i wanna die

Fix warlocks in pvp

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I have played against many warlocks as a summoner and blade master and i find some of their skills too strong. If i blow my tab too early i can get chained and then die in 1.5 seconds because of the stupid high amount of damage they make compared to my bm’s honed slash or whatever. It feels like warlocks skills do too much damage compared to mine and warlock is the only class i have trouble beating in pvp. Summoner is also pretty difficult but way more bearable than warlock. 

I also feel like bm should be buffed, both lightning and fire because its been a long time since any changes were made in patches. 

I wish bm could once again be a very strong class in pvp like it was long ago.

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Nyaha   
21 hours ago, i wanna die said:

I wish bm could once again be a very strong class in pvp like it was long ago.

lol like when? At the start of the game, where bm was such a trash i was wishing to just alt+f4 every time i meet a summ or a sin in arena? 

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BMs was very strong during the lv 50 patch b/c their Dragontongue (RMB) base dmg was pretty high. They can take 100% of your HP in one long combo. After awhile, BMs  got nerfed during the next patch. Instead, DT does more dmg only if you crit, but their DT base dmg got nerfed. It takes 2 combos to take out your opponent instead of one.

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On 6/27/2018 at 2:24 AM, YangXiaoLong said:

BMs was very strong during the lv 50 patch b/c their Dragontongue (RMB) base dmg was pretty high. They can take 100% of your HP in one long combo. After awhile, BMs  got nerfed during the next patch. Instead, DT does more dmg only if you crit, but their DT base dmg got nerfed. It takes 2 combos to take out your opponent instead of one.

I play lightning which is the supposed pvp build that everyones telling me

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sojaa   

All classes abuse something. Just so happens they abuse there disable target skills. Just know that they will use that and their ss and disable skill circle combined with thrall on td.

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RavTH   
23 hours ago, sojaa said:

All classes abuse something. Just so happens they abuse there disable target skills. Just know that they will use that and their ss and disable skill circle combined with thrall on td.

sanctum doesnt get reset with td, wtf you on about also

why you necroing old posts for? :HongWhat:

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sojaa   

I am simply saying what his problem is from his veiw. I use chain lightning badge and not afraid to abuse it lol. Just like sanctum, second wind and the ss on Wl. They all disable targeting and are used to do such. They can be used consecutively and do not require a badge though. Td combo with sanctum and all the anti targeting. Which does not interrupt 1 target but all targets on that wl. It does a lot vs melee. That be like saying melee had a silence ability that worked for 1 to 3 seconds. It don't work on all your skills but just your ccs get grayed out and act like they are on cd until the times up. ( So basically if I had 3 silence skills consecutively they grey out your skills and you no longer can use cc just like I cant use approach cc). Might just get rid of your aerials it does for me( Every end game pvp wl does aerals) My approach gone. So is my grab. Imagine if soul shackle grayed out and thrall was grayed  was unable to be used to stun when BD did his back step. I do carry a 2 sec stun stone that procs. I have no problem with it because I am a bd I can spin a wls i frames away and trip you( 2 sec stone normally procs when I spin.). Most of the time they get up with their second wind and that brings them outside of sanctum I grab and throw into the wall they are done ( Thunder slash procs badge every time which is generally a 1 shot). Your defense vs my opinion don't matter. What matters is the top tier class will get Nerf as per normal. Wl are not top tier atm. They were. They were nerfed. There is other pain in the ass classes such as gunner with whip line that act as an i frame approach but it is not subject to the skill grey out as an approach is (hence the reason why they get high kills they have an invincible approach and  invincible get away) . Wl is a fine class with its strengths. I have one myself. It can barley move and attack at the same time that's its downfall.  In the sentence above it does not say anything about Time Distortion resetting Sanctum. I said simply that they will throw thrall i fame hit td and drop sanctum.They will also try to aerial you. When all I frames are burnt they will use there ss to disable targets and try to aerial. If tripped or cced they will use second wind to get up. Which also is a disable target. Now there are other skills in there like leech that they resist ccs during so on and so forth but what matters is when you get aired. If you can miss the lift up you're good till cds are up. 

Edited by sojaa

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sojaa   

Also this is a forum meant for discussions right? I have the privilege of posting just like you a do. On the contrary you have posed 1.101 times correct? I have posted 23. I am helping by giving some incites and personal views on this specific classes which by all rights I'm allowed. Wrong or right I am welcome to post here. Any player is. That is why this is a forum. Support tells you to write here. So they can review what is said. Take it into consideration and progress the game from there.  I don't state how I feel about your forum post whether i agree with them or not. Nor do I care too. That's why I didn't post on anything you have ever posted. You're allowed too. I encourage it.  Blade and Soul support encourages it. If you do decide to comment my posts though make sure you are not miss interrupting when you respond. NEVER anywhere does it say Sanctum is reset by Time distortion. I simply said they will use it in combination with time distortion. To clarify. 

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Nivalias   
On 6/24/2018 at 12:32 AM, Nyaha said:

lol like when? At the start of the game, where bm was such a trash i was wishing to just alt+f4 every time i meet a summ or a sin in arena? 

Back then, when they had a similar skill like BD/Des Spin, only with 1.5 Sec CD and no chi cost. I miss that time.

 

And on the topic of WL: The next skill patch will mitigate Air Combos in favour of normal damage, meaning that in theory they don't lose DPS, but at least you get a chance to tab out earlier, before taking too many hits.

Edited by Nivalias

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Aztael   

I think people forget that certain combos takes tremendous skill or prediction. Many classes have a 100% to 0% combo, but some of them require super hard set ups.

For a warlock you can easy shut down their aerials.


A) Warlock has 3 cc options. Tetherblade, Imprison and Thrall. Which they all have a ridiculous amount of cooldown.

Thrall stun has 24 sec allowing you to stun twice only if you use it within 8 seconds of summoning (Thrall last for 32 sec). Imprison has 45 second cooldown.

Tetherblade has either 18 second (daze/Knockdown) or 32 second. Soul shackle has 18 seconds by themselves.

 

Guess what all the important cc have same cooldown then tab escape!!!!! Or even longer!

 

Meaning if you iframe or predict a Warlock (which I will explain in a bit) then you have a free 32 second of do the ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ you want on them.

B) Warlocks are linear and predictable as ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤. I mean 3 cc isn't a lot to work around (Blade Dancer and Destroyer forces us even to use KD which leads into no combo!!!)
So how are they predictable well here is the combo:

 

Tetherblade (daze) -> Roll catch Imprison -> Aerial   How to counter it? Tab escape the roll catch.
What if thrall is out? Well then here is my personal most hated strategy but it ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ing works. GET THE ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ AWAY!!!!! A warlock is slow he cannot catch up to your movement speed on ss. Also if he tries to catch you with Thrall Q (His stun) you can ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ing block it!!!

What about the non escape-able combo? That one requires 1 peculiar thing. Better MS then your opponent. If you have more server delay = you cannot tab. You have less server delay = you can tab. I have seen so many people tab out of it even when I did it right just because latency in the game is the worst. 

To finish it off: Warlocks have a strong aerial but ITS IS OUR ONLY COMBO. Give me 2 or 3 viable set ups and sure nerf it. But it's like asking BM to not be allowed to do 100% HP damage on a Soaring Falcon + stun extend when opponent has no tab.

 

C) Sanctum is good but easy to counter. A warlock in sanctum feels safe, extremely safe. Sure you cannot target them but you can push them out, randomly cc them (Funny side note Warlocks are the only class that cannot CC without a target) Also CC immunity Sanctum doesn't have the Anti-targeting.


The only time I can see and understand your frustration is if a Warlock parries you with his block since it also leads into aerial. If that happens I mean its either he got lucky or he reads you like a book. To be fair any class that can counter, if they counter you its GG. 

All I can say is when I beat people (rofl stomp them) it is because people have no clue about the cc's and what each and everyone does and they didn't even looked at what we have as option. Also you might have seen I didn't mention Time Distortion well that is because 100-0 combo requires you to have it. If I use it outside of my combo just face tank the 50% and then kill me when I got nothing left. And become a sandbag for 32 second trying to counter you so you get scared. (While I am the one scared as ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ and praying for mercy)
 

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SkFy   

Everyone knows warlocks are broken, except warlocks ^^ dont even bother argueing with them.
Soon finally the first nerfs for them :)

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Seanhaec   

Please read Azteal's post above. It details the warlocks quite well.

Yes, everyone knows warlocks' aerial combo is op; I concede this. However, please also notice that warlocks have some considerable limitations. One of the biggest ones is that warlocks do not have the mobility or escapes of other classes. We do not have a Q and E counter; Q and E control the Thrall (when he's up). Yes, we have frontal block, but that's easily worked around.

We have Sanctum to either avoid being targeted *or* to avoid CCs. And as Azteal pointed out, we kinda feel safe in Sanctum. FM Phantom Grip or WL Repulse or any Knockback or AOE pull skill will pull/push us right out of our Sanctum and we freak.

Speaking of Thrall, he's dumb asf. He attacks and uses his aerial skill (when opponent CC'd) on his own, often at stupid times, because we can't control that part of him. Sometimes, he doesn't even use the aerial skill, and we often count on that aerial. We can only throw him at your face or call him back to us. When we throw him at your face, you can block him, easily negating one of our 3 CCs. As Azteal pointed out, our CCs are long-cd, that's why we depend on TD. As a gunner or BM or Destro or any big and fast burst class, burn the Thrall down as soon as it's summoned and watch the warlock freak out. We tend to get kinda desperate and terrified when we can't get TD.

Speaking to the OP's statement that they feel warlocks' damage output is higher than theirs... funny, because I feel the same thing about BMs, BDs, Destros, Gunners, etc. The *only* thing I have going for me is my aerials. BM has double-punish with stupid high burst. Destro, Gunner, BD, same thing. And the tech chases from those classes... omg the tech chases... because they know we don't don't have escapes/counters. #nerdrage :grrr:

As Azteal said, Warlocks can be very predictable and linear. If you know how a warlock works, you can easily beat us, especially melee classes. I suggest what many others do when facing a class they have a hard time with in PVP: make the class and play it. Learn the skills, learn the combos. Once you do that, you'll read your opponent so much better. You also might then think twice before making another QQ post about warlocks.  :glare:

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Nivalias   

WL's do not have the escapes? Are you kidding? With Second Wind, Time Distortion to reset it and Void Walk, you objectively have the most escapes of all classes in the game. And both of them can be used to get back in your Sanctum when out of it. Second Wind when pulled by Phantom Grip positions you back at least quite close to it, while Void Walk deals with all other CC's.

I think you need to learn to play the class, before bashing on WL-bashing. They're not a top-tier class, because people are too dumb to deal with them.

 

BM's, ironically one of the classes you complain about, can do nothing against WL defenses. They have no Phantom Grip, their only Knockback is immediately followed by Knockdown, and they're one of the three classes that don't have a range-block-breaker, so even your Quell is not "easily worked around" for them.

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Aztael   
On 8/13/2018 at 7:40 AM, Nivalias said:

WL's do not have the escapes? Are you kidding? With Second Wind, Time Distortion to reset it and Void Walk, you objectively have the most escapes of all classes in the game. And both of them can be used to get back in your Sanctum when out of it. Second Wind when pulled by Phantom Grip positions you back at least quite close to it, while Void Walk deals with all other CC's.

I think this needs some proper addressing since like 90% of complaints don't even read our skills.

Sanctum:

Anti CC -> 45 second cooldown -> Can be targeted, can be pushed, grabbed or aerialed (KFM jump attack) 
Anti targeting -> 1 minute cooldown -> If fast enough can grab out of it, no cc resist at all so pull and push working (unless you hit block of course).
Any type of Sanctum CANNOT BE RESETED. All hongmoon variants last 10 seconds else it is 6 seconds!

Oh side note. If you go back into Sanctum you are not guaranteed to get your target immunity right away since Sanctum provides you with a 1 second buff that gets reapplied. Hence if you push me out and I walk in there are time you can still get me. Also summoning Thrall will allow you to even attack Thrall since for a few frames he will not have the buff. And to finish off Sanctum. if during those few frames you use an aerial, well sanctum is not applied on an airborne target. 

Second Wind: User resist status and damage during use and 0.5 sec after. Gives user 3 second of anti targeting. Anti targeting is gone as soon a skill is cast. Can be reseted

Void Walk: Switch places with Thrall. Has 0 iframe properties. Cannot be reseted.

Alright so lets break them down. Sanctum as previously stated Can easy be dealt with by most classes. Current class that struggles most against Sanctum are Gunners and Warlocks (lol).

On 8/13/2018 at 7:40 AM, Nivalias said:

BM's, ironically one of the classes you complain about, can do nothing against WL defenses. They have no Phantom Grip, their only Knockback is immediately followed by Knockdown, and they're one of the three classes that don't have a range-block-breaker, so even your Quell is not "easily worked around" for them.

Um You know it is damn impossible to block Flock of Blades if the BM is inside you. Only thing you can do is pretty much turn your camera wildly and block. Sure you can stand in a corner but then BM just has to move away and Warlock won't pursue.

Our block has long been changed so we cannot just press Block and our character stop his walking animation to go into frame 1 block. So even if I try to move away to position myself so I could block your FoB you can just cast it during my walking. 

 

Also funny you mention Blade Master because Warding Spirit is a 10 sec 100% counter for us. This is basically a Sanctum version 10x better. Of course this cannot be cast randomly sure but during those 10 seconds you can nullify almost all our attacks. (Soul Shackle, Imprison, Wingstorm and Helix are not blocked). However Helix needs 3 spectral orb that only Wingstorm would provide in that situation so yeah our dps is just gone. 

Also a good counter for a BM if they cannot use FoB is Lunar Slash into random Dragontongues. Then you sway left and right and still will hurt us. (To be honest those hitsboxes sometimes are weird)


Second Wind: Pretty easy to explain. Has no cc property  (so 0 pressure applied when using it). Sure moves you backwards but a lot of classes have approach cc or range cc. The 3 second anti targeting has no CC protection AND it cannot even last for a Thrall summoning. YES summoning Thrall is BAD. You can easy cc us during our summoning animation since you will gain target. (Had BM rush to me, stun me with it and no Thrall popped.  So definitely could target)

Void Walk: Man oh Man this skill is what everyone uses as OP 3rd escape.

 

To clear this ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤. Unable to reset cooldowns. Whopping 90 seconds of cooldown.  So as you should probably know, it is rare to see 2 Time Distortions in a single match. Well Void Walk has same cooldown. (Guess still too OP)

Now here is best part of Void Walk. If Thrall is close for any reason and I use Void Walk. During the split second animation and after the animation I get a massive 0 Iframe. Not one single immunity. The only thing it does is removing root ... FANTANSTIC. I had Blade Master use Soaring Falcon when I used it and the blade did a ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ing 180 and grabbed me and pulled me in his face. Blade Dancer can use the 5 hit attack and if you aren't far enough it will still alternate between Thrall and your new place. But hey I guess a 0 Iframe, 0 cc, 0 damage 90 second non reset able Thrall switch is the most OP escape in existence. 

So that being said if you count TD we got 3 "escapes" 2 of them really are escapes and Void Walk. But don't forget like I mentioned before we kinda need Time Distortion for our offensive pressure so using it to reset escape is basically a death sentence since we cannot time out 90 seconds of cooldown. 

PS: Assassins have 45 seconds on Lotus of Escape giving them same amount of escapes then Warlock during a 90 second period. But since lotus of Escape has iframes I guess Void Walk still better :^)

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Nivalias   

In all fairness, I'm not complaining about the Sanctum. Some class have ways to deal with it, most don't. But because it can't be resetted, I think that's fair enough.

By the way, the anti-target has 1 min unresettable CD, so does Flock of Blades (which is btw unblockable, so all your camera turning won't help you). That evens out. So what, if it takes about 1 sec before the anti-targetting gets reapplied? Sure I could use my stun charge fast enough to get close to you, but then what? You can just command your Thrall to stun back with Onrush, which might with a little luck not even get blocked, so you can start a counterattack. And even if it's not, you just traded your 24 CD Stun for a (usually) 30 CD Stun, put a damper on the enemy combo, and got your anti-targetting back. What I could do now is try to apply some non-targetting CC's, but run the risk of hitting in your Quell. If I hit, gg for you, otherwise gg for me. But since this is a big gamble, it's just better to back out.

 

And in my opinion your Void Walk isn't your OP 3rd Escape, but your Time Distortion is. Before people discovered they could use Time Distortion in the Arena, WL's were pretty fair game for me, but since then the tables have turned massively.

You keep saying you need TD for offensive pressure, and while that's true, it's not a valid argument for me. Because WL's should be able to deal around 50% damage with one combo. Use TD, do the same thing again, and the rest is simple cherry tapping, if not an outright victory.

I think the most unfair thing about TD is that it resets your skill not once, but thrice even. Although you do have to be next to your thrall to receive the last two resets, that's hardly an issue that requires exceptional skill to handle, just press E before you press Tab. The worst offender in this is most certainly the Bastion, since you can cast it twice, and still got one more for the road. Not only are you completely immune during that time, you also heal yourself 5% per cast, just like with Second Wind. Disregarding the life leech skills, if you can't manage to deal 15% damage to a WL before he casts TD, congratulations, all you did up to that point was entirely pointless. And even if you manage to get past that mark, okay, you managed to deal a bit of damage, but now you're all out of CC's, while he's as good as new, safe for maybe Bastion, Void Walk, Leech and some other offensive skills I have overlooked.

 

Sin's Lotus of Escape is also pretty slick, but they can't escape Stuns three times in 10 seconds, so yes, Void Walk is still more OP, if only by a bit. And either a match-up is so fast-paced, that it lasts less than 45 seconds, or so slow-paced that it lasts longer than 90. In either case, both of you will use it roughly the same amount of times. But that's not really the point. It's not that you should have less Escapes, other classes just should have more.

 

Although, no matter how many Escapes a class has, it won't make any difference to your Air Combos. Goddammit, your Air Combos! You have three different means to use them, four even, if you count the double cast of Soul Shackle. One of them has a mere 9 Second CD and works on KD'd people, while all of them are reset by TD. Maybe half of them are situational, but still, how can you not call that OP?

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Aztael   
9 hours ago, Nivalias said:

Sin's Lotus of Escape is also pretty slick, but they can't escape Stuns three times in 10 seconds, so yes, Void Walk is still more OP, if only by a bit. And either a match-up is so fast-paced, that it lasts less than 45 seconds, or so slow-paced that it lasts longer than 90. In either case, both of you will use it roughly the same amount of times. But that's not really the point. It's not that you should have less Escapes, other classes just should have more.

If you want to escape from 3 stuns within 10 seconds we need our escape to either make us land on edge of TD so when we use it again we move back but still inside TD. Or We use one TD so we move back again into TD. And other method is having a wall prevent us from going backwards hence sitting in our TD.  Sure Void Walk can be used but it cancels out TD if Thrall was using TD and well still has no iframes.
 

9 hours ago, Nivalias said:

Although, no matter how many Escapes a class has, it won't make any difference to your Air Combos. Goddammit, your Air Combos! You have three different means to use them, four even, if you count the double cast of Soul Shackle. One of them has a mere 9 Second CD and works on KD'd people, while all of them are reset by TD. Maybe half of them are situational, but still, how can you not call that OP?

That 9 second aerial that can hit knockdown is RNG. It saddens me to inform you that it is more hurtful then beneficial. While yes of course an instant lift from a Parry or a Knockdown is strong ... really strong. Thrall will most likely use it when your CC runs out (Makes you see the lift off animation but enemy is just on ground and doesn't give a ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤) or he will cast right before yours (both animation are used at same time). The issue is if Thrall used his a couple frames before you did, then soul shackle will double lift. (Thrall lift counts as first and yours count as second) so your second cast does absolutely nothing. This can even been seen in tournaments where Warlock downright refuse to use that skill because it has more chances to mess up your only combo.
 

9 hours ago, Nivalias said:

By the way, the anti-target has 1 min unresettable CD, so does Flock of Blades (which is btw unblockable, so all your camera turning won't help you). That evens out. So what, if it takes about 1 sec before the anti-targetting gets reapplied? Sure I could use my stun charge fast enough to get close to you, but then what? You can just command your Thrall to stun back with Onrush, which might with a little luck not even get blocked, so you can start a counterattack. And even if it's not, you just traded your 24 CD Stun for a (usually) 30 CD Stun, put a damper on the enemy combo, and got your anti-targetting back. What I could do now is try to apply some non-targetting CC's, but run the risk of hitting in your Quell. If I hit, gg for you, otherwise gg for me. But since this is a big gamble, it's just better to back out.

That 1 second is enough to apply an aerial and during aerial we do not get Sanctum buff (Usually what KFM uses to counter our Sanctum)

The issue is while yes the idea of not being able to do anything while in the air and the fact that we do not need to blow your escape skill to abuse this lockdown is just a stupid powerful idea. The fact that we got so little approach makes it bad. If you get aerial and Warlock uses TD to do a full aerial again he has to CC you again and you can tab that one. once you tabbed a simple ss will gives you space and movement speed rendering Thrall Q useless (Yes it miss when targets have movement speed). In term of classes I think Blade Master have the hardest time to do that. Everyone else can get away from TD super easy and then you are on the offensive since Warlock might have all his skills back (except Sanctum, Void Walk, Thrall Summon, Leech) but we ain't best at approaching neither.

Also TD resets skills 3 times within like 3 sec since first 2 second of TD actually does nothing (just some animation) and double casting bastion does not reset your hit counts meaning if I got hit 4 times and keep recasting bastion you still need 1 hit to remove it (This even mess me up during PvE gameplay)

So yes we have a pretty busted mechanic idea (<-- emphasis on idea since this isn't something you can just pull out like that), our OP concept is harder to pull off then simple non OP concept that feel very wrong to me. Aka Sin/KFM permanent cc chain that turns into 100-0 combo. a Blade Dancer being able to phantom grab at any random moment so he can stall out and abuse more Iframes. Summoner cat that can start/extend combos while they themselves are cc'ed. Force Master wallbang that cannot even be escaped (Ping dependent but so is our inescapable Leech + Onrush liftoff)

Edited by Aztael

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Nivalias   
8 hours ago, Aztael said:

If you want to escape from 3 stuns within 10 seconds we need our escape to either make us land on edge of TD so when we use it again we move back but still inside TD. Or We use one TD so we move back again into TD. And other method is having a wall prevent us from going backwards hence sitting in our TD.  Sure Void Walk can be used but it cancels out TD if Thrall was using TD and well still has no iframes.

I wasn't talking about Second Wind getting reset more than once. The 10 seconds was just an arbitrary number. Raise it to 45 seconds -Slipping Lotus' CD on use- if you will, and you still get more Escapes than Sin's do. Sure, Void Walk may not give you iFrames, but for the most part, the enemy loses target on you and instead gets locked on the Thrall. Getting hit during that time by Soaring Falcon is quite unlucky, but it's pretty much the only downside to it, when you have enough distance to your Thrall that no other AoE-CC reaches you.

 

8 hours ago, Aztael said:

That 1 second is enough to apply an aerial and during aerial we do not get Sanctum buff (Usually what KFM uses to counter our Sanctum)

For any class that needs a CC'd target for aerials, which is pretty much any class except KFM, this is a race against ping. KFM's Flying Slam with Aerial spec also has 1 min unresettable CD, and KFM's don't have strong air combos to begin with, so there's not much harm done. They could finish it off with Meteor Slam for a 3 sec Grapple, which would be nasty, but KFM grapple is easy to counter, although in your case that would be bad, since it moves you out of your Sanctum. Too bad, most other classes would have applied a KD, which then could even be potentially used for an air combo for you. Otherwise, Void Walk would be in this situation a viable option.

 

9 hours ago, Aztael said:

The issue is while yes the idea of not being able to do anything while in the air and the fact that we do not need to blow your escape skill to abuse this lockdown is just a stupid powerful idea. The fact that we got so little approach makes it bad. If you get aerial and Warlock uses TD to do a full aerial again he has to CC you again and you can tab that one.

Okay, so you can tab out of this second CC, but your TD is still up and probably has one more reset left. I imagine it requires some practice to get the timing right, but it sounds far from impossible to get a third CC on your target, which then can't even be tabbed anymore.

I'll place it under the grey zone for the arena, but for 6v6 this becomes a moot point, as you already die in the first air combo and don't even need a second or third one most of the time.

 

9 hours ago, Aztael said:

once you tabbed a simple ss will gives you space and movement speed rendering Thrall Q useless (Yes it miss when targets have movement speed).

For real? That doesn't make sense to me, why doesn't it work on targets with increased movement speed?

 

9 hours ago, Aztael said:

Also TD resets skills 3 times within like 3 sec since first 2 second of TD actually does nothing (just some animation) and double casting bastion does not reset your hit counts meaning if I got hit 4 times and keep recasting bastion you still need 1 hit to remove it (This even mess me up during PvE gameplay)

But you still get healed, don't you?

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Aztael   
15 hours ago, Nivalias said:

Okay, so you can tab out of this second CC, but your TD is still up and probably has one more reset left. I imagine it requires some practice to get the timing right, but it sounds far from impossible to get a third CC on your target, which then can't even be tabbed anymore.

I'll place it under the grey zone for the arena, but for 6v6 this becomes a moot point, as you already die in the first air combo and don't even need a second or third one most of the time.

 

For real? That doesn't make sense to me, why doesn't it work on targets with increased movement speed?

Thrall has weird hitboxes so dunno why he cannot hit any target with movement speed. I spared with a friend before and he actually managed to avoid Q with some diagonal inputs. (Happens max 3 times so really not sure what happened there). Basically when I press Q the Thrall will go on were you are at the moment I press Q not at your current position. This can easily be seen when your opponent uses any approach skill. While you are at my face my thrall will attack at your initial position.

And yes we will have another reset once you tabbed out. But we will be more linear (no leech option). So let's say for Blade Master you just have to time a good Shoulder Charge on my imprison and you are gucci. Everything else cannot break your block (except soul shackle but means no aerial). 

Yes if we use Bastion several times we will get healed 5% each time but something like Q -> lmb -> E -> lmb -> approach liftoff will get us off guard and punish us while cutting our huge momentum. 

Lastly about that 1 second. This game has a huge targeting lag. I see blade Dancer turn around 180 degree facing away from me and press their approach skill and it goes off. (It automatically put them facing me and triggers it). Also when I cast Sanctum this isn't so bad but when I enter it because I was out of it people often cc me while I have buff just from lingering Target.

Sure 6v6 is a whole different league but let's be honest. Was it the Warlock that killed you or the gunner next to him that Rmb + F your ass while you were up there? Also currently when I team up for 6v6 or doing Clan battles I am the highest geared and do way more damage but the reason why my damage is so absurd is that almost everyone around me does aerials so I can abuse my Rmb + 4 combo. It is not even me using aerials it's people around me! Also what makes me cringe the most is that certain classes can have badge with 1 shoit options but my aerial is too much? Whut? Seriously?

I think what pisses off Warlocks the most is how people cry for nerfs on us but accept the fact that a Soul Fighter can increase their HP pool by 50% for a whopping 30 seconds and if you did not do more then 50% damage your total damage is just gone. That is fine. But casting 3 Bastions for 15% is too much. BD 15% HP regen on Guardian Tempest is fine but 3 Bastions that requires Time Distortion that is too much. Having a 100-0 combo that you can break out of it with tab escape and running away is too much but KFM and SIN perma CC chain is perfectly fine? 

Also last thing to mention is, we got some nerfs already and aren't even top PvP yet we will get another nerf because apparently using aerial in 3v3 is too OP. Sure opponents are forced to tab in and use Party iframes. But ummmm, what about Sin/KFM perma CC chain? Don't need to intervene there? What about a sweet BD using restrain grab? No issues there? Apparently not since they aren't even considering those to be issues. We had our time of being stupidly Overpowered and it was right to tone us down but now it feels like people want us to be even lower then 1v1 Gunners. The tournament rejects.
 

Edited by Aztael

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Nivalias   
9 hours ago, Aztael said:

Basically when I press Q the Thrall will go on were you are at the moment I press Q not at your current position. This can easily be seen when your opponent uses any approach skill. While you are at my face my thrall will attack at your initial position.

I see, can't say I'm against this side-stepping technique working. Sin's Bolt Strike is a particular offender here actually. The skill description says 3m raidus, but whenever I move out of it e.g. with a charge skill, 16m away from ground zero and I still get hit and stunned!

 

10 hours ago, Aztael said:

Sure 6v6 is a whole different league but let's be honest. Was it the Warlock that killed you or the gunner next to him that Rmb + F your ass while you were up there?

There was no Gunner next to the WL. Both of them can flak you on their own pretty fine. And yeah, both annoy me equally, so rest assured you're not alone in the hate sink there.

10 hours ago, Aztael said:

Also last thing to mention is, we got some nerfs already and aren't even top PvP yet we will get another nerf because apparently using aerial in 3v3 is too OP. Sure opponents are forced to tab in and use Party iframes. But ummmm, what about Sin/KFM perma CC chain?

I suppose the argument here is, if you get stun locked because you timed your tab escape wrong, then at least you have mostly yourself to blame for it. But getting blamed for getting aerialed is disproportionate here, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. You can't even prevent getting burst down in air combos. You can at best only mitigate it by relying on a team mate tagging in and throwing a party iFrame, and that will almost never happen in the lower ranks where most of the matches are played with random people. What you will see however often enough is one ranged class launching you, a WL or GUN tabbing in, and both of them flakking you down within 2 seconds.

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SkFy   
20 hours ago, Aztael said:

Thrall has weird hitboxes so dunno why he cannot hit any target with movement speed. I spared with a friend before and he actually managed to avoid Q with some diagonal inputs. (Happens max 3 times so really not sure what happened there). Basically when I press Q the Thrall will go on were you are at the moment I press Q not at your current position. This can easily be seen when your opponent uses any approach skill. While you are at my face my thrall will attack at your initial position.

And yes we will have another reset once you tabbed out. But we will be more linear (no leech option). So let's say for Blade Master you just have to time a good Shoulder Charge on my imprison and you are gucci. Everything else cannot break your block (except soul shackle but means no aerial). 

Yes if we use Bastion several times we will get healed 5% each time but something like Q -> lmb -> E -> lmb -> approach liftoff will get us off guard and punish us while cutting our huge momentum. 

Lastly about that 1 second. This game has a huge targeting lag. I see blade Dancer turn around 180 degree facing away from me and press their approach skill and it goes off. (It automatically put them facing me and triggers it). Also when I cast Sanctum this isn't so bad but when I enter it because I was out of it people often cc me while I have buff just from lingering Target.

Sure 6v6 is a whole different league but let's be honest. Was it the Warlock that killed you or the gunner next to him that Rmb + F your ass while you were up there? Also currently when I team up for 6v6 or doing Clan battles I am the highest geared and do way more damage but the reason why my damage is so absurd is that almost everyone around me does aerials so I can abuse my Rmb + 4 combo. It is not even me using aerials it's people around me! Also what makes me cringe the most is that certain classes can have badge with 1 shoit options but my aerial is too much? Whut? Seriously?

I think what pisses off Warlocks the most is how people cry for nerfs on us but accept the fact that a Soul Fighter can increase their HP pool by 50% for a whopping 30 seconds and if you did not do more then 50% damage your total damage is just gone. That is fine. But casting 3 Bastions for 15% is too much. BD 15% HP regen on Guardian Tempest is fine but 3 Bastions that requires Time Distortion that is too much. Having a 100-0 combo that you can break out of it with tab escape and running away is too much but KFM and SIN perma CC chain is perfectly fine? 

Also last thing to mention is, we got some nerfs already and aren't even top PvP yet we will get another nerf because apparently using aerial in 3v3 is too OP. Sure opponents are forced to tab in and use Party iframes. But ummmm, what about Sin/KFM perma CC chain? Don't need to intervene there? What about a sweet BD using restrain grab? No issues there? Apparently not since they aren't even considering those to be issues. We had our time of being stupidly Overpowered and it was right to tone us down but now it feels like people want us to be even lower then 1v1 Gunners. The tournament rejects.
 

Troll.. warlock bringing up sf... just hilarious... 100% of the teams at world tournament use warlock cause its just busted.. stop trying to fool yourself.. you barely even see any sf :/ and thats not cause skilled people only play warlock lol.. its just an easy broken class

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Czaro   
48 minutes ago, SkFy said:

Troll.. warlock bringing up sf... just hilarious... 100% of the teams at world tournament use warlock cause its just busted.. stop trying to fool yourself.. you barely even see any sf :/ and thats not cause skilled people only play warlock lol.. its just an easy broken class

EASY BROKEN CLASS

Did you played it?

Btw if you losing as summoner on wl go unistall BnS tbh bcs matchup summ vs wl is (80-20) for summoner

Btw gunner is fine 100% aerial combo and 70% of hp without making any reqs... wl is not broken 

Edited by Czaro
idk

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Czaro   

This post is just a ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ storm bcs low player called 1 class op as summoner xD monkaS and gunner is not hard for him :thinking:

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SkFy   
24 minutes ago, Czaro said:


EASY BROKEN CLASS

Did you played it?

Btw if you losing as summoner on wl go unistall BnS tbh bcs matchup summ vs wl is (80-20) for summoner

Btw gunner is fine 100% aerial combo and 70% of hp without making any reqs... wl is not broken 

Yes i played it, and yes... summoner is strong vs warlock..
Doesnt make warlock any less broken, especially in 3v3... there is a reason 100%!!!!! of the teams on world tournament used one and they all said its essential to any team setup atm..
It's not that other classes cant be strong... but wl just has it way too easy compared to other classes..
There isnt even a reason to argue about it... its just a fact.
It's been warlock world tournament for ages now... go watch the tournaments :/
And dont forget to read the chat and see how people react to it.

 

Warlock, warlock, warlock, warlock, warlock, warlock, warlock another warlock, and even more warlocks.
THATS why people say nerf warlock, not cause some baddie lost against a warlock with his summoner ;/

Edited by SkFy

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AxeNoob   

Warlocks needs more nerf..

warlocks can air you without cc with badge.!

warlocks can daze you on thier block each time!

warlocks untargble, in sanctum.. cd to low with time distortion.. increase CD !

warlocks can infinite cc you with time distortion !

warlock can hide behinde thrall, untagtble.

Thrall can pull you and is usable during cc (with Q )

seriously, warlock is the ONLY class that can 1 shot you so easily!

 

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The warlock is not the probelm in amateur pvp as it is a real pleb char, braindead and only played by braindeads (ok just exaggerating a little). If you are an expert with warlock, most classes should loose and will. The problem for bns is the pvp as such. U air you win. U kd u win. U stun u win. Thats bollocks in my mind. There should be more about evade and parry as well. No "air" as well. This is idiotic in my mind as well, why should a char receive more dmg "in air". Bullshit. 

The PVP needs an overhaul as such. Also remove stealth. 

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