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Warlock 100% broken in PvP? Opinions?


Myra

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1 hour ago, KaliatNess said:

Bad Argument, many players look out for tech chases and retreats.  The only difference between players is in playstyle of the classes and proficiency at the class.  Wl is not the exception.  

 

Yes, we do nothing special.  We survive by being fully offensive and watching and predicting the other player.  But it's not as easy as you make it sound.  Yes, because of the limited escapes, tab, SS, and Z (4 if you count repulse resist, but it's pointless in pvp),  arguably it would make a Warlock player very proficient compared to other classes, but it is very unforgiving class as well.  There is hardly any room for mistake, and many WL players (including me) are dismayed or unsettled by this fact.  

 

You already know how the class plays, so no need to go into mechanics and whatnot.  And since you play other classes, I am sure you aware of how pvp matches can turn on a dime.  Not so much for WL, where it's literally all or nothing.  

 

IMO,  what WL needs is only one more evade/resist, and the class would be well matched against the others.  

 

Especially if leech misses, 45sec to wait wich are extream deadly for the WL....

And timewarp is pretty easy for the enemy. He can at least always escape a part of the damage.

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We re buffed at the next patch.

 

Warlock

Repulse (F)
– Repulse Tier 3 Stage 3 can be used during Quell (1)
– Tier 3 Stage 3: CD is changed to 24sec
– Upon successful block with Quell, Repulse Tier 3 Stage 4 can be used.
– Tier 3 Stage 3/4: add effect – Dragoncall (4) and Wingstorm (V) can be cast instantly.

Bombardment (RB)
– Tier 3 Stage 1: add effect – reduce Focus consumption by 1 when attacking knockdown, stunned, dazed, floated target.

Onrush (Q)
– Tier 2 Stage 2: add effect – reduce CD by 6 sec on hit

Fall In (E)
– Tier 1 Stage 1: increase movement speed by 30% for 3sec
– Tier 2 Stage 1: Familiar is immune to damage and status effect
– Tier 2 Stage 2: dispel Immobile status and increase movement speed by 60% for 3sec; CD is changed to 9 sec

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22 minutes ago, Sygmaelle said:

We re buffed at the next patch.

 

Warlock

Repulse (F)
– Repulse Tier 3 Stage 3 can be used during Quell (1)
– Tier 3 Stage 3: CD is changed to 24sec
– Upon successful block with Quell, Repulse Tier 3 Stage 4 can be used.
– Tier 3 Stage 3/4: add effect – Dragoncall (4) and Wingstorm (V) can be cast instantly.

Bombardment (RB)
– Tier 3 Stage 1: add effect – reduce Focus consumption by 1 when attacking knockdown, stunned, dazed, floated target.

Onrush (Q)
– Tier 2 Stage 2: add effect – reduce CD by 6 sec on hit

Fall In (E)
– Tier 1 Stage 1: increase movement speed by 30% for 3sec
– Tier 2 Stage 1: Familiar is immune to damage and status effect
– Tier 2 Stage 2: dispel Immobile status and increase movement speed by 60% for 3sec; CD is changed to 9 sec

Repulse (F) - nerf.

Bombardment (RB) - useless change.

Onrush (Q) - small buff.

Fall In (E)  - good buff.

 

So, our party SUPPORT Warlock may now run from mobs.

 

 

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Well, it's the parry repulse that got changed, not the block one, and the added instant cast dragoncall/wingstorm bonus might actually make the parry block path viable for PvP. RB change is somewhat decent I guess... Spamming it on knocked up enemies in 1v1 and 3v3 works quite well seeing as it's instant cast and recovers 1 focus on crit as well (therefore potentially costing 1 focus only, instead of 3). It's decent burst DMG. HM one is gonna cost no focus at all though (on CCed target). Better than nothing I guess...

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Yeah we can also use pet's stun twice now (unless they changed that too). It might have more changes through time since it's current TL state. Also, our most important skills for pvp aren't available just yet. You can defo keep up tho, imho a good WL can reach diamond and then have casual fun, so to speak

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On 8.4.2016 at 4:51 AM, KaliatNess said:

Bad Argument, many players look out for tech chases and retreats.  The only difference between players is in playstyle of the classes and proficiency at the class.  Wl is not the exception.  

 

Yes, we do nothing special.  We survive by being fully offensive and watching and predicting the other player.  But it's not as easy as you make it sound.  Yes, because of the limited escapes, tab, SS, and Z (4 if you count repulse resist, but it's pointless in pvp),  arguably it would make a Warlock player very proficient compared to other classes, but it is very unforgiving class as well.  There is hardly any room for mistake, and many WL players (including me) are dismayed or unsettled by this fact.  

 

You already know how the class plays, so no need to go into mechanics and whatnot.  And since you play other classes, I am sure you aware of how pvp matches can turn on a dime.  Not so much for WL, where it's literally all or nothing.  

 

IMO,  what WL needs is only one more evade/resist, and the class would be well matched against the others.  

 

I wanted to write a long reply to this, but I changed my mind and want to make it short:

Agreed, but the necessity of doing complicated stuff like tech chases or being really mindful with your escape is almost none. Tab the first thing that hits you: GG. You just activate your 5 hit immunity, get siphon off, activate time distortion and the game is over. At least this is my perspective as a Destro, I am probably just blind. Some matchups sure are extremely hard for you like for example FM, but honestly... Comparing the mechanics you need to play Warlock compared to all other classes, only Summoner is really easier, but no one else.
I am not saying it is an easy class overall, in BnS every class is hard to a certain extent, especially in higher ranks, but Warlock is relatively seen not that hard.

-Ra9eQuit

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56 minutes ago, Ra9eQuit said:

I wanted to write a long reply to this, but I changed my mind and want to make it short:

Agreed, but the necessity of doing complicated stuff like tech chases or being really mindful with your escape is almost none. Tab the first thing that hits you: GG. You just activate your 5 hit immunity, get siphon off, activate time distortion and the game is over. At least this is my perspective as a Destro, I am probably just blind. Some matchups sure are extremely hard for you like for example FM, but honestly... Comparing the mechanics you need to play Warlock compared to all other classes, only Summoner is really easier, but no one else.
I am not saying it is an easy class overall, in BnS every class is hard to a certain extent, especially in higher ranks, but Warlock is relatively seen not that hard.

-Ra9eQuit

Leech can get blocked or evaded with SS or a resist skills or whatever i believe it is too easy to mess up with WL 
but i do agree destroyer can be an easy piece of cake for WL 
If we talk about mechanics .... more than mechanics i would say knowledge and timing

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5 minutes ago, Ra9eQuit said:

I wanted to write a long reply to this, but I changed my mind and want to make it short:

Agreed, but the necessity of doing complicated stuff like tech chases or being really mindful with your escape is almost none. Tab the first thing that hits you: GG. You just activate your 5 hit immunity, get siphon off, activate time distortion and the game is over. At least this is my perspective as a Destro, I am probably just blind. Some matchups sure are extremely hard for you like for example FM, but honestly... Comparing the mechanics you need to play Warlock compared to all other classes, only Summoner is really easier, but no one else.
I am not saying it is an easy class overall, in BnS every class is hard to a certain extent, especially in higher ranks, but Warlock is relatively seen not that hard.

-Ra9eQuit

I do definitely agree that warlock isn't that difficult, but holy cow... Getting siphon off is easy... Except it gets resisted by absolutely everything - player out ranges you, uses counter, blocks, Q/E, spins OR sees the animation and stuns/dazes/KD you. If you get CCed/interrupted during leech cast in goes on 45 sec CD, so you have to watch your opponent very carefully.  It's actually possible to react quick enough and pop your def/ss/q/e/divine veil/etc once you see the warlock's leech animation's start, so even when the warlock has an open frame to cast it, it doesn't guarantee a 100% land.

When you use timewarp every single opponent is going to run/SS/pop immunity/etc. A single SS can be enough to escape timewarp in some cases . You do have to make sure that your opponent does not have anything left, and while some classes only need to bait tab, warlock needs to bait everything... Including divine veil/petal storm, frost armor, and some other skills. When fighting against BD/FM, good ones are going to grab and throw you away as soon as you timewarp, rendering your timewarp useless.
 

Another funny thing I noticed mostly vs spin classes and assassins. They start running from you as soon as you summon your thrall so you have to chase them hard. AND then there is the problem with E. If you use it to get thrall near you (e.g the opponent ran to a corner and pet is now miles away) timewarp glitches 50%+ of the time and gets cast at the wrong location (where the thrall was before) or ends up 'flying' in the air sideways (oh joy) and you don't get its buff. So you gotta be aware of the glitches as well.


I think a distinction should be drawn between the class being easy and the class having an easy time against others, as I do mostly agree with what you said before.
 

Lastly, it's also worth mentioning that warlock counters destroyer.


 

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1 hour ago, Myra said:

I do definitely agree that warlock isn't that difficult, but holy cow... Getting siphon off is easy... Except it gets resisted by absolutely everything - player out ranges you, uses counter, blocks, Q/E, spins OR sees the animation and stuns/dazes/KD you. If you get CCed/interrupted during leech cast in goes on 45 sec CD, so you have to watch your opponent very carefully.  It's actually possible to react quick enough and pop your def/ss/q/e/divine veil/etc once you see the warlock's leech animation's start, so even when the warlock has an open frame to cast it, it doesn't guarantee a 100% land.

When you use timewarp every single opponent is going to run/SS/pop immunity/etc. A single SS can be enough to escape timewarp in some cases . You do have to make sure that your opponent does not have anything left, and while some classes only need to bait tab, warlock needs to bait everything... Including divine veil/petal storm, frost armor, and some other skills. When fighting against BD/FM, good ones are going to grab and throw you away as soon as you timewarp, rendering your timewarp useless.

I am aware of that, but Siphon isnt hard to land, lets be honest. The cast time is 0.1 dude. No way you can get actually interupted on purpose. Of course the other player will try to resist it, but it is 100% landed after a retreat or during a spin or after waiting for their I-frame. It really is one of the easier mechanics in the game.
And escaping Time Warp? Good joke m8, a good warlock just stands in the middle of the arena or pressures the enemy into a corner and if they SS, that will be a free soul shackle snare and you can unleash hell on them. AND DONT FORGET THE LOVELY BASTION SPAM, oh yeah... BEST SKILL. You are legit invincible during the whole Time Warp + 5 secs after its over...

Idk why I am still argueing but whatever, game is pretty much balanced.

-Ra9eQuit

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1 hour ago, Ra9eQuit said:

I am aware of that, but Siphon isnt hard to land, lets be honest. The cast time is 0.1 dude. No way you can get actually interupted on purpose. Of course the other player will try to resist it, but it is 100% landed after a retreat or during a spin or after waiting for their I-frame. It really is one of the easier mechanics in the game.
And escaping Time Warp? Good joke m8, a good warlock just stands in the middle of the arena or pressures the enemy into a corner and if they SS, that will be a free soul shackle snare and you can unleash hell on them. AND DONT FORGET THE LOVELY BASTION SPAM, oh yeah... BEST SKILL. You are legit invincible during the whole Time Warp + 5 secs after its over...

Idk why I am still argueing but whatever, game is pretty much balanced.

-Ra9eQuit

You suggested me to watch Carthh's vids, but I think you haven't watched them yourself if you think that escaping timewarp or surviving it without losing much HP is impossible, even against very skilled warlocks. I'm solely pointing out that it's not a 100% bulletproof skill like you make it sound. Anyway, imo timewarp is fine the way it is apart from the glitches. As for leech, it does indeed say that it's cast is 0.1sec, but in reality it is around 0,5-1sec, you can test it (the timeframe between starting to cast it and the moment when it lands on the enemy). Spin does resist leech during deflect. Bastion does not make you immune to p.grab and some other CC. I do think that balance is mostly fine as well.

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I'm playing for first time Blade and Soul, and my character is warlock. I promoted to gold  in arenavery fast i say. Yes he have good dmg but with very low resits compared with other clases. Sometimes i stay only in stun and i loose more than 1/2 hp very easy. Compared with other clases you need a looot of skill to be good with it. for me personaly to beat FM or asasins i need a lot of luck or a very unskiled enemy. In my opinion compared with other clases wl is the most unbalanced

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2 hours ago, 821031_1452549945 said:

Follow the crowd: reroll ranged for pve, reroll destro/sin/sum (idk whatever) for pvp and play classes you dont like 8D Profit over fun

Thats the fact but over short or long the people will quit....

The next patch is rdy and i only get angry on this patch speed...

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This is a PVP topic about WL but ppl can't stop talking about the PVE aspect :DDD

Anyway, I'm praying since I started to play this class to see in a future patch A *cricket*IN BUTTON TO CONTROL THE AA OF THE PET ! Cmon this dumb pet is totally frustrating me ! When I see a decoy I stop and I pray for the pet to stop attacking even after using my E but 80% it's a NOPE and a free decoy, dandelion, freeze, etc etc :( 

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Heya,

actually if a Destro knows how to play vs Wl it becomes a quit close match 50/50% winchance... destros who dont know how to play vs us often die in less then 10sec beeeing attracted to the shiny time disortion like moths to fire and burn down on it.

The uppcomming buffs will make Sin and BD lil easier but our poblem remains the same, wich is (at least for me) the low hp/passive def stats, weak def cds and BUGS/GLITCHES.

If i fail a single cc break almost every class got a combo that can drop me from 100% to 0% hp... and dont tell me how "strong" our Z is, as soon ppl realise how to get off 5 attacks as fast as possible on you it basicly becomes a 2sec immunity against almost every class.

Worst Bugs/Glitches atm (from my perspective) :

(Nr 1) : Time Disortion not going of though you HAMMER your tab key...sometimes i have to stop moving for a sec and do nottin to make it work...and when it goes off in 1-2 out of 10 uses i stand in it and nothing happens or its located where my pet used to be 5sec ago OR it is wierdly placed midair/non horizontal and i cant get inside it hitbox wise to get its buff...

(Nr 2) : Summon Thrall also seems to bug quit often if you get stunned while casting/immediatly after summoning your thrall goes on cd but isnt summoned... if a spell gets canceled by stun how can it go on cd ?? dont have this issue on any of my other classes.

(Nr 3) : THe Q charge of the pet misses like 51% of it useses as long enemy walks sideways or away from pet, the animation is too *cricket*in slow. On my kfm or BD i hardly ever miss a charge except enemy is still sprinting/jumping...

(Nr 4) : Sanctum is  totally bugging out aswell it seems if you move or jump inside of it you can lose its benefits... if i knock a FM 10meter into air inside his dome and he s actually above the animation of it, he still has the buff...if both my feet dont touch the sanctum simultaniously i dont have the buff...how does a Bm get an enemy airborne that cant be stunned/dazed/knocked down ? he CANT but it happens to me all the time...

(Nr 5) : Syphon... i understand how ppl avoid that skill and im perfectly fine with failing if i missused it and it gets bloked/iframed whatever... what i don get is that you can still cancel the skills effect AFTER you got hit by it by  getting out of range/ pushing the Wl out of range or putting the wl in several animation states where he cant recieve the returning syphon animation... compared to ANY other class mechanic i know this is rdicolous complicated and inconvinient (well for the WL not his enemys)

(Nr 6) : Maybe arguable but Dragoncall/Helix...srsly.. DraCall animation takes forever and if someone gets out of rang PUFF 2sec animation does nothing. You cant use this skill against half the classes if they know how to avoid it. Helix on the other hand (like your F ) should hit instantly BUT if you (or your opponent) is lagging a lil i have seen it do nothing ( F aswell but happens waaaaays less often)

(Nr 7) : Not really a bug and maybe fixed with upcomming buffs but the Thralls survivability is shit (especially compared to the Sums cat) Destros/Sins can just enrage kill a thrall in like 4-5sec, Sums take 7-8sec and against FMs (wich are unbearable as WL anyway) the Thrall often dies due losing 50% of its hp in AOE then quicknuke on him... and yeah i use Def Thrall vs those classes...

 

I only reached plat last season (class rank 191 EU... wich is a joke any other class you porpably wouldnt be top 200 on low diamond ) but i can compare my WL (main) to my twinks (kfm/BM) and i dont say Wl is weaker BUT WAYS HARDER to play and way more bugged. I litterly have Zero bugs i can complain about on Kfm/BM.  Wl is just very very very punishing since ONE FAIL can drop you from nearly 100% to 0%... and that on a class that basicly got worst def cds and by far worst hp/passive def stats...

Few people prove that WL is viable if played (nearly) perfectly but the effort you have to put in is a lot compared to other classes. i never cared for my twinks pvp rank and only did dailys pvp Qs on them but nearly reached plat aswell (though i find myself quit sucky on those toons)

 

Greetz, PEST

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49 minutes ago, Pestiferius said:

Heya,

actually if a Destro knows how to play vs Wl it becomes a quit close match 50/50% winchance... destros who dont know how to play vs us often die in less then 10sec beeeing attracted to the shiny time disortion like moths to fire and burn down on it.

The uppcomming buffs will make Sin and BD lil easier but our poblem remains the same, wich is (at least for me) the low hp/passive def stats, weak def cds and BUGS/GLITCHES.

If i fail a single cc break almost every class got a combo that can drop me from 100% to 0% hp... and dont tell me how "strong" our Z is, as soon ppl realise how to get off 5 attacks as fast as possible on you it basicly becomes a 2sec immunity against almost every class.

Worst Bugs/Glitches atm (from my perspective) :

(Nr 1) : Time Disortion not going of though you HAMMER your tab key...sometimes i have to stop moving for a sec and do nottin to make it work...and when it goes off in 1-2 out of 10 uses i stand in it and nothing happens or its located where my pet used to be 5sec ago OR it is wierdly placed midair/non horizontal and i cant get inside it hitbox wise to get its buff...

(Nr 2) : Summon Thrall also seems to bug quit often if you get stunned while casting/immediatly after summoning your thrall goes on cd but isnt summoned... if a spell gets canceled by stun how can it go on cd ?? dont have this issue on any of my other classes.

(Nr 3) : THe Q charge of the pet misses like 51% of it useses as long enemy walks sideways or away from pet, the animation is too *cricket*in slow. On my kfm or BD i hardly ever miss a charge except enemy is still sprinting/jumping...

(Nr 4) : Sanctum is  totally bugging out aswell it seems if you move or jump inside of it you can lose its benefits... if i knock a FM 10meter into air inside his dome and he s actually above the animation of it, he still has the buff...if both my feet dont touch the sanctum simultaniously i dont have the buff...how does a Bm get an enemy airborne that cant be stunned/dazed/knocked down ? he CANT but it happens to me all the time...

(Nr 5) : Syphon... i understand how ppl avoid that skill and im perfectly fine with failing if i missused it and it gets bloked/iframed whatever... what i don get is that you can still cancel the skills effect AFTER you got hit by it by  getting out of range/ pushing the Wl out of range or putting the wl in several animation states where he cant recieve the returning syphon animation... compared to ANY other class mechanic i know this is rdicolous complicated and inconvinient (well for the WL not his enemys)

(Nr 6) : Maybe arguable but Dragoncall/Helix...srsly.. DraCall animation takes forever and if someone gets out of rang PUFF 2sec animation does nothing. You cant use this skill against half the classes if they know how to avoid it. Helix on the other hand (like your F ) should hit instantly BUT if you (or your opponent) is lagging a lil i have seen it do nothing ( F aswell but happens waaaaays less often)

(Nr 7) : Not really a bug and maybe fixed with upcomming buffs but the Thralls survivability is shit (especially compared to the Sums cat) Destros/Sins can just enrage kill a thrall in like 4-5sec, Sums take 7-8sec and against FMs (wich are unbearable as WL anyway) the Thrall often dies due losing 50% of its hp in AOE then quicknuke on him... and yeah i use Def Thrall vs those classes...

 

I only reached plat last season (class rank 191 EU... wich is a joke any other class you porpably wouldnt be top 200 on low diamond ) but i can compare my WL (main) to my twinks (kfm/BM) and i dont say Wl is weaker BUT WAYS HARDER to play and way more bugged. I litterly have Zero bugs i can complain about on Kfm/BM.  Wl is just very very very punishing since ONE FAIL can drop you from nearly 100% to 0%... and that on a class that basicly got worst def cds and by far worst hp/passive def stats...

Few people prove that WL is viable if played (nearly) perfectly but the effort you have to put in is a lot compared to other classes. i never cared for my twinks pvp rank and only did dailys pvp Qs on them but nearly reached plat aswell (though i find myself quit sucky on those toons)

 

Greetz, PEST

Good post. This shoud reed this Destroyer called RageQuit, who thinks WL is the easiest class XD.

Scummoner yes but WL is completely the other side!

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I currently only have a very low FM besides my main 48 lvl warlock..  All was said above is correct down to the last word; its very hard to keep up with the other classes much too long cooldowns, no defense, no way of evading anything, locked skills which can not be accesed without paying enourmous amounts of money..    When I see a KFM hitting strong and so fast its more than clear how far behind WL are.   I have put so much money and time and it just feels such an incomplete broken class.    What in god's name is NCSOFT thinking?

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On 14.4.2016 at 8:08 PM, Val22 said:

I currently only have a very low FM besides my main 48 lvl warlock..  All was said above is correct down to the last word; its very hard to keep up with the other classes much too long cooldowns, no defense, no way of evading anything, locked skills which can not be accesed without paying enourmous amounts of money..    When I see a KFM hitting strong and so fast its more than clear how far behind WL are.   I have put so much money and time and it just feels such an incomplete broken class.    What in god's name is NCSOFT thinking?

The answer on your question is " $$ "

Want to troll us with gemsocket lost and p2w events. They don't want to fix this game. They only want your money. But if they want to go in ESL the classes should be balanced...

But they only hope to get their piece of cake in ESL. Same only for Money.

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Yes.. and you spend a lot of time and maybe some people a lot of money to have the same stats in arena with a 25 lvl character, where is the " Play hard go Pro" ? . You do "56789" Ap for what? To kill mobs faster? Maybe i'm unskiled but my gear should help me. Is just my opinion.. I played few years on a 5x Lineage server and i know what means farming and pvp. With this broken class "warlock" pvp is just something what i need to get some soulstones. It should be something fun. Damn.. is like a booring second job this game :)). By the way few days ago i saw few summoners with cheats in arena. Have fun Wl players, I go back to "work" need some golds to upgrade my gear :)) 

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