Killtrades a sort of Exploit ?!

[Latarius]

I just had a "flamewar" in faction chat, cause I caught some ppl trading kills for 10/10 faction daylie.

I know this from almost any other game, that this acting is a sort of cheating/Exploiting and where all the time a reason for a bann.

It is a sort of rankfarming in my opinien, and I guess we wont get a answer from NCSoft, but what u think of this.

 

The Quest should be a challange/training to get some fun for the open pvp lover faction.

This just cut more of the open PvP Content, if more and more ppl just met behind the big Tree and trade there kills. this ppl dont stay in the PvP Area and so some of us cant do the quest or cant "hunt" for fun.

Dont get me wrong. I DONT wanna hunt "bambis" (new players), I want some Fun chasing enemys, and the feeling of open PvP, and funny wise, the Kill trader are NOT the new ppl. they are ppl with good gear and 50k hp+

 

Almost Everyone is complaining about anything like Endgame Content, missing Fun, game mechanics and more. but most of the things is cause of us all and/or HOW WE ACT in games.

 

Feel free to diskuss, but no offense ...

 

[Maxwell Blackmor]

So because killtrading isn't challenging it should be bannable (@native speakers: does this word even exist?^^)?

Killing people in open pvp is more like "10v1 and the lucky one last hitting gets the count for the quest". If you even find enough players to get the quest done. Mostly I don't. No thrill of the hunt, not fair, nothing.

It is just a daily for about 2 soulstones and you don't abuse any mechanics here.

[Quantum]

Well, they're doing it how you're intended to do it which is to kill opposing players.  Just in a much friendlier way, what's wrong with that?

[Victorion]

Killtrading is an exploit - clearly.

 

It´s obvious the quest wasn´t designed as a killtrade - and factions werent designed for it either.

 

It´s Player vs Player - not Player helping Player doing round-abouts.

[RoXor]

Question for me is why you people do that?! Its is not even money/time efficient. You can do thousand things to earn more money than for those( 2 or 3?)  soulstones in that time.

[Els]

2 minutes ago, RoXor said:

Question for me is why you people do that?! Its is not even money/time efficient. You can do thousand things to earn more money than for those( 2 or 3?)  soulstones in that time.

Agreed, on EU 1 SS is like 23~25 silver. Unless it's a bus vs a bus, it takes quite a long time just for 2 SS, and even if we have mass pvp, well... still feels like a waste of time for me. Kill trading, killing an afk and reviving him to kill him again still takes a lot of time. Well it does not feel worth it for me, I just keep the quest and it will be done someday, just an extra 2 SS...

Kill trading is lame and boring, plus the reward is not that interesting. Maybe they want the achievement and the mask ?

[Aevri]

Last livestream stated kiltrade is "not cool". And said thing relate to punishing to players that do that? I can't remember. Go watch it yourself.

[Kerialstraz]

Killtrading is not worth the time it takes. People only do it in larger groups (3 prople) to get it done faster.

 

I don't think it is an exploit. Having a fractionquest asking you to kill 10 opposing players while you're gourp has to have luck getting the lasthit on 10 enemies is simply stupid in 2016. Killtrading simply saves time and nerves for everybody.

[Victorion]

6 minutes ago, Kerialstraz said:

Killtrading is not worth the time it takes. People only do it in larger groups (3 prople) to get it done faster.

 

I don't think it is an exploit. Having a fractionquest asking you to kill 10 opposing players while you're gourp has to have luck getting the lasthit on 10 enemies is simply stupid in 2016. Killtrading simply saves time and nerves for everybody.

No. You´re just trying to justify it by fabricated sense-reasoning for your exploit.

 

Faction quests was designed with faction-contested areas, where you fight faction vs faction for control and dominance - not carebear frindly style, holding hands and asking an enemy to let him kill you, and then he may kill you back in turn ... 10 times in a row... every day.

 

Clearly exploit.

 

Being on a hugely underpopulated faction myself, I find myself loving this quest. As I have plenty of people to kill, and whenever there´s opposite faction doing blackwyrm or terrors, it´s easy to get 10 kills in just a few minutes.

[Latarius]

3 minutes ago, Victorion said:

No. You´re just trying to justify it by fabricated sense-reasoning for your exploit.

 

Faction quests was designed with faction-contested areas, where you fight faction vs faction for control and dominance - not carebear frindly style, holding hands and asking an enemy to let him kill you, and then he may kill you back in turn ... 10 times in a row... every day.

 

Clearly exploit.

 

Being on a hugely underpopulated faction myself, I find myself loving this quest. As I have plenty of people to kill, and whenever there´s opposite faction doing blackwyrm or terrors, it´s easy to get 10 kills in just a few minutes.

no offense pls ^^ its just his opinien, but I agree

But it the thing is, that this acting cuts the only open PvP we have, ppls that finish there quests usualy dont come back.

And If u have done alle daylies/dungeons open pvp hunt is the only thing u can do, except arena ok. but the lags, and hacks + bots arent that funny.

[Maxwell Blackmor]

Well.. it might be "not cool". But it works as intended. Players killing players. There is no exploit. If we go down this road:

Killing afk bots in Arena is an exploit, since the intention is to have a thrilling fight.

NOT killing people in open world: clearly an exploit since (as said) "[...] fighting for control and dominance - not carebear friendly style.".

 

We could find much more than that. If killtrading is an exploit then many more things also are.

[Els]

Just wondering here, if a faction is camping all channels to get this done, and the other faction for some reasons cannot have enough people to fight back, do we call that griefing since they prevent players from doing their quests ? Or working as intended ? I don't know.

[Victorion]

7 minutes ago, Maxwell Blackmor said:

Well.. it might be "not cool". But it works as intended. Players killing players. There is no exploit. If we go down this road:

Killing afk bots in Arena is an exploit, since the intention is to have a thrilling fight.

NOT killing people in open world: clearly an exploit since (as said) "[...] fighting for control and dominance - not carebear friendly style.".

 

We could find much more than that. If killtrading is an exploit then many more things also are.

You can not compare killings bots in the Arena - as the same as arranged kill-trades.

 

Bots in arena is not something you planned for, or have any control over.

 

Planning a kill-trade with an opposite faction player. Meeting up in a remote corner where there usually are no other faction players to undisturbed killing eachother in turns 10 times EACH.

 

Not comparable. Not by intention nor by method.

[Latarius]

I guess NCSoft wouldnt do anything if its an exploit, cause they would just lost more paying player. but Usualy in any other mmo u could be get a ban for this.

[Victorion]

1 minute ago, Els said:

Just wondering here, if a faction is camping all channels to get this done, and the other faction for some reasons cannot have enough people to fight back, do we call that griefing since they prevent players from doing their quests ? Or working as intended ? I don't know.

Nope, it´s called OWpvp.

All we can ask NCsoft is some automated faction balance in active players.

 

Alot of the servers (including mine) is very unbalanced in a ratio of 6:1.

 

You´re not required to do PvP quests - it´s something you can do if you enjoy it. It´s not like it halts your leveling progress or otherwise disables you from general content of the game. To be honest, it´s sickening to hear so many carebears, preaching about in-ability to do pvp-quests without being forced to pvp.

Stop doing PvPquests if you don´t want to pvp!

If you want to complain, complain about the faction balance.

[Kerialstraz]

21 minutes ago, Victorion said:

No. You´re just trying to justify it by fabricated sense-reasoning for your exploit.

 

Faction quests was designed with faction-contested areas, where you fight faction vs faction for control and dominance - not carebear frindly style, holding hands and asking an enemy to let him kill you, and then he may kill you back in turn ... 10 times in a row... every day.

 

Clearly exploit.

 

Being on a hugely underpopulated faction myself, I find myself loving this quest. As I have plenty of people to kill, and whenever there´s opposite faction doing blackwyrm or terrors, it´s easy to get 10 kills in just a few minutes.

No, it is not an exploit. Dragging afk players from the safezone is an exploit, but players killing eachother in another area is not.

Killtrading even goes by your reasoning "fighting faction versus faction", only two or more people  kill eachother due to shared goals. That's the same as doing dailies with a partymember being in the opposing faction.

 

It is NOT an exploit.

[Maxwell Blackmor]

12 minutes ago, Victorion said:

Not comparable. Not by intention nor by method.

You argued why killtrading is an exploit. You argued that it is not intended. There is no difference. Maybe with the bots, but the not killing people in owpvp. Exactly the same argument of you. Against intention and by choice.

So why isn't that an exploit?

[Victorion]

On 18/3/2016 at 4:43 AM, Kerialstraz said:

No, it is not an exploit. Dragging afk players from the safezone is an exploit, but players killing eachother in another area is not.

Killtrading even goes by your reasoning "fighting faction versus faction", only two or more people  kill eachother due to shared goals. That's the same as doing dailies with a partymember being in the opposing faction.

 

It is NOT an exploit.

You´re still just trying to fabricate sense-reasoning for your own benefit. The way you describe it, leaves out the most important factor.

You say “players killing eachother in another area is not an exploit”

No that´s not an exploit in it self. However

“players doing arranged kill-trades in a remote desolated area to skip the PvP-part is an exploit”

It´s no different than players that got banned for exploiting the Ogong Door, skipping parts of the dungeon. You´re skipping the hardest part of the PvP quest, by completing it without PvP.

 

And that´s because you can not truly call “let me kill you 10 times, and then you kill me 10 times” – PvP.

It´s a kill-trade and generally MMO´s forbid this type of behaviour both for quest reward and rank rewards.
 

On 18/3/2016 at 4:50 AM, Maxwell Blackmor said:

You argued why killtrading is an exploit. You argued that it is not intended. There is no difference. Maybe with the bots, but the not killing people in owpvp. Exactly the same argument of you. Against intention and by choice.

So why isn't that an exploit?

Because if you´re going into the Arena, you have no control over who you are going to be matched up against, and you did not install the bot either. It happens entirely without your control, and your intention wasn´t to get matched up against one either.

 

Kill-trade is by intent - preplanned and arranged. With quite some efforts may I add.

 

The intent on kill-trade is clear, and the method (by asking around in Region chat) clearly shows your intent as well.

 

Not comparable - and please stop pretending not to understand something as simple as this. - If you don´t like PvP, then don´t do faction quests.

If you want soulstones, then run some dungeons and buy them off marketplace. They are cheap anyways.

[TmXx]

Laught out my ass + going to mad ... I cant trust this much complaining about everything ! Exploit is abuse something but ask som1 to help me w my quest ?? Its a joke ... and a bad joke . Its looks like better bann every1 and close the server cuz u do anything u abuse the system. Never see this much cry and complaining in other game forums in the past !! Maybe i going to older or the other players are younger ? Who know ...  But i have my char i maded it i work with it so i can decide if i let som1 kill me or not ... if i wanna i just stay in the game on a whole day afk and let others to kill me!!!!! I gonna sick of what i see every day in here...

If i kick som1 from pt cuz of low ap i will abuse the set check system or if i buy something from npc then sell in ah 2 3x more prices i abuse the market ? If some 1 wanna kill me and i use escape i abuse the escape system ?? and the biggest joke if som1 is afk on the trees and i grab him down i abuse the wallrun skill or  ??? WHATS NEXT ????   ROFL

[Quantum]

14 hours ago, Victorion said:

It´s no different than players that got banned for exploiting the Ogong Door, skipping parts of the dungeon. You´re skipping the hardest part of the PvP quest, by completing it without PvP.

Eh, I beg to differ.  Players were exploiting a bug in Ogong, while trade killing isn't a bug and they're playing it by the game's rules.  Even if both players had to fight, they could just plan a 1v1 with someone open world and then purposely lose.

[Latarius]

Exploiting means you do something that wasnt planed or indend to work that way, that doenst just mean a bug, or a mistake within the engine/mechanic.

 

This is a Question of morality, Why u have to betray urself by doing this (cause all do) for just a tiny reward, thats something like "fairplay"

 

Look, U all complain about gettin zerged here and there, and sometimes all the time. But If u killtrade, you FORCE this.

Its plain and simple, as fast ppl get there quests done as fast there gone. The Issue is. If you and ur team wanna have fun in open world PvP you NEED to rush single ppl, other wise you would stay and stay in mistywood waiting for more then one opponent. Cause the ppl that could do PvP are just killtrade there quests.

 

And Like I mentioned at first, NO BAMBIS go kill trade, no, ppls with 60 -70k hp and 400ap+ are usual the ones.

And what happens next ? right, the bored ones just zerg and grind the "bambi" player. they start to cry, you start to laught about them with comments like l2p your class, they decide to change the faction to the side that dominates, the other sides start to complain more and more ...

I dont say its just cause "killtrades" but we already have such a toxic community, and its gettin worse and worse with every new mmo.

 

So you should realy start to look over the edge of your little world.

[Nilkemios]

So, you think players agreeing to trade kills for a daily is exploiting....no. Wrong.

 

While it may not be what NCSoft intended, no hacks or glitches are being used in this situation. Just two or more players from both sides agreeing to work together to get one annoying faction daily out of the way...at least that's how I imagine it works, since I've not seen it.

 

If people want to do that, I don't see any problem with that...this game has too many real problems to deal with right now.

[Victorion]

On 19/3/2016 at 0:43 PM, Nilkemios said:

So, you think players agreeing to trade kills for a daily is exploiting....no. Wrong.

 

While it may not be what NCSoft intended, no hacks or glitches are being used in this situation. Just two or more players from both sides agreeing to work together to get one annoying faction daily out of the way...at least that's how I imagine it works, since I've not seen it.

 

If people want to do that, I don't see any problem with that...this game has too many real problems to deal with right now.

Kill-Trade is obviously an exploit.

 

Trying to fabricate reasons of sense, why you could justify doing this exploit – does not make it any less of an exploit.

 

You skip the PvP part by not engaging into PvP, when you kill-trade. You´re basically cheating/exploiting in order to recieve quest reward.

You´re boosting your faction rank, without doing faction contested play.

 

It´s not different than Ogong door exploit, where you skip minibosses to get to the main boss.

 

Or .... Did the quest say

“Use the Region channel and continously make spam requests to an enemy faction player till you find someone who is willingly going to let you kill him 10 times without a fight. Ofcourse you need to let him kill you 10 times over as well and then you shall be rewarded with soulstones - for a job well done!”

[Hatsunya]

Who the heck cares if someplayers want to do it fast way and trade it. theres nothing wrong with it. If you want to hunt down opposite faction players you're free to do so but so is those who want to killtrade quest.

[Victorion]

30 minutes ago, Hatsunya said:

Who the heck cares if someplayers want to do it fast way and trade it. theres nothing wrong with it. If you want to hunt down opposite faction players you're free to do so but so is those who want to killtrade quest.

Couldn´t the same argument be used for Ogong door exploit - which alot of players recieved bans for?