Raid Nerfs

[Eckogen]

This is the TLDR list of the nerfs for VT and TT.

 

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/459989602921611265/565007531722670080/image0.png

 

What's your thoughts on this matter? Personally, I don't agree with mechanical nerfs. What was the point in coding all that just to undo parts/all of it and potentially introduce new bugs? Sure, it helps out the community gear up for the next content, but long term it doesn't teach people the complex mechanics. For instance, groups that clear TT after the nerfs will be hitting an omega wtf mechanics wall when they attempt ET. From a walk in the park to full on mechanics; groups will have a hard time adjusting. Basically, nerfing = brain dead content.

 

Nerfing health makes more sense. It's much easier to apply without changing much coding + mechanics are intact. Keep content interesting. Don't dull it.

 

#BringBackMechs

Edited April 9, 2019 by Eckogen

[prietess]

Agree. Nerfing mechs makes it not so attractive and less challenging. A bit boring tbh.

 

Btw, Eckogen, when will you use marker on your guide videos? :P It will really help to understand and focus on the things that you try to show. :P

Edited April 9, 2019 by prietess

[chickenpoodle]

if they want a nerfed version of the raid, create a separate instance.

and use the hard mode, normal mode feature thats built into party UI.

 

the hard mode is the one we have originally. full mechanics, full hp etc

normal mode is the nerfed versions.

 

alter the drop table, heck, add in diff achievements, whatever you want.

then you got a way to cater to both the demographic who wants to play the harder content, and those who wanna just do the easy stuff.

[Lyn Thunderfox]

If they'd lower the health points of all bosses, it would make the raid more available for slightly lowered geared since you'd need less dps but would still be punished for missing mechs or rewarded by clearing them which would "self-damage" the boss.

 

Literally no reasons to nerf mechs if the amount of HP is more or less the same, all it does is making people want to get even higher gear because the bosses are only sandbags while they literally requires no skill to clear because there's barely any mechs anymore. 

But as I said, HP remains the same, DPS requirement remains the same too.

[Arohk]

1 hour ago, chickenpoodle said:

if they want a nerfed version of the raid, create a separate instance.

and use the hard mode, normal mode feature thats built into party UI.

 

the hard mode is the one we have originally. full mechanics, full hp etc

normal mode is the nerfed versions.

 

alter the drop table, heck, add in diff achievements, whatever you want.

then you got a way to cater to both the demographic who wants to play the harder content, and those who wanna just do the easy stuff.

That is entirely the worst possible solution and what broke World of Warcrafts neck at the end.

they have :

Idiot Mode

Easy Mode

Normal Mode

Mythic Mode

 

for their raids, it make the whole game feel uninteresting and unrewarding.

 

I understand why raids get made easier after a while, but sadly i couldn't clear it before that point, we just beat the second boss in TT this weekend, it took a lot of practice got get everything done right and it felt really good when the boss finally fell.

 

What i really dont understand is why normal 6 man dungeons get made even easier, i mean. after the awakened patch its complete faceroll already because everyone deals so much more damage now. I only run Hardmodes nowe because normal is too boring.

[ShadowLane]

It is just a way to push high gear players to switch to new (and difficult) content and direct the mid-tier ones to the previously highest raids/dungeons. Dual mode does seem like a good idea though, still no way of telling whether they would bother to implement that for raids.

[Fiana]

@Eckogen hmmm, tbh i don't really care whatever they nerf it or not... lets take a look how VT raid in all main char
- asura dead before healing phase
- thrall cheese mech

- SK hp get to 35% without drive driver just stand dps the boss without moving the laser, and before cc ball open reach 10%, and then dead (pure dps) :3

- HQ is really brain dead, just dps stun, pull spider, repeat

 

now lets talk about TT raid, as much i like the mech but i see many my friend failed to kill boss 1 consistenly even after practicing for 2 month

its not like they're stupid or anything, its just 1 simple mistake like

bd not hm block, or

someone stand on circle, or

warden tank somehow get knockback even when use V, or

when someone dead infront of you when do mech and your entire game freeze, and you dead too because failed math

etc

 

and that 1 simple mistake is causing wipe... well, this is happen because ET raid will released soon

so ncsoft want people gear up to GC level to prepare the raid

from what i see in KR, the dps needed for ET is beyond reasoning =.=

even with 12man 2mil++ dps, they still hit 30 sec enrage timer

 

i think its near impossible to do ET with 12man A9 gear

Edited April 9, 2019 by Fiana

[Grimoir]

2 hours ago, Fiana said:

and that 1 simple mistake is causing wipe... well, this is happen because ET raid will released soon

so ncsoft want people gear up to GC level to prepare the raid

from what i see in KR, the dps needed for ET is beyond reasoning =.=

even with 12man 2mil++ dps, they still hit 30 sec enrage timer

 

i think its near impossible to do ET with 12man A9 gear

compared to VT / TT when they came out , ET will be much much muuuuuch easier. They even said it themselves because people were complaining raids are too hard, ET will be already easy.

 

I fully agree on the raid nerfs...they are dumb. They should actually do something to promote / entice people learning mechanics rather than dumb everything down. The raid gear should be a reward for clearing and not something made available to literally everyone for free.

[Fiana]

53 minutes ago, Grimoir said:

compared to VT / TT when they came out , ET will be much much muuuuuch easier. They even said it themselves because people were complaining raids are too hard, ET will be already easy.

 

I fully agree on the raid nerfs...they are dumb. They should actually do something to promote / entice people learning mechanics rather than dumb everything down. The raid gear should be a reward for clearing and not something made available to literally everyone for free.

you said it yourself... that dev heard from a lot of player base that raid is too hard, that why they nerf the mech

that mean its not just 1%-2% population who complain about this and not just from NA, but in all region
 

[Hanuku]

1 hour ago, Grimoir said:

I fully agree on the raid nerfs...they are dumb. They should actually do something to promote / entice people learning mechanics rather than dumb everything down. The raid gear should be a reward for clearing and not something made available to literally everyone for free.

Sadly the money is where there are people paying. It seems too many people out there disagree with most people posting in this thread and instead prefer easier content. Sad day for those looking for something akin to a MMO Dark Souls. Remember these episodes the next time you open your wallet for a game. Publishers are not here to sell a game only for the few and proud super hardcore expert players. Those kinds of players usually pride themselves on earning everything without spending a penny anyway. And that is bad (or none) business to them. They sell to whales who will clear anything regardless, and to the masses with some disposable income. And the masses are speaking, though not everyone agree with them.

 

Some people promote the idea of making easy and hard versions of raids. I feel the population may be too low to fill both kinds of raids at the same time. What I'd say instead would have been to ease up on all the materials and stuff needed to upgrade. That way people can maybe concentrate more on learning mechanics and their class abilities rather than worry about how many of this or that fragment of a fragment they need to collect to give their ring 3 points of attack per "evolution".

 

Also, there should always be some content for casuals to play with. Though that'd be more of a personal wish as I'm a casual myself with no real hope of even entering a raid ever. Anyway, these are just my opinions.

[ombremq]

My thought, mechs in this game are not adapted for the average IQ of BnS Community and for a game that poorly optimized, when you spend double or triple of time your suposed to spend in a raid cause of incredibly slow Learning curve of 80% of the population in Blade & soul + mistakes caused by low FPS, freeze and lagg...better nerf it and end our misery.

[squirrely thoughts]

Thoughts: Why bother raiding now, bns is effectively another idle game. 

 

Hold rmb until you get enough gold to hold rmb in a higher tier "dungeon". 
or pay to skip the wait and go straight to the highest tier to hold rmb with more flashy lights. 

 

 

Edited April 9, 2019 by squirrely thoughts

[Fiana]

10 hours ago, ombremq said:

My thought, mechs in this game are not adapted for the average IQ of BnS Community and for a game that poorly optimized, when you spend double or triple of time your suposed to spend in a raid cause of incredibly slow Learning curve of 80% of the population in Blade & soul + mistakes caused by low FPS, freeze and lagg...better nerf it and end our misery.

exactly, not everyone like game like sekiro or darksoul, especially most casual player who not even hardcore gamer

and yes, not only the problem the mech, but also the condition game itself, in TT we have to show all char and we got only 30fps
- in normal DG i can get 50-60 but in raid only 20-30fps, 

- game freeze even crash when someoen dead in front of us

- my friend last week TT, failed because the tank game crash not responding

- player have to use vpn to even able barely play, due to game design we have to do rotation to dps.. so lag is serius problem

 

and the TT raid already get nerf 3 times before this, now is the 4th nerf... no one complain when they nerf it before, why? because at that time even the most whale player thought it was a difficult raid

after several nerf and lv60 patch, most player now have access to aranshu gear and thus increase average dps player in raid

that why the raid now become like its easy

 

if they not nerf any raid including BT, not even a single bit of it... iam sure now we still have BT gear while the whale only have aranshu

and no one running TT raid

 

 

Edited April 10, 2019 by Fiana

[Indifferent]

Ye Ye, first they asking raven geared raids, then they unhappy when gets one. And YEYE no paid raids for you any more bastards to get half week gold in 1 run, and no SELLING items with 2-10k of gold. Bebe bebeebe

[Darksilent]

I agree with the Nerf. today those who prefer mechanics luckily have a good MS so they can enjoy and have more damage in the raid. but this is a global game and many do not have 50-120 ms and many that have 250 ms+. those people are separated from the raids because they do not do enough damage or are not quick for mechanics. with this it leads that people can only equip in events. since nerf BT there are a lot of players that can at least get to raven 9 thing that before the nerf was impossible. and now even to do EL-IF- SMM-NS they ask aransu 3+. so I do not understand why they cry for a nerf if to do simple dungeons they ask for VT equip .. I've seen many people be separated from the simple dungeons by only having seraph / baleful 12. with this many players can continue to enjoy the game and equip themselves. it would no longer be for a few to do VT. but I think the whining goes through the gold that those people would lose selling the items.

Edited April 10, 2019 by Darksilent

[Nanology]

Personally, I dislike the raid and dungeon nerfs. Part of the reason I love this game is because of learning mechanic and having the skill to execute them properly. Unfortunately, I believe the majority of the player base is not capable of learning and executing many of the mechanics, which is why the nerfs are happening. Player’s inability to complete the more difficult dungeons or raids can be due to a number of things like: high ping, low fps, poor performance of their pc, bad internet connection, the poor optimization of the game, or quite simply lack of skill and knowledge of how to play their class. It’s too bad that NCWest can’t figure out some way to help those players that are struggling outside of “make it easier.”

[Riss77]

Well I'm more comfortable with the Dark Souls serie than the mechanics of this game that never made any sense and need you to go Youtube just to get a beginning of understanding of what's going on.

In games where game design is ok you can figure out the mechs by yourselves.

In this game it's not, you have to rely on guides or Youtube, I never did that before for any game...

If you play with static group it might be ok, but for more that half of the population it's more likely that they have to do F8 and pray that every pug knows the mech of cancer dungeons because you know that even if you prepared for the mechs sometimes it needs only 1 person that do not know and your run go to waste. It was way too punishing.

Edited April 10, 2019 by Riss77

[Grimoir]

6 hours ago, Nanology said:

Personally, I dislike the raid and dungeon nerfs. Part of the reason I love this game is because of learning mechanic and having the skill to execute them properly. Unfortunately, I believe the majority of the player base is not capable of learning and executing many of the mechanics, which is why the nerfs are happening. Player’s inability to complete the more difficult dungeons or raids can be due to a number of things like: high ping, low fps, poor performance of their pc, bad internet connection, the poor optimization of the game, or quite simply lack of skill and knowledge of how to play their class. It’s too bad that NCWest can’t figure out some way to help those players that are struggling outside of “make it easier.”

but they did....there are alternative accessories which are raid equivalents in tier, there are weapon paths which are equivalent to raid weapons in tier (different skill mods but thats how its supposed to be) So people can get the alternative gears and still be somewhat on-par with raid geared players. 

Instead of promoting that, they rather just dumb crap down so much that you can do it with your eyes closed, and in the long run it wont help or fix anything as the same players which are like this now will be like this with every single new content that comes.

A game should not change because some people have lives and cant do XYZ, a game should not change because some people have XYZ ping....its just plain absurd.

[Laura099]

In all honesty, mechanically raids were almost never difficult in this game. Arguably the most annoying raid, and I say this with a grain of salt, was the sudden move to 12-man for BT and VT. The main reason being, especially for BT boss 2, it really ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ed with mechanics. It became a bit more class dependent, requiring certain double ccs. But that was about it.
TT used to be fun, and normally I wouldn't agree with the nerfs, especially on boss 1. But now they've taken away warlocks rescuing capabilities, and honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they did this with the rest. Boss 2 is a joke with almost nothing that can kill you, while boss 3 is literally just know when to cuddle and you good.
As for VT, I appreciate the sentiment, but why would they only just NOW force you to learn mechs for boss 2? That nerf should have been added long ago, to force people to actually learn how to do the raid. The lack of conduction for boss 3 is useless, simply making it a dps boss and nothing. And the orb eating for boss 1...well I have mixed feelings on that as someone who's colourblind.
All in all this game is pathetically easy, the hard part about is it disabilities. So no, I do not agree with these nerfs save for VT 2 and perhaps TT 1 now that they're going around messing with kbs,