Destroyer vs Blade dancer (Balance game)

[Rawst]

1 hour ago, OMGLOL said:

 

ty confirming exactly what i just said, destroyer = 2 stun escape, bd = 1

You absolutely cannot take the 2 escape option when you are fighting a BD because that would mean you give up fury for a 1 minute cd stun/daze escape.

 

BD's have a plethora of different ways of keeping distance and playing passively until their cds are up. 

 

Destroyers HAVE to catch BDs with a all-or-nothing burst combo to chunk the BD down because they lack the guarantee damage setups that BDs possess. If Des tries to exchange even blows with BD, they will lose via attrition. 

[Valiant]

2 hours ago, Fantality said:

 you are a total idiot. aside from your overload of saltiness found in your very childish "talk to the wall" kind of attitude you are writing down attributes of destroyers that bd also has and using them in this discussion.

 

both class has spin

both class has vortex

typhoon? im guessing this is the red spin which is totally worthless in 1v1's

hurricane is our defensive spin

 

not only did you write down commonly shared skills between des and bd but 3 of the 4 written down goes into the single category of your first item: spin. so you're trying your hardest, but to no avail, to inflate the list to try and draw the discussion in your favor. let me say this again, you are a total idiot. 

I did mention the common skills between them to show you the *cricket*ing difference between them

For example *cricket*ing hurl can be cast during grab for both of them, for BD it cost nothing and it cast instance and it don't have any tree point and able to knock you back 15m with Unconscious status 

While Hurl for destroyer need atleast 2 points so it put the enemy into Unconscious status and it cast time is around 2 second, 2 *cricket*ing second.

 

As for Spin because SpinToWin is more like a defensive skill more than any attacking skill, I was comparing the escapes and protection between BD and destroyer.

 

BD got 2 immunes, Vortex, Escape from grab 1 min cooldown, 35 second cooldown for stun, Q, E and SS switch.

 

While destroyer need to gave up on fury for 1 min cooldown for stun/daze only escape,35 second escape for Grab/stun/daze , 1 Iframe + SS leap back + SpinToWin which is 45second or 1 min cooldown and ofcourse the useless spin tab.

 

talk to me about balance now, That destroyer with much escape will gave up on his fury damage just for escape while BD either way will have high damage light skills + grab Blades that do tons of damage,

 

 

So again ? Which one is op ?

[Valiant]

2 hours ago, Rawst said:

You absolutely cannot take the 2 escape option when you are fighting a BD because that would mean you give up fury for a 1 minute cd stun/daze escape.

 

BD's have a plethora of different ways of keeping distance and playing passively until their cds are up. 

 

Destroyers HAVE to catch BDs with a all-or-nothing burst combo to chunk the BD down because they lack the guarantee damage setups that BDs possess. If Des tries to exchange even blows with BD, they will lose via attrition. 

I know how it feel, When I go with my defensive build as destroyer I can't do zero damage to BD while he able to put tons of damage on me even with the 2 escapes and that due to fact I got nothing left to do damage.

 

And work part of I went offensive with fury, I can't catch him for a second due to many immunes beside he able to grab me easily and stun lock me down due to leak of escapes 

 

It just unbalanced game :/

[Valiant]

2 hours ago, OMGLOL said:

 

what u said is like saying des doesn't have 2 stun escape and bd has only 1 and not a single other skill so therefore bd is better. just incase u didn't understand that, let me simplify it for you, what you said is irrelevant to the context of this discussion.

 

why dont u mention:

spin2win

vortex2win

typhoon2win

hurricane2win

 

you have a class that is so not perfectly designed and easily picked up that noone can do well on it right off the bat.

typhoon2escape more like, if some stupid destroyer tried to typhoon2win you just can ss and run away lmao

 

Vortex2win atleast gave you a immune for 2 second while hurricane2win gave you nothing except deflect which can be passed by pierce parry or knockdown :/

[Irisdina]

Rly... Someone still thinking destro can win by just spinning? RLY? For red one just SS and no dmg taken. You can even STUN/DAZE him! Blue dont deal good dmg. its just to make yourself better cover/remove snore etc. And if you think Destro is more powerfull than BD tell me why ppl cry about Blade cancer not Destro in game? Oh right! Summoners and BD still saying "You`r destroyer"/"Destroyer is damm OP" becouse before update destro was one of the most attacked class (2 most attacked was summoner and destro).

[Masqava]

I like how people say Destroyer have two stun escapes yet if you don't get fury you have the kill threat of a potato.

 

Smash can do a decent chunk of damage (like 7k) IF they're cc'd and has a 45 sec cooldown so you can use it 4 times in a match. Piledriver can do 6-7k damage too, but you need to grab them and they can grab escape you first then just be able to throw them into the air without being retaliated.

Besides that, they got no reliable grab escape. The RMB/LMB combo is too force hungry and you can't really spec into the LMB without giving up a lot of things.

The only real escape destroyer has got a 36 second cooldown, no, people won't use perseverance because they won't have any kill threat, without fury the red spin also just you out of force in a couple seconds.

 

Destroyer without fury would be useless. BD just got way more tools. It's impossible for destroyer to fury them because they'll just do the flying sword around them making them permaresist. Destroyers get choked out of chi FAR, FAR easier. Destroyers actually need to stun you before they can grab you, and guess what? most people will roll out before you can even grab them. They're basically a slower version of BD with worse chi management and less escapes BUT IF, just IF they can catch you and fury, you MIGHT die.

[BybisRaibas666]

"Balanced PvP" "It will get better with lvl 50 patch". Heh, right

[Sakate]

Why does no one mention that with this "stay unconcious for 30s or escape" has a really big flaw?  If they knock you unconcious, don't escape.  You do know after a few seconds you start healing rapidly right?

[Valiant]

55 minutes ago, Sakate said:

Why does no one mention that with this "stay unconcious for 30s or escape" has a really big flaw?  If they knock you unconcious, don't escape.  You do know after a few seconds you start healing rapidly right?

Well that is true but first 10 second their cooldown will be finished mean they will deal more damage than you can be healed with. lol

[Valiant]

1 hour ago, BybisRaibas666 said:

"Balanced PvP" "It will get better with lvl 50 patch". Heh, right

I think we got the level 50 hp patch lol, Anyway there no balance now destroyer is suck really suck

[Valiant]

4 hours ago, Masqava said:

I like how people say Destroyer have two stun escapes yet if you don't get fury you have the kill threat of a potato.

 

Smash can do a decent chunk of damage (like 7k) IF they're cc'd and has a 45 sec cooldown so you can use it 4 times in a match. Piledriver can do 6-7k damage too, but you need to grab them and they can grab escape you first then just be able to throw them into the air without being retaliated.

Besides that, they got no reliable grab escape. The RMB/LMB combo is too force hungry and you can't really spec into the LMB without giving up a lot of things.

The only real escape destroyer has got a 36 second cooldown, no, people won't use perseverance because they won't have any kill threat, without fury the red spin also just you out of force in a couple seconds.

 

Destroyer without fury would be useless. BD just got way more tools. It's impossible for destroyer to fury them because they'll just do the flying sword around them making them permaresist. Destroyers get choked out of chi FAR, FAR easier. Destroyers actually need to stun you before they can grab you, and guess what? most people will roll out before you can even grab them. They're basically a slower version of BD with worse chi management and less escapes BUT IF, just IF they can catch you and fury, you MIGHT die.

And don't forget even if you are having immune instead of fury that mean you gave more space for BD  cause BD immune and escapes are more faster cooldown than yours.

 

Mean the only chance you got to deal damage won't deal any damage beside their, even if time out they will win due to damage.

Same apply for KFM Vs destroyer, Assissan vs Destroyer, FM vs Destroyer , BD vs Destroyer =  Time out mean destroyer lost due to leak of damage and fury

[Evict]

Stopped reading after:

 

But let us take a look at some of their skills and different between both of their skills in damage , effects, requirement and cost.

Source : https://bnstree.com/BD

Blade dancer :  Phantom Grip (4) = Cooldown : 24second , Requirement : Basic stance , Defense/Parry penetration,Cost: 2 Focus .

Common used skills during Phantom Grip is : Hurl (X)  = Cast time : Instance , "Knockback enemies 15m and knocks them Unconscious for 30 sec", Cost : none,No skill points needed.

Blade storm (RB) = Cast time : Instance , " Deals 360 ~ 420 [30.00] shadow damage over 5 hits ", Cost : 6 Focus, No skill points needed.

 

Source : https://bnstree.com/DE

Destroyer : Grab (F) = Cooldown : 18 second , Requirement : Stun or Daze or Knockdown or Unconscious or Defending enemy , Break block/defense stats , Cost: 10 Focus .

Common used skills during Grab: Hurl (C)  =Cast time:2 second, "Throw and knockdown enemy 15m for 3 second",Cost : 10 Focus ,2 Skill point points needed for" Unconscious 30

second ".

Launch (4)  = Cast time : Instance , "Knockup enemy and  Deals 54 ~ 63 [4.50] damage ", Cost : 20 focus, No skill points needed.

 Power Slam : Cast time : 0.8 second , " Deals 18 ~ 21 [1.50] damage ", Cost : 10 Focus,3 skill point needed to make Cast time : 0.3 second and recover 120 Focus.

 

Comparing the 2 is stupid.

Blade Storm is one of the hardest skills to set up, most people save their tab when vs blade dancers for phantom grip.

The ONLY time you will see blade storm is when somebody wastes their tab accidentally or if they got caught previously and were forced to tab after expending all other escapes.

Both of which make that skill extremely hard to set up once you graduate from silver.

Also a lot of BD have been sec'ing to the 30 second cd on Phantom Grip vs your 18 sec cd on Grab.

[ShiroYayoi]

all i can say is when bd use its imune aka 10%hp heal ,combo finish all thats left is deflect spin if u can count the sec when it stop u can certainly not get deflected i myself face alot of ppl know how to wait for my deflect spin to end and hit me before i hit a second time

[dmoe33]

im a FM and i say both these classes are broken :D

[Valiant]

1 hour ago, dmoe33 said:

im a FM and i say both these classes are broken :D

Say the class that keep running and freeze spins , lmao xD

[Valiant]

4 hours ago, Evict said:

Stopped reading after:

 

But let us take a look at some of their skills and different between both of their skills in damage , effects, requirement and cost.

Source : https://bnstree.com/BD

Blade dancer :  Phantom Grip (4) = Cooldown : 24second , Requirement : Basic stance , Defense/Parry penetration,Cost: 2 Focus .

Common used skills during Phantom Grip is : Hurl (X)  = Cast time : Instance , "Knockback enemies 15m and knocks them Unconscious for 30 sec", Cost : none,No skill points needed.

Blade storm (RB) = Cast time : Instance , " Deals 360 ~ 420 [30.00] shadow damage over 5 hits ", Cost : 6 Focus, No skill points needed.

 

Source : https://bnstree.com/DE

Destroyer : Grab (F) = Cooldown : 18 second , Requirement : Stun or Daze or Knockdown or Unconscious or Defending enemy , Break block/defense stats , Cost: 10 Focus .

Common used skills during Grab: Hurl (C)  =Cast time:2 second, "Throw and knockdown enemy 15m for 3 second",Cost : 10 Focus ,2 Skill point points needed for" Unconscious 30

second ".

Launch (4)  = Cast time : Instance , "Knockup enemy and  Deals 54 ~ 63 [4.50] damage ", Cost : 20 focus, No skill points needed.

 Power Slam : Cast time : 0.8 second , " Deals 18 ~ 21 [1.50] damage ", Cost : 10 Focus,3 skill point needed to make Cast time : 0.3 second and recover 120 Focus.

 

Comparing the 2 is stupid.

Blade Storm is one of the hardest skills to set up, most people save their tab when vs blade dancers for phantom grip.

The ONLY time you will see blade storm is when somebody wastes their tab accidentally or if they got caught previously and were forced to tab after expending all other escapes.

Both of which make that skill extremely hard to set up once you graduate from silver.

Also a lot of BD have been sec'ing to the 30 second cd on Phantom Grip vs your 18 sec cd on Grab.

Well it seem like BD don't have any problem with casting it in second grab, Yes I do escape first grab and I don't wait till I get raped by it.

 

and you say our skill is 18 second cooldown is something nice ? LOL

Our 18 second skill need a stun or daze or knockdown target which skills like that need to pass through spin and immune and wait their long cooldown which is arund 18 to 45 second while Phantom grip wait 24 second and can cast instantly on target.

 

Tell me about having hard day trying to lock someone down for grab while all you do spin around and gain focus before grab us and ram blade storm 

[Lapuka]

if BD so op then why top 1 BD is somewhere around 25-30th in global rankings lol ?

[Brainy]

16 minutes ago, Lapuka said:

if BD so op then why top 1 BD is somewhere around 25-30th in global rankings lol ?

Because not all classes are destroyers.

 

Also, they are easy to play till a point, but then they hit a brick wall cause people can't do more than 2 combos with them. (I'm not talking about people who actually know how to play).

[Valiant]

37 minutes ago, Lapuka said:

if BD so op then why top 1 BD is somewhere around 25-30th in global rankings lol ?

Come visit EU servers where first 10 is 2 KFM, 3 Summoners, 2 BD and 2 BM and 1 FM 

[Valiant]

23 minutes ago, Brainy said:

Because not all classes are destroyers.

 

Also, they are easy to play till a point, but then they hit a brick wall cause people can't do more than 2 combos with them. (I'm not talking about people who actually know how to play).

He don't understand that BD, BM, KFM and FM are perfect counter for destroyer at this point of game while Summoner due to huge pump for it and the nerf that affect destroyer became more hard to kill summoner using destroyer .

 

Due to fact that destroyer can't switch behind his enemy meaning he not able to break blocking status special if you KFM or BM as for FM who keep tricking down his spin and make it useless while BD been op in own version of immunes and escapes.

As for Assissan it about who do mistake first if Destroyer made mistake goodbye if assissan made mistake goodbye,

[Lapuka]

10 minutes ago, Valiant said:

Come visit EU servers where first 10 is 2 KFM, 3 Summoners, 2 BD and 2 BM and 1 FM 

in first 30 there is only one BD , it seems things changes fast in these rankings 

[Atroh]

3 hours ago, Valiant said:

Well it seem like BD don't have any problem with casting it in second grab, Yes I do escape first grab and I don't wait till I get raped by it.

 

and you say our skill is 18 second cooldown is something nice ? LOL

Our 18 second skill need a stun or daze or knockdown target which skills like that need to pass through spin and immune and wait their long cooldown which is arund 18 to 45 second while Phantom grip wait 24 second and can cast instantly on target.

 

Tell me about having hard day trying to lock someone down for grab while all you do spin around and gain focus before grab us and ram blade storm 

I just want to point out that Blade Storm can't be used on a target unless it is affected by Soul Stab. Soul Stab is a fairly obvious telegraph that you should be able to use your Reversal on to get out of their Phantom Grip basically for free. Maybe I don't know what I'm talking about, being the low gold that I am, but if you can't Reversal out of the soul stab, you deserve to get hit with Blade Storm.

[MarkoffAs]

Dude you know ;D Destro can ani-cancel right ? And that 0,8 sec becomes 0 and can kill you in that one lock down... So pls 1st think about what you are saying... Or you think that 4 rbm do so much dmg ? Try to play with bd then ;) I give you 100% you will lose about 80% of your games vs destroyers ;p

[Somisan]

Yeah that would be an interesting match destro SPiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiN while Blade Cancer  SPin Spin spin PSin

these classes need so much brain like a plant ....

[Vexe]

3 hours ago, Atroh said:

if you can't Reversal out of the soul stab, you deserve to get hit with Blade Storm.

 

To be fair, the game never explains how to use grab counters (reversal). I really wish it'd at least force every player to do it twice or thrice in a quest and/or give us a test dummy that spams grabs and random grab skills of each class separately.

 

I still don't know how to use reversal coz I'm used to preventing grabs through resists or depending on flock / second wind.

 

 

How much time exactly do you have during reversal? 0.5s like Vortex / Bladeguard?

 

 

15 minutes ago, Somisan said:

Yeah that would be an interesting match destro SPiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiN while Blade Cancer  SPin Spin spin PSin

these classes need so much brain like a plant ....

 

And guess how smart you need to be to defeat such easily predictable players?