List of Summoner Stealth Nerfs in Rising Waters

[Archaegeo]

1) Taunt now sucks.  Pet doesn't hold taunt like he use to, things break away a lot.  He still taunts, but cannot hold against our damage.  HUGE nerf in pve solo ability.

2) Doom and Bloom heal greatly reduced. Still need hard data, but feels like the heal is down 30%.

 

What have you found?

[Summons]

Doom and Bloom was always meant to heal us based on the damage dealt. We might be doing less damage due to higher defense of the new mosnters.

[Zephyranthes]

Been reading that pet stats have been reduced by as much as 25%. I don't have a record of the pre-patch stats so I cannot tell.

[Elvenmad]

 

 

From a experience Summoner player who has mained Summoners on CN servers for 4 years I can certainly say the changes in the Cats agro and taunt, plus the heals received from Doom and Bloom were immediately very noticeable, but there is nothing in patch notes, I dont need numbers I can tell the difference straight away from just game play.

[DarkKaos]

Someone that play in other regions (CN/TW/JP/KR) can confirm if it's all right? I think that the other servers have the same patch of skills right? So we could have a real answer since I think that NCWest doesn't even know what they have done.

[Zephyranthes]

I'm under the assumption that B&S US is just following the KR/CN patches. So does this mean that they deviated with the ninja summoner nerfs?

[Windy]

Summoner cat's taunt almost inexistant ,cat does not hold agrro more then max 3 seconds -less dps with rumbebees,second wind rarely or inexistant procs ,also escape heavely altered .Enjoyed summy- won't want to play other class or lvl up another just because the game cheats me-moving on then ,seems not a serious company while in the patch notes were nothing about the cats taunt.No fun ,no pay then .

[lmaogg]

I have never added a single point in my Q, I see not much issue when mobbing a group as well. L2P seriously.. stop crying over AI pet taunt and actually use your 3 and 4 skills|
Just be glad they didn't actually nerf sunflower's ridiculous damage.

[Reivur]

I disagree about taunt 'sucking'. It works absolutely fine in Bloodshore Harbor with the only real pain being the Flame Sister when she starts doing chain dashes at 50%. If you are only having the cat 'not hold agro more than max 3 seconds', then you are barely clipping a mob with the taunt and popping it as its about to lunge away from the circle, and that is 100% player error. I won't pretend there weren't changes, I'm noticing them, but this "It only holds a couple seconds, whats the point of a skill for aggro that doesn't hold aggro" is exaggerated beyond belief to the point of simply not being true. And the couple people who implied that the cat's stats were altered were wrong as well, since the stats are the same curves with ability ratios being improved across the board. Tooltips should be changed or acknowledged, but the Summoner is dead hur its no longer fun crap is so silly.

 

I'm also not sure why people are even wanting to taunt floor 7. Some poster complained about having low damage and taunt being ignored there-- curling causes low damage in the first place. He doesn't even have a joint attack requirement. Its practically PvE pretending to be a PvP match that doesn't know how to use SS. Talent Daze on 2 and C. Keep the Snare on 1. Get enhanced Pin for Tab and keep Knockdown for V. Talent Alley Cat if you're lacking damage because a curled Alley Cat can tank anything in this game without pause, and, if you're sincerely having your pet 'lose aggro' the moment taunt aura ends, then that means House Cat is even more useless outside of arena by your own admission, so may as well get that crit rating.

 

Rotate 2 (Starting with it so Sunflower can immediately get to work on lowering the CD), C, and V ending V with a with a pin, saving your 1 Snare for after the pin so the moment they both get back up your cat uses Swoosh to reposition behind him so he's helpless. Curl only as Snare is about to end to buy the 3-6 more seconds needed to start the daze chains again, repeat.

 

The only true hit we really took is Doom and Bloom. Honestly? Single target Doom and Bloom appears to be healing identically to last patch. What's not healing the same is when Doom and Bloom hits multiple targets at once-- the healing from that seems to be tapered to 100% damage off a single target.

[Nimbukie]

4 minutes ago, Reivur said:

......

I appreciate the info on this, but have you played with the taunt. By that I mean have you went into the fight with the intention of not actually fighting and just playing with the taunt? Because that is what I did for a little over an hour this afternoon. Mostly because a buddy of mine that plays a summoner what whining like a little girl about it. I had noticed a bit, but thought I was just sucking for some reason or another.

 

When thoroughly tested though I'm able to consistently lose agro off of my cat after 3 seconds have passed on the cool down.

 

Ways I tested.

Root Mob - Taunt

Stun Mob - Wait 1 sec - Taunt

Simply Taunt

Knockdown Mob - Wait 1 sec - Taunt

Daze Mob - Wait 1 Sec - Taunt

 

Each time it went as follows:

1) I have agro

2) Pet Taunts

3) Pet has Agro

4) 3 Sec pass according to cooldown timer

5) I have agro

 

PS. Yeah doom and bloom AOE not healing right.

[Reivur]

As far as condition 1 goes, that would have happened pre-nerf/changes. Its the reason the etiquette threads on Black Wyrm tell Summoners to talent into Weed Whack/remove Snare and ask Force Masters to refrain from freezing. You can have a Blade Master or Kung Fu Master tanking and a Snare will completely ruin the aggro table. Black Wyrm is used as an example because he provides the most solid consequences for what happens, but it applies to every boss/monster in the game but most of them are crippled enough/don't have deadly enough mechanics to make the snare or freeze consequential.

 

As for just 'idle testing', no... But as for playing the game and sub-tanking the Sisters and lazy tanking most of the trash, yeah. Literally the only time the Fire Sister would ever break off me was after 8 seconds, in that 4 second lull of needing a new cull. Then she'd go to slap up our assassin for a brief moment and I'd grab her again. Issues came about later when she phase transitioned at 50% where she starts doing chain strikes to each member in the party, which can give her enough motion to leave the taunt. Solution was the person with aggro just walked right back in and it did pick right back up.

 

And the aggro generated worked. I did a couple taunts where I grabbed both sisters because our composition uses a Blade Dancer, Destroyer, Sin and me. When the Destroyer lifts, the Blade Dancer goes nuts with draws. When the Blade Dancer lifts, the Destroyer goes nuts. Draw stance can kind of crush any kind of damage I would ever hope to do in a scenario of 20% bonus damage, weapon focus procs and grapple focus bonuses and yet during the entire burst of 10k+ crits my cat still had aggro on the aggro table, so I reallllllly doubt these claims that Summoners are "doing good damage" and yanking off the cat. We can't match draw. Period. Its just a class limitation. Super Sunflower for me reaches at most 8k for me, but realistically around 6k, and regulars being a 4-6k range. So there's no way these examples are matching such extremes if it were truly an issue of aggro generation purely.

[Zephyranthes]

After further testing, I'm actually more concerned about Doom n Bloom's sucky healing now. There may be more about it than just not healing AOE damage anymore. I'm not really sure.

[Nimbukie]

https://www.reddit.com/r/bladeandsoul/comments/4580hv/current_summoner_issues_0211/

linked for reference/source i claim no credit

 

[Rhokdelar180]

Played Summoner on BnS Taiwan for quite a while.  There was a nerf to our taunts and heals.  I went back to test it and there our taunt is not working properly.  Also the mobs will switch to the summoner straight away after its over unlike on the other server.  Not sure if it is a bug or not but its affecting the game play.

[DarkKaos]

6 hours ago, Rhokdelar180 said:

Played Summoner on BnS Taiwan for quite a while.  There was a nerf to our taunts and heals.  I went back to test it and there our taunt is not working properly.  Also the mobs will switch to the summoner straight away after its over unlike on the other server.  Not sure if it is a bug or not but its affecting the game play.

 

Could you explain it a bit better?

You can login the TW version? Do we have there the same skill tree?

Could you do the 2 tests?
1 - If there the cat can really taunt. Test it in two ways. First, if you lose your aggro when the 8s pass. And the other, after a few seconds, like 3 or 4.
2 - Doom n Bloom is healing from aoe or just single? Pack a bunch of mobs, like 6~12, let your hp goes down to 70% and use it. Can you get back to almost full? Here you can see the example. Atm we are just draining hp from the first target. Even hit the others.

 

 

We really need to understand that and if its a bug, call for a fix. We can't just let it alone.

[Windy]

I suggest every one of us should make a ticket to support to skill related section .I see NONE official answer ,wich its bad -actually they screwed up a large base of players ,leaving them unable to continue normal play.While there its written in the Martial Tome Skills list the amount of time /conditions skills have to be used to work and actually its not working ,then its a bug and they should be able to handle it asap ,otherwise players will just leave this unfinished ,laggy and farming game that disavantages players in mass...

[Zephyranthes]

5 hours ago, Rhokdelar180 said:

Played Summoner on BnS Taiwan for quite a while.  There was a nerf to our taunts and heals.  I went back to test it and there our taunt is not working properly.  Also the mobs will switch to the summoner straight away after its over unlike on the other server.  Not sure if it is a bug or not but its affecting the game play.

 

From what I understood, he had played BnS Taiwan for a while before and he tried playing his summoner class again there  to see the difference. He's confirming that the US version has taunt and heal nerfed / not working properly.

 

Read from several other sources too that KR/CN version of the game have taunts and heals working the same as before. Other versions of BnS are far more advanced than the US so the current change doesn't follow any previous official BnS patches.

[Chabi]

Reivur!

You are probably right in if we spec different we can once again be able to handle more and survive. 

 

But for me being forced in to a spec i don't like is the same as the class is broken or at least very close to it. I would like to play the game as I enjoy it and i strongly believe many others do to.

If you want to call that easy mode so be it. I had great fun with the summoner and my cat before patch. Now i already hesitate to login.

[Reivur]

4 hours ago, Chabi said:

Reivur!

You are probably right in if we spec different we can once again be able to handle more and survive. 

 

But for me being forced in to a spec i don't like is the same as the class is broken or at least very close to it. I would like to play the game as I enjoy it and i strongly believe many others do to.

If you want to call that easy mode so be it. I had great fun with the summoner and my cat before patch. Now i already hesitate to login.

That's fair. But I don't think the issue will be taken seriously, nor future issues, if things are described in terms that aren't true. (People saying taunt will only work for 3 seconds, for example, are simply full of crap. People saying Cat's mitigation changed at all are wrong. There's literally no other way to describe them.)

 

I will hesitate though that specing as if it were a PvP fight in a themed challenge tower meant to, eventually push your limits, not working on every spec does seem kind of... eh? As a complaint. I mean, I generally love Ice Themed magic and I acknowledge the issues it can cause and the lack of damage it can push compared to fire on my Force Master. My preferences doesn't change the result of the runs, I simply have to try to find a way to make it work.

[LittleBubbles]

1 hour ago, Reivur said:

That's fair. But I don't think the issue will be taken seriously, nor future issues, if things are described in terms that aren't true. (People saying taunt will only work for 3 seconds, for example, are simply full of crap.... There's literally no other way to describe them.)

 

 

Are you calling us liars? http://imgur.com/a/YjSZw

 

[Ennychan]

ok people i submitted a ticket on the crouching tiger skill not holding aggro like it should anddddd!  it's a glitch we aren't crazy or whiny lolol!

 

Trinity Today at 11:32

Hello There!

Thanks for contacting Blade & Soul Support Team.

This is currently a known issue and the Development Team is working to correct this in a future update.

I'm sorry, but the Game Support Team does not have a workaround at this time. Once a fix has been created and tested it will be made available in a future update.

Please let us know if we can be of any other assistance.

Regards,

Trinity
NCSOFT Support Team

[Reivur]

2 hours ago, LittleBubbles said:

 

Are you calling us liars? http://imgur.com/a/YjSZw

 

Fun thing. Calling someone wrong doesn't mean they're lying. So no, I don't think you're a liar. I think you believe what you're saying. But considering I can still reliably hold things for the full 8 seconds other than lunging or dashing mobs (Whom I had success with before), I do believe you're exaggerating.

[LittleBubbles]

I provided you 2 screen shots of the cat not having threat on a mob within taunt range in the 8 seconds it would be active. How is that exaggerating?

 

The cat grabs threat eventually... but loses it at 8 second mark. So the taunt actually lasts 0-8 seconds and not 8. It depends on if the cat can get threat in the first place.

 

People like you are the worst, just because it doesn't happen to you (maybe you don't do a lot of damage?) is no reason for you to treat us like liars and act like we're just making stuff up.

 

 

 

[Zephyranthes]

Cat not holding agro properly even when in taunt range and duration has been confirmed by a lot of people with proper supports. It may not happen to all players like Reivur but it's happening to a good percentage of summoner players.

 

All we can do now is wait and see what happens since NCSoft has already listed it as a bug for now.

[chinmi]

On 11/02/2016 at 7:48 AM, Archaegeo said:

1) Taunt now sucks.  Pet doesn't hold taunt like he use to, things break away a lot.  He still taunts, but cannot hold against our damage.  HUGE nerf in pve solo ability.

2) Doom and Bloom heal greatly reduced. Still need hard data, but feels like the heal is down 30%.

 

What have you found?

this two is what i found out too, i see that dev is looking into can taunt (from other thread), but any info on the doom & bloom ?? the dev must check it out too