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romiocan

F10 and trove?!

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romiocan   

Am i the only one who "Dislikes" the f10 store in general and trove event? It looks like you can buy everything you need in store/trove to progress you character. Basically all the materials is available for purchase for real money for upgrades.. Are "some" guys that lazy? If i were to buy all the mats to go to top gear for real money then what there is left for me to do and why would i do that ? I dont understand, just to show your gear or smth?

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MantisxD   

There are ppl who dont want or dont have time to farm mats but has lots of money. So they rather spend money and save time. For me i just farm gold>sell it for hm coins and use it on trove on specific items i can get cheaper. Right know top priority for me is legendery jevels(for weap/accesorys). Troves purpose is to get much money as they can for ppl. Because no one works 4 free :D

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lets be clear, NC Soft is a for profit organization, listed in Korea.  If nobody swipes, there is no bns.  Trove scam is another thing.  It sells something worth 20g for 40g.  Of course, it will ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ off customers, then ppl will not buy.  I think NC honestly thinks we are all idiots.

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RAID   
8 hours ago, MantisxD said:

There are ppl who dont want or dont have time to farm mats but has lots of money. So they rather spend money and save time. [...]

That's the worst and most retarded reason I've ever heard.

They impact the in-game economy to a large negative extent due to Micro-Transaction influence, and they cause the game to become very unbalanced and socially divided by poor and rich players causing an unfair gameplay. Players with money have the ability to literally "cheat" in a "legal" way, while players who cannot afford the money, have to deal with playing without this ability. So as you can see, the game-rules itself are not even either.

 

If the game wouldn't focus on Micro-Transactions, then content which has to be played to progress would be easier to reach, as the focus would be set to a more quality game. Of course with some harder approaches for those who like playing and enjoy challenges.

However, due to the current situation, even those challenges are worth nothing any more, because of what you've already noticed, almost everything in the game can be purchased using the Micro-Transactions. At the same time, everything becomes a hard challenge for the "free to play" player, to motivate players to pay for Micro-Transactions.

 

The motivation to continue playing Blade & Soul becomes less. New players who start with the game and realize the game's business-model always quit early without going further to the game. In-Game community is dramatically decreasing and content getting more expensive, because there are less and less farmers due to players quitting the game for good.

Believe it or not, right now BnS is losing players more than gaining any. Very good prof of that is the fact of the merged realms which happened several times already. It has nothing to do with performance, they did this because players quitting the game, to not let it look like the game is empty.

Edited by RAID

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Smoq   

You can always go to work and spend some money on the game. People spend on their hobby big sums and get rewarded for it, so what's your problem RAID?

Also game doesn't really lose so many players and it still gives proper revenue for the company, if it didn't ncsoft would slow down with their cash shop items and trove.

You just sound like angry kid that can't get toys.

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RAID   

@Smoq

Apparently you didn't understand anything from what I've wrote.

You could at least try to get the bottom line.

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FrozenB   

Yes, there is a BM tanker in my clan who is very busy in his life. He barely gets on to play on weekend. Now, he just gets dragon forge weapon stage 3 just from troving (he doesn't even PVP) and raven 9 all the way to aransu stage 9 (yes, he just got his husk last night).

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20 hours ago, romiocan said:

Am i the only one who "Dislikes" the f10 store in general and trove event? It looks like you can buy everything you need in store/trove to progress you character. Basically all the materials is available for purchase for real money for upgrades.. Are "some" guys that lazy? If i were to buy all the mats to go to top gear for real money then what there is left for me to do and why would i do that ? I dont understand, just to show your gear or smth?

You are not the only one that dislikes the f10 store. You can do what the majority of them do, don't use it.

I spend money on f10 and trove. I just spent $500 this trove. Why? Because $500 is 4 days of work for me. What I got from f10 / trove this time around saved me more than 5 days of in game work. This enables me to take even more on-call work, make even more money. I know it seems counter intuitive, but I pay money to free up my time, so I can use that time more efficiently (making more money). It's called "optimising opportunity cost. What's left for me to do after getting all the mats? Farm for mats that you can't buy, play with friends, hang out? And no, I'm not lazy, I actually work hard, like 60 hr/wk hard.

 

Oh and also I support BnS, and they need money to operate, so I give them some.

15 hours ago, RAID said:

That's the worst and most retarded reason I've ever heard.

...etc

No it's not, it's an entirely good and valid reason, for anyone whose hourly rate is high enough and can readily obtain more hours, like me.

Now mind you, I do agree that being able to buy mats affects the in game market, but not all necessarily bad. Being able to buy mats indirectly means there is less demand for such mats, and would therefore drive prices down. The content remains the same regardless, it's the same for both f2p and p2p. The only difference is p2p does not need to "farm" for mats. SK / Queen hits just as hard, the mechanics just as unforgiving, for both types of players. If the mats that can be bought are behind similar challenge as SK / Queen, then yes, I would completely agree with you that something needs to change. But when they are farmed from killing naksun / doing celestial basin for example, where's the "it becomes a challenge for f2p"? The only challenge here I suppose would be "how fast can you farm", but that isn't a skill check, it's a "how much repetitive boredom can you handle" check.

 

As for the new player argument, I don't know if you have noticed, but they have always reduced material requirements for entry level equipment. Heck now you automatically get legendary weapon. Another example tiger / dragon bracelet. Before it used to be that you have to fight for it with thousands of gold, now, two quests and do NS 10 times and you are done. Vastly easier than before. It may very well be true that BnS is losing players, but to pin the reason for that entirely on being able to buy mats is unjustified. Many factors contribute to people stop playing. Biggest I could think of is "some other newer, never played before game came out". Or what I'd call content fatigue, no new, interesting, content came out, it's kind of boring, therefore play some other game.

 

To me, there's almost no difference between f2p and p2p. p2p players pay BnS real money to progress, f2p pay BnS "time" to progress. BnS can't really operate on your "time", but they can operate on money. The whole thing is designed so that it's more efficient to progress with money, instead of time, to get people to pay money. That said, BnS needs both the f2p and p2p players to function, at least in my opinion. So I'm not against / for either side.

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romiocan   
13 hours ago, Racingwind said:

You are not the only one that dislikes the f10 store. You can do what the majority of them do, don't use it.

I spend money on f10 and trove. I just spent $500 this trove. Why? Because $500 is 4 days of work for me. What I got from f10 / trove this time around saved me more than 5 days of in game work. This enables me to take even more on-call work, make even more money. I know it seems counter intuitive, but I pay money to free up my time, so I can use that time more efficiently (making more money). It's called "optimising opportunity cost. What's left for me to do after getting all the mats? Farm for mats that you can't buy, play with friends, hang out? And no, I'm not lazy, I actually work hard, like 60 hr/wk hard.

 

Oh and also I support BnS, and they need money to operate, so I give them some.

You wrote that you have spent 500$ on trove and its saved 5 days of in game work for you. I am sorry but why you do  you call in-game work tho? Isnt that suppose to feel like not (work) but rather enjoyment? I dont know but for me to get all those mats for upgrades and doing dailies is actually fun experience and when i breakthrough a peace of gear to next stage i feel the sense of self achievement. I dont understand people  who work IRL, earn money then spend them щт bns to do less work in game. Mind you i personally have nothing against the Whales as we call them but in the end of the day dont they feel loss (wasted money) rather than achievement when they finally get to the top tier gear ?

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1 hour ago, romiocan said:

You wrote that you have spent 500$ on trove and its saved 5 days of in game work for you. I am sorry but why you do  you call in-game work tho? Isnt that suppose to feel like not (work) but rather enjoyment? I dont know but for me to get all those mats for upgrades and doing dailies is actually fun experience and when i breakthrough a peace of gear to next stage i feel the sense of self achievement. I dont understand people  who work IRL, earn money then spend them щт bns to do less work in game. Mind you i personally have nothing against the Whales as we call them but in the end of the day dont they feel loss (wasted money) rather than achievement when they finally get to the top tier gear ?

I am like racingwind - I do whale. I didn't play game for 1.5 years and just recently came back and Trove is here on which I bought 800 keys + some extra NCoins I spent to buy flat gold from F9. I was able to go from Baleful 10 to Raven 9 and saved up a lot of mats for accessory upgrades, soul upgrade and pet upgrade. 

Now the thing is I work a lot and end up playing 2-3 hrs a day including weekends. One day in a week or two I might have an entire day to play. If you want to farm properly in this game you need to spend more than 2-3 hrs a day or  at least play more during weekends, have alts to decently use up the events. I don't have such chances because I don't have time. But I earn almost 800 euros per week so for me to spend 500 eu for thing like Trove isn't big deal, it isn't even a weeks pay for me. 

And regarding achievement feeling, I personally do feel. I feel nice being able to do end game continent, to do things I want in game without bothering my self too much about catching up to "meta requirements" in F8. I can log in after days work and just play nicely what I want without stressing my self too much. And I still need to work on accessories, farm some up, upgrade them. Only thing that concerns me are big boi raids for which I hardly have time.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

And also, guys, this game is now waaaaay easier than it used to be. Even for f2p player there should be absolutely no problems to catch up. Before I quit for 1.5 years I was an f2p player. Had true boss weapon and was saving up materials to go straight to Baleful 6, I had almost everything besides few things and had no PTS (back then you needed them even for Baleful / Serpah weapons). When I came back I claimed my weapon from story (then for 5 Naryu Silvers bought a lot of baleful weapon boxes till I got 6 gem slots) and with materials I had I went straight to Baleful 10 and had bunch of materials left over. Then I saw you get from quest also pet, pet aura, decent gems, soul, full MSP set, 250 draken cores that you can instantly get legendary accessory, peaches, 3 Raven soul shield parts.... You can go to 900 ap easily without breaking too much sweat and 900 ap is totally enough to farm majority of continent (just need to find normal guild because majority of F8 people has elitism issues or just wants higher ap to do things faster) and farm for other things. Also, you don't even need to do raids to upgrade to Raven, just farm up gold and buy materials from F5. 
As a player coming back after 1.5 year of hiatus I can see that game was made so so much easier than it was before, especially for f2p players. When I see topics like that it actually makes me question, did you play this game in the past? 
And to add up, you playing game that requires money to run, develop and maintain and you using its service for free. Meaning you don't pay for their job and you complain about people who has it easier that pays for their service and lets f2p people enjoy the game? I think it is totally fair that people who do pay can have easier time playing. I can pretty much  guarantee that most of f2p complaining people are still teens that live with their parents, that don't work to pay for food, taxes, bills etc. This world goes all about money. Lets take hotels for example. You can pay 20 eu for night and you will get one type of room, then another guy pays 200 eu and he gets way better room and it totally makes sense right? He gave more money for hotel so in exchange hotel will give him better service. The exchange between 2nd guy is on higher scale than exchange between hotel and first guy. So if we take now games, f2p players plays the game that people work on but in exchange they give nothing while "whales" gives something back for an exchange so they get better service from the company, you see?

 

 

P.S.: I am not saying BnS business model and economy is okay, it really could use some tweaks here and there and it is a fact. My point is that it is completely fine and normal that paying users for the service can advance easier and faster while free players needs to work more in game that was made way easier than it used to be.

Edited by Spyroxion

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On 2018-03-24 at 12:22 AM, romiocan said:

I am sorry but why you do  you call in-game work tho?

I dont understand people  who work IRL, earn money then spend them щт bns to do less work in game. Mind you i personally have nothing against the Whales as we call them but in the end of the day dont they feel loss (wasted money) rather than achievement when they finally get to the top tier gear ?

I call anything repetitive and boring in-game "work". I find no sense of enjoyment or accomplishment in what people call "farming". I get a sense of accomplishment when I kill SK or Queen. For me, farming isn't fun. What is fun is raids, things that actually presents a challenge, a puzzle to figure out. Which is why I also do not enjoy pvp, as pvp isn't a puzzle, it's reaction test.

 

I do not know your situation, but like I've pointed out before, it's opportunity cost. My hourly rate is high enough, and there are more hours readily available that I can take, which enables me to play less, work more and, in the end, come out with more money in the bank and upgraded gear in game. As compared to if I had just spend time in game farming, and not taking extra real life work.

 

As for the top tier gear, you can't buy that. You cannot buy the critical Aransu upgrade material. Even if I could, I would still need to upgrade to Aransu 9, which I wouldn't f10 / trove for. I don't get a sense of achievement hitting end game gear, it just feels like a huge "finally I don't have to waste my time farming anymore" drag. Compared to WoW (as I raided in there), since gears aren't "farmed" but rather "dropped" by raid boss, it's an accomplishment for me.

 

In a nut shell, I don't feel a sense of accomplishment spending my time doing farming, I feel a sense of accomplishment spending time doing challenges / puzzles.

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