Warlocks are worthless.

[Durethia]

I started playing this game as a warlock, all of my nice gear is on my warlock, my main is a warlock, and it's what I rolled.

The issues I have are the following:

1) I don't know why NCSoft saw fit to give other classes the Soul Burn.  It's the only reason anyone ever wanted a Warlock in their group.  Furthermore, they gave it to a class that commonly initiates engagement (Warden), and it feels as if the Warden's ability to initiate it is quicker than for the Warlock; like one key hit and boom it's on.  While the Warlock can attain Black Wing, and with some soul shields have additional boosts to his Soul Burn... you can not explain this to some cocky Warden in your group; their Soul Burn is part of their rotation, and it doesn't matter that their boosts aren't as good as yours.  I just went through this trying to explain to a lowbie Warden that my Soul Burn was more powerful, he just claimed I was jealous.  He didn't even have Black Wing; none of his badges were legendary, his soul shields were crap.

2) DPS is dismal, absolute garbage.  Even with a bad rotation, crappy skill rotation even, it shouldn't be as horrible as it is.  Even doing spiders in the moon refuge, it feels like breathing through a straw.  You can perceive how fast you're burning down the monsters, and everyone else accelerates far faster than I do.  ANY other person hitting the same spider, I can tell they are out dps'ing me by a lot; my contributions are negligible.  This follows in raids and in dungeons.  The most DPS I have ever achieved is a couple thousand over 1million per second.  Mostly, I just average around 300-500k per second.  Again, I perhaps could try to work on my rotation, as this is always the excuse in all games about people complaining about their DPS.  However, even in top tier dungeons everyone knows, Warlocks have nothing to contribute, so if the nerds and spreadsheet crunchers are coming to similar conclusions... something is definitely wrong.

There seems to be a general agreement, from subreddits on Reddit, to Youtube videos, forums and faction chat in-game... any other class can have half the gear of the Warlock and easily out DPS him without requiring a difficult and tuned skill rotation scheme.

NCSoft this is ridiculous.  No one should have SB but the Warlock.  And you have to do something about the DPS.  I'm convinced, if you straight up doubled the DPS stats for all skills, the class would still lag behind in DPS.  It's ridiculous.

I have no choice to stick with the Warlock, I'm too vested at this point.  I have another character, but I just use him to store some Hongmoon stones and stuff.  The class is so gimped, I don't really feel I contribute much to any group.  I'm HM 19 close to HM 20, I believe I'm decently geared, and I have to say, I wouldn't be surprised if there's a lot of HM 15s out there that can out DPS my character.

I'm not left with much incentive to continue playing, other than very personal objectives of finishing dailies.  This isn't good for your player base.

[GrimQueen]

And here I thought I am the only one having DPS issues XD

I mean, I have high ping most of the days that certainly doesn't help while playing wl and I highly prefer distortion/ice spec because of the mobility and overall fun I have with it, so my DPS output is even lower. From what I tried, scourge deals a bit more dmg. I still prefer distortion tho.

 

I am still without the newest badge from ToI and my gear is from up to stage 5 chest from the previous event, so I still have ways to improve. Although i average 300-700 k per second as it depends if I manage to step into every annoying mech. But yeah, my max dps is same as yours and it indeed is underwhelming knowing that on my alt, that didn't even finish the main story, i already can parse to 300k. And before someone tells me about rotation, I am truly doing everything right. There isn't much room for errors in wl combo. The only thing i despise is macro usage in games, so it is that i prefer manual skill input than using macro for 4t. I learned to click at similar pace to macro with different keybinds (no one wants to get a carpal tunnel), so the difference shows usually when I am tired. 

 

I am actually kinda ok-ish with wardens having similar skill. We can still use TD after all, although for Scourge spec it is not recommended because they loose some DPS. BUT. I am wholeheartedly against people saying that Warden has Soulburn. Wardens have Soulflare. The end. While mainly similar, the difference lies in details, where SB gives 100% focus recovery on use and SF gives 20% health recovery. And it saddens me when people say that they want SB but what they actually seek for is warden with SF. It especially shows within parties with low DPS where warden with badges will be always preferred than wl with same gear. The difference in dps output is quite... eye-opening?

I know that it does look similar and that we give same blackwing effect but c'mon. At least some actually write "ward sb" which is much clearer as to what they seek for. 

 

Wl is truly not up to par on early stages but is quite nice to play with at higher gear. Still not as satisfactionary with DPS but still... At least that is my opinion, as I don't have to pay that much attention to upholding Focus as the right combo sustains itself. But how one plays their wl, which badges and what talents they use depends on one's personal preference. 

 

Maybe it would be nice if using SF didn't give universal cd on SB usage. I am pretty sure som wl that have warden in a party pray not to click SB a milisecond after SF. 

The hilarity ensues when there are 2 wl (one ice with TD and one scourge with empowered helix) and one warden and noone uses SB or SF. Just sit back, grab popcorn and wait for flaming both wl, wait for it. There is a chance the one complaining will be warden. Then be ready that at next boss, after wl will want to SB, SF will happen before wl clicks 1. But welp that might be just my rotten luck. 

 

The only saving grace (although i still get a little bit depressed seeing their DPS when I am happy that had 1 mln and they just jump in and say they have 3 mln with same gear) are my clan members who seem actually happy to have someone they know using wl. because sb. and there are no wardens who can play in the clan. so yeah. Alright, that's actually sounds depressing. 

I will see myself out. 

Edited May 19, 2020 by GrimQueen

[Durethia]

Soulflare, Soulburn, they are just labels, when one negatively impacts the other.  If a Warden throws a Soulflare, and prevents me from initiating Soulburn... as far as I'm concerned, he has a Soulburn-ish skill that competes with mine.

Originally, the Warlock was under pressure to hit Soulburn and keep it up, but in the beginning it was rather difficult to initiate.  Originally you had to deploy your thrall, which takes a bit of time to summon, and then you had to hit another skill to sacrifice your thrall... which that took a while... and then finally everyone has Soulburn.  It was common to be interrupted, as the warlock is impacted by every CC thrown it's way by the bosses in PVE.  (A lot of yelling at Warlocks to get SB up during those days.)

Now a days, Soulburn is a little easier to initiate, the Warlock is required to block, and then hit Soulburn.  But there's a bug, 20-30% of the time, the Soulburn doesn't actually activate but the cool-down is kicked off; it's mildly infuriating.  I have thought about making a macro for Soulburn, maybe that will help, but if done manually this bug is real.

The Soulburn should be very easy to kick off, and I would suggest cool down buffs so the Warlock can hit it more often... but ultimately, I feel Soulflare and Soulburn should have distinct, non-competing buffs and they should stack and not share a cool down.


Frankly, I don't care what NCSoft does, as long as they make the WL competitive in support and competitive in DPS.
 

Edited May 20, 2020 by Durethia
clarification

[GrimQueen]

XD it's not a bug sweetie. Once whether sb or sf is on, a universal cd starts and lasts for 1 minute. 

For example there are wl, ward and some class with ac. Once warden hits sf, no matter how much you want it, even if the sf effect is over, you can't hit sb. Why?

There is an icon with golden wings that shows universal cd in group for sf AND sb. If you want to use sb while cd is not over, the effect won't take place. The end. Same happens if the roles are reversed.

The only way you can hit sb after sf ends, is if someone uses alpha call that resets the skill. But all in all, you have to look out for that cd. 

There is simply no other way for you to hit sb and for it having no other effect than going straight into cd time.

Ah old days, old days. Still idk how you played the wl tho. The positioning is and always will be crucial for this class. The main thing u did before the tank engaged a fight was summoning the Thrall.  This way even tho cd for summoning was long, you could fasten the next sb. But at the same time Thrall was much more useful back in the days, as it had more skills that u could choose from. When I wanted to use sb in  mid battle I always used sanctum and bastion and stood there not caring about the world because I could XD 

I play distortion because of the mobility it gives. I cry seeing the new dragoncall animation tho. These look more like eels than dragons like before XD

Edited May 23, 2020 by GrimQueen
I forgot to add some commas

[Durethia]

The bug I mentioned, certainly seems like a bug.

I'm well aware of a universal cool down between the SF and SB.  I talked about this in my complaint, I believe they should stack, give distinct buffs, and they shouldn't share a cool down.  I'm also well aware if another warlock is my group.

Without any cool down, without a warden or an additional warlock in my group, about 30% of the time when I go to start Soulburn, the cool down activates but the buff doesn't.

 

Edited May 24, 2020 by Durethia
clarification

[Exchallenger]

I'm sorry but WL is dead class. Nobody care us. Therefore I left my WL a long time ago. I do not trust to ncsoft team anymore. 

[chilegamerz]

every time I find more failures in bns is unfortunate.

But I still have faith in ncsoft and I do not want to give up until the third specialization comes out. I hope that with that they fix all the problems that the warlock has, I have been playing for years and as I say the person who published this topic is difficult for me to change my mind. main I have been playing for many years I have a lot of time invested and some ncoin I also hope that the admins read this and help us improve the warlock and that it improves in general apart this pj is supposed to be for support but it does not help at all all of me clan makes more dps than me and several have less ap and worse equipment.

[Bonbon Beans]

My issue is with the summon's long cooldown. During boss fights, you will for sure have a long window where your unique ability is not available, leaving you to fight alone. It also does not follow you around, which I thought should be a given for all summons.