Jump to content
Forums

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 81
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

its always the class that you don't play

Sighs ... all this talk about best DPS... really thisGame got other stats only for decoration... thx to the awesome Gamedesign of every stupid Boss got Enrage Timer ... Listen... u cant say for s

@Shiune dude i dont want to quote all of that hogwash u have there. but bro i think u got ur shit mixed up.... dps != dph. they are 2 very different concepts.... dps = damage per second while dph = da

1 hour ago, ChimChim said:

I'm pushing 18~19k dps on my FM and thats without baleful :p Are sustaning that form of dps?

Yea, Have you seen a SIN in action on our server? Like I said I main both classes... And they are very similar DPS wise. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, ChimChim said:

I'm pushing 18~19k dps on my FM and thats without baleful :p Are sustaning that form of dps?

"I'm pushing 18-19k (dmg on some hits) on my FM and thats without baleful :p Are (sins) sustaining that form of dps?"

 

fixed it for you, and i am tired of saying this but u cannot compare the dmg u do per hit and make that the entirety of the term "dps". dps and dph are 2 completely different things and while dph does in fact calculate into dps, dps is not entirely based on dph. How many skills do u push out per second? how much dmg does each individual skill push out? do u have dot tick uptime? as you can see there is more to dps than just individual skill dmg. for example if ur someone that can only cast 1 or 2 skills per second and that 1 or 2 skill does 18k and 19k dmg per hit then wow thats alot of dmg, but what about the guy thats pushing out 3-4 skills per second thats dealing 8k,8k,10k,15k dmg per hit and has dots going off then clearly math says u wont be out dpsing that dude (baseless numbers dont take it liberally). but yeah u cant compare dph to dps, they are different.

Link to post
Share on other sites

You also can't compare theoretical DPS to actual performance. Casters will generally win long term because they don't have to chase a boss.  Melee DPS classes (Sins and now SF I guess) need to do more burst damage to be on par with a FM/WL/SUM.  You also can't look at DPS in a 20-30sec fight because cooldowns and rotation play into it.

 

To get a true representation of what class has the best DPS would require a 5 minute dummy fight using perfect rotation and execution in the exact same gear and dividing the total damage done by number of seconds from first to last hit (300) to get true DPS. This isn't possible in our current version of the game. Assuming the Devs balanced the game properly, Sin/SF and maybe BD SHOULD be on top in this situation because, again, they need to chase mobs so need higher average DPS potential to be competitive with a caster who can stand still and focus on rotation without missing hits.  Next - FM/WL should be about the same to be balanced properly, with Sum slightly behind followed by the tank classes.  You give up damage for more survivability (again, if the game was balanced properly). Then throw in Single target vs AE - A WL or BD will murder just about any other class on a 3 target fight, where a Sin/FM will murder just about any class on a single target fight.

 

Now - Throw all that out the window because in real world situations, you're dodging boss attacks, moving around to avoid AE's, chasing the teleporters, timing/coordinating CC chains, downing adds etc etc.. (assuming you're doing your job). Then throw in the massive variation in gear and ability scaling from class to class with different stats and there's no way to get a true #1 - again in real world situations.

 

In the end - Yes, DPS meters help show contribution and call out those who are slacking off, but in reality I'd take a DPS character who also does what they can to support the rest of the group than worrying about what rank they are on the parse.  Real world situations, DPS characters should all be about the same +/- 1-2K DPS depending on the fight/gear/etc. Casters will generally have an easier time at it than Melee, and in the end, if the mob dies, that's all that really matters. Play what you like to play.

Edited by Eileithia
Link to post
Share on other sites

Guys chill... I think when u compare dps there're many factors u need to think of. 

Which dungeon? FM definitely do higher dps than sin when u face bosses such as poharan, wig in bsh and mandate... Cuz those bosses move a lot, as a melee is hard to do damage all the time, Fm can just dps the boss ranged easily. (Even better if someone else is tanking ) This factor does matter a lot.

Hit dummies at mushin tower? I personally think sin do higher damage than fm when the boss is not moving such as winter mane, lair fang and Scorpio... 

Solo dungeon? I personally think sin do better than fm at soloing bosses, but it still depends on the boss move a lot or not. If u r a fm u can try solo kaari in cold storage, it's pretty hard maybe I'm just not good, when u stay close to him u don't have any block skill, when u stay far he rush to u and stun u, fm's qess cd are pretty long compare to sin.

also don't forget sin can stack 5 stacks bleed very easily all the time, which mean the boss will not heal, yet fm cant stack bleed.

conclusion: when u compare dps of two different classes there are many factors need to consider... This is just my personal opinion, no offense.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/29/2016 at 10:34 PM, Shiune said:

Are you stupid? 

 

According to the current meta in KR based on the DPS meter SIN is number 1 followed by FM and destroyers. 

 

This is the chart after the newly introduced amulets. 

Don't write smth about KR when you actually know shit about it. 

 

Here a small example how SIN dps looks like with the new amulet:

 

 

 

 

On EU/NA FM is top followed by SIN and then comes summoner, WL etc. 

I've seen this video before, it's actually neck and neck all the way thru between the sin and FM, ending with a close margin. You do realise latest amulets gave FMs a next level epic increase in damage on a skill right? Keep telling yourself sin matters above all, but it's getting kinda old now. Even with all this stuff, NA will never have the ping for Sins to be on top.

On 7/5/2016 at 2:29 AM, Himekami said:

Guys chill... I think when u compare dps there're many factors u need to think of. 

Which dungeon? FM definitely do higher dps than sin when u face bosses such as poharan, wig in bsh and mandate... Cuz those bosses move a lot, as a melee is hard to do damage all the time, Fm can just dps the boss ranged easily. (Even better if someone else is tanking ) This factor does matter a lot.

Hit dummies at mushin tower? I personally think sin do higher damage than fm when the boss is not moving such as winter mane, lair fang and Scorpio... 

Solo dungeon? I personally think sin do better than fm at soloing bosses, but it still depends on the boss move a lot or not. If u r a fm u can try solo kaari in cold storage, it's pretty hard maybe I'm just not good, when u stay close to him u don't have any block skill, when u stay far he rush to u and stun u, fm's qess cd are pretty long compare to sin.

also don't forget sin can stack 5 stacks bleed very easily all the time, which mean the boss will not heal, yet fm cant stack bleed.

conclusion: when u compare dps of two different classes there are many factors need to consider... This is just my personal opinion, no offense.

How to solo kaari lord:
charge 1: Q
Charge 2: E
Charge 3: SS
Aoe 1: ice V
charge 1: Q
Charge 2: E
Charge 3: SS

Aoe 2: Ice tab
charge 1: Q
Charge 2: E
Charge 3: SS

Aoe 3: ice V
charge 1: Q
Charge 2: E
Charge 3: SS

Aoe 4: take the hit, you can sustain it

Repeat until he's dead, takes a bit of time but it's doable. Also if you don't get q/e/ss before his charge hits you, spam that ability and you will get it off before his follow aoe, stun wears off in time.

 

Option 2

HM impact counter, super ez mode.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/29/2016 at 4:53 PM, ChimChim said:

I'm pushing 18~19k dps on my FM and thats without baleful :p Are sustaning that form of dps?

I can sustain a hell of a lot more than that per second on my sin.  I've had single hit crits higher than that 0.o

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/8/2016 at 1:40 PM, KzE said:

I prefer FMs in party over sins. FM is more foolproof.

 

 

With that logic you could say you prefer ranged over melee. 

 

As a SIN myself, I am always the last one to die in parties. It comes down to the player, not the class. 

Edited by devildawg
Link to post
Share on other sites

Sighs ... all this talk about best DPS... really thisGame got other stats only for decoration... thx to the awesome Gamedesign of every stupid Boss got Enrage Timer ...

Listen... u cant say for sure what Class is best Dps anyway and u know why?

There are the Following Factors ... wich are very Important that u tottaly ignore like some kids...

 

- Like in every Game of this Sort... Atks are Min ~ Max Random Dmg Based...

- Like in Every Game of this Sort... Atks areLuck Based on Crits... Crits can Fail even with 99% crit or 100% crit depending on Boss Crit Eva Def whatever...

- This Game HEAVY HEAVY HEAVY depend on Ping... while one player do 20 hits in 10 sec ... the other do 40... the other 60 ... wich is a HUGE DIFFERENCE IN DMG...

- Player experince and Builds... the outcome of how much dmg a Class can do... depends HEAVY on what Build the player use ... what combo ... what Timing...

- Range got this stupid advanatge that all his atks ... are like a search and destroy misslehead tha never ever miss the target once launched... meeles can miss sooo often...

- Gear ... u watch some random vidz on a tottaly other version with other SKILLS other patches... other Knowledge... and expect its same on here ? ...... dudes .... no words..

- Wich leads to... got the Player his LMB and other key skills unlocked ...? Is it fair ? is it standing or moving target? Who lag more?

 

So .... short..... before u not got a option...(wich u never will have) to have 100% min max same dmg and 100% crit rate and acc and same pierce and same skills and build and exp and ping and and and and and..... u will never have a real... comparison and u proves and NONE and u just talk crap and thin air... go breath... enjoy the Game play what u like... this dps race nonsense is a joke and the main factor about bns that i hate to the bone... have  a nice day...

Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, devildawg said:

With that logic you could say you prefer ranged over melee. 

 

As a SIN myself, I am always the last one to die in parties. It comes down to the player, not the class. 

I really like good sins in a party, they hardly take damage. The only thing is, not all sins are good. There's a high percentage of encountering a newbie player everyday. If that's the case, people will pick a newbie FM rather than a newbie sin. Since it takes more skill to dodge and dps the boss compared to a ranged dps. In bosses where they dont jump/move, i think sins will be on  top. But if you will consider all bosses including the ones that jump, move around, any skill which melees cant do damage, FM will have more damage.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/12/2016 at 0:12 AM, Choco Wack said:

 In bosses where they dont jump/move, i think sins will be on  top. But if you will consider all bosses including the ones that jump, move around, any skill which melees cant do damage, FM will have more damage.

yep, we've already established this :P 

 

Realistically, as long as the party has the mechanics down, classes don't matter. (unless ur doin 4man)

Edited by devildawg
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...
On 29/06/2016 at 2:00 PM, Shiune said:

Well youtube is a huge platform where you can find dozens of videos of other classes but i'll search them for you because i'm a kind man - all you have to do is compare them. 

 

First another assassin with 180k dps (without WL) 

 

 

Summoner is not even in the chart anymore after the latest nerf to bees:

 

 

Another stronger summoner but still far behind:

 

 

 

 

BD far behind (destroyer very stronk) 

 

 

 

Soul Fighter far behind:

 

 

 

I mean you can search yourself and find your classes with better scores but you won't find them because like i said they are NOT ON TOP! 

If you go back to my third post, you'll see that by 'as it stands' applies to our current predisposition. i.e. a patch behind Korea - NA/EU client in its current form. The actual wording I used was 'pre latest patch'. However, in Korea, what you say only holds some truth to it, and you seem to possess some inherent bias for the Assassin class.

 

If you look at the video below, you'll see Soul Fighter maintaining highest dps for most of the video (for 7 minutes) after the initial burst with buffs at the start (where Assassin, Summoner and Soul Fighter each do 350k+, much more than your 180k example), however, throughout the whole video, the lead is essentially shared between Soul Fighter and Assassin in regards to actual damage output once the initial burst is up. At the beginning, during the initial burst, Summoner also shares that lead, however, it is unable to sustain the dps of Assassin/SF and proves to have good initial burst but nothing sustainable as SF/ASS. Therefore it is logical to deduce that in Korea's current patch, Soul Fighter, Assassin, and Summoner seem to have the highest damage output at any single point throughout a battle. It's also a very new dungeon, and that video is a world first with 24-man to compare the damage meters between.

 

It's absolutely true that currently, in our patch, Assassins are junk;. FM/BD/SM/SF rule damage. Until we get Korea's patch with all of the new variables, it will stay that way.

 

Here is the video (about 2 minutes in is where the initial burst ends):

 

 

So yes, Assassin is, as per Korea's patch, doing very high dps (one of the top), however, so is Soul Fighter. In our current NA/EU patch though, that isn't the case for Assassins. And that's just the way it is, for now - no amount of salt will change that.

 

0Zt9VLk.jpg

Edited by Fat Cat
Link to post
Share on other sites

Nice damage and everything but your videos prove nothing. How does the dps tool works? Does it accumulates the total damage but shows only dps? Calculates it the dps by the time you are doing anything or does it calculate the dps by damage and overall time after start? It's a huge difference. The videos are also just examples. They don't show best players or highest possible damage or whatever. It's a nice tool but I would not bet on something I couldn't test for myself.

Link to post
Share on other sites

All this posts and videos proof nothing,  just play the class you like and feel comfortable with and favoritizes your playstyle, that's all.

 

Back to dps meters, are great tools to cmopare performances but have in mind factors like ping does alterate the results.

 

I've seen summoners and SINs that are just so good players that you would scream they nerf those 2 classes, same with KFM.

 

But yeah, your avarage summoner/sin/kfm is not that good for you to scream, so if you want to check your dps just gather up people with similar skills than you and just run a dps meter then check yourself the difference, in my party for example we are summ SF and BD myself, our dps meter indicates we are very close to each other in terms of damage and depending on boss and stuff like who handles some mechanics then I might win the dps or the SF or the summoner, there is not much difference, also our gear is not the same but very close, like me being 670 AP then the summoner is like 680 and the SF is maybe the less geared with 650 or so, anyways AP itself doesn't scale too much, tho crit damage + crit rate + AP then you get the real scale and since we mostlikely have the same cdmg and cr then a difference of 20AP does not change anything.

 

So in a resume, its hard to say which class is most overpowered but I bet SIN FM and SM in proper hands (and ping) might be the OP classes but if you don't feel comfortable on them or can't play them perfectly then you are wasting time and should play whatever suits for you.

Link to post
Share on other sites

all this pooping :D what is best dps class :D

"best" is player who comtrol class not class it self :) as fod destro/bd being lower dps don't foget both of them loseing dps for 6 sec every time they CC and grab boss, in longer fight that can be 30 sec+ and that is a lot but give party even more.

only way you can rly see true diference in dps is same gear,same hm skills,same bopae and same badge and ofc dps training pinoki

Link to post
Share on other sites

back in the days of blackwyrm it was imho a very good way to measure DPS since the boss its pretty much DPS brainafk as far as you have a good tank facing it 100% uptime the rest of people just have to kill a sitting duck that only thing he does is an AOE every 15 seconds which you can just SS out of it on any class and the fight is long enough to see who's done the damages. Problem is still the low FPS on the area and the ping difference. Prestige points you obtained from the kill are proportional to the DPS you did and on my personal experience I can say when I did like 30pp Summoners and FMs made between 45 and 55. But that's old stuff since it was level 45 with no hongmoon levels (or HM5 when it came out) and no HM Skills also.

 

Does now get balanced with more levels and skills available? Imho if your class scales with that, the others too, so basically if we put good players all together with similar gear, level and HM skills I do still think FM and Summ are probably a bit overpowered in comparison to some classes like blade master, destroyer and blade dancer.

 

Maybe NCSoft should give to all melee blue buff on a skill that is useless for PvP and that way balance a bit because if people ask in forums what classes are OP is either

 

1) They want to play the most dmg class so they are someway wanted in a party (and/or can solo stuff)

2) They want to avoid the less usefull classes in a party

 

Which in any case breaks the overall balance of the game (you just got to see in openworld which classes you find around and most people are either summ fm or wl)

Arena doesn't count into this because its mostly solo and the 3v3, but still if we would take a look its the same thing full of summoners and FMs because both are strong classes for 1v1 and even become stronger in 3v3.

Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, gakdan said:

this is little off the topic but can someone tell me why I'm pulling aggro off of a lot of people with 100 AP higher then I am?

FM LVL 43...

Either they are using skills that don't generate aggro and you're not.. or they suck, and you don't.. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Eileithia said:

Either they are using skills that don't generate aggro and you're not.. or they suck, and you don't.. :)

I play once or twice a week for may an hour at the most... I have no idea what I'm doing so it can't be me who is doing a lot of damage.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Is there aggro buff or increase skill for FM?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, gakdan said:

I play once or twice a week for may an hour at the most... I have no idea what I'm doing so it can't be me who is doing a lot of damage.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong. Is there aggro buff or increase skill for FM?

Then it's likely the first - They are using damage skills that don't generate threat as a good portion of their DPS.  Like FM Frost Palm T4F2.  Most non-tank classes have a similar skill, though some builds may not use them. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Eileithia said:

Then it's likely the first - They are using damage skills that don't generate threat as a good portion of their DPS.  Like FM Frost Palm T4F2.  Most non-tank classes have a similar skill, though some builds may not use them. 

Ahhh I c so there are skills that has like 0 threat, skills with some threat and skills with increase threat? if I got this right.

Thank you for your advise.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, gakdan said:

Ahhh I c so there are skills that has like 0 threat, skills with some threat and skills with increase threat? if I got this right.

Thank you for your advise.

There aren't that many skills with no threat. Sin -> stealth -> losing aggro, for example, at least in your level range. Fm is also one of the best dps classes atm. In most groups it is enough if you use burn most of the time to out dps the other players. In the end it depends on the people. Higher ap doesn't mean they are good or doing more damage than you. If you get aggro for a while, you are good, that's it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...