AttacKat

Too all those LAME high AP dungeon requests ...

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Nerien   

The problem is when those people are on the LFP. Last night I was trying to get into a necro-6 party quickly, so instead of waiting for a 440~460 AP party, I just pressed the button to be done with. The game placed me in another lobby and the guy upon checking my gear, kicked me out...of an LFP party.  I tried searching again and the game placed me on the same lobby 3 times again.

 

 

So yeah, it's getting annoying.

Edited by Nerien

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Anso   
37 minutes ago, Hongmoon said:

Why are you complaining about low ap players, when you can't even take aggro from them with your supposedly high ap?

Exist something called "Generates more threat"
A Blade Master or a KFM with low AP will generate more threat them other classes because of his skills.
And, if you read all my post, i said about the ice orbs

Like i said in my post, if someone doesn't like the requeriments from others people party, just create your own and announce, or go LFP

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Tykea   

No one ever said that you NEED a specific AP value, to be able to clear the dungeon.

I cleared all the dungeons with 380 AP with a group of friends, so what? If you know that your group will make it anyway, AP for a single guy don't matter whatsoever, but in a random party you can't be sure that your team will make it.

And don't forget that it's a lot more convenient to clear the dungeon with 500+ AP. It's way faster.

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Reyax   

Obviously it can be done with lower AP... there's no doubt. With proper group set up and knowledgeable players, AP req can be much lower and fin on time. The main issue about this topic is a lot of people think those with higher AP has a higher chance of being more knowledgeable than the users with lower AP. It's a lazy and gullible thought but that's how it is. In most cases it can be true but it comes down to individual players tbh.

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Unicorns   

In pretty sure everyone knows you dont need insane ap for this dungeons. I honestly ask for high AP parties  (480+) because i take into account ppl stupidity. So when 2 or 3 players die half way through the boss (people have such a hard time with quite simple boss mechanics), there is a high chance we can still kill the boss, because dps.
If i do it with clan members/friends, that i know are not complete idiots, idm if their ap is on the low side, because i know they can stay alive, which means its more dps on the boss than having 2-3 480+ ap dead players in party.

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reilo5   

Yeah grab a full party of 6 with 400 AP for yeti and see how that goes... AP is not everything but it's an indicator that the person did their homework.

Edited by reilo5

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Yamyatos   

I agree with both sides to be honest:

1. AP requirements are not a bad thing. You just wont beat yeti for example if most players in your group have true profane with infernal accessories. Making for frustrating runs.. 

2. AP requirements like 500+ shouldnt exist. I'd agree with 400+ for normal stuff and maybe 450 for yeti since i personally find the enrage timer much harder, but other than that i dont think that there is a reason for high AP requirements - unless you are trying to do speedruns. But in that case you most likely dont use random people anyway.

3. Everybody should be able to reach ~400 AP with decent gear that does not even cost a lot. So some AP requirements to sort out the really trashy gear are not really unfair even to casual players, just the insanely high ones.

 

Edit: If somebody says 400 AP is unreasonable, that's still basically true profane with infernal assecories, the stuff from the story til 50 and a 25 AP gem. So it's really basic gear. And it makes the runs way more fluid than having people with 280-350 on your run.

Edited by Yamyatos

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Naekuh   
Just now, reilo5 said:

Yeah grab a full party of 6 with 400 AP for yeti and see how that goes... AP is not everything but it's an indicator that the person did their homework.

400AP is still a TON better then 320AP... Sigh...  

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Just now, reilo5 said:

Yeah grab a full party of 6 with 400 AP for yeti and see how that goes...

You forgot the word "pug" before they come back and say "Well my clan and I did that and we had less than 400 AP -snaps-"

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zorz767   

Yeah, 450+ for BSH is a bit overkill heh :-) I see that too. I think those guys spend more time looking for group than they would in the dungeon if they joined normal group.

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2 minutes ago, zorz767 said:

Yeah, 450+ for BSH is a bit overkill heh :-) I see that too. I think those guys spend more time looking for group than they would in the dungeon if they joined normal group.

nah you find groups fairly quick at 450 since it is not a high AP rating anyways.

 

The point of requesting higher AP (than 400 or 300) is to clear the dungeon in a quick manner. Most of the time it's just for a daily.

With high AP groups, and no combat glitch I can clear it in 10min or less than move on to a dungeon that I want something from. (it's basically for meant for time which is why they usually say something like +450 speed run)

 

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reilo5   
8 minutes ago, zorz767 said:

Yeah, 450+ for BSH is a bit overkill heh :-) I see that too. I think those guys spend more time looking for group than they would in the dungeon if they joined normal group.

the person who's forming the party will always ask for higher AP than his current AP, this is mostly just to show off "Look I made it to 500 AP so only 500+!!"

 

bsh naryu and poh shouldn't even have an AP check... also 500+ for 50 dungeons is OVERKILL. I think It should be around 420-450. my AP is around 517 now and if I pug new dungeons..just forget it. You cant do those in cross server, from my experience it's been bad. They do no damage and freeze all the time. Scorpion and Lair is fine with cross but Yeti is problematic.

Edited by reilo5

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reilo5   
15 minutes ago, Naekuh said:

400AP is still a TON better then 320AP... Sigh...  

well that's true but 400AP/HM2 etc also means low crit/crit damage and poor knowledge of the game(not always) Other day I cross server Yeti and it was terrifying, I was max ap with 505 and had aggro 100% while everyone was 400-420 AP. It didn't work well. I prob did half the damage solo

Edited by reilo5

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zorz767   
17 minutes ago, reilo5 said:

the person who's forming the party will always ask for higher AP than his current AP, this is mostly just to show off "Look I made it to 500 AP so only 500+!!"

 

bsh naryu and poh shouldn't even have an AP check... also 500+ for 50 dungeons is OVERKILL. I think It should be around 420-450. my AP is around 517 now and if I pug new dungeons..just forget it. You cant do those in cross server, from my experience it's been bad. They do no damage and freeze all the time. Scorpion and Lair is fine with cross but Yeti is problematic.

But not always. Just today I saw person above 500 AP forming 400+ Naryu group. That was really nice to see and I totally understand such requirement.

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reilo5   
Just now, zorz767 said:

But not always. Just today I saw person above 500 AP forming 400+ Naryu group. That was really nice to see and I totally understand such requirement.

Personally I don't mind low AP, it's just the cross server you can't trust. If I form for anything and you have low ap/bad gear but talk english and contribute, then you're better than a silent 500 ap player. 

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One adverse side effect of this is that people look at these AP requirements and start dumping all their resources into their weapon, and don't concentrate on anything else, just so they're able to join these parties. They don't focus on getting a good set of soul shields, don't focus on fusing them. The result ends up being someone with:

 

True Pirate: 450ap yay

Infernal accs: 660 cdmg.....

Less than 3k crit at level 50

 

Terrible crit rate and crit damage in most cases would lead to lower dps than someone with much lower ap but well balanced stats (say, 400 ap, ~50% crit and 200+ cdmg).

Edited by OniOfTheSword

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3 hours ago, lnvisibleOne said:

The problem many people have (myself included) isn't the groups with 500+ ap or whatever, I have no issue with people making their own groups. The problem stems from the fact that its becoming more and more widespread that people think you NEED that much ap MINIMUM to stand a chance in the dungeon which is incredibly misleading. That leads to people not thinking they can do a dungeon until those stats. And guess what you'll have then? A bunch of people with 500+ ap that have absolutely no experience because they were too afraid to try the dungeon until they were so painfully over geared for it.

 

When you do use LFP (I generally do) I get a constant leave train of people that think you need a minimum ap of over 500 to complete stuff like lair 4man (i.e the easiest purple currently in the game including the 45 cap ones.). This is because of all the groups you see in the f8 window want such such overly high stats that people think it's the norm or the bare minimum to complete content we're already horribly over geared for. If the trend continues you'll keep having to boost your ap requirements further because you'll get more and more people with over 500 ap and virtually 0 experience. 

I'll 2nd this point. The issue is that people now expect this kind of high AP when they push the LFP button as well. It's a bit ridiculous when I get a ton of people who just contsantly leave when trying to form a 4-man Lair pug group. I'm sitting at 483 AP right now and I believe anything above 450+ is good enough for a 4-man Lair if everyone knows what they are doing. The issue comes when a 500+AP comes in and instantly leaves when he sees guys with 460-480AP. I just think to myself "seriously, why didn't you just make a room for 500+ or join one".

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LOLOL the funny thing is that I see alot of ppl in xserver lobby asking for 480++++ while they themselves have only 450ish AP......lol....its tough to play this game without friends or guildies. Insert other media

Edited by WayOfTheBacon

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Guild recruiting:

-Guild Name: Elitist Pricks (Rank Max, Mushin)

-Requirements (No exceptions):

Max Level,

BiS gears(Yes that means perfect SS rolls crit/acc/HP/DEF),

Max PvP Rank with no more than 10 lose 

Max Faction Rank(Ceru) and Must be able to SOLO B.Wyrm and must be able to 1 Vs 5 at all possible times.

Absolutely must be a prick,

You will be kicked outta group or even guild if you get K.O'd just ONCE in dungeon runs! Must be perfect runs for every single run!

Must be able to donate to guild at a rate of 100g per day.....for crafting stuff......

 

 

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Sunmashi   

Allow me to sum up this ridiculous topic.

`OP suggest that AP requirments are dumb and should be waved to the side as not important. So he post's a video of someone completing it with below average AP.

`The the post here and the people posting here are saying although AP requirements may seem dumb but the problem isn't with the requirement its self. Its the idea behind it.

`Sure someone with lower than average AP can do the dungeon so long as two rules apply. ONE: The person knows the dungeon and understands the rotation and can contribute to the party. TWO: The person knows how to play their class and balance between survivalbility and efficient DPS.

HOWEVER the reason for requiring a certain AP is cause people aren't going to take the time and interview each and individual player to test their ability to play their class and survival. It just takes too long. You lose gold or grind time that way. So why do we want a certain AP level? So we can lessen the need for the person to play their class correctly and compensate with better AP to DPS more. If everyone has the right amount of DPS the dungeon won't take long or have less chance of failure. Dont get me wrong, you SHOULD know your class and it's already an assumption you should be good at your class until we see otherwise. But unless we know someone personally who's good at their class and can survive without having to be babysit while having low ap, we're going to take someone with higher AP over someone who's lower AP. It's just a liability factor. I would rather run 10 dungeons without failure than to spend the time on some random dude i'm never going to see again. Waste of my time.

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AttacKat   
12 hours ago, AttacKat said:

 

7 hours ago, Sunmashi said:

Allow me to sum up this ridiculous topic.

So he post's a video of someone completing it with below average AP.

Below average AP by whose standard? High AP elitist? What is the standard that determine the min AP for a given dungeon? How is it below average AP, when the group completed it within the rage time limit, with over 20% of the time left to spare?

 

Totally missed the point and couldn't see the contradiction presented by the video against all of those high AP dungeon demands.

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Have 512 AP and 52% crit. I run dungs with random with similiar AP and its only because of time we spent here. Nothing more, nothing less. Ppl can sure run it with much lower AP, but they spent more time here. Its not about i dont trust lower AP guys, i simply saving my time.   

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