Aeryn Blackrose

My opinion on the dungeon nerf sent straight to the staff. Everyone in the community should do the same because it affects us all and its wrong.

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So I actually spent a lot, and by a lot I mean like all day every day on this game and the amount of gold and materials I got from doing daily dungeons was still nowhere near enough for me to level high enough on this game in a reasonable time frame. Most people don't have that kind of time to play a game. As a mid level player who has spent money out of my own pocket to support your company because I enjoy the game, taking away the gold and materials I need to play the game with any efficiency at all is a slap in the face after dedicating time and money into it. It's disgusting and shameful to do this to your player base and I'm furious about it and I hope everyone else is too because it's wrong and it makes me want to stop playing your game and it's going to discourage new players from enjoying your game as well. I hope I'm not the only one sending you this complaint because its unforgivable and you guys need to fix it. Please send this message as high up as you can because people making these kind of decisions really need to hear it. I take it personally when you take something away from me and what you did has ruined this game for me.

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Fiana   

i think dev in korea, make this decision based on player base in korea not in NA

and well, yes player in korea most of them already get aranshu weapon and twilight temple weapon, so erasing NF below is not a problem for them
but for player in NA this is big disaster

the problem is NA keep rushing to release content within very small time frame, make ppl can't keep up in term of gear
in korea usually they will release new content in 2-3 years, but in NA, just less than 1 year

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JIFSTER   

I took a screenshot last night of this forum when almost every new thread on the main page had a title related to how they were negatively impacted, also a screenshot of Reddit user sub same thing, a screen of a popular twitch streamer deleting his characters, screenshots of 17 PTS failures in a row shown in chat (not that it matters but still WTF) and I sent it to the support staff before uninstalling myself. I know this doesn't matter but I felt like I did my part. A few of my guild members did the same. We weren't rude about it, just showing them the data of what they have caused hoping they do something about it. No one has got a response and I don't blame them. I would ignore players too if it meant my paycheck kept arriving.

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What gets me is they sit up there on live stream and say, "We've been listening to you guys, reading your feed back".  Then go right back and do the complete opposite.

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HateMe   

You people need to stop acting like kids.....it makes perfect sense that old content which is irrelevant gets adjusted in terms of loot.

The entire point of a mmo game is grind, you are supposed to progress through content and not just spam a yeti dungeon where you can basically 1 shot the boss.

 

There are plenty other places that reward materials, even more than what they nerfed, if you yourself choose not to run those because its too hard for you or because you simply do not want to that is entirely on you. they left the old dungeons with the loot in for so long, if someone did not upgrade in that time that means he didnt care about upgrading his gear as much as about just being greedy and making cheap profit of it.

 

If you dont like the grind or dont have that much time to play the game, then have you maybe thought the game is not for you then? If you cannot invest the time to achieve what you want then its not a problem with the game but with you.

If i can manage to upgrade my gear fully by playing 2-4h a day then so can you.

 

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28 minutes ago, HateMe said:

You people need to stop acting like kids.....it makes perfect sense that old content which is irrelevant gets adjusted in terms of loot.

The entire point of a mmo game is grind, you are supposed to progress through content and not just spam a yeti dungeon where you can basically 1 shot the boss.

 

There are plenty other places that reward materials, even more than what they nerfed, if you yourself choose not to run those because its too hard for you or because you simply do not want to that is entirely on you. they left the old dungeons with the loot in for so long, if someone did not upgrade in that time that means he didnt care about upgrading his gear as much as about just being greedy and making cheap profit of it.

 

If you dont like the grind or dont have that much time to play the game, then have you maybe thought the game is not for you then? If you cannot invest the time to achieve what you want then its not a problem with the game but with you.

If i can manage to upgrade my gear fully by playing 2-4h a day then so can you.

 

I ran those dungeons every day and that was how I was able to grind my gear up while still being able to level myself at a decent enough rate to enjoy the game, every day! Those mid dungeons are still where newer and mid level players have to grind to get high enough to do the newer content and the costs to get there are thousands of gold and mats. People want 1k AP to do Sanctum up and the only way to get that 1k AP is to grind those mid dungeons for gold n mats, they're crucial for newer and mid lvl players so if you've got it so you can get yours without needing those dungeons, good for you. Most of us still need them, they're not irrelevant yet.

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HateMe   
3 minutes ago, Aeryn Blackrose said:

I ran those dungeons every day and that was how I was able to grind my gear up while still being able to level myself at a decent enough rate to enjoy the game, every day! Those mid dungeons are still where newer and mid level players have to grind to get high enough to do the newer content and the costs to get there are thousands of gold and mats. People want 1k AP to do Sanctum up and the only way to get that 1k AP is to grind those mid dungeons for gold n mats, they're crucial for newer and mid lvl players so if you've got it so you can get yours without needing those dungeons, good for you. Most of us still need them, they're not irrelevant yet.

1k for sanctum is not needed, if other people need 1k then make your own party with less requirements.

In all the times i ran a dungeon the issue is not the AP but the issue is people being dumb and not knowing what and when to do which causes wipes and no clears.

 

AP is not everything. with the standard gear you get from story you can easily do the mid dungeons, and the cost reductions in weapons and accessories make it even more easier to upgrade since you dont need almost any mats or gold for it just a tiny few. So this isnt a good excuse even.

 

You have naksun, celestial basin, daily challenges (which are easy as hell), plenty of events that award materials.

This change is especially god for those that quote "dont have much time to play" because in the time you would do those low dungeons for measily 5g all together, you could do 1 starstone mines for 3/4 times the amount and better materials.

 

The only thing holding peoples progression in this game is the people themselves and not the game or its changes.

 

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18 minutes ago, HateMe said:

1k for sanctum is not needed, if other people need 1k then make your own party with less requirements.

In all the times i ran a dungeon the issue is not the AP but the issue is people being dumb and not knowing what and when to do which causes wipes and no clears.

 

AP is not everything. with the standard gear you get from story you can easily do the mid dungeons, and the cost reductions in weapons and accessories make it even more easier to upgrade since you dont need almost any mats or gold for it just a tiny few. So this isnt a good excuse even.

 

You have naksun, celestial basin, daily challenges (which are easy as hell), plenty of events that award materials.

This change is especially god for those that quote "dont have much time to play" because in the time you would do those low dungeons for measily 5g all together, you could do 1 starstone mines for 3/4 times the amount and better materials.

 

The only thing holding peoples progression in this game is the people themselves and not the game or its changes.

 

Naksun gives you 1 gold, the celestial basin daily gives less then that and the daily challenges for new and mid lvl players... are the dungeons they nerfed! Your acting like people are just walking into Sanctum and up fresh out of story. You have to grind to get there and to say it only takes a few gold and mats is ridiculous. I've spent thousands upgrading my weapon and accessories to be above 1k AP and it took months before the nerf. Nobodys joining or staying in your party with less then 1k AP if your trying to do the high tier dungeons so your not playing the same game as me if you think its that easy. You got about 40 gold all together from the dungeon dailies, I don't know what your talking about 5 gold and no matter what you say a huge chunk of us are affected by it and your not going to have a game progression when newer players can't even catch up to you and if your doing so good, what do you care about our concerns about not being able to catch up to you anyway. You just here to look down on lower players then you so you can tell me what a bad ass you are because you don't need the mid level stuff anymore. I'm saying I still need these and so is most of the community if you haven't been paying attention to the forums. If you don't need them good, go enjoy your game play, most of us still do and I am going to voice my concerns about it, concerns that involve those of us affected, so if your not affected... don't worry about it, it's not your problem!

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Statler   
vor 2 Stunden schrieb HateMe:

You people need to stop acting like kids.....it makes perfect sense that old content which is irrelevant gets adjusted in terms of loot.

The entire point of a mmo game is grind, you are supposed to progress through content and not just spam a yeti dungeon where you can basically 1 shot the boss.

 

There are plenty other places that reward materials, even more than what they nerfed, if you yourself choose not to run those because its too hard for you or because you simply do not want to that is entirely on you. they left the old dungeons with the loot in for so long, if someone did not upgrade in that time that means he didnt care about upgrading his gear as much as about just being greedy and making cheap profit of it.

 

If you dont like the grind or dont have that much time to play the game, then have you maybe thought the game is not for you then? If you cannot invest the time to achieve what you want then its not a problem with the game but with you.

If i can manage to upgrade my gear fully by playing 2-4h a day then so can you.

People should stop deffending every ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ing crap of NC-Soft.

1. We are supposed to catch up with KR and we are now close to them. We had a bit more than 2 years to gear up, KR had over 6 years. But NC-Soft keep making thinks harder.

2. Look at the price of Moonstones, they where close to 11 Gold yesterday evening. Not even in the days when silverfrost was released they have been so expensive.

3. No One want to get everything for free, but with the latest patch NC-Soft killed the game for low / mid gear players.

They cant run the high dungeons Go try to find a group for IF, EL with 1k or for SM, HH with 1k Its nearly impossible in normalmode and overall you wont have the slightes chance for hardmode. I have tried to find a group for SM with my alt (1k AP HM9 gunner) and gave up after 45minutes.

How they supposed to earn Gold. They can get the materials but materials are useless without gold.

500+ Gold for a premium stone, 300+ gold for the other stone you need to go to raven (dont know how its called in english) 130+ gold for a petpouch that was somewhere at 30gold befor they changed upgradeing the pet. 300-400 gold for oil.

1.5 gold for clearing NF once a day, no more safes, no more gold from daily nor the chest, nearly no unbound materials. Never got so less unbound materials like i get since patchand in do IF-DD at least once a day.

So you cant even make money by selling unbound materials or craft nessesary materialy by themself.

 

So low and mid gear players realy ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ed up by nc-soft.

Even im quite high geared i thing about to quit every time i see a ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ing flower from MSP dropping in the highest dungeon feeling nc-soft is trolling us, but as a low/mid-gear i would have already quit that game...

 

 

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HateMe   
1 hour ago, Aeryn Blackrose said:

Naksun gives you 1 gold, the celestial basin daily gives less then that and the daily challenges for new and mid lvl players... are the dungeons they nerfed! Your acting like people are just walking into Sanctum and up fresh out of story. You have to grind to get there and to say it only takes a few gold and mats is ridiculous. I've spent thousands upgrading my weapon and accessories to be above 1k AP and it took months before the nerf. Nobodys joining or staying in your party with less then 1k AP if your trying to do the high tier dungeons so your not playing the same game as me if you think its that easy. You got about 40 gold all together from the dungeon dailies, I don't know what your talking about 5 gold and no matter what you say a huge chunk of us are affected by it and your not going to have a game progression when newer players can't even catch up to you and if your doing so good, what do you care about our concerns about not being able to catch up to you anyway. You just here to look down on lower players then you so you can tell me what a bad ass you are because you don't need the mid level stuff anymore. I'm saying I still need these and so is most of the community if you haven't been paying attention to the forums. If you don't need them good, go enjoy your game play, most of us still do and I am going to voice my concerns about it, concerns that involve those of us affected, so if your not affected... don't worry about it, it's not your problem!

Celestial basin and naksun for materials and not gold. Those the the 2 most efficient and easiest way to farm all the upgrade materials you need. All it takes is some time.

If someone really wants to upgrade that bad....he will grind the materials and get there.

And again you are stuck at the 1k AP....if i make my own party with 950AP, i take people with 950AP and experience and guess what i clear it just fine.

as for newer players, ofc they will have it a bit harder to catch up but gues what,., its the same in any other game. You dont get full gear hand outs as a new player, you need to work for them like everyone else. I still do the mid stuff because of alts and materials needed for those alts. If a nice item drops and people bid..hey gold profit for me and i earn even more.

And by all means i am not looking down on anyone, but its starting to get old that people complain because the game gets a bit harder and actually if you look at the change objectively, it benefits you far more than letting people spam the low level stuff.

You voice your concerns about it and i voice mine. I accept the fact that some people see things differently but i am a person who aint afraind of speaking his mind even if it conflicts with others.

 

@Statler

 

1. Nothing is being made harder. KR went through the exact same changes where their drops were also nerfed. Also its a different market in KR and different community so never compare those.

2.you do not need moonstones for any upgrades, you only need crystals. Moonstones are only needed for crafting. You can either farm the moonstones via PVP or Weekly challenges and use them to craft your own transformation stones, or you can sell the bits you get and use the gold to buy the transformation stones you need. Asside that moonstones are not needed at all.

3.They cant find a party for those dungeons because they are looking for carries instead of trying to make / form their own party with their own requirements.

 

You calculate everything in gold....if you keep that thinking you wont progress at all in this game. you are meant to grind for your materials and not get stuff free. The reason most prices went up is because of higher demand.  If i were to calcualte everything in gold i would quite the game because there would be no point.

 

Fact is you wont earn much gold or materials if you keep running the old low level stuff, you earn far more in the higher tiers than that. BT only needs roughly 850 AP to clear if people know what they are doing. Many of the dungeons are easily cleared with 900-950AP even. which is more than enough to let you farm mats for the end game dungeons.

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thieve   

Tons of same topic since from last patch and there is nothing "any single" reply from them at least like as"the message is taken we will consider about this".My friend list almost all time offline at all...My full member clan mostly time 4-5 member is on....Keep goin on with this way guys....Active player base amount is much much more supporting the game than 10-20% whales for free2play games...No1 wants to start play dying game free2player or pay2player doesnt matter.Especially with tons of new games coming up.

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18 minutes ago, HateMe said:

 

18 minutes ago, HateMe said:

3.They cant find a party for those dungeons because they are looking for carries instead of trying to make / form their own party with their own requirements.

 

Rage timer lowered nuff said imagine a 900 ap goes to Sanctum? even 1k players have a hard time or can barely make the timer(i am 1k player I play that dungeon i know the rage time) You? 

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Evilline   
Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, HateMe said:
Quote

 

You people need to stop acting like kids.....it makes perfect sense that old content which is irrelevant gets adjusted in terms of loot.

The entire point of a mmo game is grind, you are supposed to progress through content and not just spam a yeti dungeon where you can basically 1 shot the boss.

 

 

Quote

There are plenty other places that reward materials, even more than what they nerfed, if you yourself choose not to run those because its too hard for you or because you simply do not want to that is entirely on you. they left the old dungeons with the loot in for so long, if someone did not upgrade in that time that means he didnt care about upgrading his gear as much as about just being greedy and making cheap profit of it.

 

Quote

 

If you dont like the grind or dont have that much time to play the game, then have you maybe thought the game is not for you then? If you cannot invest the time to achieve what you want then its not a problem with the game but with you.

If i can manage to upgrade my gear fully by playing 2-4h a day then so can you.

 

 

 

You said so much things that makes no sense, I guess it makes to you but not to a new player. Lets start

 

1st qoute.

You said that MMO is all about grinding, and then you said that you can't expect to 1 shoot a boss and get good loot? You just owned youre self with your sentance ... Grinding means doing something over and over again as fast as possible, grinding isn't consider if you need 1h to get a party and 30 min to clear it.

 

2nd qoute.

Tell people where? Why don't you make a guide about it? Forum post or  a youtube video? If you are so wise then share us your secret where all other streamers and players cant ...

 

No one complains about the grind, the problem is that ppl can't grind or if they do it isn't rewarding to progress to mid tier.

And yes you might have  but so did many others before this change. Make a new account and try from the start and you will see what people mean.

 

To clear something this patch is targeting new players, people who just lvled there char to 55 and finished the story. It gives them an option to quit or pay to progress ( or pay to win ). 

 

Ill give you an update, from stage bela or seraph 10 to raven 1 you need around 2000gold ( without buying moonstones ... etc ) lets say u get those should be able to. And now a new player makes 10 gold per day that's 70 gold per week lets say 100 so thats 400 gold per month lets say 500. So he will need 4 months to get enough gold just to upgrade his weapon. And thats just his weapon where is the rest? And even when he does it this point of the game having raven isn't considered mid range ... So in around 1year he will get to mid stage where the stuff will be probably for free in the story or the game dies cause of bad managment system or should I say we want only whale community managment system ...

Edited by Evilline

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7 hours ago, Aeryn Blackrose said:

So I actually spent a lot, and by a lot I mean like all day every day on this game and the amount of gold and materials I got from doing daily dungeons was still nowhere near enough for me to level high enough on this game in a reasonable time frame. Most people don't have that kind of time to play a game. As a mid level player who has spent money out of my own pocket to support your company because I enjoy the game, taking away the gold and materials I need to play the game with any efficiency at all is a slap in the face after dedicating time and money into it. It's disgusting and shameful to do this to your player base and I'm furious about it and I hope everyone else is too because it's wrong and it makes me want to stop playing your game and it's going to discourage new players from enjoying your game as well. I hope I'm not the only one sending you this complaint because its unforgivable and you guys need to fix it. Please send this message as high up as you can because people making these kind of decisions really need to hear it. I take it personally when you take something away from me and what you did has ruined this game for me.

Ditto, and you have my full support. 

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RavTH   

I think in my opinion is that they should release the new dungeon raid whenever Aransu/TV gear becomes a common so everyone could do that content that they are flashing everywhere. Imagine new players they see ads of raid content and they are like "Wow!" then they realize that they are years years behind to be even there. lul

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Granger   
vor 56 Minuten schrieb HateMe:

2.you do not need moonstones for any upgrades, you only need crystals. Moonstones are only needed for crafting.

On what version of the game are you playing? Every single upgrade for baleful asks for 5-15 moonstones. 

You seem just as out of touch with the newer players as the management is.

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I actually have to agree with the OP on this one, and i have an fm at aransu 6 tiger 5 soul awake neck 3 and a  gunner with vt gear, with various alts at bt/vt. Mats for mid to high tier is harder to get now, more than ever and that is on of the main reasons. soulstone/sarcred crystals:moonstone crystal ratio is around 7:1. while i disagree that low tier players have a hard time to gear in a reasonable time, its mid tier that gets rek'd by this change. One thing i seem to see a lot is ppl just see dc gold, while i agree its a pain for mid tier and low tier to get gold is harder now, low tier do not need it, its mid and high. People seem to forget that most BT pugs are 1k and you can net around 100g with share on that a week, per character and you have the weekly challenge,  that's around 50g.
The whole AP in F8 is for 2 reasons:
1st is those that have spent time and or money onto the game want similar ppl to burn the content, because they have done it 100's of times and did it when it was hard and its a time waste.
2nd AP is a rough gear level for e.g. 1k ap is bale with msp maybe partial bt,  1.1k is full bt with maybe partial vt 1.15k-1.2k is full vt thats your ap tier list.
There are those like myself who just recruit with no ap requirements because everything up to HH is soloable(bar mechs) and helping new players is rewarding.
But back to the original point, every dungeon has a % change on dropping chests and even then it is one, how are mid tier players ment to gear up at this rate in a reasonable amount of time without sinking money into the game or killing them selves and their love for the game doing it.

*thats my 2 cents*

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Fiana said:

i think dev in korea, make this decision based on player base in korea not in NA

and well, yes player in korea most of them already get aranshu weapon and twilight temple weapon, so erasing NF below is not a problem for them
but for player in NA this is big disaster

 

Indeed, the player base in Korea had been playing for years before us, not to mention their experience % requirements for each HM level are like half of ours, so the majority is highly geared and high level. While in NA/EU we have the opposite situation, and now we get a majority of mid tier players getting stalled by a decision that doesnt fit the circumstances in our servers at all. NCWest, please open your eyes. 

Edited by Rea Shinwa

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Granger   

Even if it would fit and the majority of the playerbase wouldnt need to run those anymore; whats about the newcomers? They'd inevitably get stuck there.

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Posted (edited)

Except you all forget 1 place where you can get a ton of resources in a reasonable amount of time and that is Celestial Basin. I mean 500 peaches for 1 pouch that gives 3 of the 4 basic crystals, thats pretty good in my opinion. Getting 500 peaches doesnt even take 15 mins so yeah, you can farm alot in there. Last time i checked all item upgrades only use moonstone crystals and that was 1 day ago that i checked it.

Edited by Amarathiel

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1 minute ago, Amarathiel said:

Except you all forget 1 place where you can get a ton of resources in a reasonable amount of time and that is Celestial Basin. I mean 500 peaches for 1 pouch that gives 3 of on of the 4 resources, thats pretty good in my opinion. Getting 500 peaches doesnt even take 15 mins so yeah, you can farm alot in there. Last time i checked all item upgrades only use moonstone crystals and that was 1 day ago that i checked it.

You have a point, but it actually takes even less time if you are over 15k peaches and if you do the area boss's every 43 mins you have a chance at evolved stones, 18g atm. But no1 wants to spend 8 hours a day in the godforsaken place

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Granger   
Posted (edited)

Thats what i did and its really not "a ton". I've farmed enough peaches for the 50k peaches achivement over the last week, killed the worldboss 2-3 times everytime it came up and im still struggling with materials (esp moonstones). The gold income is also just barely scraping by.

Honestly im so sick of it. So done. There must be something better or at least some alternative where i can farm materials.

Edited by Granger

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Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, Princess Kupo said:

You have a point, but it actually takes even less time if you are over 15k peaches and if you do the area boss's every 43 mins you have a chance at evolved stones, 18g atm. But no1 wants to spend 8 hours a day in the godforsaken place

Nobody wants to live there, no. And that is what those dungeons whose rewards they just nerfed so badly provided: a variety of ways to scrap gold and mats for new, low and mid tier players to keep upgrading. Nobody was getting rich in gold and mats from those dungeons, but it helped people to gear up, to get more experience in the game, to have different options every day and being able to choose what to do. Now, instead, new, low and mid tier players are stuck in a limbo and higher geared players are crowded in a very few high level instances. And they want the game to thrive like this? 

I do LOVE this game, and I am sure everyone that is expressing their opinion about this patch loves it as much. I dont want to see it dying because of a poor understanding of what the NA/EU non-hardcore playerbase can realistically reach with what the game is offering right now.

Plus it is a GAME. We all would like to have FUN when we play it, no?

Edited by Rea Shinwa

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Statler   
Posted (edited)

@HateMe

There is just a tiny detail you and devs always forget.

B&S was released 6 years ago in KR but only 2 years ago in EU/NA. Since we are catching up to KR and cost to where they are, they had 4 years more to gear up to the current content

 

Edit: 

Your kidding sending low / mid gear player to battleground, the whales playground, to farm moonstones, right? 

Even Player with high PVP gear are one shot. A whale only need to look at a low/mid gear player to kill him/her. And you want to send them there? Great idea they will instant quit when they are not a masochist

Edited by Statler

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