xchedeik1o

To all the low ap players in F8

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This is why 60% community left when silverfrost update came.

 

Massive masses players were enjoying the endgame as it was before, the map size for a whole story was enough up to hogshead/necropolis and it felt amazing, everyone could get the gear and even open pvp was balanced.

 

 

Now there's no way a capped character can beat a p2w person.

They advised us before they released game their ''business model'' not being p2w and they even said that they wouldnt put things that give you AP/Advantage to have higher gear than others, and all was purely cosmetic and things like potions only.

- They didn't repply back once they released their stupid trove events and they made all worse with the crafting of souls.

 

 

People tries to play and when they hit all and want to farm, they want a clan, Im in mushin, supposedly the most played and crowded server and it's becoming a total ghost town. Bamboo village dead, jadestone has like 5 ppl sometimes, zaiwei probably 10, all maps hell empty, you barely see people leveling with you, mushin tower has people but surely much lesser as 5 months ago, less than half for sure.

 

 

People keeps arguing about their idiotic AP power being needed to do all fast ignoring newbies thinking they can host their own parties all the time, imagine yourself with 650 AP which is the average AP you get at the end of storyline without diamond gem, asking for every single run you need to do dailies help, do you think its possible? 1 hour for like 4 dungeons? do you think everyone has that time? if its a blue dungeon its ok but what about purple ones? and then they get arena/6vs6 challange and what do they do? arena isnt longer balanced as it was when cap had lvl 45

Try do it by yourself then talk, thanks to this behavior the game lost massive mass of community and is turning into a ghost town.

Next year if this game survives you will play with 100 ppl overall in all your servers I don't think that funding event its actually true that theyre getting 350k from people unless people that are rich are willing to waste so much in a dying game not supporting newbies and killing it which makes all senseless.

 

I gave a try to this game I got to almost 800 AP but I see it's not worth coming back, theres almost no clan recruiting and the few clans available either are inactive af, only 2-3 online one afk and the rest asking for +850-+900.

 

You are asking for high, and you're going so high that you don't realize the fall will be worse the higher you get.

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@CrazyAmber And in your opinion, what would the solution be? I mean, how are you going to persuade some 1050AP player, that he should search for 700AP+ for say desolate tomb? Considering how 1050 means raven weapon, most likely stage 10 bracelet and necklace, which directly results in that 1050ap outclassing the 700-850 players to the point he/she could solo and finish literally at Xtime, while finishing with party means X-2min time. And if we are talking about a player with class that can't handle aggro well? Some classes aren't good damage sponges, especially nukers. There's more to this than meets the eye...

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@MassiveEgo because game doesnt mean all has to be fast or faster, even the main storyline teaches the player about wellness and how you should care about others even after failures, even the loading screen says ''everyone makes mistakes, do not persue your party members, encourage them instead''

 

You are just making the game die faster, thanks to your ''I dont want to fail the party so +900 only please'' you will make this game close and all the money you put in there will be enjoyed by NSCOFT like what happened with archlord and archlord2, so go on keep hosting stupid parties and forgetting new members, you're just killing the game further.

 

5 months ago there were many people in jadestone to chill with.

 

Go in jadestone mushin the most crowded server and see now

1 and half year, and look how many players this game lost.

 

In youtube everyone talks about their bad experience whenever someone plays it, livestreamers, famous people testing games, even thelazypeon said it was awful

 

And you're still ''defending'' your fake pride?

 

haha, good luck once it closes or becomes a ghost town, let's see who they ask for +1000, 2000 AP when there's a really tiny player base, which, is already starting if you noticed. What will be the point of playing with no players? soon that will happen if things keep up like this, and until then these stupid elitists will realize the true price of community, players and working together.

Edited by CrazyAmber

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They must just remove Desolate Tomb and Naryu and above from dailies; problem solved.

Whenever these are in dailies, dumb new players with Ivorymoon weapon will be there trying to join and be carried.

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Valiant   
10 hours ago, Kosako Assano said:

They must just remove Desolate Tomb and Naryu and above from dailies; problem solved.

Whenever these are in dailies, dumb new players with Ivorymoon weapon will be there trying to join and be carried.

Wait wait?

Why you called them dumb ? Ohh because they can't make a dungeon without making mistakes or because you want to be rude to them for your pleasure ?

 

First of all , they are not dumb.

I as someone who just start a game and search around guides, or asked people or etc, people will tell you to make a daily challenge to earn some gold and fast way to level up.

So nothing wrong here and that not something dumb, that some smart person who try to level up and gain gold but I know you will ask why DT or NF? Because he can't join 6v6 and in worst case he isn't expert with pvp in general.

 

Second if you want to blame someone for the mistakes, blame yourself for not teaching them, blame the game for not putting a guide for their dungeon.

How I'm a new player suppose to know that dungeon got mech, and such ?as I came from another heck and slash game that require no mech, how would i know ?

And don't tell me to google or youtube that, Cause it the game who should show stuff like this related to game and not myself as player discover the mech.

 

And I'm really sad from this, Why everything about game is come from outside or other region player ? Why I don't have guide for every game dungeon that been released ? Why should I look outside of game ?

Edited by Valiant

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problem is on both low players and high players. the lack of communication from low players and unwillingness

to teach others on high players. 75% of people i have encountered have shown no interest whatsoever to teach or

to learn a dungeon. Majority of the low level players wont even tell you that they are new to the dungeon or

don't fully understand all the mechanics and needs help with learning it.

It's as if they don't even care about learning the dungeons or plain on ignores mechanics when they do know it and only expect high level players to carry them,

which has resulted in some high level players, who were willing to teach, not wanting to teach anymore thus having high ap requirements and such.

It is not my job to ask the players in party weather they are new to it or not. if no one says anything at start, i will assume you know the dungeon and the mechanics of it.

Ofc i would help with teaching it if you tell me you are new to it or don't understand mechanics, buuut majority wont even bother doing that.

So unless the attitudes on both sides changes, it will all stay the same or get even worse.

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hwalien   

how many time have we bitched at new players for not knowing the mech and for doing the mech that is not needed anymore?

we need to have new guide for elite carry runs "How to be carried with out getting bitched at"

 

its not new players fault.

its how the game is now and its community.

 

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18 hours ago, CrazyAmber said:

@MassiveEgo
1/ because game doesnt mean all has to be fast or faster, even the main storyline teaches the player about wellness and how you should care about others even after failures, even the loading screen says ''everyone makes mistakes, do not persue your party members, encourage them instead''

 

2/ You are just making the game die faster, thanks to your ''I dont want to fail the party so +900 only please'' you will make this game close and all the money you put in there will be enjoyed by NSCOFT like what happened with archlord and archlord2, so go on keep hosting stupid parties and forgetting new members, you're just killing the game further.

 

3/ 5 months ago there were many people in jadestone to chill with.

 

4/ Go in jadestone mushin the most crowded server and see now 1 and half year, and look how many players this game lost.

 

5/ In youtube everyone talks about their bad experience whenever someone plays it, livestreamers, famous people testing games, even thelazypeon said it was awful

 

6/ And you're still ''defending'' your fake pride?

 

7/ haha, good luck once it closes or becomes a ghost town, let's see who they ask for +1000, 2000 AP when there's a really tiny player base, which, is already starting if you noticed. What will be the point of playing with no players? soon that will happen if things keep up like this, and until then these stupid elitists will realize the true price of community, players and working together.

1/ Well time confinements prevent me from "caring" about newbies more often than I do. Considering how much time this game requires, I really have no time to spare on mistakes that lead to wipes. Nothing person, just life interfering with my sense of empathy. I'm not the type of guy that'll sit down to throw insults at random just cause someone didn't drive their blade straight and as a result died. There's no point in bashing people ingame, unless they persistently fail the same thing 20 times in the same run. That starts shifting their inadequacy from lack of experience to deliberate ignorance.

 

2/Just because people need training won't magically mean I'll have more free time for this game. If you know some incantation that can extend the day indefinitely, creating infinity in the time-space fabric, do share. It would solve a lot of problems actually.

 

3/5 months ago there was a daily event for amethysts that took place mainly in Jadestone village.

 

4/I'm not in the NA server circle, sorry.

 

5/How good the game is, is up to personal preference. I'll be the first to point out that it's full of flaws, some critical, others not so much. The fact that it literally runs like a slug on a piece of sand paper is one of it's greatest demerits. When a game can't run on most PCs under the sun on minimal settings, especially a MMO game, the demographic considerably shrinks. This game isn't limited by it's graphics. It's CPU requirements are so out of the loop that not even 5% of the gamers out there have enough CPU horse power to run it without severe FPS dips of SPF spikes. There's an old saying - there's a train for every passenger. Problem is that this is kind of a VIP train that not all that many people can board. Any kind of grind can be accepted if the game that employs it is good enough. With BnS this clearly isn't the case.

 

6/Just personal preferences due to my particular circumstances. I'm still waiting for explanation as to why my time will be well spent in joining low AP runs. Because according to me, it isn't well spent. I simply don't get enough out of it, to justify the time investment, it's as simple as that.

 

7/When it closes it won't be due to players. It would be due to bad game design. We as players are not the ones that should compensate for NCs decisions. If they structure the content in a way that excludes people who aren't high tier geared yet and cannot gear relatively quickly to do it, that's not up to us. And expecting people to play for 6+ hours/daily just so they can do runs with low gear peeps, is unreasonable. Afterall when you look at it objectively, we play the game to have fun. If the amount of fun per minute isn't high enough, we lose interest. If you're insinuating that I (because yet again in this regard I can only speak for myself) should gain fun from what could be considered carrying others, then that's you telling me how I should behave. And you're no authority in the matter. The only people who can attempt to tell me what to do in this game are NCSoft. And if they try to do that, I'll just leave. It's not like I'm anchored to this game xD

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I'm new to the game and to be honest most players from f8 dungeons are nasty, selfish, toxic and immature. Another thing that I hate about this game is it is always like a marathon in a dungeon run like everyone is always racing against each other thinking only of themselves not waiting for others. You are in a team/party but there is ZERO teamwork. And if you make a mistake you do get berrated A LOT! All this high AP people act like they were never once a noob are delusional. It is a game FFS! People make mistakes so what it is a GAME! Having said that you are supposed to play it and enjoy but unfortunately because of the unfriendly and nasty community in the game, it is becoming toxic and demoralizing to play with these so called "elitist".

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@MassiveEgo Probably nobody bothered in reading your elitist bible AS SOON as I saw you trying to defend your point agian I stopped at the part of ''I am not in the NA circle'' and I didnt read anything else only that, because youre in NA/EU forums as well, your fist post says all about yourself, and your forum name makes it worse, you're behaving like anyother generic player who someone tries to teach something to them but they're masters in all, know everything and when they are wrong they just don't learn because they're always right.

 

Please, if youre not in NA, don't behave like the elitists in NA. You're the perfect model that nobody will follow, ask anyone here. Now, I don't have more time to lose with elitists in here, so keep ignoring newbies and excusing yourself with pride. Repply go on keep defending yourself, I don't want to see anymore.

Edited by CrazyAmber

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RavTH   

ap doesn't matter, did ebon with 400ap sin, people were stunned as I did mechs and everything as I said I was on alt.

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@CrazyAmberI don't need to defend my point as there are no legitimate counter arguments against it. Saying "You're wrong cause of reasons I'm not going to list", has zero weight in this discussion. If you can't give me a legitimate reason as to why I should be recruiting low AP players, I simply won't do it due to the reasons I wrote in my previous post. I need to know why I should invest time in a way that will be less rewarding.

 

As for the "teaching" bit - I've been playing MMOs for almost 20 years now. There's nothing you can teach me that I don't already know. And attempting to shut me down by trying to demonize me won't work. You'll have to do much better than that. Like actually arguing my point for example (but you need to read what I wrote in order to do that, xa xa).

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Grimoir   

I find it funny how high ap / p2w people act like they are gods gift to this community....

 

Either way:

 

2 hours ago, MassiveEgo said:

@CrazyAmberI don't need to defend my point as there are no legitimate counter arguments against it. Saying "You're wrong cause of reasons I'm not going to list", has zero weight in this discussion. If you can't give me a legitimate reason as to why I should be recruiting low AP players, I simply won't do it due to the reasons I wrote in my previous post. I need to know why I should invest time in a way that will be less rewarding.

 

As for the "teaching" bit - I've been playing MMOs for almost 20 years now. There's nothing you can teach me that I don't already know. And attempting to shut me down by trying to demonize me won't work. You'll have to do much better than that. Like actually arguing my point for example (but you need to read what I wrote in order to do that, xa xa).

Last i checked the dungeon rewards are the same so by you investing time there is nothing less rewarding in that. Truth is you simply dont want to do it because of selfishness, dont say not because we all know thats how it always is. People simply do not care about the lower players / new ones. You expect them to know mechanics and all but if no one actually takes and teaches them how will they learn? Given there are guides out there but personally a guide does not do anything for me i have to actually experience the dungeon to learn it.

 

Fact is the p2w that nc is giving basically made a grand canyon between the wallet warriors and regular players because they will never catch up, as result you have a dead pvp scene, dead open world pvp, people leaving.

Good example: spend 80+ runs to get a bracelet, a person comes, spends 100$ and gets it, fully upgrades it....

 

I ve even seen guilds who keep lists of people they run with and their dps from the dps meter to not run with them again because even if they give the same effort to a dungeon clear but just dont do as much damage they are less of a valued player.

People should stop acting like Mother Theresa's and just face reality.

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Maryelle   

I have had countless disagreements with people in faction chat about the crazy AP requirements some people list in F8. Cold Storage normal mode 800AP? Yes, it's a preference and yes you can specify what you want for your party, but there's necessary (actual requirements to run the dungeon such as stealth for DT), and then there's self-indulgent snobbery.

 

Of course, I agree with the OP that people should honour the requirements listed to join a party, but let's be real: sometimes those requirements are just plain lunacy.

 

People seem to forget that no one started in game with 1000AP, and that at times they were probably the one with the lowest AP or the one being carried.  Unless you specifically need a fast run or want to run hard mode, what is the harm in relaxing the AP requirements (in older dungeons)? After all, continuing with the CS example, people were running that when it was released with less than 600AP and surviving just fine.

 

Trying to LFP lately in F8 is an exercise in patience when it comes to filling a party. It takes ages to get other people in (probably the time of day I play) and then people pop in, see a HM level or an AP they don't like and exit like their ass is on fire. I truly feel for newer players and the frustration they must face where they have neither the AP or the mech knowledge to meet the requests in F8. When they LFP it, they're subjected to snide comments and often left behind or burned crispy because an AP hero wants to race ahead and complete the dungeon yesterday. And faction chat has turned into a trade channel - good luck to them in finding a party outside of F8.

 

In my view, the problem lies in the people who see AP as the be all and end all of party selection. AP isn't a measure of skill, but an indication of a) how deep your wallet is or b) how much time you spend in front of a computer. It's like this: you can have all the muscle in the world but that doesn't mean you have the required skillsets to be the next ninja warrior, Cricket.

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Agree and all... Still, I will not join HM7 with Ivorymoon weapon to run Desolate Tomb or Ebondrake Citadel when those are dailes; that is just silly and a waste of time.

 

The thing is, when those are dailes, expect a ton of Ivorymoon warriors wasting everyone's time, specially their own.

Edited by Kosako Assano

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@GrimoirThe rewards might be the same, but the longer the run, the less profit per second is generated. I simply have a threshold below which the profits per second are unacceptably low. And here's the thing - I'm not super high AP either. The further away my AP is from the current cap, the lower my lobby requirements are. I wouldn't make a lobby with 900+ap requirement if I'm playing on an alt with say 750ap or something along those lines. It's unrealistic. Just how it's unrealistic for me to make a lobby with 750ap requirement (for a dungeon where common ap of 900 for example shortens the run by half compared to common ap of 750-800) when I'm playing on my 950ap/6800cr/269%cd toon for example. I have no problem running a dungeon with low AP players. Player is a player, low/high doesn't really define anybody. But when I'm the only player of my dps and everybody else does literally half my damage, the run duration would lean towards a run with 6 low ap players, than to run with 6 players near my stats.
Here are some arbitrary numbers for the sake of illustrating this:
Player A has 80k dps       The dungeon has a total of 20kk health (we'll ignore mechanics, assuming everybody is proficient at it);

Player B has 20k dps       Total dps of the players is 207k. This means they'll exhaust all the health of the dungeon in roughly 97 seconds.

Player C has 25k dps       Now let's do the math with everybody sitting at 80k dps. 80k times 6 is 480k dps. With this much umph,

Player D has 28k dps      the party will exaust the dungeon's health in 41 seconds...

Player E has 30k dps       

Player F has 24k dps

 

Now depending on which dungeon we are talking about, it's more then possible to allow one low ap player in, but in the dungeons where damage matters for whatever reasons the lobby creator decides, certain players are unacceptably underpowered. Especially when we are talking about dungeons that people are going to grind say 10 times in a row in one day for some jewel or key materials. It's pretty easy to see the reasoning. If you take 10 min to do a dungeon, it'll take you 100 minutes to clear it 10 times. If it takes you 20 min, that's 200 min. And when we consider certain items are rare drops, the longer it takes to clear, the less chances one has to get the said item per hour of play. And if people are playing like me with a time window for this game of about 2 hours during the week and 3-4 hours at week ends, blaming them for wanting to clear faster is nothing short of unreasonable. Nobody plays for charity. Not low ap player nor high ap players. 

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If you have raven 9 and just want to get the dungeon done, you really should help carry lower levels. The problem with these carries is these people say nothing, never say thanks, aren't interesting AT ALL which is actually more like 99% of people. Just because you are in f8 doesn't mean you cant have a goofy conversation about stupid shit. Lighten up and enjoy the chance to basically omegle chat while doin stuff for 15-20 mins. I also honestly don't have any problem straight up soloing and carrying 5 people, but they wont even let you have the drops if you do that so it detracts. I personally think its awesome to help noobies, but they should be respectful and a little interesting or why bother.

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Caecae   

Why are people like complaining that dungeons are set so high and no noobies will ever be able to join? There's a reason why there are ap limits as that sets gear differences which naturally sets dps and how fast things die. I don't feel obligated at all to help people as I realized I could barely join things too when I was lower levels. So you suck it up and get what you can grab. Like the hell I'm going to take bare min fresh off story pinnacle true ivory hm 10 like 750 ap to a dungeon like IF because they need the daily. In most scenarios, even trying to be nice and letting lower geared people be carried, they screw up mechs and end up being like literally carried. Dead. On the floor. That's some bull. Then they expect rights on bidding when they literally contributed nothing but a dead body the whole time lmfao. Like there's no thanks for carry so here, take all the drops. It's like carry me. Now give me the stuff cause I need. ????????? :thinking:

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There are so many ways to resolve this.

I was doing dailies on 700 ap alt and it was desolate tomb that day, managed to finished Hard mode with 1 clan member and 4 randoms, i was doing position 2 aswell, it went swiftly, no complaints, no deaths just Tyfp. (And yes, this was 900+ party)

basically, if your low ap

 

a) do a full clan run (if your in one)

b) Get a high ap friend/clan member to help you (attracts other high ap members)

c) learn mechs and join parties with near ap requirement (if its 800, and your 780, thats usually fine)

d) if you can't do any of the above, try leveling your ap higher or closer to 800ap. its not hard tbh.

 

I also did a DT normal run with party with 650 - 750, (well i joined at the end) it was simply impossible, not enough dps>> leading to enrage timer, as an alt and a nice guy, i stayed with them for 2 runs but when they keep dying, it's just impossible.

 

But I agree with some members comment, when I was doing dungeons on my main, there were some low ap players which was fine, but if you don't bother contributing (attacking mobs etc) and afk, then don't expect me to carry your ass all the way. 

Edited by Jae Young

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Only came in to share my recent experince of an Asura run while doing F8 LFP.

 

I am a hm14 1072ap Des. Everyone in my party minus 1 was below hm8. In which im completely fine with. I can solo the instance quite easily, and i do not have a problem carrying people, since i do it all the time. What i do have a problem with is when people decide that since im already doing all the damage, they can just AFK parts since im already doing all the work. That is a no go. Im not there specifically to carry you, your friends or anyone else. I expect you to participate in all parts. 

 

The reason why i say this is right after the 2nd boss, we got to the mini bosses before birds, killed the first batch, killed the 2nd, and noticed something. Everyone other then me was standing near the dragon blood post waiting for me to kill everything. If it was a bunch of friends im in discord with, i wouldnt mind, but when you are a group of randoms, that is disappointing. So i decided i was going to AFK as well, and you wanna know what happened? Nothing. We stood there, all 6 of us for a good 5mins before 1 person decided that they were going to do something, and it was the 2nd lowest AP in the group. After that, 2 people died, and they finally moved to the birds, in which another 2 people died. Then i decided it was time to just get it over with.

 

TLDR just becuase you get a hp AP person in your group, doesnt mean you can just float and not do anything. Participate in the instance and get it done quicker. Then everyone is happy.

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