Abuse of pvp clothes.

[Calidel]

8 hours ago, SmilingMonster said:

As for the ppl who are blamming me for using clothes, go *cricket* yourselves. As this continued to be bad experience gaming, this game will be terminated if they do not put a hold to the ppl who go around bothering others. Like to be nude, you know porn is an option, dont just play for tities. Thats the community about, teenagers with mamy issues that feel glorified about killing some lvl1 on a game. Disgusting.

If you think the game will end because of people pvping with others flagged for pvp then you have never and yes I mean never played any open world pvp before. 

 

Also this is not about porn or just teenagers, it is just open world pvp.  This game is actually nice in the fact it gives you a very easy option to keep from flagging yourself for pvp.  That option is to not wear the pvp costume!  Yes it is a costume, don't wear it unless you wish to pvp.  If you decide to wear it regardless, well either expect to die a lot or get better at pvp, fight back and win some of those fights.

[Zenshinmaru]

1 hour ago, Cadbury said:

Sarcastic replies are exactly what derail threads. I skimmed the thread truth be told, OP has a point, and he could simply get a peaceful reply telling him there are few outfits that will mark you as a PvP player including the one he wore, "take it off" explains nothing, there are other outfits that won't mark him as a PvP player thus no player can attack him.

This came up several times, my post said it. Other posts said it. Not to be rude but you skimmed much too quickly as it was stated several times by several people rather nicely and with rather rude responses.

[Cadbury]

1 hour ago, Zenshinmaru said:

This came up several times, my post said it. Other posts said it. Not to be rude but you skimmed much too quickly as it was stated several times by several people rather nicely and with rather rude responses.

Well, much appreciated, I never said OP never got an answer to his question, I was talking about the majority in this forum -not just this thread- who only respond with half-assed sarcastic answers.

[Callback]

10 hours ago, Rief said:

 

It's how MMORPG is. I remember an article on ultima online, a long long time ago. They started allowing PVP and suddenly Murder and Robbery become much more common in the game. It's a reflection on how a world without law is, majority of human is not noble kind hearted people. People will do cruel things if there are no repercussion. Sometime even not in the name of greed or hate or any type of reason. Simply, because it's fun.

No it's not.  It's a reflection of how bad this playerbase is.  You don't see this kind of behavior on any of the Asian servers.  Players there have a little thing called dignity and self-respect.  They're not assholes for no reason.  The uniform doesn't mean "kill me", especially not in town or while running dailys.  It's supposed to just mean "I'm interested in a good fight."  And if you meet someone else wearing a uniform who is interested and a similar level to make it interesting, you can go at it.  Big groups from each faction wait on neutral ground for the other to show up looking for a fight.  They don't just go around slaughtering every lowbie and lone quester they can find for the sake of douchebaggery.

[Puppy Pie]

LOL!!!!!!!

[iCream]

11 hours ago, Trinket said:

Press 3. You respawn with PvP clothes off.

^ This

[Sorcerer21b]

9 hours ago, Sorcerer21b said:

 

3) This one is my favorite. Keep talking to them and keep them wanting to spawn camp you, giving you time to hit faction chat up and call on people to come teach him a lesson in why its bad to spawn camp.

 

7 minutes ago, iCream said:

^ This

Is more fun though.

[DrowningEarth]

1 hour ago, Demiosu said:

I'm not sure if you won lol, you alt tabbing for 15 mins means he had free pvp kills for his additional piercing stat achievement. You basically gave him what he wanted. 

I mentioned this in an earlier post, but that shouldn't be allowed. Killing people is one thing, exploiting achievements is another.

 

Now I don't think bans would be handed out over this, but a system that resets people's achievement progress for engaging in that would deter such behavior. I would not be surprised if there were people who are dual boxing alts just to gain the achievements that way.

[Callback]

11 minutes ago, DrowningEarth said:

I mentioned this in an earlier post, but that shouldn't be allowed. Killing people is one thing, exploiting achievements is another.

 

Now I don't think bans would be handed out over this, but a system that resets people's achievement progress for engaging in that would deter such behavior. I would not be surprised if there were people who are dual boxing alts just to gain the achievements that way.

Maybe not that, but a karma system to add some big penalty to these behaviors would sort things out.  Of course it shouldn't be bannable, but it should entail a risk to players wanting to play out the "evil" killer fantasy.  Constant killing of innocents and lowbies would build up until the player gets marked, locked into their own PvP gear, and can be themselves hunted for a bounty.  Dying like this would have some sort of big penalty for the player, and reward for the one who takes them down.

 

It's ok to be a bad guy in a PvP game.  It's just not ok to be abusive when there are no consequences for your actions.

[Ethria]

You flag yourself for pvp, you'll get pvp. And if you don't remove it, you might even get camped. Deal with it. No one cares if you're lvl 1, no one cares if you were afk and no one cares if you wear the pvp costume because you like it. And no, no one will come to rescue you, unless you're lucky and you find some bored 45's. Just remove the pvp costume and move on. 

[Asuka]

59 minutes ago, Callback said:

No it's not.  It's a reflection of how bad this playerbase is.  You don't see this kind of behavior on any of the Asian servers.  Players there have a little thing called dignity and self-respect.  They're not assholes for no reason.  The uniform doesn't mean "kill me", especially not in town or while running dailys.  It's supposed to just mean "I'm interested in a good fight."  And if you meet someone else wearing a uniform who is interested and a similar level to make it interesting, you can go at it.  Big groups from each faction wait on neutral ground for the other to show up looking for a fight.  They don't just go around slaughtering every lowbie and lone quester they can find for the sake of douchebaggery.

You are very "hard-coded" and I think that's unfair. I don't dabble into the owpvp aspect too much and I am getting ganked, ambushed etc. but isn't your view of how things should be exactly what owpvp isn't about? I mean, arena, yes, sparring, yes, but the warring factions with uniforms? Doesn't that emulate the two warring sides in a neverending skirmish in a pretty much lawless world? You even have uniforms for flagging (it's a uniform like a soldier's uniform), quest hub that are near the opposing faction quest hub, quests that require you to meet other faction, quest that require you to group, spontaneously or with friends etc.

 

I see your post as extremely one-sided and unfair, as I am not a douchebag, I don't do these things listed, others do them to me, and I disagree with you. Your post doesn't leave place for another opinion, for example, mine. Your sentences are very matter-of-fact while you are talking about your perception of how morally or commonly an aspect of the game should be regarded.

 

I see an owpvp with warring faction as an absolutely purposefully gritty aspect that is unfair by design. I see myself as not doing it as I should be, actually.

-I don't attack first (why not? it's the other faction member? Am I playing the game or pretending that I'm playing the game? Why wouldn't my character want to thin the numbers and hinder the efforts of members of opposing faction? That is pretty nonsensical)

-I don't gang-bang (again, why not? Sun Tzu would be facepalming at me not doing that. It's not a boxing match, it's a simulated war/skirmish)

 

I respectfully strongly disagree with you, but that doesn't mean I'm an idiot or a douchebag. You are EXTREMELY quick to make binary judgments based on personal preferences. For me, if I get ganked like there's no tomorrow, that means that the enemy faction is doing a good job of deterring me from working for my faction. It is very unnatural, if you think about it, for bunch of fantasy "medieval" lawless soldiers to meet outnumbered enemy soldiers in their "work uniform" and NOT engage them. The game world emulates a lot of things, it's not a one-shot match type of game (except arena), it emulates lawless setting with warring factions.

 

You disagree, of course, as seen from your post, but that doesn't mean you have to be rude, snarky and bash people who disagree, while also automatically assuming that the reason they disagree is because they are douchebags or I don't know, have inferiority complex or are sociopaths or jerks etc.

I don't do any of the things you deem "disrespectful", yet it saddens me when I see owpvp becoming a place of agreement and fairness - that means that a very valuable aspect the game is trying to emulate, is ignored. Some of us want to feel anxiety while walking around in their faction uniforms, we like even to be ganked, as it provides a sense of, well, FACTION WARFARE. Why would they spare me, we aren't playing tennis so it's silly to go 5v1, they want me dead. If they don't want me dead, they shouldn't be in a faction.

 

Again, feel free to disagree, but don't automatically go for snarkiness and personal frustration and namecalling without even reading others' line of reasoning. It just makes you look unable to approach things like an adult. I hope your future posts won't be like this one in their arrogance. Pretty rude of you.

[Callback]

19 minutes ago, Asuka said:

You are very "hard-coded" and I think that's unfair. I don't dabble into the owpvp aspect too much and I am getting ganked, ambushed etc. but isn't your view of how things should be exactly what owpvp isn't about? I mean, arena, yes, sparring, yes, but the warring factions with uniforms? Doesn't that emulate the two warring sides in a neverending skirmish in a pretty much lawless world? You even have uniforms for flagging (it's a uniform like a soldier's uniform), quest hub that are near the opposing faction quest hub, quests that require you to meet other faction, quest that require you to group, spontaneously or with friends etc.

 

I see your post as extremely one-sided and unfair, as I am not a douchebag, I don't do these things listed, others do them to me, and I disagree with you. Your post doesn't leave place for another opinion, for example, mine. Your sentences are very matter-of-fact while you are talking about your perception of how morally or commonly an aspect of the game should be regarded.

 

I see an owpvp with warring faction as an absolutely purposefully gritty aspect that is unfair by design. I see myself as not doing it as I should be, actually.

-I don't attack first (why not? it's the other faction member? Am I playing the game or pretending that I'm playing the game? Why wouldn't my character want to thin the numbers and hinder the efforts of members of opposing faction? That is pretty nonsensical)

-I don't gang-bang (again, why not? Sun Tzu would be facepalming at me not doing that. It's not a boxing match, it's a simulated war/skirmish)

 

I respectfully strongly disagree with you, but that doesn't mean I'm an idiot or a douchebag. You are EXTREMELY quick to make binary judgments based on personal preferences. For me, if I get ganked like there's no tomorrow, that means that the enemy faction is doing a good job of deterring me from working for my faction. It is very unnatural, if you think about it, for bunch of fantasy "medieval" lawless soldiers to meet outnumbered enemy soldiers in their "work uniform" and NOT engage them. The game world emulates a lot of things, it's not a one-shot match type of game (except arena), it emulates lawless setting with warring factions.

 

You disagree, of course, as seen from your post, but that doesn't mean you have to be rude, snarky and bash people who disagree, while also automatically assuming that the reason they disagree is because they are douchebags or I don't know, have inferiority complex or are sociopaths or jerks etc.

I don't do any of the things you deem "disrespectful", yet it saddens me when I see owpvp becoming a place of agreement and fairness - that means that a very valuable aspect the game is trying to emulate, is ignored. Some of us want to feel anxiety while walking around in their faction uniforms, we like even to be ganked, as it provides a sense of, well, FACTION WARFARE. Why would they spare me, we aren't playing tennis so it's silly to go 5v1, they want me dead. If they don't want me dead, they shouldn't be in a faction.

 

Again, feel free to disagree, but don't automatically go for snarkiness and personal frustration and namecalling without even reading others' line of reasoning. It just makes you look unable to approach things like an adult. I hope your future posts won't be like this one in their arrogance. Pretty rude of you.

Do you know who's most often spared in warfare?  Children and innocents.  That's our lowbies and questers.  War is meant to be fought between soldiers on both sides, against the soldiers of the other side.  The kind of behavior we are seeing is not warfare.  It's terrorism.  Running daily quests is like being a civilian donating to the war effort.  They aren't fighting, and they have no intention of being a combatant.  Slaughtering them is just death and destruction for destruction's sake, and the people who engage in it are terrorists committing acts of evil, not honorable soldiers in the line of duty.  In a war, there is respect on both sides  Surrenders are respected, the remaining combatants spared. Prisoners are not kept and tortured.  Innocents are not dragged into the fray. There are laws even within war itself.  Try looking up the Geneva Convention some time.

[EffinSoul]

Out of all of the complaint threads, these are definitely my favorite :D

[UrbanSavageZenith]

I feel what the OP is saying, I have no problem losing in pvp or even giving away free ganks because i like the outfit, but when your camped and there standing on top of me like im some kind of a huge threat well there low as scum for camping a person 35 levels under them, and yes i do believe its called grief killing when they do that and its against the rules.

 

when other players defend grief killing it shows who you actually are btw, griefers are honorless low scum that has no feelings for others playing expirence.  just sayin... and defending these people is wrong. but what comes around goes around.

[Daymon]

2 minutes ago, Callback said:

Do you know who's most often spared in warfare?  Children and innocents.  That's our lowbies and questers.  War is meant to be fought between soldiers on both sides, against the soldiers of the other side.  The kind of behavior we are seeing is not warfare.  It's terrorism.  Running daily quests is like being a civilian donating to the war effort.  They aren't fighting, and they have no intention of being a combatant.  Slaughtering them is just death and destruction for destruction's sake, and the people who engage in it are terrorists committing acts of evil, not honorable soldiers in the line of duty.

    Not sure how you view about children and innoncents in this game. Questers can simply be in peace if they wear neutral outfits and doing quests ( except the faction quest -> fair game for everyone), lowbies wearing faction outfits will more likely to be ganked by some one near their level, or maybe about 3-4 lvl higher. Sparing everyone in this game might put people to potential disavandtages, they can be jumped when they turn their back because they think "non-combatant" shouldn't be attacked.

    Sure, we have jerks in every game, this is no exception. But hey, open world PvP is never fair, only opportunities and chances, if you got killed-bad luck, maybe come back and do quest at another time, or switch channel

[GnatB]

3 hours ago, Cadbury said:

Sarcastic replies are exactly what derail threads. I skimmed the thread truth be told, OP has a point, and he could simply get a peaceful reply telling him there are few outfits that will mark you as a PvP player including the one he wore, "take it off" explains nothing, there are other outfits that won't mark him as a PvP player thus no player can attack him.

 

No, he doesn't.  He specifically called them PvP clothes.  So presumably he already knows that those specific clothes flag him for PvP

[Callback]

6 minutes ago, Daymon said:

    Not sure how you view about children and innoncents in this game. Questers can simply be in peace if they wear neutral outfits and doing quests ( except the faction quest -> fair game for everyone), lowbies wearing faction outfits will more likely to be ganked by some one near their level, or maybe about 3-4 lvl higher. Sparing everyone in this game might put people to potential disavandtages, they can be jumped when they turn their back because they think "non-combatant" shouldn't be attacked.

    Sure, we have jerks in every game, this is no exception. But hey, open world PvP is never fair, only opportunities and chances, if you got killed-bad luck, maybe come back and do quest at another time, or switch channel

I'm not even touching on the imbalance problem, I have a different thread for that.  My main point is that these behaviors are problems within the community, not inherent features of PvP.

 

On all the Eastern servers of this game, the system is no different, yet you see none of this behavior.  Why?  Largely because accounts are linked to your actual identity, meaning people put value on their own reputation and avoid tarnishing it over pointless and unfair kills.  Partially because of the general culture putting a higher emphasis on respect, and treating other players like the humans they are.

 

What do we have here?  The same group of people who have driven thousands to suicide through online harassment.  Who think that somehow the veil of anonymity the internet provides excuses them from the most abhorrent and inhuman behavior imaginable.  People who are unable to conceive of consequences.  Pure machines of hatred and spite.

 

THAT is why we have these problems.

[SmilingMonster]

I thanks to "Callback" to her maturity responses and the fact that i dont posses the wits to do so as my primary lenguage is not english. I asumme ppl with not argument but to said "pvp flag" or "is it writting" has no maturity to see what a pvp is like. This is not lol, dota, counterstrike and so many that intends for ppl to kill themselves. No, this is a game with options to play in group, alone, pvp and pve. 
PPl to fail what it is to be molested, sexual arrasment, are just terrorist hide on a internet profile. And it is reportable, i could go to autorities about this matter as to ask for the game to close.
And for those who dont know, i ask them to stop, i try reasoning with them. But they are like childen in mentally. I even tell ppl to gift me another good outfits because i do not have any, ppl who play till lvl10 known that there isnt a new weapon or clothes to put on. 
I dont saying you could not pvp, Im just saying not to do it on ppl who dont  want. Thats why the games that has an option to left click > pvp and wait responses are good ones on pvp an has good welcome. This on the other hand, is not a pvp server, is a war server, pretty much nonsense cause they have diferent oppinions but want the same for the place. SO the game itself lack on maturity.

[Ethria]

Yea well this is not Eastern servers in which btw I got pk'd by a 45 when I was like 28 several times till I realize that dobok is a pvp one and I can just remove it. This is how the game is, you have every right to wear the dobok you like and ignore all the signs and warnings by calling them "immature", but you have no right to cry in forums about it. Be glad you have an option, in many MMO's you don't. I wish you luck and who knows..If you stop killing yourself maybe you can reach 45 one day and get good gear and maybe even take a revenge on these people who killed you. 

[GnatB]

Huh?

 

By the time you hit lvl 10, you should have (IIRC) 3 different non-PvP outfits available.

 

Default Hongmoon (start with)

One you get from the Stalker Jiangshi wheel of fate (~lvl 6-7)

One you get after the quest killing the undead dude.  (I think you get this by around level 10)

 

The idea behind the PvP outfits is a great idea.  You can tell at significant distance that somebody is enemy because of how they look.  You don't have to turn on nameplates, you don't have to get close enough for nameplates to show.  They are in "X" outfit, they're the enemy.  Attack them.

 

They are not civilians.  They are not non-combatants.  They are enemy soldiers in uniform.  If you don't want to fight, don't put on your "I am a soldier" uniform.  If you're a civilian, you don't go around dressed in an army uniform.  Same thing in the game.

 

 

Oh, and fwiw, other than the one quest in jadestone in the instance where you get the blackram uniform, I have *never* put on one of the PvP uniforms.  Because I don't (yet?) have any interest in OW PvP.

[Mishi]

11 hours ago, Callback said:

Do you know who's most often spared in warfare?  Children and innocents.  That's our lowbies and questers.  War is meant to be fought between soldiers on both sides, against the soldiers of the other side.  The kind of behavior we are seeing is not warfare.  It's terrorism.  Running daily quests is like being a civilian donating to the war effort.  They aren't fighting, and they have no intention of being a combatant.  Slaughtering them is just death and destruction for destruction's sake, and the people who engage in it are terrorists committing acts of evil, not honorable soldiers in the line of duty.  In a war, there is respect on both sides  Surrenders are respected, the remaining combatants spared. Prisoners are not kept and tortured.  Innocents are not dragged into the fray. There are laws even within war itself.  Try looking up the Geneva Convention some time.

Children and Innocents would be those who are NOT wearing a faction outfit.

 

Once you equip a faction outfit you are working for your faction, with an opposing faction working against you.

 

Therefore it is war. Do you think 2 warring factions would show mercy based off of how long a soldier has been part of their faction while at war? They don't.  

A soldier for the enemy, is a soldier for the enemy, weather they are young, old, seasoned vetern, or a new soldier.  Even Fighting, defending, scouting, spying, reporting, digging supplies, gathering, ect... They are a soldier, doing a job for their faction.

Hindering your enemies, and advancing your allies, is part of war. 

 

For Surrenders:

You're right surrendering is respected, hence having the option as a soldier in a faction to surrender. Which then removes you from being in PvP so you won't be killed. (Also known as hitting the #3 skill while dead.)

[tcodex1]

Pft, that Number 3 Button does not exist in my books.

 

[Kitty58]

Yeah I hate pvp..mainly because I suck at it..lol

Only problem I really have with pvp is when I have to wear the suit to do a quest, and they won't stop killing me.

I mean come on guys, I know a lot of you out there like to pvp but let others do their quests, ok?

[Civic26]

1 hour ago, Mishi said:

Children and Innocents would be those who are NOT wearing a faction outfit.

 

Once you equip a faction outfit you are working for your faction, with an opposing faction working against you.

 

Therefore it is war. Do you think 2 warring factions would show mercy based off of how long a soldier has been part of their faction while at war? They don't.  

A soldier for the enemy, is a soldier for the enemy, weather they are young, old, seasoned vetern, or a new soldier.  Even Fighting, defending, scouting, spying, reporting, digging supplies, gathering, ect... They are a soldier, doing a job for their faction.

Hindering your enemies, and advancing your allies, is part of war. 

 

For Surrenders:

You're right surrendering is respected, hence having the option as a soldier in a faction to surrender. Which then removes you from being in PvP so you won't be killed. (Also known as hitting the #3 skill while dead.)

 

I think the person you are quoting meant by innocents are the so called (and shamed by pvp kids) casuals, plebs, or by more mature people called PvE players who have to wear faction uniforms because of the quests to obtain Soulstones. When there are actual PvE quests to get them, then all those PvP people defending attacking on sight in this topic will be right. Until then, when I ignore other players and they must see that I run around them when they fight that ugly boss so they must realize that I have no intention in fighting them, and a minute later when I'm trying to loot those silly quest items I get killed by that -cricket- anyway, then I think there is really something wrong with people's mentality. And I already know that some jokers here will try to sell us the idea of PvE players buying Soulstones from marketplace, but why should we do that. If people were actually nice and respectful towards each other, whole game would be so much better. That something in the game is possible, doesn't mean that you should do it without second thought. (Just like in life, that something isn't literally forbidden by law, doesn't mean that there are no other unwritten moral laws and codes.)

 

[Mishi]

Let me ask 1 thing:

 

If the quests are "PvE" quests and not meant for PvP, then how come the quests require you to flag for pvp by equipping a pvp dobok, and why some of them also require kills of the enemy faction?

 

 

While true PvE quests do not require you to flag for pvp, nor have quests to kill any of the opposing faction.

Yes soulstones are obtainable through pvp quests and pve ones, the same with gold/money. However the rewards vary pending on risk. 

I know many focus on the pvp dailies for soulstones, however there is also a ToE daily which gives SS.

It gives less, and you can not be PK'd by another player nor do you have to flag for pvp to do it. (But it is a pve quest, not pvp quest.)

 

Yes some like to pk, some like a good fight, some will kill anything that moves, and others will allow all to live. It is a matter of WHO you come across.

There should be nothing which negates the basis of the fact you are doing quests for a FACTION at WAR, and while at war, doing things as a soldier, you have the option to complete tasks/missions as any soldier does, if killed you may surrender, and you can always do the quests a different time.