How will be the future of the players that can't raid BT?

[xCandyBear]

The weapon seems fine to me taking other path idm, but i'm stucked on the progression of my accessories (ring, earring) and soul shield. I work, my guild is small, no pugs doing it and no guild selling spot on my server that i know.

My ncoins/gold are getting dust on my account because everything i need the most i can't have, sadly i can't do this BT since it exist in our server.

 

Should just quit and find other game or in the future players like me will have a chance to get same stuff without these freaking annoying undoable 24man?

 

 

[Shanetheillest]

My suggestion would be to join a new guild that runs BT or have your guild leader do what mines did and combine guilds with other guilds that run BT. We all communicate on discord to setup different runs for BT that will work out for everyone so that could be another option for you. I'm not really sure if there will be other ways to get the gear in the future but who knows there probably will be or if they end up implementing another set of gear for those that can't run BT.

[AlanWake]

dont worry there will be new god weapons that are better than raven from 6-man later. 

also BT will get nerf that you can just F7 it. keep collecting gold and you will be able to use it later.

 

for now,get the new bracelet and new weapon this will give you huge boost.

[Shadovvv]

KR and CN nerfed Black Tower to be more manageable.

[CharlieIsBoss]

just hang around. things always change wrt gear. also, quit your clan and join one that is active and has enough people.

 

keep levelling. the max is HM20 now and the halfway point for total XP is probably like HM15-16-17-ish,

(there is an awesome chart linked in some thread here that shows the points for each level and a running total but now I cannot find it QQ)

 

so if you aren't HM15-17, you aren't even halfway done.  

 

also, if that is the ONLY goal you have for this game, I recommend that you quit now.

 

there is other stuff to do.  

 

**************************************************************************************************

regarding the dungeon itself:

 

If things stay the same I wont ever run this dungeon either, by choice.

 

the logistical nightmares and all the additional effort and organizing and timing needed to run that dungeon sounds like a worse hassle and stress than most real life horsepucky that always happens. 

And all that work happens before you even step foot into the actual dungeon.

Whatever godly or legendary means in this game, I am not even interested due to the ridiculous hoops needed jumping through.

 

 

there is NFW that I would ever have interest in trying to do all that sht for some weapon upgrade.

this isn't a real life job that you need to steel yourself to take the pain to survive

[NightFer]

The raven weapon path comes from the 24man raids (both weapons). The other weapon path comes from the 6-man dungeons. Accessory wise, the only way to get the BT accessories is BT itself, they wount be obtainable from other dungeons or troves or w/e. There indeed will be another accessory set in the game, but its far away in the future. So either you find a new clan and start running BT with them, or you keep playing the game and save up gold. Or you can just give up and quit like most people did :D

[Lamae]

Raven patch and current should never have happened.

[AlisaTheFluffy]

BT will get a nerf. just wait and keep collecting the gold :)

[Mordlif]

Well I think BT is one of worst mistake of this game since launching...without any alternative it is just mistake. Even after nerf it is only for 24ppl. And players with raven gear can farm far faster so you never catch they. I know big clans are just glad because they are only one who can do it and then they can carry for gold which is another big gold income, just bad.

[FrozenB]

1 hour ago, AlisaTheFluffy said:

BT will get a nerf. just wait and keep collecting the gold :)

Yes BT will get a nerf, but that'll be just a bit less mechanics to do in each floor. I believe the boss hp and damage will be still the same.

 

Of course people can go other weapon path to boost their AP so that they will have easier life in BT raid. However, remember that the next upcoming 24m raid vortex temple requires raven gears to do it. (unless you are carried by players with raven gears). 

 

Also, at this moment, most of people can't get BT gears not because of the AP or mechanics issue, it is about their time schedule in real life. There aren't much people who can sit in front of the computer for like 5-10 hours just to run the BT raid. (I am talking about inexperience BT raid party. Plus, if you have to constant afk in party, do you think you can still stay in the raid?) Like the above posts stated, either you have to spend few thousands golds to buy each BT raid runs or you need to have massive hours to get all the mechanics down with a 'static' BT raid group before you can get the raven gears.

 

This 24m BT dungeon idea is just so wrong. But why does 24m MSP dungeon is fine? The answer is simple. "No firewall in MSP once the boss is engaged." If there is no firewall in BT as well, I guess no one will ever complain about how hard it would be to complete. 1 single raid run may take only max 2-3 hours to do for an inexperience parties with enough AP/dps to take down the boss within enrage time.

 

 

[Zedonia]

2 hours ago, FrozenB said:

This 24m BT dungeon idea is just so wrong. But why does 24m MSP dungeon is fine? The answer is simple. "No firewall in MSP once the boss is engaged." If there is no firewall in BT as well, I guess no one will ever complain about how hard it would be to complete. 1 single raid run may take only max 2-3 hours to do for an inexperience parties with enough AP/dps to take down the boss within enrage time.

I dont get that. It doesnt matter if you have a firewall or not. MSP has no mechanics until stage 4 and only a few people have to know the mechanics for stage 5 and 6. In BT everyone must know how it works. Yes, some people can ignore the mechanics there aswell but then they will die for sure.

2 hours ago, FrozenB said:

Also, at this moment, most of people can't get BT gears not because of the AP or mechanics issue, it is about their time schedule in real life. There aren't much people who can sit in front of the computer for like 5-10 hours just to run the BT raid. (I am talking about inexperience BT raid party. Plus, if you have to constant afk in party, do you think you can still stay in the raid?) Like the above posts stated, either you have to spend few thousands golds to buy each BT raid runs or you need to have massive hours to get all the mechanics down with a 'static' BT raid group before you can get the raven gears.

Yes, but "no time" is very often just an excuse for not having patience. No one needs 5+ hours a day to do that. We never did the dungeon for so long on one day. The first 2 bosses are really not hard and should be doable for everyone now. People just have to understand that they have to do mechanics unlike all normal mode dungeons (except sanctum). Doing and learning BT doesnt take extremely long. It's just that you have to wait for people because they afk or whatever. Thats the reason everything takes so long.

4 hours ago, AlisaTheFluffy said:

BT will get a nerf. just wait and keep collecting the gold :)

That wont help anyone. The problem now is not that it is so unbelievable hard (it is not of course) but that people dont wanna build groups and try that dungeon for a while. People in that game use this logic: "I join a group and after 2 fails 'm out." Thats why so many people dont even try to learn that dungeon. These people will never clear BT or any upcoming raid without getting carried. And they will get carried in any other content from people who simply do the available dungeons, and not only the easy ones, all of them, like BT now.

[Zuzu]

To the people saying BT will get nerfed later, it doesn't change the fact that some/most people do not want to sit and learn mechanics and wipe some times to do BT.

The nerf will just make it easier for clans that already run it, it doesn't change the mentality of people who already don't feel like learning.

[AlanWake]

22 minutes ago, Zuzu said:

To the people saying BT will get nerfed later, it doesn't change the fact that some/most people do not want to sit and learn mechanics and wipe some times to do BT.

The nerf will just make it easier for clans that already run it, it doesn't change the mentality of people who already don't feel like learning.

 

i heard they will remove almost all mechs from all stages (stage 1 only 4 adds) so you can just f7 it. but we'll see.

 

[Zuzu]

14 minutes ago, AlanWake said:

i heard they will remove almost all mechs from all stages (stage 1 only 4 adds) so you can just f7 it. but we'll see.

They toned the mechanics down for most bosses, not completely removed them.

You still have to follow certain mechanics to stay alive; mindless DPSing won't work unless your group is already well-geared for it.

[Wataru]

Make friends with people or get your small clan to play with other clans. Problem solved.

[Alysha Hawkeye]

If you're non-raider, go Riftwalk/Dawnforged.

 

At stage 6, you can either:

-Change to Raven. Still require raid.

-Continue to upgrade to further stage, which will eventually turn into a new path. Checking this Link

 

Also, in future when Vortex Temple is out, Spire raid will be nerfted to make it a lot easier to raid, so having Spire equipment would be the minimum gear requirement in order to tackle Vortex raid.

 

If at that time you still have not yet able to raid Spire, then consider:

-Join a better clan that can actually raid.

-Wait for the new path of Rift/Dawn and follow it.

-Post new thread about how F2P players cannot get raid-quality gear.

[xCandyBear]

8 hours ago, Wataru said:

Make friends with people or get your small clan to play with other clans. Problem solved.

i try, but as i said i work and it's hard to manage time to raid when they are online, also these big clans makes me feel like a stranger even though i try my best to be nice to them i'm just completly ignored like many others -feelsawkwardman-.

 

7 hours ago, Alysha Hawkeye said:

If you're non-raider, go Riftwalk/Dawnforged.

 

At stage 6, you can either:

-Change to Raven. Still require raid.

-Continue to upgrade to further stage, which will eventually turn into a new path. Checking this Link

 

Also, in future when Vortex Temple is out, Spire raid will be nerfted to make it a lot easier to raid, so having Spire equipment would be the minimum gear requirement in order to tackle Vortex raid.

 

If at that time you still have not yet able to raid Spire, then consider:

-Join a better clan that can actually raid.

-Wait for the new path of Rift/Dawn and follow it.

-Post new thread about how F2P players cannot get raid-quality gear.

the problem is not the weapon i'm chill with the weapon i can choose this new path idc, but how i'll get the soul shield and accessories? there's nothing else i can do, even if i pay for the feathers i still need to do at least 3 bosses there.

 

Maybe in the future things will be easier i hope they will sadly it will be outdated content by then. 

 

This 24man is the biggest unfair content ever made and i've heard next 24man will be same thing/system so i'll be always an outdated player. 

[Eckogen]

- BT doesn't have to be a solo clan effort. Create an alliance BT with clan(s).

- Join another clan that does BT

- Go down the alternative weapon path if it comes down to that

[Rea Shinwa]

Personally, I don't do BT. I have neither the time nor the patience for it, even though I belong to a big clan that runs it. I prefer to spare myself the salt and frustration of those runs. Also, if I ran it, I wouldn't have money enough to bid.

I don't leave the game cause of that, though. I just do other things and take it easy. BT and Vortex won't be for me. 

[AlanWake]

14 minutes ago, Rea Shinwa said:

Personally, I don't do BT. I have neither the time nor the patience for it, even though I belong to a big clan that runs it. I prefer to save myself the salt and frustration of those runs. Also, if I ran it, I wouldn't have money enough to bid.

I don't leave the game cause of that, though. I just do other things and take it easy. BT and Vortex won't be for me. 

 

i dont run BT too,i stick to 6 man and try to get the best gear from there.

 

as a destroyer i also love the MSP soulshields because of the huge boost for emberstomp specially with the new axe that give resets.

i dont know about other classes but from destroyer going from MSP ss to BT ss isnt much improvement (and actually dps loss if you dont have all 8 BT ss)

 

but the oath necklace and destiny ring are just like babies near the new BT accs.

 

i think they should give an option to evolve the draken accs even further to Awakened oath necklace and Awakened destiny ring with much higher stats so than we non raiders can stay updated.

also same with soul shield,they could bring legendary SS from later 6-man dungeons with better stats than MSP but less strong than BT.

 

if this wont happen,non raiders will be stuck with MSP soul shields and with oath/destiny forever.

 

[Displeased]

I understand how some players are frustrated because no matter how much F8 they run, they'll always be 2nd tier compared to raiders. But the fact of the matter is, people who choose to put in the time, effort, and dedication into 24-man raids deserve better rewards than those who don't, voluntarily or not, put in that same amount of patience, skill, and coordination. 

 

Now if you'd like to argue that it's really hard to join/form up a decent 24-man raid to begin with, then that's another, albeit related, topic worth discussing.

[AlanWake]

48 minutes ago, Displeased said:

I understand how some players are frustrated because no matter how much F8 they run, they'll always be 2nd tier compared to raiders. But the fact of the matter is, people who choose to put in the time, effort, and dedication into 24-man raids deserve better rewards than those who don't, voluntarily or not, put in that same amount of patience, skill, and coordination. 

 

Now if you'd like to argue that it's really hard to join/form up a decent 24-man raid to begin with, then that's another, albeit related, topic worth discussing.

 

iam not saying that non raiders should able to obtain same gear as raiders. but we do deserve to advance too. the new weapons path is a step to the right direction.

 

next should be SS,and better draken accs. new non raid SS could be the same but with less %.

like instead 30% eradicate dmg make it 20%.

 

just please NCsoft dont make non raiders outdated players in terms of accs and SS.

[Rea Shinwa]

1 hour ago, Displeased said:

I understand how some players are frustrated because no matter how much F8 they run, they'll always be 2nd tier compared to raiders. But the fact of the matter is, people who choose to put in the time, effort, and dedication into 24-man raids deserve better rewards than those who don't, voluntarily or not, put in that same amount of patience, skill, and coordination. 

 

Now if you'd like to argue that it's really hard to join/form up a decent 24-man raid to begin with, then that's another, albeit related, topic worth discussing.

Oh I agree, people running BT deserve BT items, people who dont run it (for whatever reason) can't expect that those same items will be magically given out to them. All I am saying it's that I do what I can game wise, and I don't torture myself trying to do what would turn an enjoyable time into a very stressful one (for me). I will play as long as there are things for me to do that I can enjoy and as long as my gear can keep up with them... if the balance tilts completely towards the hardcore side it will be time for me to leave, but that is not so yet :)

 

[Rea Shinwa]

16 minutes ago, AlanWake said:

 

iam not saying that non raiders should able to obtain same gear as raiders. but we do deserve to advance too. the new weapons path is a step to the right direction.

 

next should be SS,and better draken accs. new non raid SS could be the same but with less %.

like instead 30% eradicate dmg make it 20%.

 

just please NCsoft dont make non raiders outdated players in terms of accs and SS.

^ This makes sense too.

[FrozenB]

13 hours ago, Zedonia said:

I dont get that. It doesnt matter if you have a firewall or not. MSP has no mechanics until stage 4 and only a few people have to know the mechanics for stage 5 and 6. In BT everyone must know how it works. Yes, some people can ignore the mechanics there aswell but then they will die for sure.

Yes, but "no time" is very often just an excuse for not having patience. No one needs 5+ hours a day to do that. We never did the dungeon for so long on one day. The first 2 bosses are really not hard and should be doable for everyone now. People just have to understand that they have to do mechanics unlike all normal mode dungeons (except sanctum). Doing and learning BT doesnt take extremely long. It's just that you have to wait for people because they afk or whatever. Thats the reason everything takes so long.

That wont help anyone. The problem now is not that it is so unbelievable hard (it is not of course) but that people dont wanna build groups and try that dungeon for a while. People in that game use this logic: "I join a group and after 2 fails 'm out." Thats why so many people dont even try to learn that dungeon. These people will never clear BT or any upcoming raid without getting carried. And they will get carried in any other content from people who simply do the available dungeons, and not only the easy ones, all of them, like BT now.

I am not talking about mechanics. I am talking about people dying by silly mistakes or lags during boss fights. I know MSP mechanics are a lot easier, but still people die in there because of silly mistakes or ping drop or fps drop. It is similar to BT. However, in MSP, they can press 4 and run back to continue to DPS. In BT, they can't. Basically, if a person disconnected or died, other members in the party has to make up his/her dps too. Imagine around 5 people were either disconnected or died, basically it is a reset in a BT raid dungeon run, but in MSP, it is completely fine.

 

It depends on your group schedule. Not everyone can play the game for several hours 'at the same time' per day. Just to gather people in the raid at a specific time is already hard. For example, player A, B, C, D, E joined today's raid. However, they can't join tomorrow raid due to real life issue. Then, we have to find replacements. However, since we have practiced for several hours on mechanic with these players already, tomorrow we will have to start over again with the new replacements.

 

I have had experience in 2 different raid parties. The first group, we practice 2nd boss mechanics for over 10+ hours (2 days) to get it down. From then on, we can always clear 2nd boss in like 1 or 2 tries. I joined second group (new raid) because I missed the first group's party raid time. Initially, they ask me for boss 1 and 2 and they say they know mechanic and can possibly clear them. So, I joined. Boss 1 was very smooth (only take 2 tries). Boss 2 was problematic because I found out that 70% of the people in the raid don't know mechanic. So then, let's practice. After several wipes, I even said "In my last bt raid group, we used 10+ hours to clear this 2nd boss". People start laughing and saying my last group was retarded and stuff and you know what, after 3-4 hours of practice, this 2nd bt party group still couldn't get the boss down below 40% and raid was disbanded because of frustration. So, having a static bt raid is really important, which is also difficult to do at the same time.