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This game is pay to win, you know it, or I will show you.


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thread is just derailed into a argument in all honesty, the game is or Isnt p2w, that's a Personal opinon, trying to enforce ur opinon to matter more is worthless, the OP thinks the games P2W for whatever reason he thinks its physically Impossible for himself a free player to Earn what the paying players are getting given, just leave it at that.

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so... your logic here is this   A Person has a CHOICE and its not RECQUIRED to buy gold ( and potentially get banned for this) to buy a silly item in a game that could potentially make a cha

Just save your money up and buy it. Just because you're broke dont cry pay2win. Im far off from buying the book nor do I care at lvl1 warlock but will save my money up to buy it.

I would like to have the defending people of this game explain me how this is not pay to win:   BM /  Warlock / BD - BSH 4man Skill Books   These Books: - have a price of 400g

2 hours ago, mihwK said:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pay-to-win

 

Maybe you should have spend some time learning how to read, so you can inform yourself what p2w actually means in your mature state.

How fking dumb do you need to be to be like:

 

Hey, I can farm everything in this game. The other guy can buy it tho, it's not p2w, because in my dumb world, I don't understand the word pay to win even if it's linked like 5 times, even if it clearly means, if anyone can buy power at a faster rate it means it's p2w. But hey KIDS, I'm not a kid!

 

So if you had to farm something for 1 year straight, but another guy can buy it for EUROS, then it means it's not pay to win right? Since the game offers you to get the item if you invest the time into it. Do I have to link it again for your stupidity? Let me do it, just to make sure you uneducated fk actually LEARN what PAYTOWIN is: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pay-to-win

 

Its not because it is on the internet that it means its right, P2W is only if you cannot get the item without Real money, if it drops ingame and you can get the drop yourself without paying money for it be it gold or real, its not P2W.

If they were selling +50 AP diamonds in the cashshop and only for NCcoins you could buy them, thats P2W, if the diamonds dropped ingame it would not be P2W.

 

People seem to losely use the term P2W when in reality it only took effort to get it, put some effort in run BSH4 man get your book, if you buy gold through the exchange with your NCCoins, you are paying for convienience.

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15 minutes ago, Beeboo77 said:

so if someone can make his char. stronger than mine  just sitting in town and paying real money its PAY TO WIN simple as that

exactly this^

In their world this isnt true, it's not p2w if you can grind it for 100 years, it's only p2w if you can't get the item without money.

I understood the exact same thing you wrote, they say no, I google, first link all I see is I'm right.

 

But hey, I challenged them to show proove several times, not a single one has managed to show 1 link which states what they say. They *cricket* about my link, hell, go get a better one then. We are on page 8, and I'm still waiting to actually see if one of them managed to get a better link than mine, since mine is so bad, it shouldn't take long to link a trustworthy source stating p2w is only if you can't get the item by free ways too.

 

Guess what, they simply can't do it, that's why that link never appeared. It's easy to say nonono, your link is trash, it means nothing without delivering something better.

Edited by mihwK
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2 hours ago, Mishi said:

Pay to win:

Able to gain an item/skill/gear/ect... via ONLY real life cash.

 

Since the skills drop IN GAME, and you can get it from farming, or saving up IN GAME currency, the item is available via in game means, therefore it is not Pay to win. (As Pay to win would have it only available through buying it with real life money from a cash shop and not being able to farm in game.)

 

 

Now this game is Pay for convenience:

Pay real life money to gain gold quicker and have the convenience of gaining the skill/item quicker than those who do not pay. 

However as it is available through fully in game means, without having to buy from the cash shop directly, then it is not pay to win. 

 

You CAN grind out dailies, and farm for gold, thus making currency in game to outbid the others on your team. (Not to mention the net currency gain when the item does drop in the instance.) However it will, and does take much more time invested in the game, as you are not paying real life money to invest less time in the game. 

 

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

SS's sold @ 25s- 5.25g/daily

(Just from dailies for SS's.)

Now if you add in the MWT's you can sell: 4MWT drops x2/e=8MWT's @ 70s each=  5.6g a day

Add in Dailies gold gain at a "lowball" number, and that's another 15g/day

 

So far we are at: 25.85g/day

Now if you also farm Arena for ss's you can also sell those and gain another: 6.25g/day (not including ss pouches for gold+)

 

That leaves us at a lowball number of gold gain per day at: 32.10g/day

 

Now you can Also sell poharan perfumes, the purple ones from BSH, and gain more gold on top of the listed amount. (Though those prices are normally 30s/each.) Not sure how many you gain a day to add into the mix or not so I will leave those out. (Other various items sell for decent amounts of money which you get normally from the daily dungeons as well, and you can sell.)

 

So 400g/32.10g= 12.461 days of farming. (Less than 2 weeks, and many ways which the number of days farming can be lessened.)

 

 

7 minutes ago, mihwK said:

exactly this^

In their world this isnt true, it's not p2w if you can grind it for 100 years, it's only p2w if you can't get the item without money.

I understood the exact same thing you wrote, they say no, I google, first link all I see is I'm right.

 

But hey, I challenged them to show proove several times, not a single one has managed to show 1 link which states what they say. They *cricket* about my link, hell, go get a better one then. 

 

If you believe everything on a website just because it goes along with your views, then none should bother their time pointing out how the game is not pay to win. 

 

Everyone has their own view of what Pay to Win means. (If you start reading through all the links google brings up you can start to see it's not just black and white as some believe it is, and many have varying opinions on it.)

 

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12 minutes ago, Mishi said:

 

 

If you believe everything on a website just because it goes along with your views, then none should bother their time pointing out how the game is not pay to win. 

 

Everyone has their own view of what Pay to Win means. (If you start reading through all the links google brings up you can start to see it's not just black and white as some believe it is, and many have varying opinions on it.)

 

I can see those opinions in this thread aswel, don't need google for that.

 

I also saw this:

The problem is that there is no agreed-upon definition of pay-to-win. "Convenience" items are a good case in point. Some folks don't mind them, while others point out that they can make your character more powerful in less time, depending on the system.

 

They think they are right, why shouldn't I, it's not like they gave any proove at all. You can see how I asked for links, nothing came, just some 10IQ kids who are really bad at trolling. As long as none of them could be asked to bring up any source stating their side, I had no reason to back down. If I want to have a fair Arena 1v1 experience I wuld have to farm this book for 12 days now or spend 12 days of already farmed gold into it, while some other dude will buy it in mere seconds with cash. I'm fine with both sides beeing somewhat right. It's still funny for them to market this as an esport with mechanics like these.

 

On the twitch link he's talking about those loot boxes, why they got removed after a couple days. Keep in mind, they did implement them anyway, like no one is looking into this stuff or they do it on purpose.

Edited by mihwK
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so uhm.. this ain't pay2win

 

I used to play a game that had the option to pay for stats

 

if you payed like 20 euro you could import extra stats like 200 attack power & 40% extra crit rate (B&S perspective)

and besides that you could fly what other characters couldn't if they wouldn't pay and they'd just attack you from the sky when you were forced to do ranged attacks even if you were melee

 

that my friend is pay to win, these books you talked about.. farm farm farm and you get it

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27 minutes ago, mihwK said:

I can see those opinions in this thread aswel, don't need google for that.

 

I also saw this:

The problem is that there is no agreed-upon definition of pay-to-win. "Convenience" items are a good case in point. Some folks don't mind them, while others point out that they can make your character more powerful in less time, depending on the system.

 

They think they are right, why shouldn't I, it's not like they gave any proove at all. You can see how I asked for links, nothing came, just some 10IQ kids who are really bad at trolling. As long as none of them could be asked to bring up any source stating their side, I had no reason to back down. If I want to have a fair Arena 1v1 experience I wuld have to farm this book for 12 days now or spend 12 days of already farmed gold into it, while some other dude will buy it in mere seconds with cash. I'm fine with both sides beeing somewhat right. It's still funny for them to market this as an esport with mechanics like these.

 

On the twitch link he's talking about those loot boxes, why they got removed after a couple days. Keep in mind, they did implement them anyway, like no one is looking into this stuff or they do it on purpose.

Your live is P2W, get over it or leave the game.....

 

Linking urbandictionary proofes nothing, so stop whining. If you don´t like it...go.

Edited by Shinobe
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6 minutes ago, Pacma said:

its not p2w its morre of a p2 progress.   if u pay, u get moonwater stones fast, if you dont, it will take about a week.

Pretty much what I'm thinking. Honestly there is no "win" in this game, just progression.

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Chill, it's just 400g. You can manage. It's not p2w, it's inflation. With the bots roaming around, the inflation will only get worse. Wait till the lv. 50 content is released, with how things are, the prices of things will skyrocket and you won't be complaining for such a small amount like 400g.

 

This game is a grindfest as you near end-game, so get your gears up and farm that gold. 

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48 minutes ago, Dray0s said:

thread is just derailed into a argument in all honesty, the game is or Isnt p2w, that's a Personal opinon, trying to enforce ur opinon to matter more is worthless, the OP thinks the games P2W for whatever reason he thinks its physically Impossible for himself a free player to Earn what the paying players are getting given, just leave it at that.

 

That's the problem it's NOT an opinion, it's a flat out wrong assumption. It's an item that can be farmed in-game, paying gives no advantage on the drop rate of said item. If it was available in the cash shop for fairly cheap it could be considered slightly pay to win, but it's not. This thread on its own speaks VOLUMES about OPs experience with MMOs, because there have been MMOs that include more things you have to pay for with every update alongside nerfing the drop rates of the needed materials at the same time. I've played several MMOs that actually were pay to win, as I'm sure others in this thread have. To call this game p2w over something you can farm easily in game if you actually try instead of QQing on the forums over it is just insane.

 

Calling people kids just shows how uneducated and immature you are. 

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I understand what OP means, but it isn't pay to win. Pay2Win is when you can buy it DIRECTLY from Cash Shop.

 

Selling NCoin isn't Pay2Win. It's....well. Credit Card hero. I know P2W people use their credit cards too but, idk, I like to think it's slightly different. Selling NCoin is more like Pay4Convenience? Pay2GitGud? Because the Skillbook is available in game, not cashshop. Therefore, you're not PAYING NCsoft, directly. The Gold you buy with NCoin has to come from the game ONLY (from other people's farming). 

 

TL;DR: NCSoft isn't selling Skillbook, not pay2win, it's pay2GitGud.

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15 minutes ago, Udunnome said:

Pretty much what I'm thinking. Honestly there is no "win" in this game, just progression.

let me break it down for ya : if i'm doing the faction quests  and a warlock with a 70%more power book (that he bought with real money) jump me and kill me its pay to "WIN"

EDIT : he won the fight cause he payed real money .

Edited by Beeboo77
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2 minutes ago, Beeboo77 said:

let me break it down for ya : if i'm doing the faction quests  and a warlock with a 70%more power book (that he bought with real money) jump me and kill me its pay to "WIN"

EDIT : he won the fight cause he payed real money .

 

You assume he paid real money, maybe he spent his time farming for it like the people complaining about it should be. People willing to pay $300 for a skill book are extremely rare and it's likely you would never come across someone who paid. The hundreds-thousands-millions of people who farm for it have the exact same advantage as the 2 people who are willing to buy it with RL$. P2W games have advantages that aren't reasonably available in-game for sale in the cash shop and free player have no chance to be as powerful as paid players.

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3 hours ago, mihwK said:

Games that let you buy better gear or allow you to make better items then everyone else at a faster rate and then makes the game largely unbalanced even for people who have skill in the game without paying.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pay-to-win

 

It's okay bobby, I will explain this to you, I'm expecting brainless people when I make a thread like this.

 

Someone who can buy power at a faster rate because he pays for it, is the definiton of p2w. Just because you can save up gold doesn't mean it's not p2w. I just rocked your world, admit it.

Games that let you buy better gear or allow you to make better items then everyone else at a faster rate and then makes the game largely unbalanced even for people who have skill in the game without paying.
Dude, you've spent like 400 bucks on this game so you can beat everyone who hasn't spent any money. Pay-to-win noob!
by Icupeverynite February 07, 2011
 
This urbandictionary entry was made by a user. That means thats his definition of Pay 2 win is like that. But go ahead on your crytrain with p2w or do everyone a favor and just leave the game because you, obviously, do not like the "pay to win" in this game. Good luck at Black Desert Online or whatever game you go playing
 

 

Edited by MinaTakashi
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how dense can some ppl be? OFC its p2w if you can trade REAL money to GAME money. Skill books shouldnt be drops, they should be something you need to make or grind for. PvE is p2w and i doupt anyone cares because this game tries to be e-sports focused.

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2 minutes ago, Bendosuff said:

how dense can some ppl be? OFC its p2w if you can trade REAL money to GAME money. Skill books shouldnt be drops, they should be something you need to make or grind for. PvE is p2w and i doupt anyone cares because this game tries to be e-sports focused.

So what you are saying is that there needs to be no change as we can clearly grind for the books or anything that we need other than inventory slots. Got it boss. Good talk.

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2 minutes ago, Bendosuff said:

how dense can some ppl be? OFC its p2w if you can trade REAL money to GAME money. Skill books shouldnt be drops, they should be something you need to make or grind for. PvE is p2w and i doupt anyone cares because this game tries to be e-sports focused.

Apparently you can be VERY dense. The exchange rate isn't good enough to be worth anything considering the amount of money needed for upgrades and such. When you can grind the dungeon that drops it for the drop, how is that not a grind again? The ability to buy in-game money for gold doesn't make it P2W. If that was the case, EVERY game is P2W because you can buy gold online in every game.

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