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NCSoft please no DPS meters. Dont need more elitism


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I have played both WoW where dps meters are the mainstream and TERA where dps meters are a bannable offense for extended periods of time and can assure you we are better with dps meters than for them to be taboo. The people who don't want dps meters are those who like to half-afk or absolutely will not listen regarding class, skills or gearing. 

 

I personally would like to see dps meters implemented as it is the most useful tool for self improvement.

 

I'm sure dps meters are in high demand and OP is certainly a member of the overtly vocalized minority.

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I would like a personal DPS meter.. 

I know your implementing DPS meters in other versions of the game but pls do not bring them over here. We already have enough elitists in this game, and now we have to worry about how much dps being r

Yes please, we do need it because I am sick of speculation about how I should build to optimise my class, I want to get the most out of it and the only way I can confirm what build does the most for m

11 hours ago, KzE said:

So now you guys are complaining about a korean TEST SERVER features?

Wait too long and they could end up implementing it or being close to implementing it so that peoples opinion is less likely to change anything. I'm erring on the side of not implementing it. To me I've seen more elitism in this game than previous MMOs, albeit people are still a lot more toxic in MOBAs.

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I use to use whats called a parser in other mmo's ive played. if your not familiar with it a parser records everything that for us would be in the combat log. the program would register all damage and healing you did did both to yourself or to others from the time it was activated. it allowed me to view all damage delt separated by attack and you can view total damage, damage per sec and % of total damage again by skill. so dragon call might hit hard or w/e but say it did 100k damage and 20% of you dps or w/e. it was helpful for finding what skills were the highest dps ones, and helped me tweak attack routines to use those skills that did the highest dps not just the highest spike damage. it also let me do that for party members as it recorded even their damage/healing and displayed it in the excel style sheet, or graphically if I so choose. it was very useful for tweaking my own builds or coaching friends in perfecting their own classes.

 

now for a dps meter.... as a private meter I don't see a big deal, would be helpful though not to the same extent as a parser. if likely isnty going to record any of the values and will only display a dps value at the time of the attacks. will take a lot of trial and error to find a "optimal build" that way without being able to review all the background numbers. however I still think it could be nice to know especially on those long nights were you've been grinding for what seems like an eternity, and you cant quiet remember what your doing. also could be useful if you wanta compare your dps from one class to another alts dps.

 

as a party dps meter though heres where we get the problem. as many have said before dps is not the primary thing to worry about in a dungeon. first and foremost you have to be able to survive the dungeon. once you survive you can then deal damage, most classes dps drops RADICALLY when they are tanking a boss. as a warlock player my dps drops to probably around 1/3 my normal when im taking a boss. I have no trouble tanking with my blocks and resist skills but I do miss out on a lot of damage. if people are judged by their dps alone the tanks are likely to get a bad rep. also what of classes that use skills that grapple, or in some way cc the boss in order to give party members a few seconds of free hits. im speaking of course of the bd and kfm now. im aware their still doing "some damage" with their cc skills but the damage is far and away from what they could be doing if they just went full on dps mode. but by doing those grapples and grips they increase the dps of the group and a whole and thus kill the boss faster. are we going to criticize those classes because their dps dropped and all ours increased? my warlock is using all damage boosting gems, my bm only has an amethyst that drains to boost damage, the rest are healing gems and a defense diamond to help with tanking bosses. her dps is probably half my warlocks but she fills the role I want her to play.

 

I personally hope they do come out with a dps meter I just really hope its not displayed party wide or if it is that its an optional feature for helping coach clan mates and friends. I also hope that it can be made visible or not and repositioned via the adjustable HUD.

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Based on my observations during WoW, dps meters do bring out the elitists.

 

I got tired of the person with the highest dps spamming the party chat with the dps count after each fight.  Of course, I had a meter as well and they sure didn't post their dps in the party chat when they weren't the highest dps.

 

In fact, here's a perfect example of why dps meters are a bad idea:

 

 

 

Edited by Bezerko
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DPS meters are very nice to have just dont make it public idk why people are making such a big deal out of something so trivial like seriously if its a personal dps meter and no one else can see it chill out. Theres a huge difference in elitism and wanting capable people. EX right now people asking for 500 AP+ for yeti 6 man is elitism people asking for 450+ wants capable people. Only people i see crying about elitism is people with krap gear who whine just cause they have 340 ap and get kicked form yeti pts. 

 

Its not a big deal

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People always say *OH I want a dps meter so I can see how much damage I do* not sure if they realise they are lying to themselves or what.  Not so long back I finally gave in and bought WoW I had been playing for about a week when I entered my first dungeon.  Total novice in noob gear that I had picked up as expected when you first start playing a game.  Half way through the dungeon they start talking about kicking me because I'm not doing enough damage.  I'm like are you guys for real we are in a lvl 17 dungeon and I have only just started playing the game.

 

Yeah ... Yeah of course you only want a dps meter to see how much damage you do :D

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I find it really funny how people assume stuff they have no way to know about.

If you don't want to min/max and get the BEST setup possible, it's ok, no problem it's your choice. But a lot of people do and it would be an amazing tool to have. Tbh it doesn't even have to be a dps meter, if there's a tool to track your damage so you can do extensive testing with a whole lot of different gear setups it's good enough.

Not gonna lie, a lot will look down on people with less dps, but having actual numbers to work with would be great.

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Dps meters is great idea.

 

I saw some bullshit suggestion like: "add a special dps met. which show us how much evade, def, hp, block"... what ever that bullshit was... if dps meter counts def, evasion, blocks and so on it wouldn't be called DPS (damage per second) meter as I am pretty sure all those (evade, block, df, hp..) is not damage.

 

Tanking is done by agro, agro is generated by threat from skills + overall damage (ap + crit dmg + crit chance + pierce). So its just ridiculous fail idea. The support which is every class that do less dps then everyone else, but take care of CC ing and stuff (in most case destroyers) don't need meters for how much dmg they block and so... same for kfm.

 

By being able to tell how much dmg u deal u know how good u preformed. For stupids: yes you will have less damage if you constantly dying due to failed stun or else... which automatically means if u have less damage you either spent time on ccing and stuff, or you failed that same things and spent most of it afk-rev or dead.

 

I guess logic is hard nowadays.

 

Anyway I am sick and tired of all those words like: elitist, troll, kid... and list goes... is it modern today to use words you don't know meaning of, or terms in wrong context? one has seriously to sit down and wonder that... that sound like damn phenomenon.

 

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alright so I was debating on whether to respond to this or not but by the time I got to the end of it I kinda felt obligated. so lets that this one step at a time.

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2016 at 7:18 PM, TrollOfCaribbean said:

I saw some bullshit suggestion like: "add a special dps met. which show us how much evade, def, hp, block"... what ever that bullshit was... if dps meter counts def, evasion, blocks and so on it wouldn't be called DPS (damage per second) meter as I am pretty sure all those (evade, block, df, hp..) is not damage.

ur right about the defensive "accomplishments" I don't know of many parcers that even bother to track defensive skills outside of hp healed, or I guess maybe for this game they could add a column for resist though I don't see how that would help u analyze or improve your play style.

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2016 at 7:18 PM, TrollOfCaribbean said:

Tanking is done by agro, agro is generated by threat from skills + overall damage (ap + crit dmg + crit chance + pierce). So its just ridiculous fail idea. The support which is every class that do less dps then everyone else, but take care of CC ing and stuff (in most case destroyers) don't need meters for how much dmg they block and so... same for kfm.

u honest to god lost me here. I understand tanking is the "agro" stat and that's a combination of total damage delt + any threat mods to that damage to increase said threat. what the heck do you mean by "So its just ridiculous fail idea"? as for support, I would define support as a role that actually helps someone else. im pretty sure Webster would back me up there. it has nothing to do with dps and everything to do with CC, healing, focus generation, parry (canceling enemy attack routines). anything that would give the party as a whole an advantage. no matter how small. for example summoners can be an incredibly powerful dps char and yet they are probably the best support class in the game, doom can either heal hp or recover a focus for the party. they have a root, double stun, and their cats can support a knockdown or grapple to lower boss defenses for the next 10 sec. its a fairly powerful support combo that in a party environment gives players time to "sandbag" on the boss, or drastically increases their damage, as well as either defensively maintain health, or boost dps rotations.

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2016 at 7:18 PM, TrollOfCaribbean said:

By being able to tell how much dmg u deal u know how good u preformed. For stupids: yes you will have less damage if you constantly dying due to failed stun or else... which automatically means if u have less damage you either spent time on ccing and stuff, or you failed that same things and spent most of it afk-rev or dead.

so max dps is king? should I just stop using any form of cc on my chars then because I need to focus more on higher dps skills while neglecting the fact that the boss just agroed to a poor fm that running desperate circles trying not to get squished? I will caveat with those cc skills very well might save that FM's life. to that end should we applaud the fm in this example for doing a great job by being the highest dps since that's the only measure of performance defined by your post? what about the overall drop in dps of any non ranged party member who is now chasing the boss around because the fm is running laps? should we condemn or scorn their "low performance" because they did significantly less damage? should we be upset that the run took longer because of the overall dip in dps despite the FM's commanding performance?

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2016 at 7:18 PM, TrollOfCaribbean said:

I guess logic is hard nowadays.

logic is a rather flexible term. it simple means, given a problem you use a set of beliefs to arrive at a conclusion. what u believe changes ur definition of logic and thus changes the conclusion u arrive at. by saying this quote you've basically said everyone who doesn't agree with your brand of reasoning just isn't up to the challenge of simple analytical thought processing. at what point do u realize you've gone off the path and are no longer trying to educate, or assist but are now simply looking down on and berating people for not agreeing with you? why not just spell it out and show them what you were thinking? if you present a strong argument your bound to change a few minds. I know I for one am always open to an alternate view. I hold no monopoly on reasoned thought.

On ‎3‎/‎28‎/‎2016 at 7:18 PM, TrollOfCaribbean said:

Anyway I am sick and tired of all those words like: elitist, troll, kid... and list goes... is it modern today to use words you don't know meaning of, or terms in wrong context? one has seriously to sit down and wonder that... that sound like damn phenomenon.

would u like me to define those? I don't think the terms kid or troll really have a place in this particular discussion but elitist, probably. I would have considered myself an elitist in the games I played while I used a parcer. I was not willing to settle for just "good enough" I wanted the "optimal" build. that desire to be the best and have the best, and be surrounded by the best does in fact meet the definition of elitism. if you disagree reply and leme know what you meant. elitism or the pursuit thereof can be applied to nearly anything we do in life. anything from having the fastest car to having the nicest house. if you look down on those trailer parks and turn straight to the expensive suburbs that in of itself is a form of elitism. to be clear in that example ur not going off the deep end into fanatical elitism but it is a form of it.

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I didnt like it in my WoW days and main reason why i stoped doing any groups at all outside of my guild.

If they bring it here, then i just do the same. No more random groups.

Also, people will leave because of this, seen it back in WoW, it's always sad to see some of your friends quit a game and in the end it can make you leave too.

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On ‎27‎/‎03‎/‎2016 at 3:01 PM, Devinator00 said:

I know your implementing DPS meters in other versions of the game but pls do not bring them over here. We already have enough elitists in this game, and now we have to worry about how much dps being required to join a good group? no no no. Sorry but i dont like that idea. Having come from WoW where all people ever look at is dps meters, i can tell you its a really really bad idea and all it does is breed a hostile environment where people with low dps are removed from a group. No ty

We need them so people understand that LMB+RMB is not enough DPS in Dungeon Finder when doing LFP to clear dungeons successfully.

 

Need to stop being dramatic.

Edited by Taemek
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15 minutes ago, Taemek said:

We need them so people understand that LMB+RMB is not enough DPS in Dungeon Finder when doing LFP to clear dungeons successfully.

 

Need to stop being dramatic.

FYI : OP left this game 1 month ago :)

Edited by KzE
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Besides the very few who will use it to max their skills/dps, YES this will create elitism.
Dont know how it may be implemented but should be an option to turn on/off for your own dps for self improvement or whatever.
I REALLY Dont care how much someones dps is, just Contribute to get the job done as a team and its fine.


I will laugh hard if someone would yell at me for not having enough dps, We all have different time to play to max build/stats/skills etc. I have no interest in an epeen contest.
If you want to be the best and want the best players, make your own damn elite group and leave the ones building their char and playing for fun alone.

 

Kinda a circle of stupidity...you want to get better but cant(fast enough) cause some elite/hardcore people wont help/let you into the group when they see the AP sucks compared to them, or same with PVP which is needed for stupid mats costs like soulstones.
How can the weaker players get better when you are killing them in PVP so they cant finish their dailies to get the mats and usually just give up cause of 2-3 hits ganking?
People(not all fortunately) with better equips are hindering others to get better but at the same time you want better better dps from them in party...how when they are killed on their road to OPness is stopped/slowed?   

 

Reminds me of Everquest2 days when I was the main necromancer in the best guild of the server.
Then some other new necro comes along boasting/showoff and topping the dps charts of the raids.
The leaders and I were like ok...whatever.
But it still continued with his big mouth and then I showed him what I could do with my better equips if I focussed on dps only in one of the raids and blew him away with my dps...guess what...he shut up and nvr spoke about it again.
Just dont put others down cause they have less dps/equips/skills than you have, have some RESPECT to others, we cant all be the best cause of other commitments.

 

Its my choice to do whatever I want and Im playing to have FUN and get the job done, provided that others are also willing to contribute and learn the mechanics.Its OK to fail...We have all been there.

But as Ive seen before, this dpsmeter will create more aggravation in playerbase than is necessary.

Edited by Kazeshinime
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On 27.03.2016 at 9:35 PM, Evechan said:

What is all this garb....talking ? for real ? with dps meter carebears with 10ms will complain about players with 200ms dps, get out, ppl asking 470/480 for yeti 6man lolololol, noobs without hability will aways search for more dps to beat dungeons not with hability, but with dps race, aways noobs.

They also ask 460+ ap for poharan 6-man.

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DPS meter in a game about martial arts, as if in reality damage was measurable. I don't know, it just doesn't fit in a game like this. I'm against measuring virtual penises, remembering how bad it was in Tera. only bought or no-lifed gear mattered.

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Yes to DPS meter because like most things, it's a tool. If you don't feel like using it don't do so. If you don't like seeing randoms complain about your DPS in PUG's, block them. They can't kick you anyway and there's no way to see someone's DPS from the lobby. Either way from my experience in other MMO's that had it, teammate's DPS is merely an indicator not something to go off of because it depends on class role/latency/build/burst/gear. Hence mainly it's a tool for self improvement.

 

It's unreasonable to decline such a useful addition. DPS meter or riot. 

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The people saying no are mainly the same people complaining about the groups asking for high AP numbers.

 

Do you realise that a DPS meter will lower the requirement they are asking for when they realise that AP is not the defining factor in how people perform?

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No problem with it... if dps wasnt directly linked to your ping and if the ping wasnt completely messed up on their end

Having a dps meter on dummies, only for yourself, would be much appreciated. But in dungeons.. nah.

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26 minutes ago, Nattia said:

DPS meter in a game about martial arts, as if in reality damage was measurable. I don't know, it just doesn't fit in a game like this. I'm against measuring virtual penises, remembering how bad it was in Tera. only bought or no-lifed gear mattered.

If you wanna see how toxic dps meters can make a community just try doing some end game raiding in world of warcraft. if you are below a certain amount of dps it doesnt matter if you do the fight 100% correct you will get the boot. I've been in vent with 25 other people, and whenever the group wiped it was always like ok who has the lowest dps. Ok you do sorry kick lol.

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I've used meters in WoW for years. Comparing the game design of the two games, I don't think meter fits in this game, because it doesn't use the tank/heal/dps trinity in group content. I see mechanics and utility more important here, as long as you provide sufficient damage, not max damage. Even in WoW, simply chasing meters could do more harm than good, and people who know how to use meters never just look at the dps numbers, either.

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