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Archaegeo

KFM replacing Summoner as FOTM

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AyeAye   

Triple kick has a cool down, I don't tend to waste my guard breaking cooldowns during my I-frames. Especially not when I have 6 other ways to initiate the same combo, but only 1 way to break a guard in to a stun. That's personal preference though.

 

If I am going to use Q/E I'm following up with a hard to land skill shot stun or daze instead of wasting my GB - Reason being, I'm in no threat of missing or being hit in return because I'm invincible...

 

I don't see how shinkick is theoretically going to 'land more times' ....Even if your opponent becomes unstunned, you can still use cyclone kick after EACH shin kick? Your not canceling Cyclone kicks dmg with shin kicks animation. If one or the other is more likely to be resisted or dodged, or shin kick is unable to be evaded etc? I mean idk, I've never seen anyone dodge my damage while stunned in the first place.

 

 

I never argued if sin was a better or worse counter to KFM.

 

KFM is the closest thing we have to an S tier in this game currently.

 

The only S tier for summoner is Scrub tier.

 

(I have stated it was easier for ME to fight Sin as KFM then most people claim it to be. Probably because I've also pvp'd 500 or so matches as an assassin so I understand the mechanics of that class I don't panic when he is invisible or I go blind :-p.

 

C IS YOUR BEST FRIEND. Decoy has a decent cooldown, if you see him countering and can't ignore it press C, you will chase him through and out of stealth = gg. He can't restealth unless you let him moth you and get a free body swap.

 

There is counter play to both sides of this match up.

 

When I look at KFM vs SIN and then Look at Sin vs KFM. Here is how I feel

 

KFM - If I catch him slipping he's dead, otherwise I'm going to be getting chipped at and annoyed. My BIGGEST concern here is landing my counter for 100% defense buff at all times. 100%...Sin already does low dmg...Now the odds of him slipping up during a fight where he has to deal TWICE as much damage(plus KFM heals good) I mean c'mon :-p. It feels annoying, but not like I'm underhanded.

 

It takes 111111111111111 skill shot to pull him out of stealth just one, and this fight suddenly becomes in my favor.

 

Sin - I'm pretty confident that the KFM can't control me, however. I'm PRAYING TO GOD he's not looking at my lotus flower. And or that he doesn't randomly hit me with a stun or daze as soon as it wears off. If this happens, you are pretty much going to lose the fight.

 

You will now be forced to blow your tab to escape ANY of the 8-10 CC's KFM has. (Or eat 20k dmg in 2 seconds) If you tab out of the first CC your only option is literally to run away like a coward because he still has a handful more.

 

I also feel like I never want to tab out from his grapple combo....But some KFM have specced in to healing from grapple...and tab is literally my only escape. In order to kill a KFM, I basically have to control him for his entire health bar, without ever allowing myself to be combo'd a single time, and if I start to get combo'd I have to PRAY that my flower is not going to fail during this time.

 

-I am by no means a diamond swag sin- So maybe I'm just bad, but that's how you fight a KFM, you A. don't get hit or you B. Die. In fact, that is how you fight KFM,SMN,Destroyer.

 

And ironically enough, Destroyers also feel like we counter them extremely well.

 

How can you call me your counter, if I slip up ONE SINGLE TIME the entire fight, I die. No questions asked. To me I feel like YOUR MY COUNTER. I have no breathing room, I'm running from you the entire fight, everything you do is potentially life threatning...etc. etc.

 

 

 

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MantaZ   

that guy is hilarious. He have a KFM, but have no idea how skills work, have a sin, yet failed to prove atleast some points that its a hard class.

Ive asked his screenshot with his diamond assassin, still waiting.

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PatchKid   
5 minutes ago, AyeAye said:

How can you call me your counter, if I slip up ONE SINGLE TIME the entire fight, I die. No questions asked. To me I feel like YOUR MY COUNTER. I have no breathing room, I'm running from you the entire fight, everything you do is potentially life threatning...etc. etc.

 

git gud?

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AyeAye   
8 minutes ago, PatchKid said:

git gud?

 

I mean that to destroyers tho not KFM's XD.

 

If I have to get so good that I can't get hit a single time to win a match (By time out) I don't think I should be considered your hard counter. :-p

 

MantaZ, whatever google translate is telling you to say, makes no sense to the rest of us. The reason everyone else is discussing this with a normal tone, is because we are able to understand these things and discuss clarify game mechanics.

 

All you did was make it look like your a lvl 22 kfm.

 

I said several times in every post why Sin is Harder then all classes.

 

Even in his best match ups, he can be killed so easily, and even if he is playing defensively MOST of his enemies can out heal his dmg.

 

This turns in to you trying to never be hit while chipping damage, Its INCREDIBLY hard to never be hit.

 

Even if you could macro your entire assassin combo, it would still be hard to not get hit by a single attack from the enemy. (Last destroyer crit me for 20k, while I had my tab up...no time to react, no reason to tab yet, 20k dmg. GG bro)

 

Every other class can take a combo from the enemy and still be in a decent position to fight back. with the exception of maybe summoner.

 

DRUMROLL PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

AND WE DON'T HAVE PROPER Q/E <- all the classes without this are "Harder" XD I won't even bring up combo difficulty lets pretend the combos are all automatic.

 

Movement and class mechanics alone put me at a disadvantage at least until lvl 46. And my hp/defense is to small to recover with no healing unlike any other class =D

 

Edited by AyeAye

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PatchKid   
2 minutes ago, AyeAye said:

 

I mean that to destroyers tho not KFM's XD.

 

If I have to get so good that I can't get hit a single time to win a match (By time out) I don't think I should be considered your hard counter. :-p.

I'm just trolling you, bro.  Assassin is not the hardest class to play.  The only people who claim it's hard are the people who don't have patience.  That is the only "skill" you need as an Assassin.  The skill to not get anxious and jump immediately into combat.  Bad / anxious assassins are easy to beat, even for a KFM.

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AyeAye   

Well initially I was talking in terms of linking together your general combos.

 

All classes ESPECIALLY KFM and SIN are similar in difficulty and management. Probably BM falls in this group as well for the 3 highest skill caps.

 

Sin however, is incredibly reliant on a few things that increase the skill cap beyond the others.

 

1. Proccing skills on the enemy <- without managing this correctly you can not and will not 'stunlock' anyone. During your damage combo's you have to actively proc poison, which generally requires you to manage both your in stealth and out of stealth skills at the same time. This rhythm is NEVER the same as it would be for a KFM doing 3rf.

 

2. The combat is really fast paced, and the animation cancel is the least predictable one in the game.

 

3. Sin's have by far the LOWEST burst damage in the game, clearly his PvP damage was balanced around being able to have poison on the enemy most of the time. Even if you did manage to poison someone the entire fight, you lack the ability to just burst someone down in 2 seconds if they decided not to tab or tabbed at a bad time.

 

4. You have to actively track and aim the majority of your skills MANUALLY...

 

5. The combo is longer, harder to pull off, enemy lag effects your game play dramatically, etc etc. I mean this is where I would put all of that kind of stuff.

 

I'm not saying Sin is ungodly harder compared to these classes.

 

I AM saying, Bad KFM's who only rely on 1 dimensional stun lock 3rf fighting can easily approach platinum. And probably would struggle to reach upper gold on assassin. The combat is INCREDIBLY fast paced on Sin compared to other classes, and lets face it, the faster your doing something the more room for error.

 

And since its typically the higher risk higher reward style play, that higher margin of error increases the difficulty.

 

Its also IN THE WORSE CURRENT POSITION with regards to the current balance patch where we have access to absolutely NOTHING beyond the normal lvl 45 stuff, and half of the other classes are deep in to lvl 50 content skill and dmg wise etc.

 

If you want to have a logical discussion about THAT =D Lets do it.

 

-I know you were not being srs when you said git gud- but still wanted to explain the situation, because all I hear is Destroyer's get crapped on by Sins (Which they do) but man its not an easy feat.

 

1 out of every 10 sins probably dominates a good destroyer, the other 9 went 3 minutes without getting hit, delt 60k dmg, and got 1 shot XD

 

Edited by AyeAye

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MantaZ   

ok ok ok im lvl1, bronze 0-100000 and all other stuff whatever. So can you please post your screenshot with your diamond assassin?

yes you said, sin is harder yet did not even gave one valid point why. All these points you made are not even worth considering. All ive read from you is that sin have 2 stuns, which magically can hold you for 10+ secs, you act like you know stuff so is it really that hard to show your diamond sin?

 

I intend no insult or anything, its just that if your not a diamond sin...i mean even first timer in game with sin can get to plat easy so..

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Valdes   
19 minutes ago, MantaZ said:

ok ok ok im lvl1, bronze 0-100000 and all other stuff whatever. So can you please post your screenshot with your diamond assassin?

yes you said, sin is harder yet did not even gave one valid point why. All these points you made are not even worth considering. All ive read from you is that sin have 2 stuns, which magically can hold you for 10+ secs, you act like you know stuff so is it really that hard to show your diamond sin?

 

I intend no insult or anything, its just that if your not a diamond sin...i mean even first timer in game with sin can get to plat easy so..

You'll be waiting a looong time for that.

 

He's not even Platinum... he is a Gold scrub that is vehemently proud of beating other low ELO golds.

 

Not only this; says bad KFM can get into plat with 3rf spam yet is not in plat with his KFM.  This kid is more entertaining that Reddit.

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Kutsuu   

@AyeAye come on now do you really expect people to believe you when you make ridiculous absolute statements like "I can't get hit a single time to win a match (against KFM)"

 

Just kidding! Now moving on to reality... Anyone with half a brain will see the truth after reading your posts. Sin is truly the hardest class in the game by orders of magnitude that only a chosen few can overcome. I really appreciate you educating us on this topic and making sure that none of us consider this nigh-impossible class. I'm proud to interact with someone who can master it so thoroughly. I know that I can trust your knowledge of the Assassin class, given that you're also a BM player and expert. 

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