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Warden/Warlock SB focus and You! (Opinion)

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I see some Warlocks say they're now useless and

so just putting some of my input out there, sorry if this ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ off others that don't agree.


First of all, this is not a guide and I'm not Marry Poppin's

Secondly, When I mean SB Focused, I don't mean you have to focus your whole life around it.

It basically means, you're using SB as a boost for the party, making you a freaking SB focused Warlock. You are not obligated into doing this,

however if you focus on it it simply means you chose to have it and you chose to buff your party with it.


(Someone got mad at this and said "That's a meme" You don't have to have focus and concentration to use SB on a warlock.)

I don't give a darn about the meme and you're taking it the wrong way, but thanks for letting me know but that's not what I said at all.


Some of you are mad you can't use SB or think you can't, because Wardens have something similar and you think you're useless?

Luckily, you don't really have to make it a big deal anymore, if you're going to let a Warden use Soul Flare, basically soul burn with some differences.

You're not as useless as you might think. Ok so you're a warlock and you think SB makes you the most useful in party: but you have SB, just a Warden gave it to you

and now you have your thrall attacking adding to your dps more then you were before. Also, not to mention, you can use TD as well.

You're still useful as ever

you just have help SBing and keeping the party from getting pissed, because you're not an SBing Warlock and you have time to do your nails and paint a pretty picture and all while

you're dpsing.

Other then that, stop worrying about who has what because everything has its usefulness. If you want to SB, you can always alternate with the Warden, no big deal.

So just have fun.

Plus Warlock + Wardens make a great team.

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Are you sure that you're addressing *Warlocks* and not warlock alts that exist for free carry and income supplement? Warlocks are well aware of how their class works and it's nice to be liberated to use thrall as a utility for a change instead of having to destroy it right away just 'cuz some people want to see their dps go up for a few seconds and will rage if you don't indulge them.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Since I just read your topic and coincidentally have a Warlock as a main, I think your opinion is generous compared to the racist society out there. If you consume your time with your warlock like me, you will see how ppl in end gear content would kick a warlock to give a slot for a tank (which might be a warden). Not only that, they keep asking for TD every single time a party has warden and warlock when both have Blackwing or not (Which is so annoying). Lastly, the current content makes newbie warlock extreme hard to join the community because:

- no Blackwing? kick

- no TD? quit

- more than 2 sb in a party? kick

I have been played Warlock since the day it comes out. Trust me, if I don't love Warlock's playstyle, I would switch to other classes. My blacklist is full of those discriminators and I guarantee the list will be expanded even more if NCsoft doesn't fix this problem.

P/S: I wish they could give TD to gunslinger or remove it so that I won't have to keep changing my skill board every single dungeon.

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Warlocks get more milage and damage out of TD anyway so its not bad for a warlock to go TD. Only the good warlocks know about this. Ofc my statement only applies to party play otherwise feel free to use ur thrall sacrifice outside the party.

Edited by Taimatsu
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KFM + Assassin both shares Fighting Spirit and things are fine. The difference of Warlock being "dead" was never about Soulburn but it's about a deeper meaning. I main Shadow Warlock by the way and no I do play the game but I've heavily stepped up from it, the Gunslinger release already annoyed me enough as it literally absolutely outdamaged every single ranged dps ever with even less efoorts. Let me not start on the gameplay design it brought to the game with Alpha Call.. like the bosses weren't already 'easy', we can now burst it with BB/SB twice more than before ! Interesting right.

Then Warden was just another bigger nail, but I'll explain why right below in multiple parts.



1. Role

Warden is seen as a tank. While they do their job as good as KFM/BM, it seems they also have an even higher dps than both of these classes. Actually Warden is pretty good on the dps chart, that gives them a great boost combined with their role compared to the other two.

Warlock on the other side... it has only the "dps" role now and it's laughable enough : Frost is very crit dependant so if rngesus isn't with you in terms of crit rate, adios dps. I think we don't even have to talk about Shadow which is one of the lowest ranged dps... (along Wind Summoner as I heard)


So yeah, the fact only Warlock had Soulburn was kind of a "role" for them. Now that it's shared with Warden, it really isn't a class I would pick totally.



2. Time Distortion ?

Save your time, I can already see you with "but WL has Time Distortion qq" which in fact is true I admit, especially since now we have both SB/TD legendary effects in one single badge. The Time Warp effect is good enough to  throw out Leech during Warden's Sf since you can reset 30 sec of said Leech, which has a 45 sec cooldown. Sf's uptime being 15 sec, you have Leech available after it ends.

Good thing isn't it ? There is a flaw to Time Distortion actually : if you're not in range of Thrall, you don't get the whole effect of TD. Making it mostly useful for.. yourself and potential other ranged players. 


Thrall let's talk about it now, it's probably what makes the difference on this whole debate, at least for me.



3. Thrall ? You mean Troll. 

Where do I even begin with him.. 


a) 0.8 sec summon time. You need him ? Well, waste almost a second just for that. (not really attractive if you're "dps" now)


b) annoying delays with almost everything in relation to him : soulburn + circle of wrath/hallowed grounds. The only positive thing I see about this is that now, hopefully, I will not see Warlocks using Circle of Wrath only once since they sacrifice their Thrall right after for Soulburn.. this thing actually do trigger me. (you are ranged anyway, better read c) and apply this)


c) Thrall is optimal only if you use Gravity Well. You'll trigger the aggro if you use Onrush to stun the boss obviously, so keep your distance like any Warlock is supposed to do. 


d) Soulburn isn't instant. For Shadow WL it's actually a pretty annoying thing to lose at the start. Soulflare being instant, no matter how you want to start a rotation, you WILL lose time. Not really awesome if you're supposed to be a dps role since Warden's release ^^ If you don't spec TD, Shadow obviously starts with V, problem being you'll have to hard cast it which takes a whole f-ing second, and since Soulflare is instant, 1 sec loss. 
Now if you spec TD, you'll have to use Leech since you can reset 30sec of it if you own the legendary mystic badge. Isn't it great ? You do need to brand the boss first to have access to Leech. Here you go with another loss of seconds during Soulflare.



So literally, making a conclusion list :


-> Warlock's Soulburn is slower to cast. The focus regen' is probably good only at low-gear since you don't have focus regen goodies such as BT ring. Passing mid-high gear, you'll be better off at HP regen. (mostly to counter potential dots from bosses like Jurupo or Amara)


-> Warlock is more like a "support" class with all the buffs, problem being Soulburn was pretty much the only valuable buff, which is now shared by Warden. It's not that the other buffs aren't valuables, it's just too small of an important increase : 

- Circle of Wrath boosts your AP by ~50.

- Hallowed Grounds provides focus regeneration which is, as I said before, mostly enjoyable at low-gear. (unless you play focus-hungry class such as Wind Summoner)

- Time Distortion's tl;dr : short range for full effect / much more desired with the legendary Time Warp effect / resets only 'normal' skills every minute. 


-> Roles : KFM tanks, SIN has party stealth. (both BB)

Warden tanks, WL has.. eh.. (both 'SB')

DPS ? There are much MUCH better classes than Warlock to fill the simple role of "dps". Fire FM is superior, Earth Sum is superior, both Gunslingers are superior. It's a waste of time, if you really love the way a Warlock plays, you'll stick to this class otherwise run, run far away and do not consider turning back.


So you can say Warden having Soulflare is the "cause" but for me it's more like the firestarter of this whole thing : you have two classes having the same buff, so after that, you want to know which one has better capacity than the other in terms of everything else and that IS when you realise that there's no need to go much further : Warlock is badly designed for PvE.  

If you really want to have faith in the class, you'll have to be patient enough for the Awakening update.



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I'm a warlock main as well. The only thing I can add to Thunderfox's breakdown is this:

Get at least 2 characters to "Main" level. Get them good gear as best you can. Anyone who's been playing for more than a year knows that buffs and nerfs come and go. WL especially has been the target of massive hits in the past. Depending on one class makes you wholly vulnerable to the whims of the devs.

In summary, don't put all your eggs in one basket. I love WL, and it is still my spirit class, but Gunner or BD seems more practical, and so I'm leveling & gearing them both.

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My Second character right now is Warlock and i totaly hate to play it, the damage "rotation" just feels clunky and you can't deal any damage if the target isn't marked for instant bombardment.

WL has very little iframes and the stun/daze escape always makes you jump backwards, out of range from bosses costing even more dps.


The Dragoncall gets interrupted too easy

mob dies> spell ends,

getting out of range> spell ends.

If it at least would still continue on dead enemies so it hits others around...


The RMB of Shadow is annoying as hell to play, i really liked the WL when it came out , played Dragon helix+Bombardment felt really good, but now i am forced to some cripple skillset that just feels weird.


i think the Warden made WL obsolete because it is such a clunky to play class with no movement and little iframes. At least they are still okay in arena.


Edited by Arohk
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@Arohk Your post makes me think of Leech. Whereas you use it on a mob has such a big flaw : Leech starts to be in cooldown the very moment where the animation begins. However, Siphon starts ONLY AFTER the Leech animation ends, which is utter bs as if the mob dies, your Leech will be in cooldown but you haven't even gained the Siphon state.


Actually I feel more like asking why this has never been fixed after all this time.. oh well.

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Whats the most funny part is. Warden outdpse's a WL XD


Warden:                  Warlock:

Party buffs: +               +

Tank:            +               -

Dps:             +               -


Well considering that Wl was only good for Sb in PVE and now Warden has it. I wouldn't invest any gold in that class anymore. Its even dead in Koreoa tho ...


They will probably buff it. And that will probably be a dmg buff. Cause now  there isn't a reason she should not compete with Summoners, Fm's and Gunners.


Its like with Kfm's and Sin's. Both share bb but KFM is a tank and sins is a DPS. Hard to play but if u do it right u can be on the top. But Warden being a Tank. having Soul Flare and doing more dmg then WL its just stupid ...

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I see it basically as a bait. Not many new players coming to BnS, so let's try and make the old ones reroll and pay again (if we can). I see it also as a sign of stagnation (let's take from other classes cause it's too hard/expensive to think of /design something new for the next class).

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