Their stories with "Draken neck"

[882184_1452550488]

i dont how this can be a problem.. im working 8-9 hours a day, im playing 3-4 hours, i do my dailys only cause " im max geared ", got my necklace last night after 85 runs.

 

sure maybe increase the drop rate, but giving it out for free in a merchant? whats the point in even doing the dungeon then?

 

maybe put every legendary piece in merchant, like stage 6 weapon too.. i mean i have it on my main , but my alt wants it too.

should they do it?

[JatoJato]

13 minutes ago, Grimoir said:

if you hate the grind why are you playing korean mmos? Its pretty obvious the game is a grind since its out in other regions for years already.

If you dont like the grind, dont play mmos.

->

Just a quick annotation to this point. If you speak of grind - do you mean rng or do you mean actual grind.

I mean grinding is more or less repetivtive "work" (yes it is a game - but english is not my mother tongue and i cannot explain it better) to collect/farm stuff and then get something for it or achieve the goal you have.

Rng is an mechanism that is in general unfair but can be used to make things more exciting. For example if all dungeon drops would be the same it would be a bit boring. On the other hand if things are only gated by rng and the chance of success is so slim it is not grinding it is rng. Because it is possible to get things with luck but it is not possible to "grind" (ergo invest time - for example 150 runs - and i think in average a tom run is 20-30mins - so ~50h - is a lot of time) it really effectively. And in general ppl are annoyed due to the unfairness. So some kind of pity-system or tokens would be enough to get many players happy again. Same goes btw for the PSTS - there it is also possible to get lucky and do not have to grind while others did the grinding and are unlucky and get nothing for their efforts...

To the grind point. 

 

Then to the other stuff. You might not be aware of it - but we are either in NA or EU. And even if this is a KR-Game there are some differences - for example:

-Server Stability

-Ping in general

-Weapon Evolution Paths

-Gold in Quests

-Stuff in F10

-Differences in HP/Dmg

-...

 

As you now might see - the game in general is the same but there are some adaptations in place - because not every region has the exact same requirements. For example i heard that asians love rng - a thing i did not hear in general from our Regions.

 

Then the other point - you are aware that we also got content way faster -> so there had to be some adaptations in droprates/costs because if you think when there are no adaptations the game would be a lot less grind-intensive in KR because they had way more time...

[Nattia]

6 minutes ago, JatoJato said:

->

To the grind point. 

 

Then to the other stuff. You might not be aware of it - but we are either in NA or EU. And even if this is a KR-Game there are some differences - for example:

-Server Stability

-Ping in general

-Weapon Evolution Paths

-Gold in Quests

-Stuff in F10

-Differences in HP/Dmg

-...

 

As you now might see - the game in general is the same but there are some adaptations in place - because not every region has the exact same requirements. For example i heard that asians love rng - a thing i did not hear in general from our Regions.

 

Then the other point - you are aware that we also got content way faster -> so there had to be some adaptations in droprates/costs because if you think when there are no adaptations the game would be a lot less grind-intensive in KR because they had way more time...

I'm glad that there are people with brain out there. The game might have asian roots, but to sell well in other region, it has to appeal to the majority of the audience there. If the company does not understand this, they won't sell the product well here.

[Grimoir]

2 minutes ago, Nattia said:

I'm glad that there are people with brain out there. The game might have asian roots, but to sell well in other region, it has to appeal to the majority of the audience there. If the company does not understand this, they won't sell the product well here.

OR the players need to understand that a company wont change the base and structure of a game because certain individuals dont like the way drops and rng work.

They will not change the basics of the game to make it appealing for a minority of players who complain about everything they do not like.

 

Fact is if you are really unhappy in playing a game as it is, it frustrates you, you are free to leave and find something else that will more suit your needs.

Fact is most players expect everything to be handed to them without putting in any effort. Legendary items are legendary for a reason, they shouldnt be easily obtainable. Other games have this aswel.

[882184_1452550488]

10 minutes ago, Nattia said:

I'm glad that there are people with brain out there. The game might have asian roots, but to sell well in other region, it has to appeal to the majority of the audience there. If the company does not understand this, they won't sell the product well here.

tbh, you sound like you want  everything for free, you dont wanna do anything to get it.. thats my point of view what i have been reading from you. so you dont have to answer this but.. its kinda silly ^^

 

and calling out people for not having a brain when they dont share your opinon about giving out the necklace easier , its  something that bothers me..

i dont see how they will make it better for everyone in this game, but i do think they will make something new with the necklace.. that someone else will come up with a new complaint about.. cause EU / NA will never be happy - way  to greedy

[Windy]

I would like that the upgrades i need or that i like to have wouldn't be locked behind an RNG wall- rewarding the players efforts and time . I mean ,if someone's RNG is this bad and after 300 runs gets empty hands is far to be fun .

[Lunakitty]

I want lege stage 6 with 6 slots and hepta gems by doing all silverfrost purples 100 times and having 4000 achievement points.

[Hail0]

2 hours ago, Lunakitty said:

Not everyone hate the grind. There are people who enjoy doing the same thing over and over but they are minority in EU/NA. Majority just want to get everything handed to them on a silver platter but imho that would ruin the purpose of mmo if it wasn't grindy. At least it would for me.

U for sure have no idea what u re talking about,this is not grind at this point

There are people who sees 7 necklaces under 50 runs and there is a guy who didnt see a single one at 420+ runs,if you think this is okay EVEN for a "korean" mmo(even tho this is eu/na version) ,you should get help.

It would be "grind" if u could get the necklace after an x amount of runs with some tokens etc,but this is pure rng which is bullshit.

You just sound like a selfish dude who got his necklace in few runs for 100g.

[Hail0]

3 minutes ago, Lunakitty said:

I'll take that as you never before played actual grindy game where droprates were something like 0.001 % for extra rare op items. People farmed even years while trying to get that and then some newbie gets it on first try. Fair? Absolutely since everyone had the same chance. Regardless people called it grinding.

what makes u think one person getting 7 necklaces from 50 runs and not needing to run dungeon ever again while other one havent seen anything for 400+ is grind? I dont care about dumb people u had in ur previous games but this is not the case atm sadly.
You can run forever and never get anything,this is not grind.

[Lunakitty]

4 minutes ago, Hail0 said:

U for sure have no idea what u re talking about,this is not grind at this point

There are people who sees 7 necklaces under 50 runs and there is a guy who didnt see a single one at 420+ runs,if you think this is okay EVEN for a "korean" mmo(even tho this is eu/na version) ,you should get help.

It would be "grind" if u could get the necklace after an x amount of runs with some tokens etc,but this is pure rng which is bullshit.

I'll take that as you never before played actual grindy game where droprates were something like 0.001 % for extra rare op items. People farmed even years while trying to get that and then some newbie gets it on first try. Fair? Absolutely since everyone had the same chance. Regardless people called it grinding.

[Lunakitty]

7 minutes ago, Hail0 said:

what makes u think one person getting 7 necklaces from 50 runs and not needing to run dungeon ever again while other one havent seen anything for 400+ is grind? I dont care about dumb people u had in ur previous game but this is not the case atm sadly.

It is exactly the case. People are jealous over other's luck while every run has the chance dropping it. Some get lucky, some wont. But sure let's assume it's not grind, what is it then? Running dungeon 400 times just for fun because you didn't get the necklace? 

[Nattia]

3 hours ago, 882184_1452550488 said:

tbh, you sound like you want  everything for free, you dont wanna do anything to get it.. thats my point of view what i have been reading from you. so you dont have to answer this but.. its kinda silly ^^

 

and calling out people for not having a brain when they dont share your opinon about giving out the necklace easier , its  something that bothers me..

i dont see how they will make it better for everyone in this game, but i do think they will make something new with the necklace.. that someone else will come up with a new complaint about.. cause EU / NA will never be happy - way  to greedy

yea, doing 100 runs to get something is WANTING EVERYTHING FOR FREE. you have no idea how much of free time and money i've invested and let it stay that way, I would be seriously worried if I realized this. I'm very passionate about the game, I don't want to give it up on it but I'm really close right now.

[JatoJato]

6 hours ago, Grimoir said:

OR the players need to understand that a company wont change the base and structure of a game because certain individuals dont like the way drops and rng work.

They will not change the basics of the game to make it appealing for a minority of players who complain about everything they do not like.

 

Fact is if you are really unhappy in playing a game as it is, it frustrates you, you are free to leave and find something else that will more suit your needs.

Fact is most players expect everything to be handed to them without putting in any effort. Legendary items are legendary for a reason, they shouldnt be easily obtainable. Other games have this aswel.

You are aware that there are still changes in place - ignoring arguments in this direction and instead attacking others is not very helpful.

6 hours ago, Lunakitty said:

I want lege stage 6 with 6 slots and hepta gems by doing all silverfrost purples 100 times and having 4000 achievement points.

So why not - i think you did a lot of work for that ;-).

5 hours ago, Lunakitty said:

I'll take that as you never before played actual grindy game where droprates were something like 0.001 % for extra rare op items. People farmed even years while trying to get that and then some newbie gets it on first try. Fair? Absolutely since everyone had the same chance. Regardless people called it grinding.

Comparison to other games is not very helpful either. We play BnS not some other game...

5 hours ago, Lunakitty said:

It is exactly the case. People are jealous over other's luck while every run has the chance dropping it. Some get lucky, some wont. But sure let's assume it's not grind, what is it then? Running dungeon 400 times just for fun because you didn't get the necklace? 

Luck is a result of RNG which is not grind. I had a nice post for that reason - but for some reason ppl ignoring it - mb because they would have to come up with some real arguments instead of the face-like saying "ppl only want things handed to them"...

2 hours ago, Susumimi said:

This is why you don't worry over these things. Who the f*ck cares about some stupid necklace that probably gives you 3 more attack? Does it make your life complete to get it? Really love that ugly orange border around your gear icon? I couldn't care less about legendaries, wouldn't even bother spending 3k gold to upgrade my stuff to legendary even if I had it drop, for what? Boasting to others "I have 3 more AP than you now"? I'd rather spend that money on cosmetics which are actually fun to look at. I'll never get the logic of hardcore players who cares more about a single meaningless number than things that actually matter. Ho ho ho I have 703AP and you only have 700AP, I'm so pro. Congrats, enjoy beating Yeti 3 seconds faster.

/facepalm

As i mentioned earlier - ppl need something to do... Thats all - playing for long periods of time w/o any improvements discourages ppl. 

[LilMsQT]

My Draken necklace story 

 

Looks at the dungeon where it drops, factors in the drop rate, after running said dung, and says mah no thanks not fun enough for me. I'll wait till there's another way.

 

I don't mind grinding something, say 50 times, if I get my reward. But personally that's my limit. If I get said item in 1 to 50 runs then okay, but if it's over that I'm salty over it, I might do it 100 times max if I want it bad enough, but still its likr grrr damn thing took me 100 runs and I'm bitter.  I like to stay sweet =p 

[mrpeeng]

No necklace here but I've only ran and completed about 20 runs (I barely play these days).  I don't want the necklace to be handed to me but like some have mentioned the RNG is horrid for some people.  Maybe they can implement a token / coin / fragment system for this but still have rng included.  For instance, if you got a token included in the box for each kill and you can use 10 tokens and trade to merchant for an rng box with an additional chance to get it.  This wouldn't remove the rng to this but would increase your odds with more chances.  

[Blubbz0r]

Give up your dreams on the necklace. They're gona decrease the ring drop rate even more than the 0.1% droprate for the necklace.

You've higher chances to win in the lottery than this stuff.

[Nattia]

4 hours ago, JatoJato said:

You are aware that there are still changes in place - ignoring arguments in this direction and instead attacking others is not very helpful.

So why not - i think you did a lot of work for that ;-).

Comparison to other games is not very helpful either. We play BnS not some other game...

Luck is a result of RNG which is not grind. I had a nice post for that reason - but for some reason ppl ignoring it - mb because they would have to come up with some real arguments instead of the face-like saying "ppl only want things handed to them"...

As i mentioned earlier - ppl need something to do... Thats all - playing for long periods of time w/o any improvements discourages ppl. 

I'm your fan, you're smart. ^^

[Boscodash]

just 150? took me 200 to get mine. my guildies are around 350 without seeing theirs yet. 

[Alysha Hawkeye]

19 hours ago, Nattia said:

If the Koreans who like to grind have multiple ways to get it, why not NA/EU people who have a much different mindset than the Koreans? How they implemented it in our version was flawed from the start.

When you enters a market as a business, you will have to adapt to the customers` demand, not make customers adapt to your liking. Fail to do that, and customers will simply ditch you for better products or services.

 

It is not like NA/EU players cannot grind or spend like Korean. The thing is the effort vs reward system of this game is too RNG-based. RNG is fine when you need some extra thrill and money sink, like Premium Stones. However, it is very bad when you attach its to dungeon loot. Running 300 runs without a single neck drop with an elite group, or get one with a half-wiped group upon your first try. Your efforts and time spent sometimes mean nothing without the luck factor.

 

Yeah, I know the legendary neck is supposed to be rare and hard to find, but there are many ways to ensure its rarity. First is RNG loot, like what we have now. Second is achievement vendor: if you can run 300 runs of it, you deserve it. Or just token/fragment based: you collect like 100 tokens (require at least 100 runs, providing you bid all tokens), and exchange them for the necklace. Or they can all come together, giving players more ways to get a neck, either with luck, with efforts, or with money.

[Jackiesaysya]

If only everyone with massive entitlement issues left the game.

Some things are better when their worked for and earned vs just being handed out like candy.

 

[JonJonPoPong]

150 runs and not seeing it is unacceptable. That is way too low of a drop rate.

You also need to realize that 1 run of a dungeon is 4 to 6 runs since 4 to 6 people run it.

That is a really bad drop rate given that its a very mechanic heavy dungeon to start with.

If you have a group of 4 friends and you agreed to run the dungeon till you each got 1 necklace, at that rate you would be looking 400-600 runs of the dungeon...

That is stupid.

 

[Alysha Hawkeye]

3 hours ago, JonJonPoPong said:

150 runs and not seeing it is unacceptable. That is way too low of a drop rate.

You also need to realize that 1 run of a dungeon is 4 to 6 runs since 4 to 6 people run it.

That is a really bad drop rate given that its a very mechanic heavy dungeon to start with.

If you have a group of 4 friends and you agreed to run the dungeon till you each got 1 necklace, at that rate you would be looking 400-600 runs of the dungeon...

That is stupid.

 

Let convert it to time. Let say one run costs you 30 minutes. So essentially, you just waste 4,500 minutes for 150 runs. Let say you play devote three hours, hence 180 minutes, for running the tomb per day, then you need to run it for 25 day straight. Still, too bad, no loot for you, cuz RNGesus said so, or cuz you forgot to do the ritual to respect Lootcifer.

 

Meanwhile, let convert it into a token-based loot, where you get a token per run from dynamic chest, and 1-2 extra tokens from 4-man loot. You only need to run 6-man for 100 runs, thus 3,000 minutes, to get the neck. If you run 4-man and get lucky, you can get it in less number of runs, and you can steadily see your progress. Even luckier, you can get the whole necklace, and can use the tokens to exchange for things like the 20g EXP legendary gem.

[Grimoir]

So....
let me give Tera as example.

 

There you have a higher chance to drop the loot but you are limited to 2 dungeon entries per day (4 if you use a reset with 6h cooldown).

 

Would you rather have that?

[Nattia]

3 hours ago, Grimoir said:

So....
let me give Tera as example.

 

There you have a higher chance to drop the loot but you are limited to 2 dungeon entries per day (4 if you use a reset with 6h cooldown).

 

Would you rather have that?

yes, that's very nice, because you can reset the entries no problem. stuff for resets was easily obtainable, I had a lot of them unused in my inventory and had the best gear for my toon, at good pace, without frustration.

[KzE]

5 hours ago, Grimoir said:

So....
let me give Tera as example.

 

There you have a higher chance to drop the loot but you are limited to 2 dungeon entries per day (4 if you use a reset with 6h cooldown).

 

Would you rather have that?

Tera is good. Why? Because there are 3 gear sets at every content patch. If you new, you can have the 1st one for free. If you not, you probably have it because its the 2nd gear set from previuos update. So you can start the content without grind. The 2nd gear is easily obtainable, its like 1 month even if you are casual. You can do everything with that gear. If you grind more, you can go for the best gear.

 

http://www.polygon.com/2016/4/29/11539102/gaming-stats-2016-esa-essential-facts

 

" Online gamers spend 6.5 hours a week on average playing with others. "