This patch is Abysmal: Suggestions and Fixes needed ASAP

[Ootakemaru]

I love this game. I really do. I've been playing since launch and I've been through some bad patches in this game's life. But this one was absolutely atrocious. I mean no disrespect to anyone, but I cannot understand how such a long awaited patch was released in the state that it was. (Please bear with me, this will be a bit of a hefty read, but I appreciate you sticking with it!)

 

Core mechanics of the game itself were broken. Such as the new class, Musician not even showing up visually in our own character lobbies. The inventory system didn't work preventing a lot of us from playing new characters since once it filled up, there was nothing we could do. The achievement system was broken, which is tied to a lot of merchants and our own skill points. On top of that the main story itself was broken, which is entirely game breaking, preventing people from advancing the game. All of this has been fixed now, sure, but the fact that it was even released like this is absolutely ridiculous; it took an entire week of most people either softlocked in story or being unable to properly play the new class for this to be fixed. Why this didn't have an emergency maintenance is beyond me.

 

Even soul boost, despite having a maintenance is broken. And the responses we are getting are unhelpful. I'm pretty sure most people expected to be able to play their musician with soul boost. It makes me wonder how many aren't playing them because it won't register their 15th character. This is honestly the tip of the iceberg here. Because there's so many issues with this patch that need to be fixed as soon as possible.

 

I want to start with the pros of the patch:

 

- The change to Daily Challenge rewards is a nice welcome! We can actually get gold now. And with the rest bonus we can take a bit of a break from the daily grind. This was a needed change and it's nice to see!

 

- The new class is fun to play and shows that it had some care put into it. This is subjective but I initially had my doubts about it. It's a nice addition!

 

- Starcross on lower stages is also a nice change! It's nice when you want to solo and do fast runs, hit stage 1 and know you still have a chance for these. But this does lead into another issue that will come up later.

 

- Soul League is interesting and fun. I'd actually like to see this return! It's just a nice change/reward to the usual grind we do.

 

- The free gear was really generous! While the lack of a character slot was....questionable, seeing as we usually get a free slot in some way with a new class, the gear in f10 was a very nice surprise! 

 

 

Not a lot of pros but there are good things in this patch! I probably missed a few but the main point of this thread is to point out some glaring issues. Especially some I keep seeing pop up in the forums.

 

Now for the Cons:

 

 

 

The patch notes are useless.

 

We should be able to trust the patch notes. This is the only game where I can say the patch notes are maybe half right of what's actually going on. It's confusing to me that we get patch notes in the state that we do and this has been going on for a WHILE. For example, here are the most glaring flaws with the notes:

 

- They were completed HOURS after the actual maintenance were done.

 

- They were and STILL are incomplete.

 

- It consists of info that is just plain incorrect or doesn't exist in our version game such as the Halloween emotes that were finally confirmed to not even be in the game. Yet they were listed in the notes, in known issues and had a bug fix as if they DID exist.

 

- Cold Storage and Heaven's Mandate were said to only have updated loot tables. There was nothing mentioned about these dungeons being buffed which threw a lot of players off guard and had them confused. No they are no "solo" dungeons but please remember Heaven's Mandate has an achievement that requires you to beat it solo.

 

- Skystealer accessories were entirely removed from dungeons with zero notice. There was nothing in the patch notes that said this was even happening. Yet we got an update to the material that upgrades it. More on this later.

 

- Force Master Fire and Ice specs were entirely reworked. Patch notes only listed badge fixes. Not that the class would be changed as a whole. Lightning Force Master in my experience plays the same. No one knew this was happening. Patch notes did not touch on this. Why? People were rightfully confused and upset about logging in and their entire class was not what they read. We need to be able to look at patch notes and have a FULL picture of whats coming. Not have half of it. I suggest more care is put into getting more concise patch notes out that cover changes. And if the reason is "there's a lot to go over" maybe split them up like you often do with the system changes. Find a better system for these.

 

 

 

Soul Boost was messed up.

 

The removal of Hall of Trials as a Demonsbane dungeon effectively screwed up the 4th tab of soul boost. Since stages are no longer there if you haven't (or have alts that haven't) done stages 2 or 3 you're now locked out of it and are forced to do the 12 runs. This also happened the last time a dungeon was removed from Demonsbane. Why does this keep happening? It's causing annoyance and complications for a lot of players. So I think:

 

- (EDIT: I was mistaking CSC for Aerodrome! It was the one I was thinking of that got removed and I completely mixed these two up. My mistake! This proves however that a demonsbane dungeon can exist without a ranking so removing HoT while keeping it with its stages is possible!)

 

- If you're going to remove it as a dungeon, change soul boost so it reflects our current choices. Instead of Hall of Trials, why wasn't it changed to say, Grim Nexus. Have the new dungeon or a preexisting demonsbane dungeon replace the one that was removed.

 

- Allow Namdo Shrine to count towards the 12 runs. Despite the stages specifically saying Hall of Trials, the dynamic 12 run quest only says "Nykarri Island" which indicates Namdo Shrine could ALSO count. I don't know if this is a bug, or entirely intended just with bad wording, but Shrine doesn't count towards the 12 runs at all. Allow this dungeon to count for the 12 runs because Hall of Trials is tiring and long. I believe most people find it the most tedious one to do.

 

On top of this soul boost is STILL broken for the 15th character. We keep being told "contact support" but support cannot do anything about this. We had an emergency maintenance to extend it but it's as if they just added the number yet didn't actually increase the limit. Please look into this.

 

 

 

Skystealer Accessories are missing entirely.

 

Now, not entirely but unless you want to spend a month getting 200 demonsbane tokens, these accessories have been removed with no notice or warning. Why? Just because Starcross is easier to get doesn't warrant the flat REMOVAL of these. The biggest issue with this stems with the drop rate of the Starcross Accessories. I've done over 100 runs combined of the three dungeons that drop them and not a single accessory I can use has dropped. The one drop I did get was a bracelet that my class could NOT even use. So my character is STILL stuck in soul boost gear because this one started late on the grind.

 

What makes the choice even more odd is that the skystealer upgrade material was changed to be one condensed material. Now I have thousands of orbs but nothing to use them on at all. This almost seems like a bug as if the accessories weren't supposed to be removed but somehow disappeared.

 

There have been a few threads asking about where to get these now. They have been either moved to less viewed forums or flat ignored. It's a viable question. Where DO we get these? It also makes soul boost feel useless, especially the multi runs for some of the dungeons (aero, sub, echoes) because I believe the point was to help get the dps skystealer accessories. Now it feels pointless. So I suggest:

 

- Clarifying if the removal was intentional or a bug. If this is in fact a bug, it needs to be fixed asap. It's screwing over a lot of returning players, new players, and alts.

 

- Return the skystealer accessories to their dungeons! It makes soul boost feel really empty and odd. Why are we running these dungeons? They drop nothing for us or upgrade material we cannot even USE.

 

- Allow us to buy the accessories from a merchant for a REASONABLE price. They are the first step into the mythic accessories they shouldn't be ridiculous but still have some work. Maybe the tokens could come from the dungeons they were previously removed from.

 

As of now these dungeons have zero use to anyone aside from maybe Aerodrome or Substratum, yet we have to complete a week's worth or more of them for soul boost. It's odd.

 

 

 

Achievements are missing.

 

Since the bug last week, many of us who lv 60'ed a character or who used skill point items (and weren't aware of the bug) are missing the achievements. Myself included. The only achievements I got after the fix were for my level. I am ENTIRELY missing the story achievements and titles. There's no way for me to get these unless I delete and remake the character which I cannot do. The character obtained the free gear and some items I can't get back. It was done before I was aware of the bug at all.

 

There was a bug report made yet all we got told was to go to support. Support can't fix this. People have lost items and now the game is acting as if characters made to 60 before the maint has never done the story. This is a MASSIVE bug that needs to be fixed and support cannot do anything about it.

 

At some point support needs to stop being the go to answer and things simply need to be communicated to the devs. This is a dev issue they need to fix. Here are two thread bug reports about this. If you are also missing achievements, skill points, and items because of this bug please let them know and maybe it will then be pushed for a fast fix. There is nothing support can do and nothing we can do.

 

 

 

I am urging our CM to please push these to the dev instead of telling us to just ask support, many of us do go to support first thing. These are huge bugs. 

 

This is all I can remember that have been bothering me since this patch's release and Wednesday's "fix" for now because I've never been so frustrated with a patch. How these issues are allowed to persist is beyond me. Granted yes, it takes time to fix things but some things that were huge and deserved an emergency maintenance were left to be fixed for an entire week with no compensation to people or no emergency maint to just fix the story bug alone. Some who literally could not play if the inventory was full or they were stuck in story. The sheer state of this patch is just...appalling.

 

I know a lot goes on behind the scenes and managing patches aren't easy but this patch shouldn't have been released in the state it was and things are still broken to all hell with no indication if we've even been heard or it's going to be fixed soon.

 

I appreciate the hard work of the staff and if you read all this then good on you. Maybe put your own suggestions in or issues you've seen and let's hope it gets sent to the devs or maybe even fixed soon. (And after that, maybe even the disconnects get their fix? Please, I'll bake you cookies, haha.)

 

Thanks for reading.

 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Ootakemaru
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[DenialOfTruth]

Honestly while I really enjoy this patch, I cannot help but agree with many of the points made in this post. However, there are a few errors...Chaos Supply Chain was never in Demonsbane ranking at any point in time, so it never has been up for removal from Demonsbane. I imagine it'll get the boot when a new tier of Soul Shields is available, whenever that will be. In addition, the Halloween Emotes are technically in our version, just the means to get them isn't active yet. We'll probably see that sooner rather than later since Halloween itself is coming up soon.

 

The Starcross Ring and Earring seem to be far more common at least. I suspect this will be the case when we get the next dungeon, the Ebondrake Mutation Lab, which likely will be renamed when we get it, making the Necklace and Gloves more common.

 

At least this time Soul Boost being messed up, outside of the weirdness with some people being unable to register a 15th character in it, isn't flat out disabling it. It's still doable, just it takes longer. I actually have a theory on why people can't register a 15th character: If they previously registered 14, it effectively caps them, even if the limit is increased later. This could be a left-over remnant from the fix from last season to block people from deleting characters over and over for infinite gems.

 

The rest is pretty spot on though.

 

[Ootakemaru]

@DenialOfTruth

 

My mistake on the Demonsbane/Chaos Supply Chain thing, I think my head got it mixed up with Aero, and how it got all bugged up at one point.

 

I also do agree with Ring/Earring seeming to be more gettable. It still doesn't really feel good to have skystealer just GONE as an option. Wholly agree though! 

 

Actually looking forward to the Mutation Lab, though! Sounds interesting, oooo...

[Ootakemaru]

Just a sidenote because this is gonna bother me, and I am not able to edit my OP anymore:

 

I had originally stated:

- Leave the dungeon as a demonsbane dungeon until soul boost is over. Simply remove it from the rankings. You did this with Chaos Supply Chain, why couldn't this be done with Hall of Trials? This way people would still be able to complete the stages.

 

and then meant to have the edit to go with it for clarity:

 

(EDIT: I was mistaking CSC for Aerodrome! It was the one I was thinking of that got removed and I completely mixed these two up. My mistake! This proves however that a demonsbane dungeon can exist without a ranking so removing HoT while keeping it with its stages is possible! )

 

Sorry for any confusion! Just wanting to make this known for the record.

[DenialOfTruth]

I don't think it's viable to avoid dungeons leaving Demonsbane, but there is a fix that would work: bring us into release sync with KR. If this Soul Boost is extended one month I think that would do it. Either that, or adjust them so clearing the dungeons is what matters more then needing specific stages.

[Kailuna]

Seriously though, the most frustrating part for me right now is that I can't boost a 15th character. We've gone down for emergency maintenance and this was not hot-fixed immediately?? Where is their priorities? Cause obviously making the game playable when releasing a new class isn't one of them. They're preventing a large group of players from using their level 60 voucher efficiently if soul boost is bugged, That's a huge part of gearing your new character with the soul, heart, talisman, pet aura, etc upgrades.

[Walex]

The thing that bothers me the most with this update is that basically brand new players

can grind the same dungeon & get the same endgame gear as 6-7 years old veterans.

Huge spit in our faces.

[Ootakemaru]

@Walex

 

As a launch veteran myself, I hard disagree. As the game ages, catching up SHOULD be easier. I don't see the value of locking people out of dungeons/gear just because they didn't play for six years. As someone who gets tired of my main every now and then and needs a break, I'm glad I can run the same things on my alts who finally can do some damage because they were able to catch up. It makes things more refreshing and viable to experiment and learn new classes.

 

Not everyone just wants to stick with one class so the easy catch up benefits us veterans as well. I had some alts stuck on raven gear (yes still on raven) that I had wanted to gear but because of how much work it would have been, it made playing them difficult and even a bit depressing. Now I'm actually having fun because they were able to easily catch up and I find I enjoy some classes more than I thought I did.

 

Trying to keep things "locked" just encourages that same gear to just be sold later (like in trove) or said new players will get it by other means. I mean look at how some gear is gotten. People sell runs which is basically the new player sitting and doing nothing if they have a bit of gold while overpowered people do all the hard work of beating the dungeon for them (usually), I don't know how that is any better. At least with the ability to grind the dungeons they can play the game and learn like everyone else. They still have to work like the rest of us.

 

The best gear and possibly drop chance is still locked to the higher stages. The best rewards and rankings are also still locked to the higher stages. Being a vet still has its bragging rights in old costumes and knowledge/skill new players won't have. You doing the work now gives you the benefit of being way stronger and way ahead of people that new players or alts who get it a bit easier later. That's kinda how it's always been. It's not a spit in the face.

 

It's refreshing.

[Draknalor]

2 hours ago, Walex said:

Huge spit in our faces.

The reason i don't play alts is because.. I don't want to go from 200M dps down to 40M dpsm i also rather not invite people who do 40M dps.

 

So new players getting gear faster is a good thing, so that we get more geared people up to do content with.

[DenialOfTruth]

11 hours ago, Walex said:

The thing that bothers me the most with this update is that basically brand new players

can grind the same dungeon & get the same endgame gear as 6-7 years old veterans.

Huge spit in our faces.

Ah, so should new players be hopelessly behind forever? Do you have a better solution?

[Yingtaii]

Hiya, one of the mentioned thread folks here. Thanks for making this post to help bring awareness to everything!

 

I did submit a support ticket with screenshots and details over my issues and was met with the "We will forward your report to the development team so that they can investigate the issue. However, we may be unable to personally email you about the investigation but any major updates may be announced on our website and/or forums" response. While its sadly something the dev team needs to look into, I do recommend to keep sending in tickets with screenshot proof and as much details as you can give.

 

Bonus issue that I did report to support that I did not list in my thread is that the "Bittersweet Symphony" achievement is also locked as I completed the Echoes of a Song quest before the Achievement issues were fixed for Musician. Minor as it blocks me from a title, but still one to bring up.

[Walex]

10 hours ago, DenialOfTruth said:

Ah, so should new players be hopelessly behind forever? Do you have a better solution?

Do you remember 2016? Do you remember new players (except for clueless people) running EC or DT on first day/week for example?
 

19 hours ago, Ootakemaru said:

As a launch veteran myself, I hard disagree. As the game ages, catching up SHOULD be easier.

Catching up =/= getting endgame gear within first days of playing.
But yeah, sure, let 3-4k bap (thanks to free F10 stuff) people have the same gear as 7-10k bap people, because why not, right?
Same weapon, jewelery, soul, and badge (plus shields & gems from CSC). That's like 70% (9 out of 13 pieces)
of the endgame gear right here, while getting the "just one tier behind" pet aura from soul boost as well.

Look at other games, I won't mention titles on purpose.
Let's look at "T" - it has its years yet do people run harder stuff at start? No, they have to grind from level 1 (yes it's easier/faster now).
Let's look at "M" - it also has its years yet do people have an access to high level maps at start? Nope, grind from level 1.
And I don't remember getting anything for free/at start. Yes I know that they're different but they're still MMORPGs so...

Imo this is just ridiculous. Well whatever.

[DenialOfTruth]

1 hour ago, Walex said:

Do you remember 2016? Do you remember new players (except for clueless people) running EC or DT on first day/week for example?

That's not a solution you are presenting. While I do partially agree and feel Manifest Soul is a bit too much, the other freebies on offer like Soul Boost, the Soul Shields+Weapon in F10...are not a bad idea. And even with good gear, it does not replace learning the classes people play and learning the encounters. Again, do you have a better idea?

[Ootakemaru]

@Walex

 

First off. The game LAUNCHED in January of 2016 for NA/EU players. How can you compare the game in its first year to what it is now in 2022? Fun fact, you can't. If you expect the game to remain exactly the same as when it launched then I'm sorry, you have completely unrealistic expectations.

 

 

You literally cannot compare 2016 BnS to 2022 BnS. It's going to change. Gearing is going to get easier or believe me this game would have been LONG dead from frustrated players.

 

 

I don't know how you read that catching up was equal to getting endgame gear because unless a new player is paying thousands to buy mats, I don't see anyone like that. Aside from the free soul in f10 (which I think most agree that it's a little too much), I haven't seen a single new player rocking maxed out mythicals at +19 or higher within their first week. That's endgame gear. That's the highest you can get to my knowledge. Hell I haven't seen them barely hitting +3. They're too busy learning how to play the game and actually GETTING Starcross (since you know you have to get it to actually drop first) to have this endgame gear you keep claiming.

 

 

Even myself on my main, I don't have a full Poh soul shield because of the drop rate and the rng. (I'm a returning player, I came back around September) It's been about a month now of running it to the point I had to take a break from that dungeon. Please tell me how new players are just getting full True Poh, Upsurge, Oculus/Starcross, and myth accessories within their first few days. Skystealer from f10 isn't endgame anymore. Shadow fury 9 isn't endgame anymore. When new things come out, that becomes the new end game.

 

I'm familiar with and play a lot of other MMOs and they follow similar methods. Many, when new tiers come out, the older tier becomes much easier to get or even flat obsolete.

 

If I start BnS from level 1, I still have to go through the story. I still have to get my GC3 weapon. I still have to WORK through soul boost and grind those dungeons to get that gear.

 

 

 

You are acting like this promotion is lasting forever. As if in 3 months when a new player comes by they'll be able to claim the exact same bundle. Starting from level 1 in BnS still requires me to level and grind and work. Your time isn't any more valuable than anyone else's just because you played longer. This is the right step for new and returning players.

 

Also considering the fact that skystealer accessories are missing as a whole from their dungeons, you can't even grind for them while working on soul boost so what are new players supposed to do then? You're entirely justified to feel upset that the game wants to help new/returning people, or those of us to play alts but honestly your vision seems a bit entitled.

 

You're already ahead of the game. That's how that works. You put in the work to stay two steps ahead of the gear curve, and you stay ahead of that curve. And like someone else here said, offer a solution then.

 

 

You are so insistent that people shouldn't be able to catch up "so fast" then what should be the alternative other than "I'm mad a new player can do the same as me?"

 

I'd be glad if new players could keep up. It hurts approximately nobody for a game to be fun as well as manageable. Again no disrespect! I always sound mad when I'm not haha.

 

Edited October 24, 2022 by Ootakemaru
format/typos

[Vy06]

On 10/23/2022 at 2:53 AM, Walex said:

The thing that bothers me the most with this update is that basically brand new players

can grind the same dungeon & get the same endgame gear as 6-7 years old veterans.

Huge spit in our faces.

Could not disagree more...The point of having people get gear and able to do higher content is have more options in the community...how does that make sense to anyone that a brand-new player should not experience the fun of getting gear simply because they just started? I have been here since the beginning, and I could not be happier at the changes they have made to getting gear.  Even if a brand-new player gets gear in no way shape or form will they automatically be able to do Grim Stg 8 or above without some serious grinding on other gear not given, the skysteeler accy they give you and even the soul are amazing to get you to a medium level of power.  Plus, if there are more people who can run F8 how is that a bad thing? For months people have been complaining of a dead F8, well not anymore because they helped people get geared and not suffer like most vets had to for the power we do have, it should definitely be looked at as a welcomed change even in terms of gearing your own alts at a decent pace because IT IS attainable like it never has before.

[Walex]

12 hours ago, Vy06 said:

For months people have been complaining of a dead F8, well not anymore because they helped people get geared and not suffer like most vets had to for the power we do have, it should definitely be looked at as a welcomed change even in terms of gearing your own alts at a decent pace because IT IS attainable like it never has before.

F8 might be somehow good for alts & new/returning players... or basically for simple things like running EM / s1-s5 dungeons,
but overall it's useless. It's still better to get a 4/4 group before pressing F8, but it looks like tons of people won't understand it.
 

F8 should be disabled (I mean the recruit system), F7 should be reworked, and there should be a separated chat for "forming a group" things.

Right now people are split between game chats outside of F8, and inside F8.
 

There's one simple solution by reworking F7.

How? By simply making every player able to register to what they wanna do.
Every person register for whatever they want, and they stay there as registered until they cancel it, or they join a party.
But it shouldn't be limited to dungeons only, it should have things like "EM / HM train, s1 / s5 db train" etc.
It would make gaming soooo easier, but nooo, why even bother making a good QoL changes?

[Zai]

The thing that was abysmal was the state of the game before the patch.

Impossible to farm mats and gold, litteraly.
They had 2 possibilities to solve that : decrease the costs, or increase the amont of gold given, which would obiously changes drasticly the economy in the game. They took 2nd option, better than do nothing

You described details issue comparing to that. The only one main problem left is still the boting and cheat, but that doesnt concern the patch.

Game is now playable, in 7 years I have never seen such a massive return of players on bns, tho you cant blame that much this patch
 

[Vy06]

2 hours ago, Zai said:

The thing that was abysmal was the state of the game before the patch.

Impossible to farm mats and gold, litteraly.
They had 2 possibilities to solve that : decrease the costs, or increase the amont of gold given, which would obiously changes drasticly the economy in the game. They took 2nd option, better than do nothing

You described details issue comparing to that. The only one main problem left is still the boting and cheat, but that doesnt concern the patch.

Game is now playable, in 7 years I have never seen such a massive return of players on bns, tho you cant blame that much this patch
 

EXACTLY! I am actually excited to play this game, I played for years simply as a fan in HOPES it would get better someday, I watched everyone from my clan and group quit playing because it was abysmal before this patch.  And finally feel like I can earn and accomplish stuff on my main only if I want OR play my alts and actually get somewhere.  

[PervertedLyn]

Ive left the game in August of 2021 when Uzume gear was the best out there. So i was pleasently suprised that the next tier skystealer was free now. 

I did the soul boost and really got interested in the game again. 

Then when i got star cross ring and earring to drop i noticed i cannot do succesion and would lose all my psyches cause of this. 

So i am forced to either farm scales to buy the psyches again or skystealer crystals to make them +11. 

 

My problem with all that is Skystealer Crystals drop maybe like every 5th run so i believe i have to run hall of trials like 200 times. I really dont wanna do it since this is litterly old gear now and this dungeon dosent drop anything usefull. If it atleast had something usefull to drop i wouldnt mind but this is eating up my motivation yet again. 

 

There is also the True Skystealer Ring (Shadowbane) which i also wanna have but i cannot get it either, cause i dont have the premium tier needed to get this request granted from Support. 

 

Game is still full of cheaters. Most if not all high gear players use speedhack. 

Overall i feel like i should just stop again. I dont get why gear 2 tiers behind the current gear needs that much farming or why its not written anywhere that i cannot use succesion before +11. 

[FeralStripes]

1 hour ago, PervertedLyn said:

Overall i feel like i should just stop again. I dont get why gear 2 tiers behind the current gear needs that much farming or why its not written anywhere that i cannot use succesion before +11. 

 I feel the same, I currently have all +13 skystealer accessories & have been trying to +16 them so I can then use my succession to obtain all +12 starcross accessories. TBH I feel dumb farming crystals for accessories that are 2+ tiers behind & the gear is almost 2 years old at this point.

 

NC west needs to give all players a higher amount of skystealer crystals & reduce the amount of skystealer crystals needed to upgrade your gear, it just shows it's bad game design. NC maliciously makes the game very grindy so that the player gets fed up & end up paying for the crystals in the F10 Hongmoon store cash-shop!

Edited October 31, 2022 by FeralStripes
spellcheck

[luzt]

No, its not necessarily bad game design, since you're approaching it from your own perspective.

Was it really the intention for everyone to +20 all their skystealer gear?

Keeping in mind that they only introduced the guaranteed upgrades for Skystealer after already 4 pieces of Starcross were released?

 

That 'guaranteed upgrades' part is bad game design since it doesn't align with the other tiers, so you feel forced to upgrade Skystealer as high as possible.

While I'm pretty sure that wasn't their intention.

Their intention was, use Skystealer +0-4ish and then swap to Starcross without succession and play like it is in KR.

(in KR skystealer crystals as drop are phased out now)

 

It's still nice that the option is there, but I think it would be better for everyone if all tiers shared the same system.

 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2022 by luzt