Why discriminate against feminine Yuns?

[Astarae]

I found out last week that the magical, healing warrior race of Yuns are excluded from the new class of healing+warrior 'wardens'.  What's up with that?  Seems like yuns would be far more natural in a healing+warrior role than a bunch of aggro-dragon descended Gons.  To anyone who's been playing a while, Lynns represent the child archetype for the most part, Jins -- their body type is that of the high school student.  Gon's look/seem more like the responsible married type, mostly before they have that first child.  And then there's Yuns, the 20-somethings.  Yuns are the only ones that get to play up their feminine-beauty.  Many of the Gon women can be overflowing with sexuality but it seems more restrained. 

 

So you have a magic imbued race like Yuns, but not able to be Warlocks or Witches?  There have been many famous female assassins/agents, yet again, Yuns are excluded.  It seems ALL of the other races have 1 (or MORE) classes that only they can be, but the feminine Yuns?  Zero.  

 

So why this discrimination against femininity?  Why are Yuns locked out of at least 3 natural fits and also have NO class that is unique to them.  One person I was talking to said it had to do with the Asian stereotypes for feminine women -- being more passive and not taking more active roles, but considering they are magical amazons overflowing with Chi energy (just ask how many of them were sacrificed for their Chi energy in the last story segment).    

 

At the very least, why no access to a healing warrior class?  That, and certainly a Yun-unique class.  I've talked with some other women in game, and so far, none of them understand why Yuns are getting the short straw -- except for the reportedly higher incidence of discrimination against women, but not living in such areas, it's hard to really know.  

 

-Astara

[Zarra Tenebrae]

I can't remember which one it was but they originally planned for one of the classes to be exclusive to yun. They changed it because the playerbase complained about having a gender-locked class.

[Onbekend]

Why does the fancy, artisan race not get the simple, brute class. Great question.

[Astarae]

2 hours ago, Onbekend said:

Why does the fancy, artisan race not get the simple, brute class. Great question.

Why do the amazons not get the protector class? you tell me.   Uh...since when do brutes have healing?

[Astarae]

2 hours ago, Zarra Tenebrae said:

I can't remember which one it was but they originally planned for one of the classes to be exclusive to yun. They changed it because the playerbase complained about having a gender-locked class.

Oi...doesn't explain why a magical warrior class should be shut out .... and a mostly male player base complained of a female-only class?  But no problem with a race locked class?  Gee, that's surprising.

 

 

[Zarra Tenebrae]

15 minutes ago, Astarae said:

Oi...doesn't explain why a magical warrior class should be shut out .... and a mostly male player base complained of a female-only class?  But no problem with a race locked class?  Gee, that's surprising.

 

 

Yes unsurprisingly people complained about having character creation options limited in a role playing game

[Onbekend]

58 minutes ago, Astarae said:

Why do the amazons not get the protector class? you tell me.   Uh...since when do brutes have healing?

The healing is a questionable addition. And it doesn't make it not a brute class. If that berserk-mode they show in the trailer doesn't say enough, then I don't know what does.

 

Yuns aren't suited for anything berserk-like. It just doesn't match their image.

[SilverFoxR]

A better question would be "Why can we make Yun Assassins when there IS a Yun Assassin in the storyline?"

[SalemK]

The whole reason of why people don't want yun to have an exclusive class is played out to me because yun is a race even though they don't have males so if people didn't want them to have their own class then they should be complaining about the other races that have an exclusive class.

 

What surprises me most is that a majority of the playerbase plays female characters anyway but don't want yun to have their own class.

 

 I don't even consider yun to be women, they might be neutral, considering the fact they are able to produce offspring with no mate. I could be wrong but that's how I see it.

[Nenuviel]

well too be honest i think the warden class fits more gons then yuns... that bit of heals its really just an add like they are supose to be brute strenght and warden is a berserker kinda type so i do get it... what kinda upsets me its the other class that is coming untill now known as "archer" and its going for jin and lyn only, now that you can complain because yuns are kinda elvish right? so you think archer+elve combo fits... but well guess what they are not going for them...

 

Maybe the main reason that yuns dont have a class of there own its because they are female only race, so there for they usually give it to jin and if too many requests they pass on other races just giving an example... at the beggining Forcemaster was supose to be a Yun race only class but you know how in kr servers they simple love the Lyn race and there for they pass also to them and later on ( guessing ppl complain about wanting to be a male that is not a furry little child) added to the gon race ( for me forcemaster gon even today feels so off.. like a brute giant thing with a little ribbon bangle out of his hand ... for me simple doesnt fit...)

[Red0p]

Funny enough, in the story in-game we have seen yuns as assassins and warlocks but of course we can't play them with those classes...

[Vyd]

yuns are weird anyway, just look at that idle pose, you expect a princesswannabe carry a greatsword and play the house dragon role? :D

[Astarae]

8 hours ago, Onbekend said:

The healing is a questionable addition. And it doesn't make it not a brute class. If that berserk-mode they show in the trailer doesn't say enough, then I don't know what does.   Yuns aren't suited for anything berserk-like. It just doesn't match their image.

I gotten the impression of Warden as a type of Paladin class, I'd agree Yuns don't fit a berserker class, but neither does healing.   Wardens are supposed to be caretakers of a sort, not berserkers.  Now I'm just getting more annoyed...  

 

30 minutes ago, Vyd said:

yuns are weird anyway, just look at that idle pose, you expect a princesswannabe carry a greatsword and play the house dragon role? :D

Yah, lets make dragon into the caretaker healing role...that makes so much sense!  ...uh....NOT!

[Astarae]

4 hours ago, SalemK said:

The whole reason of why people don't want yun to have an exclusive class is played out to me because yun is a race even though they don't have males so if people didn't want them to have their own class then they should be complaining about the other races that have an exclusive class.

Good point.

4 hours ago, SalemK said:

What surprises me most is that a majority of the playerbase plays female characters anyway but don't want yun to have their own class.

I wonder if that is  true in KOR?    Is it true they rather play on Lyns more?

4 hours ago, SalemK said:

I don't even consider yun to be women, they might be neutral, considering the fact they are able to produce offspring with no mate. I could be wrong but that's how I see it.

Maybe not .. but body archetypes are gonna be transmitted and communicated regardless of what you call them. They are definitely 'women' as woman is a societal construct and they fit that perfectly, now as to whether or not they might be female...?  That could be more open to interpretation.

 

 

[Vyd]

@Astarae  tbh im more worried about their dmg output than the small ammount of healing you are hyped about

also you are not exactly right when you say berserkers dont fit the healing role, most of the mmos have berserkes as selfsustaining classes, that means healing yo c:

while using skills for hp, or fury or rage or w/e u name it, easiest example is wow's warrior class, selfhealing yo

warden is, as you described a paladin type class, paladins deal dmg, and also help allies going by the usual "paladin" role

 

about the yun or not to be yun, honestly i would gve warden to gons exclusively, cause you know, greatsword and stuff. (but gons already have a "berserker" type class, thats destroyer), a greatsword doesnt rly fit the pricesses or the teenagers, or the furryparty, (god i hate them) to me yun is more like a mage or priest type race but hey , they have kfm , totally fits them, same as gon fm,i kinda like the gon as race, even tho its hard to work with them if you want to create a normal character, but they cant be gunslingers no idea why ×.× or assassins, i could make a fuss about it too, but instead i just made a jin gs c: (i so wanted to make a max height gon sin tbh)

[Junamaki]

I feel like they should stop locking classes behind races entirely. Everyone should be able to play whatever race they want with any class. The whole “this class wouldn’t work with xyz because they’re too feminine, small, masculine, etc” doesn’t make sense because it is a game after all. So in that case a lot of things in the game wouldn’t work if we’re viewing them by logic or real life qualities. Lyn wouldn’t exist, yun, monsters, etc..

[Vyd]

17 minutes ago, Junamaki said:

I feel like they should stop locking classes behind races entirely. Everyone should be able to play whatever race they want with any class. The whole “this class wouldn’t work with xyz because they’re too feminine, small, masculine, etc” doesn’t make sense because it is a game after all. So in that case a lot of things in the game wouldn’t work if we’re viewing them by logic or real life qualities. Lyn wouldn’t exist, yun, monsters, etc..

well, first they should start at limiting the character height to some extent, you know, supersmall furries, cant see anything they do

[SalemK]

6 hours ago, Astarae said:

Maybe not .. but body archetypes are gonna be transmitted and communicated regardless of what you call them. They are definitely 'women' as woman is a societal construct and they fit that perfectly, now as to whether or not they might be female...?  That could be more open to interpretation.

 

 

A woman is a female though so technically it would be the same as saying they aren't female. I didn't think it needed more clarity but incase it causes confusion then I will rephrase it to say in my opinion yun aren't "female".

[Onbekend]

12 minutes ago, SalemK said:

A woman is a female though so technically it would be the same as saying they aren't female. I didn't think it needed more clarity but incase it causes confusion then I will rephrase it to say in my opinion yun aren't "female".

Yuns can wear female-only clothing.

Yuns can't wear male-only clothing.

How doesn't that translate to Yuns being female?

[KurooSakura]

If archer isn't yun-exclusive im quitting game 

[SalemK]

32 minutes ago, Onbekend said:

Yuns can wear female-only clothing.

Yuns can't wear male-only clothing.

How doesn't that translate to Yuns being female?

I’m not saying they are male. I said they are neutral meaning they really aren’t neither or but identify as female.

 

Also thought I should make it clear that I did say I could be wrong. It’s just a thought I had and it seemed weird that yun are able to produce offspring without a mate if they are pure female.

[Astarae]

3 hours ago, SalemK said:

It’s just a thought I had and it seemed weird that yun are able to produce offspring without a mate if they are pure female.

Lots of plants can reproduce asexually -- in fact very few plants have 2 sexes, Hops and Cannabis being two examples of 2-sexed plants.

Few "non-plants", are mono-gendered, mostly simple life forms, and a few animals change sex at various times (w/o pollution which can also cause changes) like some fish, snakes, frogs, and then there are some animals that are born BOTH sexes and can take either role (https://animalogic.ca/wild/6-surprising-animals-that-can-change-sex). 

 

And this is just "reality" here on earth -- as far as rules of non-human races on planets that don't seem to be earth -- who knows what rules/combinations exist there.

 

As far as their sex...they *appear* to be similar to human 'females', however the fact that they can reproduce with 1 sex, seems to indicate they are not females as we understand the term.    Now if only we can obtain a genetic sample for further study...  I'd volunteer my character, but her reproduction (as in representation) doesn't seem to have a biological aspect that would allow that.

 

Within the game though, I find it misleading and inaccurate to portray a warden (a caretaker).  In another game, wardens "are powerful, noble warriors dedicated to the defense of their land and their people, striking a balance between defense and offense".  Definitely not a berserker image in any context.  Maybe it's more specific wardens that have anger management issues?  Wikipedia says "A warden is a person who has been entrusted with the oversight of something important to the community, such as a college, church, prison, wild game or firefighting."  Again, no berserker component.  That seems more like a bit of fiction inserted by devs to justify the class excluding other races.

 

As far as swinging a large 2 handed sword, Joan of Ark is always pictured with one of those, and she looks awfully like a yun, if any of the BnS Classes, not to mention "Claymores" (the anime), only using 2-handed claymores.

 

 

 

[Dr SoulReaper]

@Astarae I think you might be taking warden too seriously... seeing as in Korea the class is known as warrior not warden, In terms of game play the class needs self healing due to using its own HP for skill usage however every class technically can self heal.

I see Yun as the more graceful race where they prefer more elegant weapons not brutish slabs of metal (like the great sword).

[Deadly Intent]

Do they really have to reproduce sexually?  Since they have some incredible powers maybe they can do so magically.    

[ClassicMan]

7 hours ago, SalemK said:

It’s just a thought I had and it seemed weird that yun are able to produce offspring without a mate if they are pure female.

They can reproduce without a partner because the devs are their creators lol. All jokes aside.. I seen a post a while back and someone posted what a senior writer said when asked about how yun can reproduce. They said something about them breeding with the other races and the child will always come out to be a yun.

 

I went back and found it and it seems you’re right about them not being female either based on this post:

On 1/31/2016 at 3:14 PM, 鳳綺妃 said:

Fun little factoid - if you look into the game's coding in regards to costumes, the Yun are actually noted as not having a gender. Costumes all have designated item ID tags indicating the race they can be worn by and either M (male) or F (female). All Yun costumes, however, have the tag N (neutral). In the past, I actually idly pitched an idea to the devs of allowing character generation for Yun characters to be more ambiguous in regards to gender rather than being strictly feminine in appearance, but that never really got any traction. Overhauling the whole character generation and costume design would be an absolutely tremendous undertaking, after all.