zub

Destroyers need some lovin too

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zub   

Maybe on the next class changes, give Destroyers more damage on more skills. 

 

Make us more like the Tower of Infinity's Destroyers.

 

There's already so much topic on how Destroyers are underpowered in PVE and PVP but let's make one topic on how to fix them. ^ u ^

 

Feel free on giving developers some insight on how to improved Destroyers. 

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8 minutes ago, zub said:

Feel free on giving developers some insight on how to improved Destroyers. 

Remove spin to win resists/deflect

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we have been crying for this... but if stuff works according to Korean devs.. our class will only get buff.small one after Black Tower or Khanda Vihar out which... kinda mid of next year maybe.

 

More like i want perhaps so fix to F-button.. and maybe some additional daze so we can double daze without need to get KD first and waste our tab escape.

 

related to damage/dps tho.. would love to see if we could stack more bleed (10 stages or more)  So it will set us truly apart from sin or FM.  Or perhaps giving our Bleed longer lasting time (30 seconds maybe). 

 

Or at very least give our shield sort of party protection because.. in a situation like DT when our BM or FM or sum/sin  can't get timing right for roar protection... we can't do anything.

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43 minutes ago, Suna said:

Destroyer is really good spot already, watch how many destroyers there is in world championship https://www.twitch.tv/ognglobal/v/99361314

Youre completely off topic here.Those are TAG MATCH destroyers. In tag they are great in stalling and interfering but it doesnt change the fact from in PVE that they are completely garbage right now.

I know in KR once we get the Chokma SS and some badges till will change for destroyer and also maybe the SOUL but everyone get that one.Untill then there is no way for us to be even close to the other classes.
Now with Skypetal plains for exxample Soul fighter is gonna be even further boosted away with 100% more dmg on there F anicancel.

I dont mind being a middle grade dpser and be under a sin or FM for exxample cause those are made for dps i guess,but its kinda hillarious when you make half the dps of a blademaster who is only hitting is right button while our RB is scratching the bosses.Also blade dancers have in general a 3-4k + dps advantage of destroyers.Yes destroyers have the better grab with some more critrate woehoe.While BD can keep up with dps and grab at same time we should be able to do the same i think.If its gonna stay like this they better change our name to "Supporter" instead.
Would be nice if they could give us a RB  buff or something untill we get to those new patches Korea have.
As a destroyer myself on 750+ap its a work on itself to keep up dps with my fellow guildmates.I got a good ping 15ms and i would say a great anicancel.Its just hillarious to see that people with like 80-100ap lower can pull out the same dps or more with no sweat.Those people who say learn to ani cancel properly and all that crap clearly do only pvp or play other classes.

But i guess it will be just sitting out untill we get Chokma,mystic badges and elemental dmg. ^^

In pvp destroyer is great though,I dont have any complains in there.

Cheers

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5 hours ago, 821031_1452549945 said:

Dmg buff for pve and change something on F key.

That's cute. Not that i do not agree, because I do. But due to EU/NA content philosphy nothing will be done about it.

Destroyers will keep on being the utter worst class in every single aspect of PvE in this game for quite a long time to come.

Deal with it, reroll or quit.

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45 minutes ago, GenericNick said:

 

Deal with it, reroll or quit.

Chill. Guess what I'm still playing destro since its my fave class -.- I can still hope that something will change. If we managed to get HM skill in pvp vendor I'm sure in 84 years future theres maybe gonna be buff for destro. 

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What's the whole reason for Destros having low multipliers? Is it the CCs?

 

You know what they should do. Have it so if you spec the Iframe 1 and 2, you get 50% more damage on your skills. The iframes are completely unviable in pvp, so it makes sense to up multipliers to compensate.

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But wait, there's more!

 

Come Midnight Plains the rest of the pack will pull even further ahead.

 

Wrath contributes to, give or take, 15% of a destroyers damage total (assuming no soulburn), which makes the legendary 3piece bonus a truly astounding 1,5%damage increase. That doesn't get them anywhere close to the 2nd lowest damage dealer even if the destroyer has the leg ss and the other person does not. It really shows in how deep misery the class is atm, and how unimaginably bad it will be after the next patch.

 

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But wait, destroyer isnt even needed for midnight plains lets see all those healers/tank/party safe/buffers lfgs 8D Its gonna be great o7

Edited by 821031_1452549945

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On 09/11/2016 at 10:58 AM, DevilTDriver said:

What's the whole reason for Destros having low multipliers? Is it the CCs?

 

You know what they should do. Have it so if you spec the Iframe 1 and 2, you get 50% more damage on your skills. The iframes are completely unviable in pvp, so it makes sense to up multipliers to compensate.

But Destro CC is crap in PvE, our double KD is clunky and extremely hard to use on a moving target, we cant do a double daze without being cc'd first to use tab escape and our double stun forces us to blow 2 of our 3 gap closers. Not to mention, with changes to thrall for warlock, destro is now THE ONLY class in the game without a 1 click double cc. so yeah, while our cc might be good in arena pvp, for PvE we are not in a great spot. so using cc as an excuse for lack of damage is straight up bullcrap, look at FM's, 1 click double stun, 1 click double kd/daze

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8 minutes ago, GonnaNeedaMontage said:

look at FM's, 1 click double stun, 1 click double kd/daze

FM double kd/daze is actually 2 clicks. And the first click is so ridiculously slow that I have not met anyone else use it, except me.

 

On ‎9‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 7:58 AM, DevilTDriver said:

What's the whole reason for Destros having low multipliers? Is it the CCs?

I think it is because Destroyers are the most 'tanky' in that it is very hard for them to die, similar to summoner, so lower attack in exchange for their higher defence.

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Valiant   
1 hour ago, SoulsHunter said:

FM double kd/daze is actually 2 clicks. And the first click is so ridiculously slow that I have not met anyone else use it, except me.

 

I think it is because Destroyers are the most 'tanky' in that it is very hard for them to die, similar to summoner, so lower attack in exchange for their higher defence.

Tanky and low dps ? BM is the master of tank and the mast of dps right now, Summoner is good tanker with a 2nd or 3rd place in dps?

Destroyer is tankey only for 10 second every 45 second using defensive emberstomp which make us lack in dps again or either we can just can keeep spin and spin and more spin without dps

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26 minutes ago, Valiant said:

Tanky and low dps ? BM is the master of tank and the mast of dps right now, Summoner is good tanker with a 2nd or 3rd place in dps?

Destroyer is tankey only for 10 second every 45 second using defensive emberstomp which make us lack in dps again or either we can just can keeep spin and spin and more spin without dps

Tanky as in it is very hard for them to die. If BM, BD makes some mistake they will probably die straight away. But for destroyer they can afford to make some mistake and live.

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On 11/9/2016 at 3:58 PM, DevilTDriver said:

What's the whole reason for Destros having low multipliers? Is it the CCs?

 

You know what they should do. Have it so if you spec the Iframe 1 and 2, you get 50% more damage on your skills. The iframes are completely unviable in pvp, so it makes sense to up multipliers to compensate.

Well, we lose very little of our pve dps abilities when speccing for pvp. Compare this to BD who gives up a lot of their draw stance stuff. Also, our damage delivery is fairly easy to get off, just be in melee range. I suppose they could buff pve ember somehow but that and iframe 1 are like the only things that would generally be considered 'unviable' in a pvp spec. Which is why they just changed to gear based balancing instead I imagine. Future gear gives us tons of multipliers that work together for the rmb skills which make up like 60% of our damage already along with giving us more wrath time.

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4 hours ago, SoulsHunter said:

Tanky as in it is very hard for them to die. If BM, BD makes some mistake they will probably die straight away. But for destroyer they can afford to make some mistake and live.

But that is a fallacy. Once the game learning curve is done the innate defense bonus destroyers have starts becoming irrelevant (even moreso when we include pet defensive bonus). It's true tabspin is a great defensive tool, it can be easily compared to block/counter/Q/E other classes have, but it's 0sec cooldown is more than offset negatively by Des having no Godmode button in form of prolonged iframes.

Classes have to be judged based on their max capacity, not players on their learning curve.

57 minutes ago, Stensatsu said:

Future gear gives us....

Yeah, future gear. Gear that will come out mid 2017 if they push content REALLY hard. I'd daresay it will be even longer than that.

Meantime Destroyers have been "45lvlcap BM" level of bad for a while now.

They are getting left behind even more with Midnight plains - Yes, instead of catching up they're getting objectively NERFED compared to other classes.

And that will not change. Reroll to another class or quit the game are your only solutions if you don't want to be a cripple.

 

Edited by GenericNick

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11 hours ago, GenericNick said:

Classes have to be judged based on their max capacity, not players on their learning curve.

And by max capacity what do you mean? Innate defense, defensive skills, party protect, healing, etc does not count? Because everyone can iframe everything themselves without fail every single time?

 

If that is the case, you are giving quite a scary argument. Becuase that means summoner dps and cc duration should be buffed back to how it was, because even though they are hard to die and have utlities, it does not count. FM divine veil and frost armor healing should also be buffed back to how it was, because it does not count.

 

I would also like to request KFM HM block to be accessible right from the start since it only helps during the learning curve. In theory someone who is perfect don't need HM block, they can block everything with normal elbow smash.

 

In that case Destroyers tab can be nerfed too, because you can spec 1 and 2 and c to iframe. And at the end of the learning curve in theory someone who is perfect can do it every single time.

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13 hours ago, GenericNick said:

But that is a fallacy. Once the game learning curve is done the innate defense bonus destroyers have starts becoming irrelevant (even moreso when we include pet defensive bonus). It's true tabspin is a great defensive tool, it can be easily compared to block/counter/Q/E other classes have, but it's 0sec cooldown is more than offset negatively by Des having no Godmode button in form of prolonged iframes.

Classes have to be judged based on their max capacity, not players on their learning curve.

Yeah, future gear. Gear that will come out mid 2017 if they push content REALLY hard. I'd daresay it will be even longer than that.

Meantime Destroyers have been "45lvlcap BM" level of bad for a while now.

They are getting left behind even more with Midnight plains - Yes, instead of catching up they're getting objectively NERFED compared to other classes.

And that will not change. Reroll to another class or quit the game are your only solutions if you don't want to be a cripple.

 

Believe me, I hold no delusions on how shitty Des is in pve right now. You can look through my posts if you want lol. Just saying that it is fixed later. (A lot later.)

 

Also, C is a pretty long ass iframe. Same with Fury or Q.

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12 hours ago, SoulsHunter said:

If that is the case, you are giving quite a scary argument. Becuase that means summoner dps and cc duration should be buffed back to how it was, because even though they are hard to die and have utlities, it does not count. FM divine veil and frost armor healing should also be buffed back to how it was, because it does not count.

I've re-read this whole thread including my previous posts, and as much as I try, I can't fathom what kind of logic made you arrive at these conclusions.

12 hours ago, SoulsHunter said:

In that case Destroyers tab can be nerfed too, because you can spec 1 and 2 and c to iframe. And at the end of the learning curve in theory someone who is perfect can do it every single time.

Yeah but here's the deal: destro C is the only "iframe for the sake of Iframe" skill. Iframes on 1 (lolyeahright), 2 and E have / V block have other uses. Other classes have to sacrifice some skill effects for iframes too, yes, but they are mobile while dpsing, have short cooldown Q/E/blocks or access to a Godmode button. If you expect a destro to do his job properly ( double stun joints, using E on dps opportunity not as an iframe), in your "nerf tabspin" scenario he'd have to rely on C as the very single defensive skill. Considering that destroyer is immobile while dealing damage, it's impossible no matter how perfect you are at skill execution. No matter how you look at it tabspin is essential, and in no ways superior to defensive means at other classes disposal. This is super simple to understand stuff, I'm sure if you try really hard you can do it.

 

10 hours ago, Stensatsu said:

Believe me, I hold no delusions on how shitty Des is in pve right now. You can look through my posts if you want lol. Just saying that it is fixed later. (A lot later.)

 

Also, C is a pretty long ass iframe. Same with Fury or Q.

Agree on C, disagree on E (has to be used when you can get the most of it) and Q (a cooldown on 1 minute is longer than other classes multi-hit 3-5 second iframes and let's face it Q is way inferior to those)

 

But about the shittyness of des in pve thing - it's just weird seeing time after time people excusing des current situation with buffs they're getting in the future because: 1. Des is not getting the "BM treatment" to compensate for past crappiness, it just goes from trash tier to OK-ish, and 2. It's so far ahead, that it's in fact very unlikely Not to have another skill change patch released that we will get even though it will Again balance around asian progress level.

Edited by GenericNick

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30 minutes ago, GenericNick said:

I've re-read this whole thread including my previous posts, and as much as I try, I can't fathom what kind of logic made you arrive at these conclusions.

I have read my previous posts too, I only suggested that the low dps of destroyer could be due to how 'tanky' it is, ok maybe I should use another word: durable. Thats all.

 

Personally I would prefer destroyer to have some new skill stages for some those that can't be used for boss fights. E.g. power slam, axe sweep, headbutt, hurl. If there are new branch we can spec into that would be great.

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5 hours ago, GenericNick said:

C, disagree on E (has to be used when you can get the most of it) and Q (a cooldown on 1 minute is longer than other classes multi-hit 3-5 second iframes and let's face it Q is way inferior to those)

 

But about the shittyness of des in pve thing - it's just weird seeing time after time people excusing des current situation with buffs they're getting in the future because: 1. Des is not getting the "BM treatment" to compensate for past crappiness, it just goes from trash tier to OK-ish, and 2. It's so far ahead, that it's in fact very unlikely Not to have another skill change patch released that we will get even though it will Again balance around asian progress level.

Ya, our iframes aren't as good as other classes but tab makes up for it in pve at least and makes us slightly different in pvp. BD has spin+q/e iframes but they don't get the long duration iframes in pve spec normally and don't have the 'anytime' damage or chain cc of des in pvp.

 

And ya, not excusing current situation. Just saying we aren't likely to see skill buffs based on NAs situation and that, if you really like Des, there is some light at the end of the tunnel.

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Valiant   
2 hours ago, Stensatsu said:

Ya, our iframes aren't as good as other classes but tab makes up for it in pve at least and makes us slightly different in pvp. BD has spin+q/e iframes but they don't get the long duration iframes in pve spec normally and don't have the 'anytime' damage or chain cc of des in pvp.

 

And ya, not excusing current situation. Just saying we aren't likely to see skill buffs based on NAs situation and that, if you really like Des, there is some light at the end of the tunnel.

But the shit DPS we got also affect our pvp in open world like 6v6  , Like people can just kill me easily while I can't bypass their defense with my low shit dps

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