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Balefire

People quitting and then Ranting about the game.

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Just now, MsPeepers said:

I can haz banannnnnnnaaaaaaaaaaaaaa?!?!?!?!?!?!?

Sure,just take it and leave please

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4 hours ago, Balefire said:

 

Game is P2W - Nope. It just isnt. There is nothing needed to progress in the game that is available on the cash store that you cannot get in game. Yes it take longer to get it in game. Yes you have to grind stuff out rather than getting instant gratification. Toughen up and pull on your big kid pants and get to grinding if you dont want to take the fast lane by shelling out a few bucks. 

 

I just want to know when the meaning of P2W got warped.

It should be fairly literal, you pay, subsequently you win.

Therefore any item acquired by external currency that gives the player an advantage over the others who are not able to do the same.

Expending hundreds of dollars instead of grinding for a month is definitely P2W.

I realize it's hard to manage a true F2P game, but players shouldn't accept this as a necessary evil, instead of showing dissatisfaction and hoping sometime in the future some game company will get it right.

Edited by r1skbreaker

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Balefire   
2 minutes ago, r1skbreaker said:

I just want to know when the meaning of P2W got warped.

It should be fairly literal, you pay, subsequently you win.

Therefore any item aquired by external currency that gives the player an advantage over the others who are not able to do the same.

Expending hundreds of dollars instead of griding for a month is definitely P2W.

I realize it's hard to manage a true F2P game, but players shouldn't accept this as a necessary evil, and show dissatisfaction hoping sometime in the future someone game company will get it right.

P2W implies that paying gives you something you cannot get in game. There is nothing in the shop that give you an advantage that you cannot get in the game. 

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Nutrient   

Farewell threads should be against the rules - it usually is on most forums I visit because of the drama it ensues.

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4 hours ago, Balefire said:

Having to run a dungeon 50 times to get your weapon t drop because you dont want to by a key to get it after one run is cake compared to running dungeons for months and competing with everyone in your party to get the 1/1000 drop is so much worse. Let alone watching it blow up when you try to over enchant it.

Keys are always at the top of my shopping list. I tried to grind with my first toon but decided that my in-game luck is shit. Bought a crap load of keys and never looked back.

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This post is just calling for a toxic fight..

Its like "Oh look guys,I am against you and because,I am against your point of view I am bashing you here so come at me"..

Regardless of the subject,its just a post that is calling for a fight..Unethical.

 

If you enjoy feeding off other people's frustration because of bugs,lags,hacks (regardless of them being because of users or company) etc then please,do this somewhere else..You shouldn't do it at all because,everyone has the right to express their opinions but you don't have the right to play with someone's emotion and enjoy as they get more and more frustrated because,you simply "don't agree with them"..

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Balefire   
4 minutes ago, Ratatatouille said:

This post is just calling for a toxic fight..

Its like "Oh look guys,I am against you and because,I am against your point of view I am bashing you here so come at me"..

Regardless of the subject,its just a post that is calling for a fight..Unethical.

 

If you enjoy feeding off other people's frustration because of bugs,lags,hacks (regardless of them being because of users or company) etc then please,do this somewhere else..You shouldn't do it at all because,everyone has the right to express their opinions but you don't have the right to play with someone's emotion and enjoy as they get more and more frustrated because,you simply "don't agree with them"..

My post calls into question the reasoning behind people quitting the game and then coming here to talk trash about it. Nothing else. I then stated some facts about the problems with the game. Nothing else. Any toxic behavior has come from others. As you would note at the bottom of my post I wish the people leaving the best of luck. I dont hold ill will toward anyone over a game or forum posts. Too much energy for no return.

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12 minutes ago, Balefire said:

My post calls into question the reasoning behind people quitting the game and then coming here to talk trash about it. Nothing else. I then stated some facts about the problems with the game. Nothing else. Any toxic behavior has come from others. As you would note at the bottom of my post I wish the people leaving the best of luck. I dont hold ill will toward anyone over a game or forum posts. Too much energy for no return.

You are still trying. :)

No comment.

Trust me,friend,you have no idea how frustrating does it feel if your account gets hacked all of a sudden and if you  get  delays for almost a whole week while your ping is low and other games (even LOL) are working properly with no delays at all while NCsoft support tells you its your ISP then finally after 5-7 days,you get an automatic repair 600 mb and game works after..my ISP?Not to mention new crash errors since silverfrost patch etc.

If you had only one of these stuff,you wouldn't have complained any less than other people did.

 

I don't justify the actions of  all of them..

However,many of the people who complain,do it because,they wanna see a solution or a logical reason for their problem and not a solution they already heard of or tried and know of..They wanna know more details to get rid of the problem and never encounter it again.

Some others,come here to vent off because,they endured many errors in this game..Instead of trying to cool them down abit or just leave them be,you enrage them more as if they haven't endured enough already and have been loyal to game not to leave till this moment.

Fighting with them in a moment of anger can make them instantly uninstall and the ones who complain do not necessarily have to be toxic etc.

Most just endure too much and start to lose patience and trying to let company know in one way or another,they are dissatisfied with their service so they can improve it.

Even company welcomes such feedback as long as it has logic into it..

Yes the angry mob is a kind of feedback a negative one.They don't fight,they try to get to the root of the problem and see if there would be any solution that satisfies both sides.

 

However,its not worth talking about this matter anymore..You are entitled to your opinion and ideas and I am entitled to mine so there is no point in arguing if you don't see my point reasonable.

Edited by Ratatatouille

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Balefire   
4 minutes ago, Ratatatouille said:

You are still trying. :)

No comment.

Trust me,friend,you have no idea how frustrating does it feel if your account gets hacked all of a sudden and if you  get  delays for almost a whole week while your ping is low and other games (even LOL) are working properly with no delays at all while NCsoft support tells you its your ISP then finally after 5-7 days,you get an automatic repair 600 mb and game works after..my ISP?Not to mention new crash errors since silverfrost patch etc.

If you had only one of these stuff,you wouldn't have complained any less than other people did.

 

I don't justify the actions of  all of them..

However,many of the people who complain,do it because,they wanna see a solution or a logical reason for their problem and not a solution they already heard of or tried and know of..They wanna know more details to get rid of the problem and never encounter it again.

Some others,come here to vent off because,they endured many errors in this game..Instead of trying to cool them down abit or just leave them be,you enrage them more as if they haven't endured enough already and have been loyal to game not to leave till this moment.

Fighting with them in a moment of anger can make them instantly uninstall and the ones who complain do not necessarily have to be toxic etc.

Most just endure too much and start to lose patience and trying to let company know in one way or another,they are dissatisfied with their service so they can improve it.

Even company welcomes such feedback as long as it has logic into it..

Yes the angry mob is a kind of feedback a negative one.They don't fight,they try to get to the root of the problem and see if there would be any solution that satisfies both sides.

 

However,its not worth talking about this matter anymore..You are entitled to your opinion and ideas and I am entitled to mine so there is no point in arguing if you don't see my point reasonable.

I am curious if you actually read my initial post. It seems like you are trying to carry on our conversation from the post about you getting hacked. As I stated in my OP. I am all for constructive criticism. It is the hate filled posts as people are out the door that I dont understand. 

 

If you are quitting then your post is meaningless. You will not be here to see responses or change if it happens. 

 

If you arent quitting and you are raging and saying you are quitting then you are crying wolf, and hurting your cause. Because you wont be taken seriously at that point. 

 

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NN13   

So, basically, OP wants to rant about people who rants about leaving the game. Very productive indeed.

 

On a more serious note - Do you realise OP that your thread is more useless than those "leaving game" threads? At least a few of them do say why they are leaving. Yours on the other hand do not provide any type of feedback what so ever. The only thing it tries to achieve is to stop others from posting what they want to and in case someone had a different opinion than yours(like me), your thread tries to tag them as morons trying to defend other morons.

Moreover, you basically want people to stop posting "leaving game" threads. But guess, what...They do not care, and rightfully so. Just as you said that people should deal with bad optimizations, you should also deal with "leaving game" threads. And if you can not, "this forum is not your place" (because you know, people having optimization problems should leave the game).

 

And about the other things you said - "yes, game has optimization issues and if you have a problem, then leave". That is such a productive solution, right? Then, how about NCSoft effing declares that in the first place - That this game has optimization issues and you will have to deal with it. Why would people suffer after paying for the product?

 

Lastly, while people who make rant threads are mostly useless(some of them being exceptions), people who make meta-rant threads are worse. Go on. Keep ranting.

 

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Shukran   

i agree on everything

but

feedbacking.

 

xcept:

Yes there are optimization issues. If you cant handle it then it isnt the game for you. No harm no foul, its F2P, nobody is asking you for anything and you still get to play and for the most part you can adjust your settings to compensate and not have to deal with many at all.

 

OWPVP is unfair or unregulated - You have to put on the dobok to open world pvp. If you dont want to pvp then dont. You arent missing out on anything you cant get elsewhere. It is your choice.

 

 

first of all , allowing feedbacking and then telling users "no harm no fault it is f2p" : it is hypocrite and wrong.

 

then

 

- game is 4-5 years old. you cannot pretend users to just be quiet about it when their end-game pc suffers from bad developing.

 

 so what? try buying something in real life and suffer from same bad-developing issues.

 

- OWPVP is unfair and unregulated: then better leave it a ranged farm fest while melee classes will suck forever? why dont just give melee classes 1million golds  and leave the OWPVP content to ranged. deal. i dont care about pvp, clear. ok. but i want to do terrors, i want to gather prestige, i want to clear harvests. but , you, know. we must be nice to the ones who gave melee classes the worst mechanics to collect pve stuff in those enviroinment.

Edited by Shukran

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Travolta   
3 hours ago, Balefire said:

Never said I had a limit. I said that the grind in this game is not as bad as in others. And that it is possible to bypass alot of it. At least where weapon drops are concerned. I may be showing my age a bit here, but the grind in this game compared to games like Asherons Call, EQ, DAoC, Lineage 1 and Lineage 2 is laughable. Alot of todays gamers seem to want to log in and have instant gratification. Like pumping quarters into an arcade game. I actually think this game could use more grind. Especially in the leveling process. Being able to start a new toon and cap level over a weekend of play is way way too fast imo. It make people appreciate what they have earned in game much less than if they actually had to work for it.

Or maybe, as an older gamer myself with 28years, you should start to adapt.

Leveling is something more players hate than players love. I for myself always hated leveling, even tho I liked the game, the leveling process was putting me off to the point where I actually missed out on WoW vanilla, I just couldn't get myself to enjoy the process. Just before Burning Crusade hit, I actually managed to get 60 and started enjoying what the game really has to offer. This mentality of work for what you want is cancerous to playing games, this is something intended to be fun and not something you should work hard for, you have enough of that in real life as it is, and guess what, you know that aswel, the rewards in real life for working hard are much better aswel. Gaming is something which should take you away from work.

 

While leveling everything you do is meaningless, the gear you get you already know is utter useless and will be replaced in a couple levels. Some of us want to play the game for the mechanics/gameplay, but we really couldn't care less about the story of these Quests. I do watch cutscenes, and read/watch the bigger quests, but asking me to do hundreds of quests and read why I have to help this farmer save his little pig, please...

 

People don't appreciate lvling for weeks. Not a single one will reach max level and then feel like(unless they simply enjoy lvling), "hell yeah baby, I made it, was fun". More players will get to max lvl and feel like "finally, this shit is over, never again". Guess what? These people want to play alts too, but doing that week long lvling again? You better shot me.

 

I can only repeat this for you, even tho it probably wont stick with your mentality. This is a game, it's supposed to be fun and leisure. WORKING to earn something ingame is plain stupid. This isn't the generations getting worse and worse, this is old developers not adapting and still having that old mentality of, you want something? you better work for it "hard". Having to put in some effort is fine, you need a system where players can be better, we like to compare each other and simply be better than the next guy.

 

But going as far as you to feel like the old ways were better, where you farmed MONTHS just for ONE item, is plain ignorance. It is time for you to adapt or get left behind. I get annoyed a little when I read bs like "Hey this stuff is bad, but you know what? back in 500 years, these ppl had a much harder time". It's REALLY time you started adapting with the time, the ways Lineage etc. handeld things where you farm an item for a month only to lose it in a failed craft is insanely bad game design. Again, it's supposed to be fun with some seriousness, not go work hard to earn some meaningless ingame item. Should things be gifted? No! But players should get rewards consistently, the game should make them feel like they moved forward in a meaningful way without asking them for an insane time investment.

 

WoW understood this, players need faster gratification. It's a game, even I take the games I play serious, but it has to reward you faster than it used to back in the days. I would welcome an MMO where you could lvl to max in 1 day, or just not lvl at all. Would make for a much worse playerbase, but atleast I could play an Alt without feeling like killing myself to get to the real content.

Edited by Travolta

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Balefire   
1 minute ago, Shukran said:

i agree on everything

but

feedbacking.

 

xcept:

Yes there are optimization issues. If you cant handle it then it isnt the game for you. No harm no foul, its F2P, nobody is asking you for anything and you still get to play and for the most part you can adjust your settings to compensate and not have to deal with many at all.

 

OWPVP is unfair or unregulated - You have to put on the dobok to open world pvp. If you dont want to pvp then dont. You arent missing out on anything you cant get elsewhere. It is your choice.

 

 

first of all , allowing feedbacking and then telling users "no harm no fault it is f2p" : it is hypocrite and wrong.

 

then

 

- game is 4-5 years old. you cannot pretend users to just be quiet about it when their end-game pc suffers from bad developing.

 

 so what? try buying something in real life and suffer from same bad-developing issues.

 

- OWPVP is unfair and unregulated: then better leave it a ranged farm fest while melee classes will suck forever? why dont just give melee classes 1million golds  and leave the OWPVP content to ranged. deal. i dont care about pvp, clear. ok. but i want to do terrors, i want to gather prestige, i want to clear harvests. but , you, know. we must be nice to the ones who gave melee classes the worst mechanics to collect pve stuff in those enviroinment.

I never said dont give feedback. I said that I encourage feedback, as long as it is useful. I acknowledge that the optimization is not optimal (see what I did there :) ) But my point stands. It is a F2P game. You can only expect a company to put so much effort into a game that they give away. If you want to see actual effort put in to making customers happy then you would need to play a game that is pay to play only. 

 

In regards to open world PVP. I see more Destroyers mowing through groups of oposit faction than anything else. Outside of that ranged always has and always will have the advantage in pvp. 

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NN13   
3 minutes ago, Balefire said:

I never said dont give feedback. I said that I encourage feedback, as long as it is useful. I acknowledge that the optimization is not optimal (see what I did there :) ) But my point stands. It is a F2P game. You can only expect a company to put so much effort into a game that they give away. If you want to see actual effort put in to making customers happy then you would need to play a game that is pay to play only. 

 

In regards to open world PVP. I see more Destroyers mowing through groups of oposit faction than anything else. Outside of that ranged always has and always will have the advantage in pvp. 

"It's a F2P game" is not an appropriate excuse. It's not even an excuse. Warframe, Dota 2, Smite, Team Fortress 2 and the list goes on. They are are F2P game and every single one of them is successful in their genre.

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Zel   
6 minutes ago, Balefire said:

I never said dont give feedback. I said that I encourage feedback, as long as it is useful. I acknowledge that the optimization is not optimal (see what I did there :) ) But my point stands. It is a F2P game. You can only expect a company to put so much effort into a game that they give away. If you want to see actual effort put in to making customers happy then you would need to play a game that is pay to play only. 

 

In regards to open world PVP. I see more Destroyers mowing through groups of oposit faction than anything else. Outside of that ranged always has and always will have the advantage in pvp. 

You do realize that F2P games with Microtransactions make significantly MORE money that Subscription based models do in the NA region... right? Look at NCsoft's earnings reports for the life of Aion, the moment they went F2P their income more than doubled and held steady up until post 4.5 (Like 2 years) when the game turned into a cashgrab reliant on whales. Tera makes BANK on their payment model and they abandoned the Sub mode 6 months in because it just wasn't working. The only game that can get away with Sub based gaming is WoW and that's because their playerbase is already set in stone and  never going away no matter how badly they screw up their expansions.

 

The only good thing that Subscription games ever did in NA was functionally make it US/Canada only. Everything south of Texas never played because it cost money.

Edited by Zel

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Shukran   

destroyers. u mean no status effect during spin to win?

 

i didnt know BnS had just 1 melee class. it means i play badly my forced-melee-master.

 

i reiterate: being hypocrite is wrong.

 

listening to nice, polite and well written feedback should be a "first world problem". because in KRnoone complain about something it doesnt mean it is good .

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Duzurix   

Idk man....  so many posts about whiny ppl leaving the game..so u just decided to take justice into your own hand and make whiny post about ppl making whiny posts.....to that p2w part - this is technicaly a f2p game but its definetly a p2w or p2progress aswell..there are emblems which are nessesary for upgrade and they are rare to obtain in game.-pirate siren(dead content)  ...then there is a part about weapon drop rate ...man i swear that weapon will be alwas a first part of upgrade what u get done in every stage after pirate weapons.....if u dont buy darts then u have to do a hundreds of runs to get them.   Alt unfriendly game af...they release a new class.-tons of ppl rerol and then come sfm expansion shortly after so ye tons of guys stuck with low geared char and underleveled lock walking in empty 24 mans to get upgrades done.   Take those ''leaving posts''  as a feedback or if u dont give a dayum then u can take it as a warning for new ppl who wanna check this game out.

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18 minutes ago, Balefire said:

I am curious if you actually read my initial post. It seems like you are trying to carry on our conversation from the post about you getting hacked. As I stated in my OP. I am all for constructive criticism. It is the hate filled posts as people are out the door that I dont understand. 

 

If you are quitting then your post is meaningless. You will not be here to see responses or change if it happens. 

 

If you arent quitting and you are raging and saying you are quitting then you are crying wolf, and hurting your cause. Because you wont be taken seriously at that point. 

 

lol

I am replying to this post. :)

However,I am done talking..If you don't get my point,its your freedom.

I won't force my thoughts into you.

Also although I was replying to your post here,it also was an indirect advise to you judging from your replies to others and some certain stuff you said in the post.

 

However,its not like I would care if you followed the advice or not..Its a game's forum and I am not sure if the person I am writing these posts to is even real so I am just sharing thoughts..You take it or leave it and in both cases it won't harm nor benefit me in anyway.(just like how defending the company in both its right and wrong decisions won't get you an honor badge or an Oscar,just stating a fact which I assume you already know)

Edited by Ratatatouille

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Balefire   
8 minutes ago, Travolta said:

Or maybe, as an older gamer myself with 28years, you should start to adapt.

Leveling is something more players hate than players love. I for myself always hated leveling, even tho I liked the game, the leveling process was putting me off to the point where I actually missed out on WoW vanilla, I just couldn't get myself to enjoy the process. Just before Burning Crusade hit, I actually managed to get 60 and started enjoying what the game really has to offer. This mentality of work for what you want is cancerous to playing games, this is something intended to be fun and not something you should work hard for, you have enough of that in real life as it is, and guess what, you know that aswel, the rewards in real life for working hard are much better aswel. Gaming is something which should take you away from work.

 

While leveling everything you do is meaningless, the gear you get you already know is utter useless and will be replaced in a couple levels. Some of us want to play the game for the mechanics/gameplay, but we really couldn't care less about the story of these Quests. I do watch cutscenes, and read/watch the bigger quests, but asking me to do hundreds of quests and read why I have to help this farmer save his little pig, please...

 

People don't appreciate lvling for weeks. Not a single one will reach max level and then feel like(unless they simply enjoy lvling), "hell yeah baby, I made it, was fun". More players will get to max lvl and feel like "finally, this shit is over, never again". Guess what? These people want to play alts too, but doing that week long lvling again? You better shot me.

 

I can only repeat this for you, even tho it probably wont stick with your mentality. This is a game, it's supposed to be fun and leisure. WORKING to earn something ingame is plain stupid. This isn't the generations getting worse and worse, this is old developers not adapting and still having that old mentality of, you want something? you better work for it "hard". Having to put in some effort is fine, you need a system where players can be better, we like to compare each other and simply be better than the next guy.

 

But going as far as you to feel like the old ways were better, where you farmed MONTHS just for ONE item, is plain ignorance. It is time for you to adapt or get left behind.

I think that a happy medium could be found. My point was that having everything handed to you rapid fire is just as detrimental as making it take too long. If the game offers no challenge in PVE ( otherwise known as the leveling process in this game) then they loose the attention of a lot of gamers that arent here strictly for the PVP.  There is a difference between adapting the leveling process to not be as grindy as games used to be and making the leveling process into a joke. 

 

Out of curiosity what games were you playing 28 years ago? 

8 minutes ago, Zel said:

You do realize that F2P games with Microtransactions make significantly MORE money that Subscription based models do in the NA region... right? Look at NCsoft's earnings reports for the life of Aion, the moment they went F2P their income more than doubled and held steady up until post 4.5 (Like 2 years) when the game turned into a cashgrab reliant on whales. Tera makes BANK on their payment model and they abandoned the Sub mode 6 months in because it just wasn't working. The only game that can get away with Sub based gaming is WoW and that's because their playerbase is already set in stone and  never going away no matter how badly they screw up their expansions.

 

The only good thing that Subscription games ever did in NA was functionally make it US/Canada only. Everything south of Texas never played because it cost money.

Oh yeah I know the F2P model makes more money. However due to the company not relying on anything other than microtransactions to make a profit they dont have to pay any attention to the people that play. Because no matter how many people complain others will continue to throw money at them. 

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Travolta   
20 minutes ago, Balefire said:

I think that a happy medium could be found. My point was that having everything handed to you rapid fire is just as detrimental as making it take too long. If the game offers no challenge in PVE ( otherwise known as the leveling process in this game) then they loose the attention of a lot of gamers that arent here strictly for the PVP.  There is a difference between adapting the leveling process to not be as grindy as games used to be and making the leveling process into a joke. 

 

Out of curiosity what games were you playing 28 years ago? 

I was a Counterstrike player for like 10+ years, I've wasted/spend a good portion of my life in that game lol. And 28 years ago, I was born, so no games ;P

When WoW came out I bought it, the first day on release. I couldn't manage to get to lvl30, I was so bored out of my mind. I tried with several heros, until I realized even at lvl15 I felt like this shit will never end rofl. Can you believe I would grow into a person who has all the heros max lvl now, I actually lvled all of them at some point except for hunter/paladin, even tho I really dislike lvling I wanted the alts :D (That lvling happened in Cata+MoP, not in Vanilla, only my Rogue reached max in Vanilla!)

 

Even tho I had the game since release, I managed to reach 60 before the Addon got released and really missed out on so many good things when you listen to the players. Everyone is praising how awesome WoW vanilla was, I never really got to enjoy that bcause the lvling process was so insane for me. It was work for nothing else, than the privilege to participate in the real game, the end game. I did enjoy my time endgame, so me not beeing an MMO player might not be completely the case I guess?

 

I'm the guy who then spend days to max his crafts doing nothing than hour long ore farming lol. It's not like I was lazy, atleast I don't think I was lazy, I didn't enjoy that either but somehow I still did it since it had to be done. I had no issue working for my gear or an advantage no matter how small it was, but leveling is something I hate to this day, it's simply a waste of time to me. I wanted to go for R14 aswel, was it R14?, think about the insane time investment that was. I never got to it, since the Addon came out, I was too late to the party. Today I'm really glad I was too late. Investing the amount of effort for a rank no one gives a fk about was plain stupid, but I wanted to do it haha.

 

To be honest, I like to run a dungeon and get what I want right away. It doesn't feel like I don't appreciate it, I appreciate my time more than I did back then. It's funny when I say that even tho I still invest stupid amounts of time just to farm Gold in this game lol. No idea if what I say makes sense, I feel like I'm a casual and a hardcore to a degree. It is not easy for a developer to satisfy demands like this, it pretty much boils down to fast gratification they need to keep going. Think about BnS now, new content gets released pretty fast. To the point where it feels like why work for your gear if it's meaningless in a couple of weeks again anyway. It's not easy to find a middle way, but BnS will not do that, you know that. BnS is rushing out everything now to catch up, after that the game will turn into massive amounts of work, this is not the time for a game like that anymore. If you implement something you have to work hard for, it simply needs to be fun, it can't just be hard for the sake of earning whatever it is by torture in something you invest time to have fun in, hard times to be a developer.

Edited by Travolta

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Balefire   
6 minutes ago, Travolta said:

I was a Counterstrike player for like 10+ years, I've wasted/spend a good portion of my life in that game lol.

When WoW came out I bought it, the first day on release. I couldn't manage to get to lvl30, I was so bored out of my mind.

 

Even tho I had the game since release, I managed to reach 60 before the Addon got released and really missed out on so many good things when you listen to the players. Everyone is praising how awesome WoW vanilla was, I never really got to enjoy that bcause the lvling process was so insane for me. It was work for nothing else, than the privilege to participate in the real game, the end game. I did enjoy my time endgame, so me not beeing an MMO player might not be completely the case I guess?

 

I'm the guy who then spend days to max his crafts doing nothing than hour long ore farming lol. It's not like I was lazy, atleast I don't think I was lazy, I didn't enjoy that either but somehow I still did it since it had to be done. I had no issue working for my gear or an advantage no matter how small it was, but leveling is something I hate to this day, it's simply a waste of time to me. I wanted to go for R14 aswel, was it R14?, think about the insane time investment that was. I never got to it, since the Addon came out, I was too late to the party. Today I'm really glad I was too late. Investing the amount of effort for a rank no one gives a fk about was plain stupid, but I wanted to do it haha.

 

To be honest, I like to run a dungeon and get what I want right away. It doesn't feel like I don't appreciate it, I appreciate my time more than I did back then. It's funny when I say that even tho I still invest stupid amounts of time just to farm Gold in this game lol. No idea if what I say makes sense, I feel like I'm a casual and a hardcore to a degree.

I hate to say this but even WoW vanilla was a joke grind wise compared to some of the games I listed. I am definitely not a fan of the grind while I am doing it anyway. But there used to be a level of pride in saying you had a level capped character in the old MMO's, because it wasn't easy to do. And there was generally only a small part of the player base that had made it to cap. There was no such thing as a race to get to cap because you were talking about months of play not hours to get there.

 

But that all went out the window when companies started with the F2P model. Its fast food MMO. Get it quick, get it now. Burn out and move on. The company doesnt care if you leave because they dont depend on your subscription to make money. Every new player that decides to try the game is likely to spend at least a few bucks. Thats their income. And as they did no western only development for the game, just recycled the content from their other markets they are not out any cost other than the hardware to run it on and a few people to over see it. Its all icing on the cake so to speak. 

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