Compensation?

[Baby Vivie]

34 minutes ago, Bamalter said:

False Advertising..... and Whales want the Heptas.. thats why they put cash in the trove. If u buy something and u never have the chance to get it, thats not a fraud? Thats not a reason for a full compensation?

wow, good job picking only part of something stated and running with it.  full comp huh.  for all the keys used that would have been none crits even?  for all the keys that would have been used for getting crap on those none crits?  no, not a full comp, just replace the ones that would have been crits, and thats about 1/20, and let them reroll the crits.  but, ohhhhh,  the ones for hepta, even if things were working 100% right, thats like 1/50 keys. so maybe they should only get 2 keys per 100.  look at the big picture, they should not, no one should, not even me, should get 100% comp.  folks already spent gold on those crits, hepta or not, already sold the stuff they could, hepta or not.  comp, should be a free key for the number of crits that they should have gotten, hepta or not.  stop trying to get everyone on the band wagon for something for free crap.  comp does not = free.  getting keys for what should/could have happened is fair.  getting double keys for a mistake that really was not that huge, bad deal.  usually 2 mega crits per 100 keys used, about 5 crits in total on average.  the issue was the crits, not every roll. comp should be for only the crits.  stop trying to be a mega mooch,

[Gabyyy]

12 minutes ago, Weissmann said:

The thing is we players pay to get the keys and we got the product. The keys are a chance at getting something in Trove and we were fully aware of the risks. However, there was no probability stated anywhere that you would be guaranteed to get a specific item(s). Nor did they advertise it so.  Additionally, we would have never found out about the issue; if they had not announced that this was, in fact, a mistake on their end. So just be thankful that they are fixing it and willing to compensate those who spent money on keys. They're trying to fix the game without breaking the game. A full refund or compensation would be like saying you gambled with your money and you lost. Now you want your money back. I wholeheartedly agree with everything Baby Vivie has said.

 

 

You see things in a tunnel. When you buy ~100-200 keys its rng when you buy 1000-2000 keys, it's not rng anymore. Please. 

[Weissmann]

13 minutes ago, Gabyyy said:

 

You see things in a tunnel. When you buy ~100-200 keys its rng when you buy 1000-2000 keys, it's not rng anymore. Please. 

That was very illogical of you. When you buy 1000-2000 keys, it is still RNG. The probability of getting the items remains the same. I mean I completely understand how devastating it is to spend your money to not get anywhere or what you wanted. I feel for people who spent a lot on a faulty trove. But that is why they are coming up with some kind of fair compensation.

 

 

[Bamalter]

Where heptas in the Trove? Did they got advertised? Case closed! ....

[Neddih]

How can you possibly use a blanket number saying only 1 out of 50 is a crit and that's all you should get back? Technically you can crit on all 50 keys so I don't understand this reasoning.

 

That being said, I do feel like 100% compensation is a bit much, but only going by the assumed number of crits seems wrong also.

[KzE]

Now i see how many people buy their gear :D

[Baby Vivie]

again, pulled 1 part of a whole statement.  average is 1/20 is a crit, 1/50 is a mega lucky crit.  and if crits where the issue, that could be the comp, nothing more.

2nd, % is not ever 100%.  even if you got 1000-2000 keys, there is a % chance you still get no crits at all.  nothing anywhere says you will get a crit in "X" number of keys.  not one statement from any BNS or NCsoft document states that you WILL get a crit every so many keys.  grow up mooches, cry more.

as for the statement about hepta being advertised, yes, they where advertised, yes, no one saw them.  if thats all your concerned about, you chould only get keys = to the average number of times those pop up normally, 1/50.  look at whole picture lol, acting like my youngest 4 kids

[FrozenB]

25 minutes ago, Weissmann said:

The thing is we players pay to get the keys and we got the product. The keys are a chance at getting something in Trove and we were fully aware of the risks. However, there was no probability stated anywhere that you would be guaranteed to get a specific item(s). Nor did they advertise it so.  Additionally, we would have never found out about the issue; if they had not announced that this was, in fact, a mistake on their end. So just be thankful that they are fixing it and willing to compensate those who spent money on keys. They're trying to fix the game without breaking the game. A full refund or compensation would be like saying you gambled with your money and you lost. Now you want your money back. I wholeheartedly agree with everything Baby Vivie has said.

 

 

This is so true. In fact, they could just tell you guys "you were just unlucky." and then secretly fix the rate at their end. We, the players, would never have known about the issues in the first place because after they secretly fix the rate, people will start to hit on the hepta gems and make other players think that they were just unlucky.

 

So, instead of barking on the forum, just be patient and see what will they do about it.

 

For the people who said "full refunds on the keys used, plus keeping the items we got from trove.", I can only say 'never underestimate the greediness of human beings'.

[SpeaksTooFast]

A rollback would not have been terrible if it had happened within an hour or two of the issue being discovered.  At this point too much has gone by in game for that to be a solution for a problem that was on their end (not exploiters) that they can fix with a refund.  Do I expect a full refund... no, my experience with their "customer service" has been mixed at best and I am very curious to see what their plans are.  That being said, if I find their response to be as lacking as with previous issues I'm planning planning to cancel the last few charges and if I still have an account it will be fully F2P going forward.

[Neddih]

I made a rational comment in the discussion and the response sounds like the real angry child.

 

Im not mooching nor mad about the situation, I just came here to discuss this, ill stop wasting my time here though.

[Charas]

1 hour ago, Youmukon said:

Hello,

 

We'll be posting more details regarding Trove compensation extremely soon. Please bear with us! We are currently ensuring that the Trove fix is perfectly working before giving all the details.

 

Thank you for your patience and understanding!

I'm hoping the compensation will be great enough to refrain anyone to sue NCSoft. Some people might go full white knight and say NCSoft is not at fault here. But selling a gamble for real life money and saying it has a chance to give you something it cannot is called scamming. I believe you well know what are the risks for you... 

[Draknalor]

Hotfix is coming

 

 

 

[Bamalter]

Greed? Ok, do the Rollback take the items away and than i wait here for u guys to come back and cry!

Now u all try to argue why 5% 10% 50% etc. keys back is fair. But its so random what u think is fair. Its ur opinon. Just go with the facts pls... Where heptas in the Trove? Did they got advertised? Case closed!

[Weissmann]

2 minutes ago, Bamalter said:

 

 

Greed? Ok, do the Rollback take the items away and than i wait here for u guys to come back and cry!

Now u all try to argue why 5% 10% 50% etc. keys back is fair. But its so random what u think is fair. Its ur opinon. Just go with the facts pls... Where heptas in the Trove? Did they got advertised? Case closed!

7

Now now, nowhere did they advertise there were going to be heptagonal gems in this trove. Nor did they advertise if ANYTHING was going to be in there. Or if we were going to have one until the very last minute on the maintenance post. Additionally, did they did tell you that you were going to get them for sure after a certain amount of keys? No. The moment you got the keys was also the moment you decided to take the risk to invest in it; hoping for what you want or something of value in return. Nothing is guaranteed in Trove. You should have been prepared that you may not get the gems even though it is in there... We assumed we were going to have a trove. We assumed we would be able to score some heptagonal gems from trove. Now that they did not meet our expectations, we are going to throw a fit? They are trying to come up with a fair compensation for those who spent money on keys.

 

 

[Draknalor]

Hotfix is coming

 

 

 

[Weissmann]

7 minutes ago, Draknalor said:

 

 

 

I do not know what you consider "Advertise" But it does say on this page that gems would be involved http://www.bladeandsoul.com/en/news/spring-treasure-trove/  .

 

If you read carefully instead of nitpicking my post, you would see that they did not announce the arrival of Trove until the last minute when the maintenance post was up. That announcement was actually posted, after the maintenance, right before Trove began. Prior to maintenance, there was no information about this trove. The list was also not released until after Trove began.

[Bamalter]

3 minutes ago, Weissmann said:

Now now, nowhere did they advertise there were going to be heptagonal gems in this trove. Nor did they advertise if ANYTHING was going to be in there. Or if we were going to have one until the very last minute on the maintenance post. Additionally, did they did tell you that you were going to get them for sure after a certain amount of keys? No. The moment you got the keys was also the moment you decided to take the risk to invest in it; hoping for what you want or something of value in return. Nothing is guaranteed in Trove. You should have been prepared that you may not get the gems even though it is in there...

 

 

They where in the official announcement for the trove! They got advertised! I bought the chance to get one. But the product i got was another one, one without the chance... I hope u now understand the difference. And why its a fraud! I was prepared to be unlucky! But i got scamed! Lucky thing it wasn´t on purpose. Not cause the scamer is a bad guy. Just cause he is stupid... Still realy simple case.

[Draknalor]

7 minutes ago, Weissmann said:

Now now, nowhere did they advertise there were going to be heptagonal gems in this trove. Nor did they advertise if ANYTHING was going to be in there. Or if we were going to have one until the very last minute on the maintenance post. Additionally, did they did tell you that you were going to get them for sure after a certain amount of keys? No. The moment you got the keys was also the moment you decided to take the risk to invest in it; hoping for what you want or something of value in return. Nothing is guaranteed in Trove. You should have been prepared that you may not get the gems even though it is in there... We assumed we were going to have a trove. We assumed we would be able to score some heptagonal gems from trove. Now that they did not meet our expectations, we are going to throw a fit? They are trying to come up with a fair compensation for those who spent money on keys.

 

 

I do not know what you consider "Advertise" But it does say on this page that gems would be involved http://www.bladeandsoul.com/en/news/spring-treasure-trove/  .

 

[Bamalter]

Just now, Baby Vivie said:

actually they did.  even on the game they showed heptas,  when you hit the trove button, there is a button that looks like a sheet of paper.  hit that, they are right on it, a ways down from the hexa gems tho.  and ty weissmann and frozen.  im happy to see folks with some form of common sense/grown up mentality.

as for folks who want to comment like "wont waist time here", crying is not talking about things logically or talking about fair comp.  its giving a opinion, nothing more.  saying a statement with out facts to back it up, is still, just an opinion.  not giving a reason for a thought process is still just an opinion also.  so yes, stop acting like 5yo children who want with out reason or thought of why or how or who it might effect acting like that.  the world is not fair, and NCsoft is trying to make it a little more fair for cry babies who are trying to blow things out of proportion with out seeing the big picture or how bad it could have been.  frozen was right, they could have done a ninja fix and let all of those who spent way to much in 1 day of trove feel they where just unlucky.

Ok mastermind tell me what is the right amount auf refound? And why? And now dont tell me ur opinion. We know that! Tell me some facts, some real logic why that amount. U cant its all random. If u agree that there should be a refound than the only way is 100% or full rollback of the servers.

[Baby Vivie]

actually they did.  even on the game they showed heptas,  when you hit the trove button, there is a button that looks like a sheet of paper.  hit that, they are right on it, a ways down from the hexa gems tho.  and ty weissmann and frozen.  im happy to see folks with some form of common sense/grown up mentality.

as for folks who want to comment like "wont waist time here", crying is not talking about things logically or talking about fair comp.  its giving a opinion, nothing more.  saying a statement with out facts to back it up, is still, just an opinion.  not giving a reason for a thought process is still just an opinion also.  so yes, stop acting like 5yo children who want with out reason or thought of why or how or who it might effect acting like that.  the world is not fair, and NCsoft is trying to make it a little more fair for cry babies who are trying to blow things out of proportion with out seeing the big picture or how bad it could have been.  frozen was right, they could have done a ninja fix and let all of those who spent way to much in 1 day of trove feel they where just unlucky.

[Weissmann]

You should not expect certain items from an event that is not a guarantee. Otherwise, you are just lying and fooling yourselves.

[Baby Vivie]

12 minutes ago, Bamalter said:

Ok mastermind tell me what is the right amount auf refound? And why? And now dont tell me ur opinion. We know that! Tell me some facts, some real logic why that amount. U cant its all random. If u agree that there should be a refound than the only way is 100% or full rollback of the servers.

dude....  really, have you not been reading......  after watching maybe 65 or so videos of this trove and past troves out of being deathly bored, its about 1/20 for a crit in many cases, and about 1/50 for a good crit worth talking about.  as has been stated many times.  so, fair comp would be a free key = to 1/20, hepta or not, you still got something from those other crits, have already put stuff on market that you got with those keys, even the none crits.  if doing what you wanted, 100% return of keys, you would be getting a lot for free that you did not pay for in anyway shape or form.  the only way i would say 100% of all keys refunded that where used, is if they took EVERYTHING you gained from the purchases in the trove back, AND all gold you got from market from the items you sold that where earned from the trove, that would put you back to 100% refunded.  you having your keys and you having nothing gained from they keys you used already.  both options are fair.  so, what one would you want?  either way i would not care.  the main argument has been getting all the keys back while still keeping all you already got.  something you never once argued that you where or where not after, stop trying to cry for more then you need/earned/spent in game or in RL.

[Bladesoyun]

give me 8 guaranteed crit keys on 200 I used with a good chance to get hepta and I am happy with it.

The fact is that many folks like me bought and used keys just for the gems as I have the rest, and instead I didn't get any on 200 keys...I would ask for a total rollback, but I understand it's not a reasonable request, so I think something like I said in the upper lines will do. soirry for my bad english

 

[Sealin]

It is not really a matter of false advertising, but product liability laws.

This trove departed from its intended design (already confirmed by BnS administration)  and it was sold as such (exchange via ncoin has cause-effect and monetary value) - so the product liability is clear.

Which legally does not leave much options - the customers (players) would have to agree on anything else than full compensation.

And since we access BnS based on adhesion contract, we have quite a few laws and institutions protecting us in this case.

 

[Baby Vivie]

you did get crits with the keys you already had, bet you bought something on those crits also

even if things where working 100%, its not 100% that on any of those crits you would have seen a hepta