Is it worth coming back to the game?

[QRob]

Hello there,

I started to play B&S on the CBTs and with the head-start. I played the game for like 8-9 months, then I quit the game and switched to Black Desert Online.
The main reasons I quit was that the game was way too repetitive and all my friends turned away from the game as well, and playing the game was not fun anymore.
I've been away for like 7 or 8 months now (It was before Midnight Skypetal Plains was launched), and as I checked what updates arrived to the game... it's a LOT of content.
When I quit, my stats were 654 AP (True Scorpion Stage 10), with roughly 72,5k HP (Full nakshun bopae), 5k crit, 1.7k crit dmg. (I was not a pay-to-win person, but back then these stats were considered above-avarage stats.) I also had 5 types of hexagonal AP gems, which was also nice, but even back then heptagonals begun to flow into the game. I guess by now they rule, or maybe even octagonal gems (I don't know if they r already in game or not) And my char is on lvl50/HML10.
I wrote my sort of "past-progress", just for you to know where i stopped.
I know there are new legendary weapons and accessories introduced in the game by now, also a lot of new (for me) contents.

Here are the main points that I am interested about:
- Which stats are considered avarage or above-avarage right now? (mainly AP, Crit hit, Crit dmg, HP)
- Which Hongmoon level is still easely reachable right now? (without p2w), also is it easier in the new content to raise the hongmoon level? (at least to some point, like hm13 or idk)
- Which legendary weapon is the best? still Balefur? (I don't exactly remember the name)
- Is it worth getting the legendary bopaes from midnight skypetal plains? are there any other legendary bopaes that may be better instead?
- Were there any optimization implementations (which really work)?
And the main question: Is it worth coming back?

Thanks in advance to those who took their time to read my post and reply it.

[SadFace]

- 650-700 ap / 60% crit / 210-220% crit dmg / is average
It will change on 12 april tho

- hm 11-12 is popular level for average player with hm 13+ being mostly reserved for hardcore nolifers.

idk what do you mean by p2w here - it's all about how much time do you want to spend on the game each day.

- Raven.

- Yes for both.

- 64 bit client may be? I haven't tried it yet - i don't go BT so i don't need optimization that badly to try it.

[SadFace]

6 minutes ago, QRob said:

I meant by p2w that many players were already hm15 when I left, because those people bought resets to the instance (I forgot the name, Cold Something maybe?) and they were keep running it, like billion times a day :)

that's... a huge waste of money in my eyes.

[QRob]

22 minutes ago, SadFace said:

- 650-700 ap / 60% crit / 210-220% crit dmg / is average
It will change on 12 april tho
- hm 11-12 is popular level for average player with hm 13+ being mostly reserved for hardcore nolifers.
idk what do you mean by p2w here - it's all about how much time do you want to spend on the game each day.
- Raven.
- Yes for both.
- 64 bit client may be? I haven't tried it yet - i don't go BT so i don't need optimization that badly to try it.

Thank you.
I meant by p2w that many players were already hm15 when I left, because those people bought resets to the instance (I forgot the name, Cold Something maybe?) and they were keep running it, like a billion times a day :)

[Yndril]

The average player seem to have 550-600 ap, but I don't pay much attention to crit stats when I run dungeons, HP usually between 50k and 75k (though these guys usually have PvP legendary...).

 

I see a lot of players HM 11 and some HM 12, HM 13 and 14 is rare, and I think I've only seen one HM 15, might've been dreaming that though. Don't think there is any easy way to get HM 11+, the story quests get you to about HM 5.

 

Raven is best for all classes, but that is expensive to get to, otherwise, no major changes to baleful or seraph's, the only class I've seen almost exclusively use seraph's is WL, while the rest of the classes go baleful, some BD and Sum (sunflower) go seraph's though.

 

Don't know which class you are, but in general, yes, MSP soul shield is still worth it. Think the one that have the least use for it is fire BM. And yes, Chokma is a new legendary soul shield, not sure if it's better or not though, it's out of my reach so haven't really looked too much into it.

 

Most players saw an improvement after 64-bit client, some barely got an improvement, and a few actually lost performance. If you had crash problems or major FPS drops in grand harvest square or blackwyrm (when that was relevant), it should be better with the 64-bit client, outside of those raid-like environments, you'll probably not see much difference.

 

I can't decide that for you, I think the game have improved over the year it's been out, and less rushed updates now that we've almost caught up to KR (we're about 6-9 months behind compared to 2-3 years). I think you should give it a chance, but maybe wait for the patch on the 12:th?

[Divine Dragon Soul]

Short answer: Yes But..

 

For some player the game progress has stopped. BT, 6vs6 etc everyone can not. A standart player is doing only daily dungeons + arena pvp + mushin tower + infinity tower. Other options left in the hands of p2w players. (Black tower + Battleground Arena 6vs6 (unbalanced) + Faction (unbalanced) + Clan Battle (unbalanced) )

[hellowie]

In KR, finishing story quests gets you to HM11 because they require 5~7 times less exp to level up. The story quests in KR also give all the material needed to get you stage 6 seraph/baleful. If they decide to reduce the required exp to level up here in NA/EU with the HM20 patch coming on April 12th, the game will be more enjoyable. But I don't think NCWest will do that and NA/EU will remain a grindfest.

[GG Easy]

 It's not worth. I started when it was first released and quit after 2 months. Came back 3 months ago to see what changed, literally nothing. All bugs i was seeing are still there, lag and fps stutters are same, nothing fixed.

 They only rush content incredibly fast, increase the max requirements, simply copy-paste literally every month and call it update.

 I am someone who is more concerned about game-play and visual experience. It seems they don't give a dime about these two themes which need a lot fixes. It's obvious they don't like bothering with fixes, even the most simple bugs which are one click away to fix are still there.

 They only care about increasing level, gear gap. Maybe, they are trying to give an impression as if they are doing something but scratching their bellies whole day.

[Lunakitty]

It depends tho. If you like the game yes it is worth coming back. I am not meaning as in liking the art or combat but as in the genre of MMO which is grindy AF. If you hate grinding things over and over then no don't bother as you will only end up wasting up time before quitting again.

[Nyaha]

If you don't like grind - simply play it casually. It is what i am doing for more than a year. Sometimes i take breaks for a week or two and then just login again and continue to enjoy combat and esthetic of the game. You are not required to grind it to the top to simply enjoy the game. The arena is balnced so you can always do fair pvp there and you can progress through the game on the speed most comfortable to you. Nothing is pushing you to grind the top content right away, you will get there eventually.
I am playing from the release and i am only hm11 and still have no legendary weapon - and that is fine.
As i see it - many ppl just burned-out trying to compete with whales and hardcore players instead of simply enjoy the game on their own pace.

[GG Easy]

1 hour ago, Nyaha said:

If you don't like grind - simply play it casually. It is what i am doing for more than a year. Sometimes i take breaks for a week or two and then just login again and continue to enjoy combat and esthetic of the game. You are not required to grind it to the top to simply enjoy the game. The arena is balnced so you can always do fair pvp there and you can progress through the game on the speed most comfortable to you. Nothing is pushing you to grind the top content right away, you will get there eventually.
I am playing from the release and i am only hm11 and still have no legendary weapon - and that is fine.
As i see it - many ppl just burned-out trying to compete with whales and hardcore players instead of simply enjoy the game on their own pace.

 I know it may be a very subjective matter. But, how come you play to enjoy aesthetics of this game ? I quit mainly because of that. All those broken body parts passing through internal organs ( I'm not talking about clipping, this is different, it's like they were intentionally made/left to be like that ) or being on different planet with attached parts. Stances especially idle ones look extremely inanimate and forced, i.e. gon female and yun making them look like androids. Those things completely ruin my visual experience with this game, even if i don't play these two races to avoid brain-damage, they are too commonly played making it too hard to look away. It's obvious for these two races that they were attempts at '' Attractive '' and '' Elegant '' modelling, which failed hard because of stances.

 

 Most of the time effect is applied without any collision. Desync is at it's max. Put two computers next to each other and play with your friend. You two will feel like playing different games, different times.

 

 Lightning in this game is totally broken regardless of bloom, volumetric lightning, brightness options. There seems to be 4 skin types with tone options. First two tones of each skin  type will make your characters look like lamps in many places. Third and latter ones are globally darker skin tones.

 

This is the worst ue3 game i 've seen in terms of aesthetics so far. 

[dualistique]

I'll be real with you.

 

If you quit because the game's repetitive, you'll most likely quit again for the same reason.  Just because a game has new content doesn't mean the core of the game has changed.  Once you 'catch-up' somewhat to above average gear and content, guess what you'll be doing?  The same dungeons over and over again so you can min/max your stats.  If you do decide to play again, you'll be spending your time grinding for legendary gear, soul shield, and accessories.  And that could be fun, since it is a 'progression' that you can achieve, but to get all that you're gonna be running the same instances/dungeons just to get them.

 

I think the key to having fun with the game is to really have that core group of friends/clans that you enjoy playing the game with and you take joy in not only your char's progression but your friends as well. 

 

I personally like the combat, it's not a typical point and click MMO, and I enjoy playing with the friends that I've made so far.  And those have been the reasons why I've been with this game for a year now.

 

[QRob]

thank you all for responding.
Today I logged in and chacked around what's going on. I saw a lot of material pricez drastically decreased, I was really pleased about it. Getting the legendary weapon finally seems reachable, and there are even some more exciting things coming with the 12th april patch.
So after all I'm giving the game one more chance
Since I don't have anything better to play right now, I will continue to play bns at least untill I may find something else. Or maybe it drags me in again as it did at the beginning.

[Nyaha]

3 hours ago, GG Easy said:

 I know it may be a very subjective matter. But, how come you play to enjoy aesthetics of this game ? I quit mainly because of that. All those broken body parts passing through internal organs ( I'm not talking about clipping, this is different, it's like they were intentionally made/left to be like that ) or being on different planet with attached parts. Stances especially idle ones look extremely inanimate and forced, i.e. gon female and yun making them look like androids. Those things completely ruin my visual experience with this game, even if i don't play these two races to avoid brain-damage, they are too commonly played making it too hard to look away. It's obvious for these two races that they were attempts at '' Attractive '' and '' Elegant '' modelling, which failed hard because of stances.

 

 Most of the time effect is applied without any collision. Desync is at it's max. Put two computers next to each other and play with your friend. You two will feel like playing different games, different times.

 

 Lightning in this game is totally broken regardless of bloom, volumetric lightning, brightness options. There seems to be 4 skin types with tone options. First two tones of each skin  type will make your characters look like lamps in many places. Third and latter ones are globally darker skin tones.

 

This is the worst ue3 game i 've seen in terms of aesthetics so far. 

I don't know what is wrong with your body parts. Mine looks fine ( http://imgur.com/JeWpV3o )
The animations are top notch in this game especially when compared to other mmorpg. Yeah maybe some idles are a bit too girly, but they are cute non the less. I don't know idles of gon and yun - i don't play those races.
Cliping is everywhere in multiplayer games. I don't know whats the deal here. It's like you just want to bash the game for something without solid reason. And skill efects are awesome. I am playing WL as a main and this class has the best the stylest the weebest skills in the universe. The moment i saw the chinese trailer for that class - the hype went through the roof. No other mmorpg can even come close not only to combat mechanic of BNS but also to my beloved WL.
Lighting is fine - it does it's job. It is not a core feature of this game's visual style anyway.
The only thing i don't like visually - is level design. If locations from storyline are usually pretty good looking and more or less interesting then most of the dungeons that we are suposed to grind look boring and uninspired. Also i wish they would use more vertical level disign so we could use that jumping/running on walls mechanic more often.
And one more thing - i wish that thare was a summer costume that would feature bare feets. I am not a fan of high heels and it is annoying to me that even swim suites have heels.

[GG Easy]

2 hours ago, Nyaha said:

I don't know what is wrong with your body parts. Mine looks fine ( http://imgur.com/JeWpV3o )
The animations are top notch in this game especially when compared to other mmorpg. Yeah maybe some idles are a bit too girly, but they are cute non the less. I don't know idles of gon and yun - i don't play those races.
Cliping is everywhere in multiplayer games. I don't know whats the deal here. It's like you just want to bash the game for something without solid reason. And skill efects are awesome. I am playing WL as a main and this class has the best the stylest the weebest skills in the universe. The moment i saw the chinese trailer for that class - the hype went through the roof. No other mmorpg can even come close not only to combat mechanic of BNS but also to my beloved WL.
Lighting is fine - it does it's job. It is not a core feature of this game's visual style anyway.
The only thing i don't like visually - is level design. If locations from storyline are usually pretty good looking and more or less interesting then most of the dungeons that we are suposed to grind look boring and uninspired. Also i wish they would use more vertical level disign so we could use that jumping/running on walls mechanic more often.
And one more thing - i wish that thare was a summer costume that would feature bare feets. I am not a fan of high heels and it is annoying to me that even swim suites have heels.

 You completely missed the point. I never said anything about jin. Even so, that pic of yours is not her default stance, it's their second idle stance which is ultimately rare to see, lasts way shorter than default ones and have to wait a lot without touching any button to see, one step or action breaks it and you end up in the default stance again if you stop. So during normal play-time it's not likely to see our characters in those second idle poses or cute animations unless we purposely stop and wait to see one which is a rng thing, still i remind you this is not a problem if we talk about jin, their default pose is pretty normal.

 I 've already stated in parenthesis that it's not a clipping issue. It's not the clipping i am bothered with. It's more like an arm meant to pass through one of the character's vital organs so visibly.

 

 Let me give examples to explain :

 

 

 Do they look like same character ? If you ask me, the one on right is a living person, while the one on left is her copied android created by a mad scientist. Even her face seem completely off, look at eyes you will see. Also her left arm and torso ... This is not just a common clipping, this is a broken arm and anatomy, you can get rid of clipping if you lower torso size, arm thickness, build slider to way negative and max out shoulder width. It still won't seem right because an arm can not be crooked like that and imagine what you are going to get by doing those adjustments i am telling :)

 

 

 

 More apparent here. If you check carefully, there are clipping issues also in the picture on right, but still it doesn't bother me at all considering this is a game created with ue3.

 I hope you got what i mean. Clipping never been an issue for me since you can clearly see that character is a bit thicker than normal. The issue is broken body parts, inanimate expression making it look like an android. I would also want to show her in combat, run, walk, rare animations but would take too much time. I can say while all of them look pretty normal, she is completely a different non-living being in that default pose. Yun has the same problems, problems caused by poses, not the modelling.

 

 

 

 This is what i was trying to mean by lightning, but not a decent example since that area is not as bright as other areas like moonwater plains, sundered nexus and many other. Even here it completely makes all colors blend making her look like the source of light.

 

 Edit : If you are on also check how incompetent their staff is. Community manager is crazily focused on giving out world-shaking information about which costumes will be replaced atm. Would it make me feel better if i bought some of those new costumes just to see my left arm stick out of my spine ? I don't think so.

 It was the same when the game first released here. People trying to give feedback hoping a reply from any dev, but devs are always busy on which costumes they should put on f10. When you go support they send you to forum, telling it is the only place where devs can gather information about what to fix. Just use search function, google and other forums, when you type simply '' Female Gon '' most you see are topics whining about that or asking for altered mods to fix these on their side ranging from 2015 to 2017. Not even a single dev has given a dime about that so far. But, when you come and ask for a costume in which your character's left arm can pierce through both lungs not only one, you get yourself a dev with extremely helpful attitude.

 

 Stop this planet, i need to evacuate ...

[SadFace]

11 hours ago, GG Easy said:

Let me give examples to explain :

You can create an ugly and/or strange characters in every game that has a decent character creation utility. Do i need to google some weirdos from dark souls for you? And such cliping is everywhere where you can change body size - because the oversized body will still be using the same set of animation - it is inevitable.

[GG Easy]

1 hour ago, SadFace said:

You can create an ugly and/or strange characters in every game that has a decent character creation utility. Do i need to google some weirdos from dark souls for you? And such cliping is everywhere where you can change body size - because the oversized body will still be using the same set of animation - it is inevitable.

 Yes you can definitely create a complete retarded character in most games. It's not the rarest feature lol. Did you read my post ? I clearly stated that clipping caused by sliders is not the issue here. It's the broken left arm and anatomy even if you are not intentionally creating an ugly or strange character.

 

 If you find that preset i showed ugly and strange, let me show you the default wardrobe preset implemented by ncsoft. You can't really say they intentionally messed up with sliders to create an ugly and strange character right ? :

 

 

 

 Does that left arm seem ok to you ? How come an arm can sag out so backward ? It's not clipping, it's the broken anatomy, so broken that it doesn't even seem right on virtual world, which could easily be fixed by just replacing that pose.

 

 Also check pictures in advertisements of ncsoft about costumes. Even they never use that default stance while showing off a gon and it feels like a complete rip off since we almost never see our characters as they show off in exemplary screenshots.

 

 

[SadFace]

5 minutes ago, GG Easy said:

 Does that left arm seem ok to you ? How come an arm can sag out so backward ? It's not clipping, it's the broken anatomy, so broken that it doesn't even seem right on virtual world, which could easily be fixed by just replacing that pose.

Have you ever watch JoJo's Bizarre Adventure? It seems to me that you probably would scream in horror after seeing some of the iconic character poses from that series.
The visual art does not meant to depict everything as accurate to the reality as posible. In art it is ok to sacrifice realism in order to better highlight the style. And anime style of 3d models in bns are supporting this as well - bns does not try to depict reality but to creat it's own world and feel. This allows it to do some crazy shit without looking too strange or unnatural. When there is some wierd thing with animation in photorealistic style - it is looking super weird. But if anime character bends his arm a bit more than he could in reality - it still looks fine because it goes along with the overall visual style.
So, no... i don't see problem with the arm on your pics. It looks fine to me. I wouldn't try to recreate that pose myself tho.

[GG Easy]

1 hour ago, SadFace said:

Have you ever watch JoJo's Bizarre Adventure? It seems to me that you probably would scream in horror after seeing some of the iconic character poses from that series.
The visual art does not meant to depict everything as accurate to the reality as posible. In art it is ok to sacrifice realism in order to better highlight the style. And anime style of 3d models in bns are supporting this as well - bns does not try to depict reality but to creat it's own world and feel. This allows it to do some crazy shit without looking too strange or unnatural. When there is some wierd thing with animation in photorealistic style - it is looking super weird. But if anime character bends his arm a bit more than he could in reality - it still looks fine because it goes along with the overall visual style.
So, no... i don't see problem with the arm on your pics. It looks fine to me. I wouldn't try to recreate that pose myself tho.

 I am already not demanding realistic stuff, i hate it in fantasy games, why are you distorting my posts ? Do you even remember the name of Black Desert Online ? Which was supposed to kill blade and soul ? The idea of extremely realistic characters, animations in a fantastic unreal world couldn't draw the attention expected. That's not my point in the first place. Please keep it without derailing.

 

 If we are going to talk about art, this pose is not the art. The man behind the modelling art of this game was kim hyung tae. This is not the pose he implemented. Original pose was something much more normal and vivid-looking. They changed it with their own minds god knows whatever reason and even they always avoid showing screenshots in that pose.

 

 You can personally like an arm sticking out of a character's spine and call it artistic. But, let's be a bit honest here can we ?

 

 Even if this game is completely imaginal, it still has an order so that it can look visually appealing. Your argument pretty much like, let's put some legs on shoulders, a nose in chest, two mouths instead of eyes, belly above neck and market it ... what's wrong ? It's visual art, it's not meant to depict everything as accurate to the reality as possible (!).

[SadFace]

14 minutes ago, GG Easy said:

 If we are going to talk about art, this pose is not the art. The man behind the modelling art of this game was kim hyung tae. This is not the pose he implemented. Original pose was something much more normal and vivid-looking. They changed it with their own minds god knows whatever reason and even they always avoid showing screenshots in that pose.

 

 You can personally like an arm sticking out of a character's spine and call it artistic. But, let's be a bit honest here can we ?

So basically you are saying that the game looks bad just because of this one idle stance that you dislike?

This pose may be questionable, but nothing that big that would make me dislike the game or its style. It took me awhile to even recognize what could be wrong here. Because, as i said, it's just blends with the style of the visuals.

[GG Easy]

1 hour ago, SadFace said:

So basically you are saying that the game looks bad just because of this one idle stance that you dislike?

This pose may be questionable, but nothing that big that would make me dislike the game or its style. It took me awhile to even recognize what could be wrong here. Because, as i said, it's just blends with the style of the visuals.

 Refer to my second post in that thread. I focused mainly on this issue since it's the most obtrusive. Also this is a really common race/gender, you see them everywhere, it makes it too hard to look away from. It just doesn't blend with the visual style of this game as you said. I 've yet to see any female gon player sincerely love that pose. When you search female gon in all over internet, most common topic people whine about is that stance. Almost everyone i 've seen agrees on that pose should be changed, 1 out of 10 just comes in to discuss something irrelevant and they go speechless when you ask them if they would still continue to use that pose if they were given a chance to pick other poses in this game.

[hwalien]

maybe log off when your not playing instead of staring at my character.

[Yndril]

3 hours ago, GG Easy said:

 Refer to my second post in that thread. I focused mainly on this issue since it's the most obtrusive. Also this is a really common race/gender, you see them everywhere, it makes it too hard to look away from. It just doesn't blend with the visual style of this game as you said. I 've yet to see any female gon player sincerely love that pose. When you search female gon in all over internet, most common topic people whine about is that stance. Almost everyone i 've seen agrees on that pose should be changed, 1 out of 10 just comes in to discuss something irrelevant and they go speechless when you ask them if they would still continue to use that pose if they were given a chance to pick other poses in this game.

You've kinda derailed from the topic of the post... but I'm not a community manager, so I don't really care!

 

I really dislike the overly sexual style female Gon is portrayed with to begin with (just look at their clothes....), I have no female Gon and never will have, and those dislocated shoulders have nothing to do with it. I hadn't even noticed it if you didn't point it out, but I also avert my gaze when I see them so...

 

I mostly play Lyn (screw logic and anatomy, they're cute) and Jin (most "normal" of the other three races), I also have one Yun, still find it interesting that the default cerulean clothes actually clip weirdly because her chest size is too small.... like they never expected anyone would create a Yun without mountains...

 

To be blunt, I don't see any reason to stop playing because you don't like one or two of the races' idle animations, there are other races and genders (well, except Yun...). If you don't like any of the races, then sure, that's a valid reason to stop.

 

But each to their own, just as you don't like it, there are others that are not bothered by it (I'm not particularly bothered by it).

[QRob]

Yeeh, I was about to ask if I may change the title of the topic to "****ed up anatomy and poses of the gon race", since there are already more replies related to it than to the actual theme of the topic :D

[Prototypemind]

I did the same as you. I tried coming back right before the Valentine's Day event, and it and the event right before it were more of the same: grind until your eyes bleed or pray for good RNG to get what you're hoping for, and maybe fall short. The amount of grind will lessen with the upcoming patch and I'll probably log in a bit and progress slowly, but the grind won't disappear. Add to that the combat: it's interesting, but it gets very repetitive using double taps to dodge and having bosses that are 5 mins of the exact same patterns again and again and again. For me it's just a time killer here and there, I can't see investing real energy into this game again, but YMMV.