buy it as a cheaper price for that last little mile.

and the amounts are also not great in the first place. But again, EVERYTHING IN THERE can be obtained in-game by playing (except costumes, which is just fashion)

 

Like someone said earlier, there is nothing you can buy with money that you cannot obtain in-game through playing. You even have the option to sell gold and get store currency to buy something if you want it, the same daily deals. You just seem to be so fixiated on your "p2w" you dont see anything outside that little box of yours.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Grimoir said:

With this sentence you jsut prove you are running out of arguments.....ok let me explain some things to you.

Mastery bundle - can be bought 1 time per account. Its a bundle meant as a head start for new players that can afford it. Its doesnt give you something you CANNOT OBTAIN in game, it shortens the time for them, you ge tthe exact same items by spending more time in game. This is not p2w.

 

The daily deals you screenshotted, were put in place so that players who do spend a bit and are short on something can buy it as a cheaper price for that last little mile.

and the amounts are also not great in the first place. But again, EVERYTHING IN THERE can be obtained in-game by playing (except costumes, which is just fashion)

 

Like someone said earlier, there is nothing you can buy with money that you cannot obtain in-game through playing. You even have the option to sell gold and get store currency to buy something if you want it, the same daily deals. You just seem to be so fixiated on your "p2w" you dont see anything outside that little box of yours.

Who is fixated on p2w? I took their philosophy and analyzed it line by line. You are the one who is only focusing on the p2w portion of that philosophy statement of theirs. Also, it seems that you think that it isn't p2w if you can get it in the game in other ways even if those ways have taken over 3 years that the game has been out, and you still don't have 1.3 million DPS, which is what NCsoft is demanding for this event. You could have over 1.3 million DPS in under a month if you paid enough money. That's not pay to win though. Here is my rebuttal to that:

 

If we are playing chess, and I pay $5 per pawn to promote the pawns to queens without putting in the work to earn it by getting the pawn across the field, and then hammer my opponent or out-perform them with those queens, that is not paying to win because I could have gotten it by just playing the game too? I just paid to get it sooner, which is ok right? Doing that would be totally fair and not paying to win? Why do you suppose they don't allow that in Chess? Probably because it IS paying to win.

 

You might say, "That is not the same thing! You might not have actually got that pawn across the field to be able to promote it before the end of the match unless you paid money. That actually takes effort." Yeah... and getting 1.3 million DPS to beat Sacred Longui Stage 4 before this event runs out is actually hard and you probably won't get that unless you paid either, and yes, it is the same thing.

 

It is taking a pawn, a weak character, and paying money to skip gameplay and prerequisites to power it up to a more powerful unit so that you can achieve a goal.

 

In Blade and Soul, it is taking a weaker character, and paying money to skip gameplay and prerequisites to power it up to a more powerful unit so that you can achieve the goal of beating the event bosses before the event is over, or outperforming your fellow players. Paying to be able to beat a boss (the Sacred Longui Stage 4) is winning. Therefore, it is "paying" to "win."

 

NCsoft has created a victory condition, which they intentionally know, by design, that most players, on average would need to pay money to achieve before the time limit of the event being over or you lose out.

 

I will also point out that once again, we see people ignoring the rest of NCsoft's philosophy statement and just trying to say, "But it isn't pay to win because it doesn't meet my definition, and that is the only point that matters! The rest of NCsoft's philosophy gets conveniently ignored." We are down to one server folks! Drop the "it isn't pay to win" argument. It is losing. People are voting with their feet by leaving, but it doesn't have to be that way. Even if you "win" the discussion, it isn't going to bring the players back who have already left in the past for this and similar reasons. Make the changes before we have to shut down the game because it is going out of business. That is what I care about.

 

 

Edited by NorbertTheOpinionated

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Like you said. many things can be obtained in the game .. now well. I'll give you the example of gems. before the gems were the hardest to get, being a player who dedicates to play could get them in a single month and when the trove came they got them in 1 day those who beat. Now a person who plays and gets his gem per event a hepta and one who pays the keys to the trove get the Gilden, that is not pay to win? in pvp 6vs6 that person would not be at a disadvantage? .. a player who runs vt for months to get hearts from the hive queen ..... this game sells items to win not evolve. enter to play 6vs6 or faction battlefields. there is no equality. It is hypocritical people with your thoughts that do not know that there is no difference in paying to evolve faster through money which is giving you more power over players who are halfway through their evolution. as many in this community play. or playing the lol and you will see that its market mode is centered on appearances, there are no items that give more power over another player of the same class and it is a game that raises a lot of money. Why can not you do something like that? because you have to sell advantages. as you decide you pay for evolving.
and this example is what I lived in the game. I started to play a friend who paid in the trove and played together and can not even reach it in equipment. I have to wait for a race of VT one per week and he only did it twice and he is already aransu 9 with gilded square. Stupid thinking if selling advance is not selling power.

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00zigor   

You guys want to know what the stuppiest part is?

That if you actually want to P2W in this game you don't even need to give money to NCsoft.

Let me make things clear before I say this, i'm NOT saying ppl who are doing are right, I'm just reporting the truth as a warning for any NCSoft employee that stills cares for this game and wants to investigate this matter.

 

The only way to get power fast in BnS is to buy gold, but not buying it from F9, the gold sellers are everywhere, they announce all day in faction chat, they are announcing it in Facebook and other medias and they are from many regions that play the game.

I can't speak for EU, but in NA servers i have to block at least 2 per day on faction chat and have been reporting them as spammers, and if you check BnS communitys in many languages and even some discords, you'll find them easily.

Even some players sell their gold and there are websites specificaly made for this purpose, you can find them in a simple google search.

Have any of you guys been to SSP lately?
The bots there are ridiculous right now, as soon as a boss shows up they all log in the game, all of them are GS, they use their ultimate skills as soon as the boss spawn and, if you are a regular player there you wont even get the reward no matter how hard you dps because the boss dies instantly.

 

And dont even get me started on BG...

This is only a couple of examples of how the gold sellers farm gold now, and you'd think NCsoft would be at least interested in ending this business but god know why they never even bother to try anymore, no matter how many tickets you open reporting the issue, believe me i know many friends that tried and got the same automatic vague response.

 

Altough I agree on the topic above, and i too think that this event was made with only 5% of the shirinking player base in mind, this will backfire for NCwest because the main tool for ppl to get stronger in the game is NOT giving them money.

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Grimoir   
3 hours ago, NorbertTheOpinionated said:

If we are playing chess, and I pay $5 per pawn to promote the pawns to queens without putting in the work to earn it by getting the pawn across the field, and then hammer my opponent or out-perform them with those queens, that is not paying to win because I could have gotten it by just playing the game too? I just paid to get it sooner, which is ok right? Doing that would be totally fair and not paying to win? Why do you suppose they don't allow that in Chess? Probably because it IS paying to win.

This analogy makes no sense at all. The problem is not that people spend money to get a bit ahead of others. I will tell you what the issue is, the issue are actually the casual players.

If someone has money to spend on a game to get things faster go ahead they have all right to do that same as players who dont spend money can sell gold for hongmoon coins and buy the exact same things, that does not create a problem, the problem is created when casual players / f2p players who cant do that and are behind, expect a free carry by the geared ones or the game be made easier for them because they cant invest the time in it or cant invest to learn mechanics and make their own parties. thats where the problem comes from because they are feeling "entitled", they want the same high end gear with minimal to no effort.

 

God forbid there are events for those who are more geared and want a challenge. Do you want the geared players to be complaining each time there is a event for the low/ mid geared people?

 

On your gem example: you only need to invest in gems ONCE, because every time a new gem tier is released, they reduce gem costs and refund a portion of the powders. I made all my gems simply by using those powders without having to get them from trove. So gems are actually a one-time investment and in terms of PVP gems dont really do much, what makes the most difference is PVP gear (accessories, and most of all the weapon and soulshields).

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, Grimoir said:

I will tell you what the issue is, the issue are actually the casual players.

With that thought the problem is not the casual players.
The problem is stupid thinking players like yours. I hope that a company or business never have people like you in front to attract people, you take them to be undoubtedly bankrupt!
By closed thinking like yours many new players or possible whales can not stand to play with the level of toxics they are. and the discrimination to do by only having main quest equipment. I seen and everyone in this game and you can confirm to remove from the party people started by they do not have raven in NS! EL.IF. HM CS and until the weekly missions .. what new player can be left with people with your reasoning. the servers are shrinking for lack of players and now I understand more because.
instead of trying to capture your supposed casual problems. and that they become players every day because the game charms them, the community helps them. you prefer that they leave ... you are one more of the problem. I would prefer to try to turn these casual players into frequent players. it's hard for you to help clean HH DD 1 min more and for just 1 min, leave many people out and end up getting out of the game ..
You want casual players not to be problems, it offers something that attracts them ... if you do not understand that, they learn Marketing: Responsible for studying the behavior of markets and the needs of consumers. Analyze the commercial management of companies in order to attract, capture, retain and retain the final customers through the satisfaction of their desires and resolution of their problems.

 

Edited by Darksilent

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