This class is a joke.

[duber]

So glad I came across this thread before I rolled a lock.  Too bad, I was really looking forward to another good solo pve caster class.

[csisy]

I'm playing a WL, lvl25 atm. I've planned to use her as my main, but I don't know... :/

Note, that I'm talking about PvE, not PvP:

 

Pros:

- has "the fewest" skills in the game (it can be good...)

- can deal high (but not the highest) damage

- have block spell (1)

- by default AoE spells

 

Cons:

- even destroyers have higher mobility

- thrall is a joke

- basically long cast times (I know about V-4-RMB rotation, but still...)

- the hardhitting spells have high cd and/or cast time

- you have to stand still while casting (expect RMB)

- survivability (however the block is a good thing)

 

Compared to the two other ranged class:

Summoner:

- CC: about the same amount (snare and knockdown and both can daze if spec'd)

- Damage: IMO summoner's damage is more consistent/constant

- Survivability: of course the summoner wins here

 

Force Master:

- CC: FM can be spec'd for more CC (Tab - knockdown, 2 - daze) and by default has Freeze (RMB -  while you stay in the left side; or 3) and Phantom Grip (4) and can stun frozen enemies with Impact (1)

- Damage: FM wins here. FM can just smash the buttons and deal amazing damages

- Survivability: maybe another FM win here: the freezing helps a lot, has bubble against ranged attacks (which heals the FM on resistl!), ice statue (Tab) and two additional iframe (q,e) ability.

 

So IMO the WL is a "midly-interesting and playable" character. I don't know how it works in PvP, maybe it's a beast, but in PvE it's just ... meh...

However it's not too hard to play (easy rotations, no stances, great focus management).

 

My 2 cents.

[Jixua]

warlock is very strong in korea bns so I'm going to go with "guy who has played class for 2 days doesn't know what he is talking about"

[Eremoo]

I reached lvl 45 by Thursday, the class seemed fine while leveling up because you just group up things, 2 -> V -> 4 / F but at max level now my damage is really lacking. Dragon helix critting for 3.4k or something (yes gear is a bit lacking but still). My FM with just true profane crits 2k with LB and 900 with RB that's already almost as much dmg as a dragon helix and it requires no setup or cooldown. On warlock if your V is on cooldown then you won't do any damage, it feels so bad. Maybe we're doing something wrong like the guy above me said but I just don't see it. Not to mention that they got so nerfed in PvP that I really don't even wanna bother learning the class any further. I'll stick with my FM which is good in both PvP and PvE at 50. EDIT: Not to mention I have to STARE at my UI to do stuff in PvE because of all the cooldowns and procs. I guess it can get better over time but it's annoying for now

[Blissoft]

Currently still at lvl 24 but really enjoying this class atm ( heard it gets harder after lvl 30, but I hope it doesnt get that hard :p )

 

Definitely agree that thrall is not that good since it is immobile, would say a summoner's cat is about 2-3x more useful lol.

 

Though, the :

Rmb (insta cast right side specced to the max) - Lmb (or X, or wait for 1 sec)  - Rmb  - F (rupture)

combo is very addicting! 

You are also almost always guaranteed to have enough focus to do that combo too since rupture grants you 3 focus and if your first rmb is a crit, your lmb will trigger mantra which is imo almost as good as doom'n bloom in terms of focus recovery.

 

For dragoncall I actually don't really mind it being a casting skill since the casting animation is pretty dang cool, and heck I love it so much more over the insta-cast animation that I often purposely do the casting ver instead of the latter :)

[rocdog]

3 hours ago, Eremoo said:

I reached lvl 45 by Thursday, the class seemed fine while leveling up because you just group up things, 2 -> V -> 4 / F but at max level now my damage is really lacking. Dragon helix critting for 3.4k or something (yes gear is a bit lacking but still). My FM with just true profane crits 2k with LB and 900 with RB that's already almost as much dmg as a dragon helix and it requires no setup or cooldown. On warlock if your V is on cooldown then you won't do any damage, it feels so bad. Maybe we're doing something wrong like the guy above me said but I just don't see it. Not to mention that they got so nerfed in PvP that I really don't even wanna bother learning the class any further. I'll stick with my FM which is good in both PvP and PvE at 50. EDIT: Not to mention I have to STARE at my UI to do stuff in PvE because of all the cooldowns and procs. I guess it can get better over time but it's annoying for now

 

If your DH is critting for 3.4k, then it doesn't matter what level you are.  Your gear is poor.

[Caex]

1 hour ago, rocdog said:

 

If your DH is critting for 3.4k, then it doesn't matter what level you are.  Your gear is poor.

 

gonna have to agree here at 40 and true infernal my DH are critting for nearly 11k O.o

[CycLee]

20 minutes ago, Caex said:

 

gonna have to agree here at 40 and true infernal my DH are critting for nearly 11k O.o

 

1 hour ago, rocdog said:

 

If your DH is critting for 3.4k, then it doesn't matter what level you are.  Your gear is poor.

 

Dont confuse Dragon Helix with Dragon Call. Helix is the Instantcast-version of it (the right path) Numbers are way bigger but it allows you to be far more mobile.

[Nilkemios]

22 hours ago, CycLee said:

I dont know what you mean - surely you just missed the point of Soul Shackle and Nether Blade which are instant AoE CC's and allow s you to freely cast Imprison, Wingstorm or Dragon Call (or combinations likle Imprison into instant Dragon Call(DC) or Wingstorm(WS))

Their cooldown times are too long to be reliable in most situations, and sometimes I've seen enemies use an approach skill and hit you anyways even when snared. Usually, the snare only lasts long enough to either use Imprison or Dragoncall, but not both without getting hit in the process. Imprison's last hit is the only way to trigger Dragoncall instantly so far even at Lv29, and because it requires you stand in place even longer, the instant cast is virtually pointless.

 

22 hours ago, CycLee said:

The LMB is simply meant for Focusregeneration - it's not a FM, there are other classes to that tend to rarely skill their LMB. Regarding the RMB - you can skill it the right path into instant and just cast LMB->RMB->LMB->RMB->repeat to use the LMB to get the chagreup of the RMB timed and used.

 

Even if some of the other classes rarely skill up their LMB autoattack, they at least get the option to. In addition, while the instant cast version of RMB is faster, it still feels clunky since the RMB swaps between three different variants (red, purple, and blue) depending on whether you combo it or block, and while it's swapping between them, there's a fraction of a second moment where it locks up and cannot be utilized, hampering any attempts to alternate between LMB/RMB clicking for rapid firing (along with the Mantra LMB popping up too), along with no Ranged Attack speed buffs available. It's nowhere near as fluid or fast as Forcemaster.

22 hours ago, CycLee said:

You are supposed to trigger the instant casts as often as possible to you can keep moving while firing - one easy way is to brand with Soul Shackle or a skilled (1point) Nether Blade into Leech into instant WS and/or DC

 

If you want to play way more mobile, try out the Dragon Helix-specc. it plays totaly different but you are very mobile

So far, there are only two instant casts I see : Imprison, which I already mentioned keeps you stuck in place and thus requires a preemptive snare (and even then won't hold them all the way for the Dragoncall "instant cast"), and Leech, which I don't have yet, but has a 45 second cooldown and requires you to mark the enemy first, meaning it's probably even less reliable than the snare+Imprison combo to begin with. I see no Nether Blade, so you probably mean Tether Blade (the AoE knockdown), but no instant casts from that skill exist.

 

22 hours ago, CycLee said:

Quell is for a meant-to-be-squishy-caster

So a class even squishier than Forcemaster is meant to have a poor clunky version of Blademaster's block, with the same weakness and almost none of the benefits?

 

Also, I've found that some of the Warlock's animations, like for Rupture, Mantra, and part of Dimensional Salvo/Volley, seem to hard-lock you for a second or two, meaning that if you see an attack coming in the midst of a combo and try to use Quell, sometimes it'll pop up a second late or not at all, which is very detrimental in the long run with a class this squishy. I died to bosses and taken more hits than I would have on BM or KFM because of this, and those classes aren't as squishy either!

 

23 hours ago, CycLee said:

If you want to play way more mobile, try out the Dragon Helix-specc. it plays totaly different but you are very mobile

Dragon Helix requires 3 Spectral Orbs to even use, and so far at even Lv29 there is no reliable way to maintain 3 orbs up when you want them to (except for maybe Wingstorm, and there's no reason to use that unless you have a large group of mobs around...although you'd probably die first or be stuck blocking to not die, messing up the combo.

 

23 hours ago, CycLee said:

If you dont skill it and/or control it, it is useless. but then again he can do many things like: AOE taunt, AOE stun, AOE Slow(80%!), AOE "suckin", AOE Knockback, AOE Brand, AOE Focusregen, AOE Damage Buff, Insane Burst on grabbed targets, AOE explosion, AOE CD-Reset, AOE Soulburn.

 

Even if it does all of that--and I really doubt it--you have only control over 4 things for the thrall : Summoning it, making it leap at an opponent once while summoned, returning to you (you can make it do this more than once per summon, but you'll probably stay by it anyways), and then blowing it up (at Lv45). Thus, there is no way to coordinate its attacks with yours effectively, and barring the Taunt, it won't even keep enemies off you. It can't even be a meatshield if nothing else...and summoning it leaves you vulnerable for a second, meaning you risk yourself by summoning it in a fight at all.

 

I'd rather have Q and E i-frames/dashs like FM and some special skill/attack on Tab over this thing.

[CycLee]

52 minutes ago, Nilkemios said:

Even if it does all of that--and I really doubt it--

 

This is the part which determines how much i can value your arguments - you just admitted that you either have never read te skilldescriptions or did'nt understand them.

 

This might also be the reason why i have no issues at all with mediocre gear while you seem to struggle against more then three mobs at a time... i would also fail if i would try to play me Blademaster like a KFM.

 

tl;dr: stay with you FM if you are unable to adapt a different playstyle

[Nilkemios]

And you just proved you read nothing else. Most of the abilities you mention are either one or two time use during the Thrall being active, require several skill points to access all of them (leaving little left for your own attacks, not smart when the Thrall cannot stay out constantly or by you the whole time, even when traited), and in the case of the last 3 (AoE explosion/Soulburn/cooldown reset), not available until Lv45, and thus irrelevant for the leveling process.

[CycLee]

Every class has a reasonable CD on their CC-Skills - you just ask for a broken OP class.

 

I only played Arena with my Lock while leveling so far (not even Time Warp etc) and i only lost to one player - a lvl45 WL. Now, after reaching lvl45 i can100-0 a opponent in about 5 seconds, while i bound him in place (with a defense penetrating snare) and after a skill that disabled their defens skills for 6 seconds. So all i have to do, is luring their trinket and follow up after they dashed - and even if they can still dash - i can be CC immune for 6 seconds, i can be immune to 5 attacks over 5 seconds.

 

The WL is able to easy face any boss and dungeon (except purple dungeons, they are bossible but challenging) solo. I really don't see why You are struggling as i felt the skillset as a very powerfull one. But well, when i got to a dungeon (AOE XP-grind for example) i dont kill every npc one by one - i pull the entire dungeon (or as much as possible before they disengange) and kill them in one big burst. Take boneyards (cinderlands) as an example - the enemys there have around 15k hp, which is very mch at that level - the whole dungeon population doesn't live for more then 5 seconds once i have them all pulled.

 

The Thrall CC can be used even if you are CC'ed yourself - it's somehow like a 3rd trinket in arena. ofc it's not allowed to be spammed.

[rocdog]

3 hours ago, CycLee said:

 

 

Dont confuse Dragon Helix with Dragon Call. Helix is the Instantcast-version of it (the right path) Numbers are way bigger but it allows you to be far more mobile.

 

Not confusing it, at all.   If it was Dragon Call critting for 3.4k, then he'd be level 23 or something.   Even DH critting for 3.4k works out to about 210 AP or so at 200% crit damage.  That's not close to decent gear at 45.

[Dray0s]

urgh, right NCSoft hasn't failed.

 

the Warlock was Released ridiculously OP due to a few things being overscaled into the oblivion, we have received the nerfed version of it, Now we have to await til KR Fixs it and we'll slowly get this patch which will buff the warlock to a balance, its hype Was ALWAYS aimed towards PvE as its extremely effective and needed in Dungeons for its buffs and Support.

 

KR Told u they're currently worse off, We told you it was Worse off, why was there ever a hype for Warlock PvP when everything that was stated for the entire month was they're one of the worse currently, Everything sees every level of the totem pole, currently WL Is the bottom one day it'll be the top.. if ur playing a Class Purely on the bases of it being Viable u need to start levelling 1 of every class, Nothings Never weak.

 

people say BM is bad, doesn't stop the Extremely good ones winning, Warlock will be the same for now, the Mixture of replies, tells the fact Some are doing well others arnt, Warlock isn't as bad as some are making out, its just not as viable as it needs to be.

 

[Nilkemios]

6 hours ago, Dray0s said:

people say BM is bad, doesn't stop the Extremely good ones winning, Warlock will be the same for now,

 

No. Not even close to the same.

 

Blade Master is not squishier than a Forcemaster with only a fraction of the defensive ability like Warlock is.

 

And before you bring up the block, I've seen that Quell is a clunkier version of Blademaster's block with the exact same flaw and barely any of the benefits.

 

Blademaster also isn't limited to having to stand in place for a few seconds each time in order to do big damage with as major a risk to themselves.

 

Blademaster also isn't limited to just 1 i-frame dodge (2 if you count Bastion, but it's cooldown is so long that even if you trait it for 5 potential resists, it usually goes to waste and buys you a few extra seconds at best).

 

 

[Foxy]

I feel so bummed out. The class is just so weak. While leveling it was fine but now that I'm level 45 with Awakened Siren stuff it is just so underpowered.

 

Sucks that I used Showgirl outfit and funneled all that gold only to find out that it's at the bottom of the DPS totem pole.

[RyuueLaview]

??? weak? my guildmates have lol'd at wl's auto acquiring brilliant boxes due to ridic dps. are you all using the dragon call build or something? (even then are you using it on insta cast?) have you considered looking at rotation guides? you should not be lacking in dps T^T....granted with the changes to the skills for less faceroll, you can still get by in pve pretty smoothly.  Perhaps its the lvl 45 cap that is hindering Wl's but I can assure you WL's with all current updates in Asian Bns's are not experiencing weak dps.

[Lingchi]

Warlocks seem underpowered compared to some of the others but by no means is a joke. Those having trouble are either under Lv25 or failed to learn the class and used cookiecutter skills. 

 

Right now my set up uses Dragoncall and not many things survive the first wave of attacks nor the second since orbs reduce DC time and others make it instacast.

 

The Thrall isnt useless but doesnt play like a SMNs familiar. Likely half the qq from players. Its hightly utility for cc/buff. I generally use it as a distraction and group hugger to blast groups down. 

[Dray0s]

12 hours ago, Foxy said:

I feel so bummed out. The class is just so weak. While leveling it was fine but now that I'm level 45 with Awakened Siren stuff it is just so underpowered.

 

Sucks that I used Showgirl outfit and funneled all that gold only to find out that it's at the bottom of the DPS totem pole.

 

these type of posts I don't understand, the warlock was CONTINOUSLY told to be bad, players Posted on the forums EXPLAINING the class wasn't what you thought it was, and both KR and NA/EU Streamers were also saying the class is of only pve value due to party support, it was the playerbase who rejected players saying this saying they only said it to try put people off rolling their class. where what they said was actually very factual.

 

Even further more, the class doesn't improve at all with the level 50 patch like some people are saying, its actually STILL Worst class in 50 content, and with BM Shooting to the top we're the ONLY bad class actually left.

[Demonical]

PvP wise in KR Summoner and Warlock are the bottom tier, in PvE we will always have a place since we bring the best buff in the game to the table. So it aint that bad. And we got the nerfed version of the warlock wich went alittle overboard, our lack of survival skills was balanced with the fact we had alot of health drain available, with that gone im sure we are in line to be toned upwards

[Diradem]

On 3/3/2016 at 6:25 AM, Silvanthis said:

NC Soft never fails to fail. Turret classes don't work unless they pump out the dps to compensate for being still. Turrets need to hit like a turret. All the hype for the new class, all the time they had to work on it, and it's still a pile of shit. The thrall is useless, just give me another counter. This class is such a giant joke.

 

Seems like every post you make is extremely negative. If you dislike everything so much (keeping in mind people warned others not to expect amazing things from Warlock), there is a voluntary exit if need be. Otherwise, try appreciating some aspects for once.

[Jinjii]

I feel like I'm the only one actually enjoying the shit out of this class.  I have my summoner to pvp and be annoying with, but I'm happy I got my 'lock to gold without much issue.  

 

As for low dps, oh man...critting 11k dragoncalls in a row while insta-casting Wingstorm that crits for 9k and bombardment/rupture for between 3-6k, you call that low? I should make a video to show my dps rotation, low? My ass is it.

 

[edit] I have shitty gear, don't even have Siren yet and I've completed 7F

[RavTH]

[Nilkemios]

Well, as much as I like the theme of this class and wanted to play it, it's a disappointment.

 

The Thrall, while having its uses, is hampered by being mostly stationary, not hitting hard enough to make up for being stationary unless you invest quite a bunch of points into it, and even then it's main use in for the Onrush taunt for enemies (which sometimes doesn't work and when it does, it doesn't take many hits to make them focus back on you), and the sacrifice for Soulburn/Time Distortion (Clearly meant for groups, and even then situational) The rest of it's abilities you have no real control over, and using Onrush or Fall In both also require you to stand still and not do anything despite having no cast time to them. And, there's no Q and E abilities when the Thrall isn't out. Would it have been too hard to give dodges to Q and E while the Thrall isn't out?

 

While an interesting idea, it ultimately comes off as a cumbersome Summoner pet...except uglier and doesn't move anywhere on its own. It'd be nicer if it just floated beside or behind you and coordinated attacks based on what attacks you did or something. But no.

 

Quell is basically a clunkier Blade Master block, same flaw, fewer benefits. While I definitely like it being there, it's just not as good or fluid, being unable to cancel certain attack animations either.

 

Soul Shackle is nice, but it's only really useful for snaring a group of enemies or a boss to set them up for Imprison/Dragoncall, or both once you spec it to snare for longer. Its 24 second cooldown also means you can't rely on it to kite with either. In addition, some enemies can just get out of it with their approach skills or seemingly ignore it altogether, and a bug with it apparently can make bosses reset in the middle of a fight.

 

Imprison does nice damage when specced, but requires you stand in place for the whole cast, moving will cancel it right away. Also, because it doesn't hold enemies in like it's name and appearance would suggest, you need to use Soul Shackle to set up for this to hit all the way.

 

Dragoncall is too slow casting to be used normally most of the time. It can be instant cast, but this requires either the final pulse of Imprison to hit, or to use Leech if you mark them first. Because of Imprison long cast for the final hit, you'd have to use Soul Shackle anyways. And, while the instant cast allows you to use it while moving, the attack still goes as slow normally It can be specced into Dragon Helix, which instantly casts and recharges but require 3 Spectral Orbs for each use, once again making it very situational.

 

Bastion was clearly an attempt to address the lack of I-frames/resists, but even when specced, 5 resists for only 5 seconds on a 36 second recharge doesn't really make up for the lack of mobility or having just the S to dodge with.

 

Tether Blade....is okay.

 

Sanctum feels like it should do more. Resisting Knockdown (and Daze if specced into Form 2) is fine, but there are far more CC effects around than that. In addition, between it's long cooldown for Forms 2 and 3 of it, and at best still having a 36 second cooldown for only 6 seconds of resistance to one control effect, it almost never feels worth using unless you know a knockdown is coming a few seconds ahead of time.

 

Wingstorm is also okay-ish. Honestly, I feel they should just let us be able to move while casting it without requiring the instant cast to do so.

 

Leech, despite it's name, doesn't actually leech anything. It can be specced to do quite a number of things (focus recovery, paralysis, increased damage or HP recovery), but the long cooldown and requirement of a Branded enemy first also make it very situational. It also feels out of place being a single target ability used to instant cast/reset AoE abilities, and while the reset of Dragoncall/Wingstorm on Leech hit is very nice, I rarely if ever ran into a situation where I managed to use either of them, let alone both, before using Leech.

 

Well...at least the Soulburn outfit change is neat. Still wish that look was an actual outfit though.

 

 

 

[KlausFlouride]

On ‎3‎/‎6‎/‎2016 at 11:59 PM, Foxy said:

I feel so bummed out. The class is just so weak. While leveling it was fine but now that I'm level 45 with Awakened Siren stuff it is just so underpowered.

 

Sucks that I used Showgirl outfit and funneled all that gold only to find out that it's at the bottom of the DPS totem pole.

Where did you get that outfit from?