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Nerf Fallen School of Aransu, please


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I don't know why it is considered as a newbie raid for them to gather upgrade materials, when in fact it is not actually newbie-friendly at all.

 

I don't know why they don't reduce the CC bar when this boss is nerfed from 24-man to 12-man. If you have trouble with 24 people to do 8 knockdown, do you think it would be much easier to do 8 knockdown with 12 people, lol? Once a single knockdown fail, the chaos will accelerate quickly.

 

"If you do the mech properly, you will win", yeah right. You forget to add "If you have proper DPS and survivability" too.

 

Even if mech is done properly, there are still plenty of things that make new players find this raid difficult to complete:

-DPS check. If you have a raid where average DPS is 30-40k, it is a super struggle. This is what happen to people who raid on their alts, as well new players with half-upgraded gear.

-Boss attack hits like a truck, sending weak-defense people go through loading screen many times. Combine with the DPS check, you have a near-unbeatable raid, if you don't have one or two high-geared carrying your raid. A single 90-100k DPS make this raid a breeze, but without them, it is still doable, but a nightmare.

-Enrage Timer, and the fact that ones who retreat cannot see enrage timer, do not help at all. You basically fight a fight where you don't know if you can win or not, if your party DPS is not very high.

 

For my part, I'm fine carrying the whole raid with my two high-geared toons withDPS. My alts are not really high-geared, but they are not fresh from story and have proper soul shields. badges and fusion. And yeah, I know all mech and can do them properly. And I can survive like a roach until boss decides to go all out against me. But there is no point if I can do them properly or deal reasonable DPS when half of the raid cannot do the same.

 

Back to the topic, I think this raid deserves some nerfs to make it newbie-friendlier, either one of those or all:

-Reduce its CC bars from 8 to 6.

-Reduce its HP bar by 1/3

-The damage buff inside Soul Separation should stack up faster, or just give max bonus upon entering.

-Hellfire, Soul Separation and boss' instant kill should leave players in Chi Recovery state instead of Dead.

Edited by Kozuki
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I would say yes to the CC bar to go from 8 -> 6 for the rest i honestly dont see the need.

If the players die because they cant learn the patterns, avoid punishment, avoid the floor puddles / flowers.....thats not a problem with the raid but with the players.

 

as tehs already said this is one of the easiest dungeons there is xD

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A few points:

- With 12 people there is more than enough to cover for CCs. Every class can do 2 KDs, meaning 24 KDs available. If people choose not to CC it's because of them, not due to the raid being difficult.

- With a proper tank, most of the boss attacks will not hit anyone else. There are some AoEs during SS people need to watch out for, yes, but they are so tale tell and delayed.

- Every raid has a recommended/suggested gear level. If you fill the entire FAS raid with Legendary stage 1 with all pinnacle accessories than yes, it's going to be a hell of a struggle. 

- People can stay inside SS much longer and do not have to exit as soon as the next KD happens. There is plenty of time to sit in SS for at least 2-3 KD rotations. Again, this is how people do the raid, not the problem of the raid mechanics.

- Chi Recovery to replace instant death will still resolve in death unless you have 2-3 people nearby to instantly press F. His punishment AoEs are quite frequent. 

- Attentiveness is what is important in these kind of raids. 

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Apart from the really "high-end" dungeons (HH, SSM, EL, IF and the raids BT, SK, VT) you can do pretty much everything with a fresh story character if you know your rotation, roles in a party and dungeon mechanics. They already dumbed down most of the dungeons so much with the introduction of normal mode, it makes daily purple train feel like more of a chore than a fun, rewarding challenge (remember NF driving? Anyone?). I know purple train is not the point of this thread, but I do like how besides all of this daily boring "move to the boss and brainless DPS", the game throws a slight challenge at players in the form of Snowjade and FAS, something everyone should do at least once per week because the rewards are so good you'd miss out, unlike dungeon hard modes. No, you don't need Raven+ to clear these. You need to read up on the mechs and do them, especially when most of these bosses have self-damaging mechanics if you do them right (damage buff on hellfire going into soulsep on FAS), or healing mechanics (Asura flowers) if you do them wrong. 

 

Kinda sad that so many people aren't willing to invest a little bit of research into stuff like this. Especially since most classes feel so smooth once you get their proper rotation down and so sluggish when you don't have a clue (looking at ice WL especially). It's a consolation that at least these people won't be getting Aransu anytime soon. 

Edited by Cauli
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On Thursday, December 21, 2017 at 12:24 PM, Cauli said:

Apart from the really "high-end" dungeons (HH, SSM, EL, IF and the raids BT, SK, VT)

 NF driving?   Snowjade and FAS,

    You need to read up on the mechs ....

Read up on the mechs?   Um where do you do that?  I'd love a good game guide, but even an up-to-date, and complete on-line guide where I can search for topics & terms...oh yeah...

Terms... How about a place where all the TLAs and such are spelled out and defined?  Everyone uses abbreviations and TLA's for in-game lingo, so figuring out what they mean is hit or miss -- mostly miss.


I'm a total newb, and don't know where to get or find anything.  Sometimes I know I need to find various items or complete a quest to get something, but I've no clue how to even find the quests, let alone all the items that might be found in each.   A few times i've sent a msg to region, but haven't ever got a response from there.  Only time I got any Q's answered was when someone wanted me to fill out a party -- where somehow they expected me to be alot more knowledgeable and/or alot more advanced than I am a lvl55HM10 SoulFighter, (started  friday before tgiving), but was assumed, it seemed, to have over a 1k attack (~880) & items -- they are mostly hollow

stuff -- have figured out one way to up my weapon a bit, but doesn't seem that high -- Seraph9, but I've really no idea how any of my stuff compares to anything.


People talk about knowing mechs, but where do you even read what they are, let alone how do you get good at them (certainly not in most parties where you are already expected to know them).


Prolly doesn't help that this is my 1st game that has any PvP stuff.  I seem to attract mostly HM12-16's, though its not hard for an HM2 to take me out either.  Only times I've survived their initial jump on me has been when they were less than lvl 50.


I have the feeling that many of those who are advanced have also 'grown up with the game' -- i.e. have been on since it first started, likely did it in beta.  I have a similar feeling that the developers likely focus on providing a challenge for that group since they've been long term supporters.  I'm also getting the feeling that the devs have focused most of their attention on providing stiffer challenges for that group and that newbies often don't give as much feedback as they don't really feel like they know what is going on (likely because they don't).  Problem is, that to get to a point of knowing the game more on the level of a skilled player isn't something that is reachable for many -- especially with no resources on how to do things, where to find things, etc.


Anyway, have written too much for most people, so better stop here.  For that crowd...


TLDR: game has a much steeper learning curve than most games and has no offline or online comprehensive and up-to-date reference.  Maybe there should be an 'easy' mode for dungeons in addition to 'normal' & 'hard'.


Many games have  alot more difficulty selections: Narrative, Casual, Easy, Normal, Hard, Very-Hard, Insane/Impossible, where 'Narrative' is pretty much just for the story, and combat is about 20-30 times easier than Normal.  Have also seen games w/sliders that have a 1000x easier range than normal as well as a 1000x harder.  Most games I start with one of the easiest settings till I get used to it, then go for harder settings as time goes on.  Most I get through on Very-Hard, though, very few on the highest settings.


This game would certainly benefit from a game-guide book like those with other big-name games (Lara Croft series, Mass Effect series, Oblivion (a fave), etc)...


Hope it continues to flesh out...


Astara

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Back then there was a site called bns academy, which contained pretty much all the guides for dungeons and raids. But unfortunately, that site has since died. The content of the site has been moved into a google doc link that I remember seeing a while back on Blade and Soul subreddit. Would be nice if someone who has that link can put it here. And yeah, you should go to blade and soul subreddit https://www.reddit.com/r/bladeandsoul/ if you can for more info. Also, google/youtube the guides for each dungeon/raid also helps. Good luck.

 

P/s: With how convoluted some of the dungeon mechanics are, the game should have included a guide within to help players out, instead of inducing players to look for 3rd party guides.

Edited by Thicc Stoccpot
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This is the link to the google doc: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1DbHgNlej01lkqgJJQJr8pOv0ikSz5xr9

I really think that NC should implement a practice mode in f8 where players can lfp with others that are trying to learn or go in solo if they choose to, it would be based fully on learning the mechanics of the dungeon/raid. I know we have hm training room but lets be honest, that isn't helpful at all compared to the real thing and really only used for showing some boss attack patterns

 

Would also be nice if they put in a book directly in the game that you could click in the menu with a list of guides for each dungeon/raid explaining it fully with watchable videos of the mechanics but I know this won't happen lol.

 

I kind of feel that they should make more use of the tv stream thing in the game, they could actually on some days show mechanics of dungeons and other things that would help out some players.

Edited by ClassicMan
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19 hours ago, ClassicMan said:

Would also be nice if they put in a book directly in the game that you could click in the menu

Like the "Game Guide" that there's a Kbd config option for that does nothing?  I.e. Under Options ('o') then the Key Bindings tab, and on the left, select 'Game Windows'.  Last one on the page is Game Guide.

 

By default there's no key bound to it -- so I tried assigning 'SHIFT-G' -- when you press it -- it does nothing.  :-(

 

Seems like the game-engine they used (looks like the same game-engine as used for the PC version of Sacred 2 and the Fire&Ice extension) has support for an in-game guide.  Doesn't look like it is implemented, or if there is one, maybe its in the Korean version?  ;^)

 

A*a

 

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