Ap

[Shadovvv]

The mentality of NA/EU is effectively mindless rushing, that they don't care about mechanics or other players at all, and they believe high AP = quicker runs. Well, that's not always the case; I've met 750s who are completely clueless as to how to play their class.

 

In every other Asia region (except CN), no one cares about AP. Even dungeons like Naryu Foundry, Naryu Sanctum, Skybreak Spire, Automaton Foundry, etc. are ALL PUGGABLE because EVERYONE KNOWS WHAT THEY'RE DOING, and if someone is struggling and doesn't understand mechanics they STOP TO EXPLAIN.

 

So why can't NA/EU be goody two shoes like KR/TW/JP? All these high AP rooms only serve to alienate the lower geared playerbase, who can't even learn or grow when they're denied to begin with.

[AhComplicate]

Here is my reason for requesting high AP

the following:

 

1. If you compared an average 6m 400 AP party vs a 6m 700 AP party (If everyone has the same ping ~50 ping)

-700 ap group

-- clear 2x faster than 400 ap group

-- High rate of success

-400 ap group

-- slow clear

-- low rate of success

 

2. I can say this with confident. Half of the player base have 200+ ping. (I'm lucky to have ~50 ping)

Therefore, I personally, I would rather get an high ap over low ap player 

reason:

- Since I don't know what is the low ap player's ping, it is safer to go with the high ap because of possible dps

 

3. Mechanic

reason:

- Since I don't know if the low ap players know mechanic or not, I, personally, would rather choose the high ap

because there is a chance they ran the dungeon already and know mechanic

 

4. Survivability

-The chance of low ap surviving is low

-The chance of low ap being one shot is high

-The chance of high ap surviving is decent-high

 

Summary:

All in all, I, personally, would pick a 700 ap over a 400 ap player any day.

I would rather have a 5-10 minutes dungeon run, than being stuck in an 50 - 60 minutes dungeon.

So, so sum it all up, I like whales ^.^

whales = easy life

 

btw you can blame Nc for making 800+ ap available for dungeons that only required 650 :P

[xxxAoi]

This is why dungeon runs are no longer fun. People prefer rushing, leaving others behind getting killed by the firewall/cores/lasers instead of taking time, explaining stuff and enjoy while gliding/running with other players. I wouldn't be surprised if there are lots of people who get burned out now and quit. More and more alts are easily created yet they are clueless or don't even bother learning the class and their role on these dungeons. This. is. so. so. so. sad.

 

High AP players/old players seem to forget one thing these days: they were once a newbie/low AP player when these dungeons were opened where only Sogun was the hardest dungeon to complete. I'm glad there are people who are willing to play with low-level players. Be one of them and ignore elitists. They serve no good to the community anyways. Those who are willing to learn and persevere get more rewards in the long run just like IRL.

[AceMaster]

4 hours ago, Shadovvv said:

All these high AP rooms only serve to alienate the lower geared playerbase, who can't even learn or grow when they're denied to begin with.

• you know you are contradicting yourself right? Lowered geared players will learn nothing with high AP players in a party. If you got someone 600+ in yeti who knows what he is doing, the success rate is close to 100% as he pretty much can solo the thing. High AP rooms doesn't alienate anyone. Lowered gear players should be able to finish themselves
• up to 50% of players don't have the requirements to be in that dungeon. Teach them how to play? Even God can't succeed if the minimum dps isn't met
• if everyone went with 45% crit, 120% accuracy (asura+), and minimum required AP ( maybe more if it's your first time/have high ping, to compensate), PUGs would be a lot easier and fun. This has nothing to do with high AP rooms. People don't want to grind AT ALL.
  • FYI, people are cheating to even have the minimum AP. Some equip gear that increase AP while loosing crit because most people only check AP. 
  • They just don't understand that the boss have an enrage timer or do not care
• i'm not in a clan. I do pugs more often than not. No one asks for help. at most 2-3 out of 6 players will respond to anything you say, the rest are dead silent. Usualy those that are dead silent are the issue, and i don't even know if they know english. In premade parties, people can at least talk.

17 minutes ago, xxxAoi said:

This is why dungeon runs are no longer fun. People prefer rushing, leaving others behind getting killed by the firewall/cores/lasers instead of taking time, explaining stuff and enjoy while gliding/running with other players. I wouldn't be surprised if there are lots of people who get burned out now and quit. More and more alts are easily created yet they are clueless or don't even bother learning the class and their role on these dungeons. This. is. so. so. so. sad.

 

High AP players/old players seem to forget one thing these days: they were once a newbie/low AP player when these dungeons were opened where only Sogun was the hardest dungeon to complete. I'm glad there are people who are willing to play with low-level players. Be one of them and ignore elitists. They serve no good to the community anyways. Those who are willing to learn and persevere get more rewards in the long run just like IRL.

• who should teach them how to play their class?
  • I spent over 6 hours, in one day, in mushin tower to learn my class. Didn't beat Naksun but learned a lot. How is it my fault someone doesn't know his class?
• not sure what pugs you were doing, but generally people wait at the boss until everyone is gathered. In EU at least. People don't rush as often as you might think. (maybe you are referring low level dungeons that can be solo'ed? but never happened to me)
• Like i said, I usually pug, but I don't understand why you people blame elitism. Bad players have the tools to learn (mushin tower) but they don't. This game requires some involvement from every player. Right now low AP want high AP parties to progress which they don't even need. Whats the issue with elitism? I just don't get it.
• 450 AP, 45% crit is ridiculous easy to get. ( 500AP requires only blue dungeons and purple 45 (blackram and bloodshade))
• the people that are rushing aren't "the elites". The average player is rushing content he shouldn't do.
• I played on launch and had 450 AP on 2 classes in march. There was no silverfrost. Almost everyone had 450AP when silverfrost came. No, people never had low ap in silverfrost dungeons...unless they started 2-3 weeks prior. Now people are doing difficult dungeons with 400 AP because they are the shit...(dungeons which didn't even exist back then)
• It's easier to get 500 AP now, why do you blame old players? ( in 3 weeks I had 500 AP on a new character without doing ANY silverfrost purple dungeon). 

[SoulsHunter]

@AceMaster

 

You don't seem to understand and I don't blame you. Because you are already lost in touch with what new players have to go through now. It is completely different from new players back then months ago.

 

It is easier if you just create a new character and try to build it up without transferring anything from your old character to help it. Then you will see what the problems are.

[AceMaster]

@SoulsHunter

What I do not understand?

 

- in the last 4 weeks I've made 2 characters 400+ AP. I gave them at most 50 gold each( for gems and some moonwater transformation stones). Could have bought cheaper gems. My main already got more gold from them that I gave to them. I only did poharon once on both of them. No other dungeons. I did all the quests in silverforst while doing main story and ended up with 50+ gold which i used on my main. Not really worth it tough. (gold/hour ratio was low as main quest is long)

- my main is hongmoon8 with 560AP. Started doing silverfrost dungeons when he was 500 AP. Only had issues with yeti as i read a guide which was to old and not good (or maybe to good, explained a lot of stuff i didn't need knowing). Currently gearing other classes as I'm bored.

 

silverfrost dailies, misty woods, poharon 24, mushin tower(ordered by difficulty) are easy and soloable and will give you 12-20 gold in 2 hours (depending on gear and what you skip. poharon 24 usualy has other people and solo might be to slow, but still doable with 400 AP, even lower). You can do blue dungeons dailies (which you need to advance anyway) and moonwater dailies if you still have time and dailies left.

Because I had other characters, I could repeat the quests i liked to advance faster. More often than not, i didn't have time tough. That is how I got to 500 AP.

 

Doing dungeons right now, I don't think I'm earning more tough. 5 gold/30 min seems to be the norm. In dungeons maybe you get some drops, but rarely happens. Some dungeons are slower because of dps or wipes. (doing pugs)

People are rushing to endgame for nothing. They should relax and enjoy the game.

[SoulsHunter]

12 minutes ago, AceMaster said:

in the last 4 weeks I've made 2 characters 400+ AP. I gave them at most 50 gold each( for gems and some moonwater transformation stones). Could have bought cheaper gems. My main already got more gold from them that I gave to them.

Because I had other characters, I could repeat the quests i liked to advance faster. More often than not, i didn't have time tough. That is how I got to 500 AP.

 

1 hour ago, SoulsHunter said:

just create a new character and try to build it up without transferring anything from your old character to help it. Then you will see what the problems are.

 

[AceMaster]

@SoulsHunter

...... I just said i made not 1 but 2 characters level 50. How many did you made?

 

Are you implying that I can't finish main quest with 200-300 AP to get 50 gold?

Ok....if you say so.

 

 

 

 

 

[SoulsHunter]

12 minutes ago, AceMaster said:

@SoulsHunter

...... I just said i made not 1 but 2 characters level 50. How many did you made?

 

Are you implying that I can't finish main quest with 200-300 AP to get 50 gold?

Ok....if you say so.

I made two too. One is an assassin, another one is destroyers. Both classes I played without help from my main character.

[Meginb]

Yeah, rushing is definitely a problem in this game. It doesn't help that a lot of places/dungeons have been made obsolete and sit deserted. They only help to encourage rushing since all the activity is at max level. Even though upgrades have been made cheaper and leveling is faster/easier, it doesn't really help new players as much as it does alts. The people making alts already know the most efficient ways to get everything done and collected while rushing to the top. Meanwhile, new players kind of have to figure things out by themselves or google it since faction chat can lie for their own entertainment and new player friendly clans can be sparse. Honestly, the current state of the game is not something I could recommend to people... which is a shame. =\

[Lunakitty]

I'm just wondering what happens when there's no new content coming out but the requirements are the same. Doesn't really matter because regardless a person cannot advance any faster and there will always be people who are lower and people who are maxed out. Are people assuming that there will never be new players coming who need to catch up many years of content in no time since they started out so late in the game?

[ImagineAName]

If u want my advice : Focus mainly on AP and forget about the other stats because it's the only way to keep up, i know that AP is not everything and

 it's useless without a Decent crit,crit damage...etc but this is the harsh truth about this game.

 

just try to increase your AP as much as possible so mindless people can accept you in dungeons. 

[KzE]

27 minutes ago, ImagineAName said:

If u want my advice : Focus mainly on AP and forget about the other stats because it's the only way to keep up, i know that AP is not everything and

 it's useless without a Decent crit,crit damage...etc but this is the harsh truth about this game.

 

just try to increase your AP as much as possible so mindless people can accept you in dungeons. 

And what about the achievement linking? :)

 

I play mmo games since 2003, but this is the first game, where finding party for dungeon run is more challenging, than the dungeon itself.

[ImagineAName]

16 minutes ago, KzE said:

And what about the achievement linking? :)

 

I play mmo games since 2003, but this is the first game, where finding party for dungeon run is more challenging, than the dungeon itself.

Well EC and DT are Exceptional I was talking about lower dungeons like Sogun / Nexus Were people Only check your ap without giving a damn about

the Rest of the other stats and yea, Sometimes it takes me 30+ minutes to find a party to finish a dungeon that can be completed within 5 minutes

[KzE]

23 minutes ago, ImagineAName said:

Well EC and DT are Exceptional I was talking about lower dungeons like Sogun / Nexus Were people Only check your ap without giving a damn about

the Rest of the other stats and yea, Sometimes it takes me 30+ minutes to find a party to finish a dungeon that can be completed within 5 minutes

At this point, every 6man and 4man till DT should be doable with LFP... but no...

[Dr SoulReaper]

1 hour ago, KzE said:

At this point, every 6man and 4man till DT should be doable with LFP... but no...

At this point till DT everything is soloable or duoable (althou necro DT and EC are harder to duo coz you have to do mechs properly or use odd strats but i digress)