Smoq

Is game p2w right now? Is game alive?

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Smoq   

Yeah, so I wasn't here for a long time... how is the game right now... is it still p2w? How is population?

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Zordrage   

Population is going down because Devs killing the game for New players and Alts with HEAVY grinding and cutting of income for low geared people in recent updates...

the game is prety P2W atm.. especially if you consider battlegrounds.....

things MIGHT change... depents what the devs come up with using our feedback later this month...

Edited by Zordrage

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Pay to win is a completely subjective term, so there's no black, and white answer for that, for any game, you'd have to either define what line a game needs to cross for you to call it pay to win, or look into what the game offers for real money to decide on that yourself. They do sell items used to make/upgrade your equipment, resets for various raids you otherwise would only be able to do once a week, hold "trove" events I think four times a year, where you can some really good stuff, and is heavily impacted by the cash shop, then have been having more cash shop related events, along side the in-game events, where the event currency comes from a cash shop RNG box, rather than doing an in-game activity, which you can then trade in for a number of good items.

Edited by Why Bother

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Bleys   
1 hour ago, Why Bother said:

Pay to win is a completely subjective term, so there's no black, and white answer for that, for any game, you'd have to either define what line a game needs to cross for you to call it pay to win, or look into what the game offers for real money to decide on that yourself. They do sell items used to make/upgrade your equipment, resets for various raids you otherwise would only be able to do once a week, hold "trove" events I think four times a year, where you can some really good stuff, and is heavily impacted by the cash shop, then have been having more cash shop related events, along side the in-game events, where the event currency comes from a cash shop RNG box, rather than doing an in-game activity, which you can then trade in for a number of good items.

You can buy gems with straight up cash and get to a required 1.1k AP by most groups in 5 min.. or grind for a year by playing.. I would say that is pretty p2w

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4 hours ago, Bleys said:

You can buy gems with straight up cash and get to a required 1.1k AP by most groups in 5 min.. or grind for a year by playing.. I would say that is pretty p2w

To you, me, and many others a game having it so paying money can heavily reduce the grind, amounts to pay to win. Although there are always those who figure that if a game provides ANY in-game means of doing the same, no matter how poor, then that will mean it is not pay to win at all, hell, even if some powerful item, or necessary material/currency could only come from the cash shop, if it can be traded, some people will try to claim it's not pay to win, as they can buy it using the in-game currency, from someone that used real money to get it. That's what I mean when I say pay to win is subjective, bias also always plays a part in if people are willing to call something pay to win, as if they like it, they'll try to find even insane reasons to claim it's not, while if they hate the game, they can come up insane reasons to claim it is.

Edited by Why Bother

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Granger   

Personally, my first definite line for pay to win is this: The cash shop offers ingame ressources, gear, expboosters or currency. 

The next one depends on how much paying for those propells you forward...

Then, gear only obtainable trough cash shop.

 

For bns this means: Yes yes no yes, a LOT, no.

Go figure yourself if this is too pay to win,

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SadFace   

1. basically all MMOs can be defined as p2w. This one is not an exception.

2. the population is not great. They should release the game on steam and make a marketing push.

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1 hour ago, SadFace said:

1. basically all MMOs can be defined as p2w. This one is not an exception.

2. the population is not great. They should release the game on steam and make a marketing push.

1. Most MMO are pay to skip. Bns was the same. But...now it became pay 2 win. Reason is simple. You need stupidly high AP to enter dungeons like NS. It's impossible for new player without spending cash. Hard mode requiring billion AP is fine. It's hard mode. It should require lot of AP. Just like in  wow. You can't enter mythic raid with iLvl890. You'll be too weak. But...890iLvl is enough to do all dungeons (even heroic mode) and raid finder raids. Reaching 890 isn't that hard. Reached it in few weeks with boosted character and basically doing daily quests. While in bns...have fun reaching getting badges, at least stage 10 soul, and raven or getting legendary jewelry. It takes much longer and what it gives you? access to NS and above? Isn't that kinda stupid that we need such high requirements for normal mode? not hard or epic or whatever, but normal mode...tbh normal mode should have simplified mechanics, dragonblood coils  with 2x dragon blood and no enrage timers. It's just normal mode. It shouldn't punish players at all. I remember being join supply chain when it was released with average..even low gear and we still managed to complete it. Back then you didn't need OP gear for latest normal mode dungeon. I was able to join latest dungeons...I think everything changed and requirements skyrocketed when ebondrake citadel got released.
2. I doubt that there are more than 10k characters in bns which are currently online. AION has like 2k on steam...elder scrolls online about 10k. And it's most active MMO on steam...AION has about 2k...secret world legends less than 700... Oh and it's not total players/month. It's just how many characters are logged in at the same time. Blade and soul could get ~2000-5000 players. But I'm pretty sure similar amount of players are online even now (EU+NA)

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moyR   

Yes it is pay to win like every other MMO. And the population is low comparing to the population at the beginning, not low comparing to other MMOs.

 

If you are about to return to this game, there are a couple of points you may want to consider, in terms of PvE content:

1. You cannot pay to win immediately. You need to return at the right time (you need RNG boxes or Trove to buy reset items) to get the end-game gears quickly. And it takes about two  months to get all gears (play many hours every day, reset BT&VT every week, play/buy TT immediately when you have enough gear).

2. The items you can get immediately from market though, are 4 end-game gems (excluding Obsidian and Garnet), a not end-game but very decent True Cosmic Soul, and most of the mats you need, except the mats that only drops from Raids and end-game dungeons such as blood pearl.

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Nyaha   
9 hours ago, YunoGasaiYandere said:

1. Most MMO are pay to skip. Bns was the same. But...now it became pay 2 win. Reason is simple. You need stupidly high AP to enter dungeons like NS. It's impossible for new player without spending cash. Hard mode requiring billion AP is fine. It's hard mode. It should require lot of AP. Just like in  wow. You can't enter mythic raid with iLvl890. You'll be too weak. But...890iLvl is enough to do all dungeons (even heroic mode) and raid finder raids. Reaching 890 isn't that hard. Reached it in few weeks with boosted character and basically doing daily quests. While in bns...have fun reaching getting badges, at least stage 10 soul, and raven or getting legendary jewelry. It takes much longer and what it gives you? access to NS and above? Isn't that kinda stupid that we need such high requirements for normal mode? not hard or epic or whatever, but normal mode...tbh normal mode should have simplified mechanics, dragonblood coils  with 2x dragon blood and no enrage timers. It's just normal mode. It shouldn't punish players at all. I remember being join supply chain when it was released with average..even low gear and we still managed to complete it. Back then you didn't need OP gear for latest normal mode dungeon. I was able to join latest dungeons...I think everything changed and requirements skyrocketed when ebondrake citadel got released.

hm... i wonder how then i manage to do NS today on my 900ap force master... Oh wait! Instead of whining on forums i just pushed the LFP button and after some pve fun and a few wipes we got it cleared! Who would've knew that you can do NS with low AP randoms instead of trying to get in to a whale party!..

And if "pay to skip" is not p2w, then how bns is a p2w if it's clear "pay to skip"? You don't have anything that was behind a paywall here, no stat boosters or premium buffs. You can just grind or buy everything with money. Or you can be smart and don't do either and just enjoy the game on your own pace.

 

9 hours ago, YunoGasaiYandere said:

2. I doubt that there are more than 10k characters in bns which are currently online. AION has like 2k on steam...elder scrolls online about 10k. And it's most active MMO on steam...AION has about 2k...secret world legends less than 700... Oh and it's not total players/month. It's just how many characters are logged in at the same time. Blade and soul could get ~2000-5000 players. But I'm pretty sure similar amount of players are online even now (EU+NA)

A Steam release would increase the player base by exposing the game to a much larger audience. Is it too complicated concept for you?

Edited by Nyaha

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Shuchin   

*tries to evade the whole P2W debate*

 

Biggest point to NCSoft West credit in my opinion is that they never hid any content behind a paywall. Everything content and item in the game, you can experience and obtain by being a very active player. For a game of this quality, considering the man-years they still pour into this after 6 years, it's a damn good deal.

 

I am currently happy with the fact that there is no wall, and that I can have lots of fun without paying anything but my premium membership.

 

But I would actually love a way how to engage meaningfully with new (or returning) players. We need more social in BnS. where's that fishing? :HajoonLaugh:

Edited by Shuchin

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Kozuki   

Pay-to-be-ahead-and-have-the-biggest-DPS

 

Pay-to-catch-up-to-join-end-game

 

Play F2P and (maybe) forever behind. Unless you know how to play around the economy and get rich. Very few players catch up with whales this way. Or you have big whale friends who carry you and bid dozens of thousands gold on raid loot.

 

Pick  one that suits your current situation, trading talent and wallet :3

Edited by Kozuki

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Zordrage   
20 hours ago, Nyaha said:

hm... i wonder how then i manage to do NS today on my 900ap force master... Oh wait! Instead of whining on forums i just pushed the LFP button and after some pve fun and a few wipes we got it cleared! Who would've knew that you can do NS with low AP randoms instead of trying to get in to a whale party!..

 

yeah and the majority of players that tried it get Hate whispers or get instantly kicked or the players start leaving the group the moment they see low HM levels or AP....
just because you got lucky does not make the issue non existent....
out of like 20 tries sofar trying to ninja myself through LFP into NS i was able to do it ONCE .... only ONCE !!! because of the above reasons...

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Zordrage   
6 hours ago, Shuchin said:

 

I am currently happy with the fact that there is no wall

 

WUT ?

be a new player with no gold or clan....
the wall is there and its freaking THICC !!!

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Nomade13   

GW2 from NCSoft/ArenaNet its not p2w like lot ppls saying all mmos are p2w (they dont have cash shop for gears/mats only skins/outfits but its P2P so u need buy copy virtual or not which its good because avoid lot of bots like in 'f2p' bns)

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On 12/06/2018 at 4:28 PM, SadFace said:

1. basically all MMOs can be defined as p2w. This one is not an exception.

2. the population is not great. They should release the game on steam and make a marketing push.

and then bns will become pay to play

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Rastei   

Believe me, i came again after beign stop for 2 years, game now sucks. Nothing funny on farming 14 hours a day the same shitty dungeons and get kicked from parties.

 

Or waste 50 or 100 euros a month and you will be fine.

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