Assassin Ability Traps

[Dreegan]

So, after doing some research and asking around, I have a lot of questions, more than I have answers. Now, I don't expect you guys to actually answer my questions, but perhaps we can gather some sort of information, or put forth some feedback for the class. The topic in question, is abilities that don't seem to suit a purpose. Especially towards end-game.

 

Flash Kick - This will be first topic. Because what the *cricket*. It's a shame, because it seems like a good skill when you're leveling up. But it's a damn lie. Once I got past 40, I only really used it for fun and AoE when I'm killing and not being serious about anything. The damage is pitiful, even when putting points 3 points into it. And if the enemy has 5 stacks of poison, I get way more DPS out of L+R than I do out of using this, regardless if they're knocked down or not. The iFrames seem to be the only thing this ability is good for, and even then... it's really meh. In PvP, you'd think... MAYBE!? But no, it's absolutely even worse. You'd have to play a crazy KD game to even get it off to do damage, and even then you're just better off with Shadow Dash, as it's WAYYY more bursty, and also has other applications (Poking, and De-Stealthing). I really can't find any purpose in using this over Web. Ever.

 

Bombard - Now this one can be fun, but that's about it. Taking it instantly destroys any combo potential you can do with Animation Canceling, the more required hidden mechanic in the game. I guess if you're once again, doing AoE solo grinding somewhere it can be useful, but considering you can't be in stealth while doing it makes it kinda stupid and pointless, taking unnecessary damage. I want it to work, but I really don't see it doing much. 

 

Sidewinder - I've used this move once, and only once, just to see what it did. I cannot for the life of me figure out why I would want my main form of gap-close and Stealth initiation to ever be on a 30 second CD. 2 Sec Stun and a bit of a tickle in damage? Whoop-di-doo. AND IF YOU PUT TWO POINTS IN!? You eliminate the dead-zone. WHAT VALUE! This ability is a damn joke. Even the HM Skill for it is absolute trash. Why?

 

Shuriken - Filler? Bored? Have to stay back? Why put points into this instead of Smokescreen? Just seems like another useless points dump to me, Which begs the question, why does it exist to begin with? I don't have an answer.

 

Lotus of Poison - This seems like some kind of God-Like PvP skill. And I've even used it. Once. Dunno what I was thinking. Sure, you get a 6 second window of the enemy literally unable to really do anything. But what can I do with 6 seconds to make use of this? Not much, really. Nothing worth it, that's for sure. Taking more skill points away from going Solo Hero Mode with Fighting Spirit (And a long ass stealth), or ditching your second Trinket (Which is crazy important with the sheer amount of low CD CC in this game) AND on top of the fact you have to poison the enemy, plant the flower, and then activate it without them moving out of 8m radius, it really doesn't add much to your kit. 

 

So, with all that out of the way, what do you guys think? What is the purpose of these abilities. Some are just absolutely pointless, and others just seem like placeholder abilities until you get enough points to make it useful (and in turn, a completely different ability all together, as it were). So, what would you replace them with? What would you change to make these abilities more desirable over their obviously better alternatives? Anything? Or do you feel that they implemented bad abilities for the sake of making the other options look THAT much better?

[Purestic]

Yeah, they suck. I only use Shuriken to tag mobs in PvE (but I think it CAN be good vs certain matchups because of the Shadowslip.. but rather not?) and I think Flash Kick CAN be good in PvP.. I don't know.. but maybe if you knockdown and pull it off before and IF the enemy tabs or something but even then it's a waste compared to other abilities in that situation. Lotus of Poison.. I can see that it can be useful but I don't see a fight where it could be better than one of the others.

 

Shadow Kick is another ability I can't really see any useability except getting out of stealth to Tab->1 or smth. I've seen other Sins using it for troll purposes, though.

[Shadovvv]

• Spinal Tap Stage 2 (right tree): More damage and less cooldown but no stun and still kicks us out of stealth? This doesn't even fit into our rotations anyway.
• Time Bomb and Swiftstep Knockdown: Why do we want to waste points to change a Daze to Knockdown? Daze makes Heart Stab go faster, Knockdown doesn't, so what's the point?
• Flash Kick: They should probably just delete this entirely, make Webbing the default, and expand on Webbing's tree. This skill is too slow and deals too little damage.
• Bombard: This skill could use A LOT of improvements to make it a more viable alternative to Heart Stab... Also the Hongmoon skill for this is crap.
• Sidewinder: If the cooldown were 18 seconds like Destroyer's Blitz (that's one of their charges I think?), it'd be a lot more usable. And the Hongmoon skill needs to be better.
• Lotus Kick Hongmoon: 2 second focus cost to 5 second focus regen... Okay what? That looks super lame for 2 skill points to spend on...
• Lotus of Escape Stage 1 Tier 4/5 (Party Pull): 10 second longer mark? 6 second chi reduction on chi recovery mode for Hongmoon? I don't see how a longer lasting marks helps. Plus Destroyer and Force Master variants don't have their chi reduction on Hongmoon; why is ours designed like this?

Shuriken could be useful because mob tagging and Shadowslip and Lotus of Poison is an interesting spec (although it could be improved), but they're just largely overshadowed.

[Purestic]

21 minutes ago, Shadovvv said:

• Time Bomb and Swiftstep Knockdown: Why do we want to waste points to change a Daze to Knockdown? Daze makes Heart Stab go faster, Knockdown doesn't, so what's the point?
• Bombard: This skill could use A LOT of improvements to make it a more viable alternative to Heart Stab... Also the Hongmoon skill for this is crap.
• Sidewinder: If the cooldown were 18 seconds like Destroyer's Blitz (that's one of their charges I think?), it'd be a lot more usable. And the Hongmoon skill needs to be better.

Agree, but Time Bomb + Swiftstep knockdown can be useful in PvP since you can knock down through many buffs but not daze.

 

When I first noticed Bombard I was pretty interested in it. I really like the idea and would love if they make it somewhat viable. Like atleast make it that Dark Strike gets activated when critting with Bombard

[Shadovvv]

9 hours ago, Purestic said:

Agree, but Time Bomb + Swiftstep knockdown can be useful in PvP since you can knock down through many buffs but not daze.

When I first noticed Bombard I was pretty interested in it. I really like the idea and would love if they make it somewhat viable. Like atleast make it that Dark Strike gets activated when critting with Bombard

Knockdown doesn't benefit Assassins outside of Webbing and Stage 2 Shadow Slash, the former we can already achieve by doing air combo or Highwire knockdown (I do use Highwire knockdown if I run out of focus and/or trick my opponent into blowing their escapes) and the latter being generally unused. It doesn't speed up Heart Stab or increase the damage of Dark Strike/Lightning Pierce, unlike Daze. Also, knockdown gives the opponent more counter options.

 

Bombard could affect bomb-type area of effect attacks like Landmine and maybe Time Bomb, Choke Bomb and Plaguemist, such as lowering their cooldowns a bit on critical hit or something. Still, making it proc Dark Strike/Lightning Pierce and maybe not kick us out of stealth would help the skill immensely.

[Dreegan]

1 hour ago, Shadovvv said:

Knockdown doesn't benefit Assassins outside of Webbing and Stage 2 Shadow Slash, the former we can already achieve by doing air combo or Highwire knockdown (I do use Highwire knockdown if I run out of focus and/or trick my opponent into blowing their escapes) and the latter being generally unused. It doesn't speed up Heart Stab or increase the damage of Dark Strike/Lightning Pierce, unlike Daze.

 

Bombard could affect bomb-type area of effect attacks like Landmine and maybe Time Bomb, Choke Bomb and Plaguemist, such as lowering their cooldowns a bit on critical hit or something. Still, making it proc Dark Strike/Lightning Pierce and maybe not kick us out of stealth would help the skill immensely.

I do use the Swift Step KD version against BD's and Destros. Not so much the time bomb, since I'm only 50 HM1, so I can't really spare the points. But it IS rather useful.

 

I have to disagree about Bombard procing DS or LP. It doesn't make much sense to attack an area and then attack a single target. I mean, if you're using Bombard (which is only comparable to damage to Heart Stab with 5 poison stacks and HM skill invested in), you obviously want to attack more than one thing. I don't even think being in Stealth would give it a purpose. It just flat out doesn't fit the class all that well in theme or function. It comes across to me more of an ability suited towards a Gunner class, who would be happy just tossing nades at his enemy CoD style.

 

For Flash step... I like the animation and everything, and it would be cool to add to a Knockdown game. But do you have any ideas for another skill, or possible buff to make it viable? Lol it's not like we don't have enough abilities on our Tab to begin with.

[Shadovvv]

Decoy's skill tree, except the middle path. I mean, the skill itself isn't bad, but Dandelion laughs at about all the specs we have.