Can we just remove the Enrage mode mechanic it's nonsense

[LagunaL8]

enrage mode is not too bad given that even the oldest of some MMO's have it implemented.

But I do agree that only a few minutes time is a bit too meh...

I personally have no problem with it but if i wanted to be neutral, then i think just a few minutes isnt the best idea.

A good amount of it just depends on good gear.

 

Rather a better way to use enrage mode:

it would be nice if they had a harder world faction boss, that took say maybe 1hr to enrage.

Obviously that would entail that the battle itself is hard as hell, Not just HP amount but tactics too.

 

 

[Virtue]

i think the game is way too easy as it is. just because hou cant clear the content the 2nd day of release doesnt mean its poorly balanced.

[HMint]

11 minutes ago, Mariester said:

You're missing the point here. What you're asking is making the game easier. Anyone can learn a boss patern and kill it in w/e amount of time it takes them to do so. A timer adds skillcap to a game. It literally means that if you can't kill it in the time limit its because of TREE things :

a) Your gear might not be adequate.

B)  You're doing something wrong with your rotation and are missing attacking opportunities or missing dmg due to wrong skills used

C) There's something wrong in your skill tree, change your tactic and see if it gets easier.

People thinking like you always manage to nerf good games to the point where it's not even challengeable to accomplish.

 

Learning a boss pattern = getting better at the game.

 

It's just that boss patterns in this game are mostly brain dead simple.

 

I would rather have more challenging bosses, with complicated patterns, reaction based action and so on and having mastered those be the skillcap. Would be more fun too.

Of course you can't just remove timers AND keep the easy bosses. People with a lot of patience but inferior gear might defeat a boss after several hours of cheesing it. We can't have that! (I'd rather stab a needle into my eye than hop around a bossfor hours, but whatever...)

[YukiAyumu]

9 minutes ago, Mariester said:

You're missing the point here. What you're asking is making the game easier. Anyone can learn a boss patern and kill it in w/e amount of time it takes them to do so. A timer adds skillcap to a game. It literally means that if you can't kill it in the time limit its because of TREE things :

a) Your gear might not be adequate.

B)  You're doing something wrong with your rotation and are missing attacking opportunities or missing dmg due to wrong skills used

C) There's something wrong in your skill tree, change your tactic and see if it gets easier.

People thinking like you always manage to nerf good games to the point where it's not even challengeable to accomplish.

 

A) gear does not equal skill they are not the same thing at all

B) and if your not it goes back to A

C)and again if this is not the case it goes back to A not only that but i have an issue with the concept of free builds then afterwards going "ahh you didn't build it right you actually have to do this"

 

the point is asking for REAL difficulty does not make the game easier unless the developers are lazy

all a timer does is blind people who are smacking a log until it breaks into not realizing that this log is as hard as any other log

 

there is nothing wrong with wanting a more challenging experience but this is false difficulty it isn't really challenging it's just annoying and lazy

[Mariester]

Just now, HMint said:

Learning a boss pattern = getting better at the game.

 

It's just that boss patterns in this game are mostly brain dead simple.

 

I would rather have more challenging bosses, with complicated patterns, reaction based action and so on and having mastered those be the skillcap. Would be more fun too.

Of course you can't just remove timers AND keep the easy bosses. Peopel with a lot of patience might defeat a boss within 2 hours. We can't have that (I'd rather stab a needle into my eye than hop around a both for hours, but whatever...)

What you're failing to understand is that with an enrage timer you need to have both the patern AND your own patern down. There's a game that fits what you're talking about and it's called Tera. Guess what, that game also have an enrage timer and oneshot mechanism. If you didn't notice yet, almost every mobs in the game are based on the classes and can be CCed. Every single classes can chain CC them to oblivion once they know how to dodge properly.

[Mariester]

3 minutes ago, YukiAyumu said:

A) gear does not equal skill they are not the same thing at all

B) and if your not it goes back to A

C)and again if this is not the case it goes back to A not only that but i have an issue with the concept of free builds then afterwards going "ahh you didn't build it right you actually have to do this"

 

the point is asking for REAL difficulty does not make the game easier unless the developers are lazy

all a timer does is blind people who are smacking a log until it breaks into not realizing that this log is as hard as any other log

 

there is nothing wrong with wanting a more challenging experience but this is false difficulty it isn't really challenging it's just annoying and lazy

Please explain to me the point of finishing a content and getting gear upgrade that you can't use. Mushin tower has a weapon upgrade which you won't be able to use anyway. Get real please. Stop complaining about something so silly and upgrade your weapon to at least True Profane before complaining the enrage timer is bullshit. If you have above that already then I'm TRULY sorry for you. (Getgud)

[YukiAyumu]

10 minutes ago, Mariester said:

What you're failing to understand is that with an enrage timer you need to have both the patern AND your own patern down. There's a game that fits what you're talking about and it's called Tera. Guess what, that game also have an enrage timer and oneshot mechanism.

In Tera the enrage mode didn't mean outright that you lost(at least as far as i got before i lost interest)

and every "oneshot" move that i ever came across could be dealt with and wasn't spammed until you died

11 minutes ago, Mariester said:

Please explain to me the point of finishing a content and getting gear upgrade that you can't use. Mushin tower has a weapon upgrade which you won't be able to use anyway. Get real please. Stop complaining about something so silly and upgrade your weapon to at least True Profane before complaining the enrage timer is bullshit. If you have above that already then I'm TRULY sorry for you. (Getgud)

Apparently i need near endgame gear to complain or even discuss about a mechanic being stupid as well~

 

The point of new content is for an exciting new experiences and challenging new battles of course rewards as well

the new place is nice both atmospheric and aesthetically minus a few spots that i don't think they expected players to see

 

But the bosses aren't that challenging honestly about what i expected from them they just have a lazy mechanic attached to them and that's the issue

[Mariester]

7 minutes ago, YukiAyumu said:

In Tera the enrage mode didn't mean outright that you lost(at least as far as i got before i lost interest)

and every "oneshot" move that i ever came across could be dealt with and wasn't spammed until you died

Apparently i need near endgame gear to complain or even discuss about a mechanic being stupid as well~

 

The point of new content is for an exciting new experiences and challenging new battles of course rewards as well

the new place is nice both atmospheric and aesthetically minus a few spots that i don't think they expected players to see

 

But the bosses aren't that challenging honestly about what i expected from them they just have a lazy mechanic attached to them and that's the issue

You're literally asking them to nerf the game so the people can complete it with less than minimum required gear. If I lose 20 second off the timer because I got stuck in a combo I should of dodged and wipe to enrage timer that just makes the game UNFORGIVING. Which is exhiting. ALLLLLL human mobs uses PvP patern with telegraphed moves and even sometimes say it. You even have a red or yellow area to tell you if the attack is dodgable with normal iframes or not. It even tell you WHEN you gotta iframe it. Can you get even easier than that???? Asking for a required gear or skill knowledge by imposing a timer is the LEAST they can do.

 

EDIT : End game gear my butt, do you know what True Profane is? Its a level 42 weapon.

[lnvisibleOne]

Gone are the days where people tried to rise to the challenge a game provided them, now they want the games to lower themselves to their level. I don't see how rewarding stagnation is fun in any way but people play games for all different reasons..

[YukiAyumu]

7 minutes ago, Mariester said:

You're literally asking them to nerf the game so the people can complete it with less than minimum required gear. If I lose 20 second off the timer because I got stuck in a combo I should of dodged and wipe to enrage timer that just makes the game UNFORGIVING. Which is exhiting. ALLLLLL human mobs uses PvP patern with telegraphed moves and even sometimes say it. You even have a red or yellow area to tell you if the attack is dodgable with normal iframes or not. It even tell you WHEN you gotta iframe it. Can you get even easier than that???? Asking for a required gear or skill knowledge by imposing a timer is the LEAST they can do.

the minimum required gear is a dokumo weapon legitimately go to the cross server and look if you don't believe me so obviously that is not the case

 

i don't know what else to say to you it's like you've been thoroughly brainwashed into believing this is okay

it has nothing to do with skill if you don't have the best stuff there is literally NO CHANCE to win and later when even better gear eventually comes out it will be taken down in no time flat and be considered to be just another easy boss it is not difficult a timer doesn't fix that

 

with that mentality they could make a boss with 10mil hp and say if you don't kill it in 10 hits everyone dies and it heals back to max it won't even fight back you just have to hit it 10 times that is not skilled at all it just isn't you just have to hit 1 mil damage 10 times or you lose they might even put a timer on that so you have to do it within 30 seconds or some nonsense like that

 

no matter how gud you git it doesn't matter

[Seseshan]

It took me a few tries before I found that CC's are awesome against Junghado.  Extended knockdowns, pins, juggles right into bursting as hard as I can then dropping back into the defensive, until my CD's reset then rinse repeat. 

 

I've never played an MMO where fighting an NPC would be pretty close to what I would do fighting another player, which totally threw me off at first.  A welcome change from the hur dur button mashing I see in rest of the PvE content.

[LagunaL8]

17 minutes ago, lnvisibleOne said:

Gone are the days where people tried to rise to the challenge a game provided them, now they want the games to lower themselves to their level. I don't see how rewarding stagnation is fun in any way but people play games for all different reasons..

i dont know about that. The current 'challenge loving' pple all seem to revolve around quick fights and speed runs >.>

real challenges are when you dont get your gear for a good year cause your waiting your turn lol

[Mariester]

1 minute ago, YukiAyumu said:

the minimum required gear is a dokumo weapon legitimately go to the cross server and look if you don't believe me so obviously that is not the case

 

i don't know what else to say to you it's like you've been thoroughly brainwashed into believing this is okay

it has nothing to do with skill if you don't have the best stuff there is literally NO CHANCE to win and later when even better gear eventually comes out it will be taken down in no time flat and be considered to be just another easy boss it is not difficult a timer doesn't fix that

 

with that mentality they could make a boss with 10mil hp and say if you don't kill it in 10 hits everyone dies and it heals back to max it won't even fight back you just have to hit it 10 times that is not skilled at all it just isn't you just have to hit 1 mil damage 10 times or you lose they might even put a timer on that so you have to do it within 30 seconds or some nonsense like that

 

no matter how gud you git it doesn't matter

I'm not brainwashed, I'm just expecting you to make a little bit of effort into progression. Which you don't seem to want to do LOL. Your whole argument is biaised by the fact you probably didn't even upgraded your weapon past a moonwater stone yet.

 

-- Except many games have that mechanism. There are plenty of bosses which requires you to burn down a shield otherwise it's a wipe. Its the SAME thing. It requires you to have proper gear/dmg rotation to get the shield down. You're going nowhere with this. The game opposed you a gear requirement. Big deal. In many games, its the players that set the gear requirement and they usually ask you to have enough gear that you could solo it yourself.

 

This whole argument is just you proving us you don't want to make the effort it takes. You rather spend hours to complete it once. What happens after you've done it once? Nothing. You still have to do it again at the same paste and lose a lot of time.

[Meiling]

people have done floor 7 with true profane. You can't give us that crap when people with gear that's quite easy to get to can easily clear 7 floors.

[lnvisibleOne]

4 minutes ago, LagunaL8 said:

i dont know about that. The current 'challenge loving' pple all seem to revolve around quick fights and speed runs >.>

real challenges are when you dont get your gear for a good year cause your waiting your turn lol

It's less about "quick fights" and more about not being able to draw something out indefinitely using a tactic that my dog could execute to perfection. Where you have to learn your class and push it to its limits in order to succeed. Enrage timers are designed with that in mind in any game that uses them well and BnS is one of them. 

[Enjoo]

It's called a dps check....  I'd be fine with removing it if this class had the trinity of dps/healer/tank.  But in a game where every class can output a massive amount of dps when played efficiently, the enrage mechanic is fine.

[LagunaL8]

Just now, lnvisibleOne said:

It's less about "quick fights" and more about not being able to draw something out indefinitely using a tactic that my dog could execute to perfection. Where you have to use your class and push it to its limits in order to succeed. Enrage timers are designed with that in mind in any game that uses them well and BnS is one of them. 

that limit is like a concentration of less than 5-10 whooping minutes....

Like they designed the game for those with a shorter attention span.

And im sorry that you have not yet had the opportunity to play drawn out games that your dog could not execute, youve missed the good times.

[Zaphery]

It is a dps check, and if you are having trouble doing dps on Mushin Tower with true profane weapon it could be 1 of 2 issues

 

1. Poor understanding of class skills/dps rotation

2. Terrible ping

3. Severely Under geared

 

I'm willing to bet its #1 or 2 for most people since almost everyone who thinks their build is good has issues with there skill build somewhere, or is not utilizing it properly.

[lnvisibleOne]

2 minutes ago, LagunaL8 said:

that limit is like a concentration of less than 5-10 whooping minutes....

Like they designed the game for those with a shorter attention span.

And im sorry that you have not yet had the opportunity to play drawn out games that your dog could not execute, youve missed the good times.

I'm aware that not all games had fights that finished in mere minutes, I've played plenty of them myself. However I've also played enough to know that each game is different and the fun for me was adjusting to the different obstacles placed in the way. If not for enrage timers you could do some ridiculously cheesy things that the developers clearly don't want you doing. 

[LagunaL8]

Just now, lnvisibleOne said:

I'm aware that not all games had fights that finished in mere minutes, I've played plenty of them myself. However I've also played enough to know that each game is different and the fun for me was adjusting to the different obstacles placed in the way. If not for enrage timers you could do some ridiculously cheesy things that the developers clearly don't want you doing. 

well thats true... cant argue with that lol

[Zaphery]

4 minutes ago, lnvisibleOne said:

I'm aware that not all games had fights that finished in mere minutes, I've played plenty of them myself. However I've also played enough to know that each game is different and the fun for me was adjusting to the different obstacles placed in the way. If not for enrage timers you could do some ridiculously cheesy things that the developers clearly don't want you doing. 

Speaking of cheese, kungfu masters can already cheese the enrage timer on Blood shark harbor Ogre enrage. If the KFM has awakened pirate, he can i-frame every single blast with 100% up time on i-frames and just dps down the boss. I believe blade masters can do this too, but it is ridiculously easier to do on a kfm.

 

Good shit

[Mariester]

2 minutes ago, LagunaL8 said:

well thats true... cant argue with that lol

Its more about teaching you to be efficient than attacking when YOU feel safe to do so. ^^

[YukiAyumu]

9 minutes ago, Mariester said:

 

 

-- Except many games have that mechanism. There are plenty of bosses which requires you to burn down a shield otherwise it's a wipe. Its the SAME thing. It requires you to have proper gear/dmg rotation to get the shield down. You're going nowhere with this. The game opposed you a gear requirement. Big deal. In many games, its the players that set the gear requirement and they usually ask you to have enough gear that you could solo it yourself.

 

This whole argument is just you proving us you don't want to make the effort it takes. You rather spend hours to complete it once. What happens after you've done it once? Nothing. You still have to do it again at the same paste and lose a lot of time.

most games with that mechanic don't have realtime skill involved and rely on numbers for everything mostly rpgs

 

this game has the potential to actually be challenging to push you as a person to the limits of your abilities

if you chew through content like cereal it gets stale fast

but if you have to struggle through using your will and abilities it's much more rewarding

 

I want to make the effort i just don't have the luxury of the best gear in the game or teammates that do

i would rather spend hours to beat it once because that's more interesting afterwards I'd do it again to get the newest thing I'd savor the experience and value the rewards more for it

 

not to mention i could spend a lifetime and never win against a timer because it is a lazy mechanic that doesn't care how hard you try or what you do

 

without thinking "gotta kill it gotta kill it or the timer is gonna kill me"

I'd rather experience the battle "this monster is going to do a tail whip i should step back then charge in"

[DoowieEU]

Guys, I think we should remove logging into the game ... it's too hard!

[YukiAyumu]

7 minutes ago, DoowieEU said:

Guys, I think we should remove logging into the game ... it's too hard!

You must be new ~

if you play'd about a month ago you'd realize they've already been there and done that