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What does the new skill system have given and taken for your class?


Alysha Hawkeye

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Main Summoner here. 

 

*What become better:

For Earth:

+Faster Photosynthesis stack with Petal Storm Toss. The skill also has Earth variant, which makes it benefit nicely from elemental damage boost.

+Shorter duration of Nettle = less time to deliver full damage before boss move away. Also allow you to get out of combat faster.

+PvP version of Sunflower = free Sunflower spam whenever you can CC your opponent.

+Grasping Root can cause AoE Ivy Poison, which mean your Sunflower deal stronger damage on a group of mobs. Good for peach farming.

 

For Wind:

-Better focus regen with Crouching Tiger, and maybe Seed Shroud Move 2 if you're that desperate, greatly help to deal with the focus-starved nature of this build

 

For both:

-You can now trait out of forced taunt, have good focus regen with much shorter cooldown.

-Surprise Gift is now 18s. It is a x2 Knockdown skill, so it is very nice.

-Shorter-cooldown and more-useful Beckon.

-Your Nettle has PvP version consolidated into it, so they are very dangerous to step on during PvP. This also make Spear General's rotation a joke, since the skill blocks defensive skills, thus blocks his deadly counter attack.

 

*What become bad:

-You can no longer shortern cooldown of Weed Whack.

-Your root last only for 4s. It is good for Foundry Hard Mode, though. 

-F roll is changed from to 10m. This sounds good in PvP, but actually bad in some PvE situation. Fighting boss and F-roll will guarantee ranged punishment, such as Yunsang's grab. 

-Wind has Quick Kitty, Earth has Tough Kitty. They are the same thing: Just our old House Cat with some offensive stat buff. However, the buff is not very noticeable: every cat-related skills deal very weak damage, and Wind build suffers cuz you no longer have the 50% critical chance from Alley Cat for Wind Summoner to execute their double Ariel combo more reliably in Tower of Infinity.

-You lose Beckon Knockback, which is very handy in Tower of Infinity and 6v6.

-You lose the block-approach Lunge.

-KaPoW! becomes even more useless since it is now only available on gripped/grappled enemy. And no one bother gives up their cat grab for this weak skill.

 

*What I hope would become better in future:

-F roll should have a choice between 7m and 10m version, similar to FM backdash.

-More meaningful damage for cat-related skills. Who wants skill that have long cooldown but weak damage? At least make these skill based on Summoner's AP and offensive stat, like they are used to.

-The return of Beckon Knockback. It is fun to send people flying away.

-KaPow! should be the cat's Restraint skill, which spamable on Restraint target instead of a variant of your Cat Grab.

 

+++
What about your class?

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warlock:

 

actually almost no difference, but there are some worth mentioning

 

- no wingstorm reset on resist with ss

- focus regen sanctum removal

- no hybrid wingstorm build

 

blade master:

 

more dps, but losing some threat buffs

 

+higher DT speed means more DT can be dished out

+daze and grab-escape tab got merged

+new skills that available to use in draw stance

+free hm z (soaring falcon) pull and stun into draw stance, now the hm version gives more bonus to it

+9s cd and daze lightning rod combined into one

 

-300% threat bonus buff cyclone removal

-spammable blade strike removal means no more ez ToI

 

 

blade dancer:

 

they got some buffs and slight nerf

 

+stellar buff, which is resettable lightning draw

+able to use parry spin and party resist maelstorm consecutively unlike before

+daze and grab-escape tab got merged

+flash step on rmb for easier positioning against mobile bosses while in draw stance

+knockdown and focus regen soaring falcon merged into one

 

-non knockup version of take flight removal

-no sundering sword means less focus regen for aoe clear, still can use soaring falcon for focus regen anyway

 

 

 

i guess that's all that i can remember for now.

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FM here.

 

+Positive 

Heathwave is now on target position

Automatic block daze on tab

Changing beam into dragonchar while sb

 

-Negative

No more moving veil

No double daze anymore 

 

And i kinda feel i have lost some healing on f, but i have to check this up tho. Don't play on ice, so i dunno the changes there exactly.

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12 minutes ago, Edyis said:

FM here.

 

+Positive 

Heathwave is now on target position

Automatic block daze on tab

Changing beam into dragonchar while sb

 

-Negative

No more moving veil

No double daze anymore 

 

And i kinda feel i have lost some healing on f, but i have to check this up tho. Don't play on ice, so i dunno the changes there exactly.

I can add here even more things since I play FM aswell:

 

+ Positive

Fire ->

Deflect fire tab combined

Removed auto detonate LB

Guard break on X available in pve

Usage of blazing beam while awakened dragonchar is available while soulburn

! 16m range of dragonchar !

16m range of Heatwave knockdown, you dont need to run to your target to cc it anymore, extremely strong in pvp

Meteor and fire wall separated  and fire wall  usable during grab

Removing fire orbits is considered a plus since you get the full buff right away

Removing fire fury is considered a plus as well since your rotations becomes faster now => more dps

 

Frost ->

Max speed Ice Rain insta on hit with Impact

Higher duration on Z is considered a plus since you can spam Ice Rain longer and you dont need to time the second a third hit of Z like before

Snowball does more dmg and is actually useful now

Frost Fury animation moved to RB stage2 skill in frost mode

Overall more dps with frost build now

 

- Negative

Fire ->

No more double daze on heatwave

12sec cooldown of Dragonblaze

18sec cd of Dual Dragon

 

Frost ->

12sec cd of Dragonfrost

Removed the projectile speed increase from Frost Palm

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Kung fu master lost everything.

tremor- lost swift strike damage bonus for wind and fire tremor lost searing blow damage bonus. In addition kick damage bonus used to be 35% not 20%. also doesn't pull as wide as before.

Unable to mix fire with wind skills is disastrous comet strike wind is without argument better since it hits twice(each could be buffed).

Iron shoulder- knocks back and dazes(could be disastrous in pve), with no way of specking it to not do so.

straight jab fire doesn't have wind side equivalent- wind sides suck.

Roaring tiger sucks. Leading palm better.

Backstep (ss)- feels like it throws me way to far to use smite imediately.

Shit I can go on and on ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ they ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤ed up the game. I still wanna mix build.

Destroyer: of course lost capability of mixing shadow and earth.

for shadow: will power doesn't trigger wrath anymore. (nerfed as ❤ ❤ ❤ ❤)

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7 hours ago, arkvard said:

blade master:

more dps, but losing some threat buffs

 

BM didn't lose threat buffs, they were just moved. The searing slash/lightning draw and lunar slash can be specced to give 30s threat buff. So now BM doesn't even need to think about keeping threat buff up, cause he uses those skills on CD anyway.

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1 hour ago, Dlacik said:

BM didn't lose threat buffs, they were just moved. The searing slash/lightning draw and lunar slash can be specced to give 30s threat buff. So now BM doesn't even need to think about keeping threat buff up, cause he uses those skills on CD anyway.

not to burst your bubble but that is 150% not 300% buff. there is no 300% threat buff anymore

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@arkvard And there never was 300% threat buff anyway. Cyclone and raid used to give this 150% theat buff.

But there is 300% extra threat (not buff) at five point strike and searing slash/lightning draw. This is unchanged for five point strike and got removed from non-threat version of searing slash, but it remains for the threat version.

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Just now, Dlacik said:

@arkvard And there never was 300% threat buff anyway. Cyclone and raid used to give this 150% theat buff.

But there is 300% extra threat (not buff) at five point strike and searing slash/lightning draw. This is unchanged for five point strike and got removed from non-threat version of searing slash, but it remains for the threat version.

before this patch cyclone mid spec gives 300% threat buff, well i don't have problem if it's gone anyway. no one does, well looks like you are pointing this maybe you have problem with it? easy... just get 8 msp and spam the 5 point strike so you won't lose aggro

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  • 3 weeks later...

I could write an essay about the changes... but I'll try cover the major parts best I can.

 

SF: Ice
more damage on frost storm and new version that moves with the user.
SF: Earth
less punishing to not be behind the enemy, kingfist can be used 3 times in a row (compared to two times if first hit from behind).
SF: Both
Dragonfist got a major buff, but feels less rewarding to get 5 chi stacks and use kingfist/frost storm as it can only be used after Z now.

 

FM: Fire

No major changes, biggest change is that you no longer need to spec dragonchar if you want the powerful soulburn.

FM: Ice

Completely reworked, ice rain is now glacial beam and is only boosted by cold snap, which had it's duration increased to 10 seconds, frost palm can be changed to the relatively stronger frost fury (old F) that cost no focus.
FM: Both

No more double daze. The double stun no longer changes to frost stance. Double KD moved to fire Z. Dragonblaze and dragonfrost now have a 12 second cooldown, but you can now get frost and fire orbit from any move, just need to crit. frost and fire orbit now only have 1 stack.

 

BD: Lightning

Lightning draw is now resetable, all basic stance abilities have changed element to lightning and had their damage reduced.

BD: Wind

Reworked. Added wind surge to multislash, skyward slash and whirling scourge. During wind surge, sunder gives an extra wind focus and rolling typhoon is instant cast (much like it was during whirling scourge before patch). all badges that previously gave an extra wind focus on crit now does so on hit. All draw stance abilities have changed to wind and had their damage reduced (with the exception of flash step).

BD: Both

Sunder now gives wind/lightning focus on hit instead of on crit. take flight can no longer be specced to not knock up, and changed button to LMB in wind spec. The restrain ability of the other element has be removed. Flash step has been moved to RMB and replaced the 3 uses lightning strike. HM requirement for sunder has been swapped (so if you had chilling flame elixir, you now have the PvP version).

 

KFM: Both

No more hybrid specs whatsoever (no more leading palm in wind or enable searing palm on smite for fire for example). Shin kick moved to 2. New fire move (replace shin kick) on 3. Iron shoulder can no longer be specced to not knockback and daze.

 

WL: Ice

Heal wingstorm removed. No threat from bombardment removed. HM bombardment now gives 1 second CD reduction of dragoncall on crit. Target for Thralls claw removed.

WL: Shadow
Shorter CD wingstorm removed. New dimensional volley that gives 3 spectral orbs on delayed cast but deals much less damage.

WL: Both

Onrush now always have double stun. Taunt moved to Well of gravity.

 

BM: Fire

Dragontongue speed increased, damage decreased. 4 flicker in a row now gives 1 second conflagration. Not sure, but think blade echo was added with a 12 second cooldown, available on a critical flicker, gives 1 second conflagration.

BM: Both
Threat buff moved to lunar slash and lightning draw (and the fire counterpart). Five point strike triple damage-threat. Winged protector/sword shroud are now a separate skill and winged protector have a weaker non-HM version. Block can no longer be specced and parry block is removed, Added a new parry with 24 seconds cooldown usable during block.

 

Sin: Shadow

Shadow strike can now be used twice in a row.

Sin: Lightning

Shadow dash is now castable in melee too. Lightning pierce stacks 1 poison. Shadow strike now enters stealth.

Sin: Both

Venom strike is no longer an HM move. Swiftstep now always double daze (no KD anymore) Lightning Stride can no longer be specced to reset poison. Time bomb merged.

 

Sum: Wind

Base rosethorn now gives instant cast on use, HM gives increased attack speed. HM rumblebees now gives free instant cast in stealth (3 focus cost is non-HM now). HM weed whack now does additional damage on petal storm toss afflicted enemies.
Sum: Earth

A new Sunflower that does some less damage but refund focus on CCd targets (refund all focus with HM). Petal storm toss now gives 2 photsynthesis stacks per hit. HM sunflower now does extra damage to targets with ivy poison.

Sum: Both

Briar patch/Flying nettles merged, duration decreased (Damage the same). Weed whack now deals damage on it's own, can no longer root. House cat and Alley cat merged, takes more damage than House cat and lower crit than Alley cat. Non-HM seed shroud now gives overflow/ rumblebees buff.

 

Des: Shadow

Wrath deals more damage, Galeforce have reduced cooldown.

Des: Both

Smash is exclusive to Earth. Execute deals more damage but cannot be used in succession anymore, exclusive to shadow. Power slam no longer enable wrath.

 

Not sure what changed with earth Des and lightning BM.

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On 4/24/2017 at 0:42 AM, arkvard said:

warlock:

 

actually almost no difference, but there are some worth mentioning

 

- no wingstorm reset on resist with ss

- focus regen sanctum removal

- no hybrid wingstorm build

We lost the iframe quell instant cast on dragoncall as well as our snare on SS, which are kinda important.

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Most notable for me (Shadow Sin):

No more melee dash for Shadow, it's lightning only now. Shadow has 5-16m range dash.

3  joint-CCs at once: Double KD (Landmine Z), double Daze (Swift Step F), double Stun (Spinal Tap LMB)

Easier poison stacking

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6 hours ago, Malign said:

RIP: FM wide dragonchar. You will be greatly missed.

We have been crying about this change for like 1 and a half years :D, best change with the increased range, who cares about how wide it hits :D

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7 minutes ago, Yndril said:

How do you stack poison in shadow? it's too easy in lightning now (it's on your most main rotation), but I can't manage to do it in shadow...

3 (2 stacks)

tab (2 stacks)

1 (stealth shadow drain, 1 stack)

 

or, if 1 is on cooldown I use

 

3 (2 stacks)

tab (2 stacks)

X (1 stack)

 

 

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2 hours ago, amokk said:

Most notable for me (Shadow Sin):

No more melee dash for Shadow, it's lightning only now. Shadow has 5-16m range dash.

3  joint-CCs at once: Double KD (Landmine Z), double Daze (Swift Step F), double Stun (Spinal Tap LMB)

Easier poison stacking

How do you stack poison in shadow? it's too easy in lightning now (it's on your most main rotation), but I can't manage to do it in shadow...

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45 minutes ago, amokk said:

3 (2 stacks)

tab (2 stacks)

1 (stealth shadow drain, 1 stack)

 

or, if 1 is on cooldown I use

 

3 (2 stacks)

tab (2 stacks)

X (1 stack)

 

 

Oh, that's nice, have to try that out later, thanks :)

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10 hours ago, Moonstruck said:

When you see someone saying BM's got a dps increse... Are we playing the same game ?

for low ping yes..its kinda buff for them but for high ping its a nerf for them xD

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1 hour ago, newbiez said:

for low ping yes..its kinda buff for them but for high ping its a nerf for them xD

I'm playing with around 100ms, and there's no buff at all dps-wise... I mean, we do 1 more Dragontongue, but the damage from Dragontongue is soo much lower than before... Our dps has been decreased by a lot (well, can't say it wasn't needed though since we saw what BMs were doing in pvp)

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Sin in pve got buffed overall, so specifically for pvp

 

Good:
Lotus kick long range and no req
Timebomb resets poison AND has daze
Mine aoe much bigger now
Q has long range (at a cost)

 

Bad:
Lotus kick no more 3s stun
Daze mine gone
Q loses the 0.5s iframe after skill use
No more 30s sleep, which was useful against sum cat

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@Yndril you forgot that shadow wrath trigger whenever you gain "willpower" also when extending willpower. - in old destroyer patch.

You forgot to say that blade master retained all the skills that would be considered "lightning" skills this is the same for blade dancer.

You also forgot to say "Sin in pve got buffed overall." 

You also forgot to say that soon even the last 2 choices we can make will be gone.

There is only 2 things that can happen to you now its either be stuck on the element of your choosing or be stuck on an element not of your choosing.

Generally for a newer player what element drops for them will be the element they will use.

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50 minutes ago, Lamae said:

@Yndril you forgot that shadow wrath trigger whenever you gain "willpower" also when extending willpower. - in old destroyer patch.

You forgot to say that blade master retained all the skills that would be considered "lightning" skills this is the same for blade dancer.

You also forgot to say "Sin in pve got buffed overall." 

You also forgot to say that soon even the last 2 choices we can make will be gone.

There is only 2 things that can happen to you now its either be stuck on the element of your choosing or be stuck on an element not of your choosing.

Generally for a newer player what element drops for them will be the element they will use.

Didn't forget anything,

Didn't know of wrath during willpower (least favourite class).

Didn't know they changed typing of BM skills, actually thought five point strike was still lightning.

And what the heck are you talking about?

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