Is this pay to win

[Azseri]

6 hours ago, Cetra said:

I'm not going to beat around the bush, the PvE/Open World PVP in this game is completely P2W if you want it to be regardless of what others will say.  It's quite simple, load up and NCoin and sell the NCoin for Gold by Gifting items to players.  The majority of gear upgrades are fueled by gold, so you can whale it 100%.  They're putting the gold exchange NCoin/Gold trade market into the game later which will only make it easier.  Those that try to deny it just need to stop, anyone with money can max their gear with a credit card whenever they feel like it.  One of the many reasons so many people are out the door with this game already.  NCSoft doesn't care, they lied about the P2W aspect just as they did a load of other stuff.  It doesn't matter how amazing or beautiful a game is, its always about money and they'll burn it to the ground over it.  The sooner everyone realizes that and stops falling for it the better the game community will be.

The only thing that isn't is Arena PvP and the mechanics only take it so far, imbalance is horrid and though it gets much better after 50 patch that's a ways out.  I think we've all waited through enough patches in MMOs for things to 'finally be fixed', we all know more issues will always continue to pop up..  MMOs these days are just becoming a never ending carrot chase joke.

This is pay to progress faster not p2w, by definition p2w is using money to gain things not obtainable at all by free players eg. if they sold a weapon on the store with 3000ap and the best you can get is 2000ap.

[Thvrsis]

There's nothing a player can buy to get ahead of you to become unreachable/unbeatable, neither in pve or pvp/owpvp.

[Jixua]

I've played p2w games before and this isn't one.  you can level to 45 just fine and you won't miss anything, you can do arena just fine and you won't be at a disadvantage.

 

however, you will not be the prettiest princess

[vegasbutcher]

14 minutes ago, Azseri said:

This is pay to progress faster not p2w, by definition p2w is using money to gain things not obtainable at all by free players eg. if they sold a weapon on the store with 3000ap and the best you can get is 2000ap.

 

lol what s different between pay 2 win and pay to progress faster in this pvp, u pay to get gold and get better gem better weapon better equip even get better potion. that 20%more exp and gold made huge gap between member and normal. wake up dude. 

[vegasbutcher]

this not p2w in pve, but this p2w in pvp 4sure. ppl said this s not p2w for pvp does not understand the game at all. dont listen to these company hired

[Jixua]

all gear is normalized and you can't use potions in arena.  what are you smoking man.  unless you're talking about world pvp in which case looooooooooool world pvp, who wastes their time on that

[Meerkat]

16 minutes ago, Jixua said:

I've played p2w games before and this isn't one.  you can level to 45 just fine and you won't miss anything, you can do arena just fine and you won't be at a disadvantage.

 

however, you will not be the prettiest princess

 

How are you winning if you're not the prettiest princess?

[Emya]

53 minutes ago, Meerkat said:

 

How are you winning if you're not the prettiest princess?

 

Because

 

[DrowningEarth]

It's not P2W by any measure, but the amount of effort required to progress does get significantly harder. People at the top (wealth/pvp) put a LOT of time into it, not something unexpected.

 

Don't sweat it though, it's just a game.

[Cetra]

19 hours ago, Azseri said:

This is pay to progress faster not p2w, by definition p2w is using money to gain things not obtainable at all by free players eg. if they sold a weapon on the store with 3000ap and the best you can get is 2000ap.

 

19 hours ago, Jixua said:

I've played p2w games before and this isn't one.  you can level to 45 just fine and you won't miss anything, you can do arena just fine and you won't be at a disadvantage.

 

however, you will not be the prettiest princess

 

17 hours ago, DrowningEarth said:

It's not P2W by any measure, but the amount of effort required to progress does get significantly harder. People at the top (wealth/pvp) put a LOT of time into it, not something unexpected.

 

Don't sweat it though, it's just a game.

Completely disagree.  "Winning" or "Beating" this game as far as PVE is concerned is nothing other then getting the best gear and clearing the latest content.  That is all made possible in the blink of an eye with RMT.  Sure, you can twist words around and play with what you consider the definition of P2W/QoL to be but in the end you can't deny what can be achieved by opening your wallet.  I can log in and dump a couple hundred into the game and have everything else you & anyone else worked for in a quarter of the time, then there's nothing else to do but stand around and bs in chat.

It's fine if you disagree, in the end you're only fooling yourself.  If you still have fun in a game that works in this way, that's fine keep playing.  Others like myself enjoy a challenge, where you progress from being good, not from being a swipe lord.

 

[Impy]

On 2/15/2016 at 0:15 PM, Anrothan said:

Yes, do not let the fanboys fool ya. 1 can get better stats for spending dosh in the market via "Passives" from the store. but its f2p so every game is p2w at some ppoint because... how will they make dosh right?

 

Do yourself a favor.. quit this game while you are ahead! Yea yea, you see 30% of the games pop since release because i mean, BDO is coming out and man the graphics are OP!!!!!

 

Also, Come at me weeb fanboys :) 

Lol Bdo's hair looks like unfinished brush strokes 

[Bladez]

Not pay to win but if you pay, you get a little extra stuff. This wont make you stronger than the next player but will make you make money faster, more market room to sell etc.. A few extra perks for financially supporting the game. I haven't spend a dime and that's because I will not stay long with BnS. Its a good game but there are some things missing for me personally. Its really fun though and community is helpful in-game. That has been my personal experience.

[Bladez]

12 minutes ago, Impy said:

Lol Bdo's hair looks like unfinished brush strokes 

 

I played BDO JP for quite sometime. I don't know if you have seen the character creator tool because I think you have no idea what you are talking about. The character customization level in that game surpasses any from any other MMo out there, including this one. You can Dis many aspect s of the game and I might not say anything but you can practically make very detailed look a likes to incredible detail and similarities. In other words, You have no idea of what you are talking about. Saying something like that makes it obvious that you have no idea of what you are talking about.

[AlcatelOneTouch]

On 2/15/2016 at 11:50 PM, Akamu said:

You inept people just whine, I swear. I haven't quit and I haven't spent money. This game isn't P2W. It offers convenience.

There's enough space to get by. Is it annoying sometimes? Yes. Just unlock all of your secondary inventory first and learn to manage items. Plus for the next two months they have a daily that once you complete, you'll get two bags. Apparently somebody before didn't notice.

People don't get "A LOT, A LOT" of money from paying. You can grind dailies for decent money. It just make take you a few days longer - It's not the end of the world.

That being said, the things that are available to buy are overly expensive, and the mailing system having a paywall is annoying, but you can work around it.

Ppppplleaseeee, 
Tomb of Exile cross-server party few hours ago:
Premium Summoner LVL 35  = Blight Staff, maxed
Non Premium Summoner LVL 45 - HM 1 = Blight staff, not maxed. (a bit more HP thou, cause I guess he already have the better Soul Shield from Moonwater)

If this is not obvious P2W I don't know what is... consider the gold drop, that guy prolly have 50% more Gold than the lvl 45 guy. So yes,  A LOT of Money. 

Also, there are still no non-premiums in Hogstead. I can even provide evidence with screenshots. 

[Bladez]

On ‎2‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 2:15 PM, Anrothan said:

Yes, do not let the fanboys fool ya. 1 can get better stats for spending dosh in the market via "Passives" from the store. but its f2p so every game is p2w at some ppoint because... how will they make dosh right?

 

Do yourself a favor.. quit this game while you are ahead! Yea yea, you see 30% of the games pop since release because i mean, BDO is coming out and man the graphics are OP!!!!!

 

Also, Come at me weeb fanboys :) 

I got conqueror's package. See you ingame bruh!!!

[DrowningEarth]

48 minutes ago, Cetra said:

 

 

Completely disagree.  "Winning" or "Beating" this game as far as PVE is concerned is nothing other then getting the best gear and clearing the latest content.  That is all made possible in the blink of an eye with RMT.  Sure, you can twist words around and play with what you consider the definition of P2W/QoL to be but in the end you can't deny what can be achieved by opening your wallet.  I can log in and dump a couple hundred into the game and have everything else you & anyone else worked for in a quarter of the time, then there's nothing else to do but stand around and bs in chat.

It's fine if you disagree, in the end you're only fooling yourself.  If you still have fun in a game that works in this way, that's fine keep playing.  Others like myself enjoy a challenge, where you progress from being good, not from being a swipe lord.

 

By that definition, you could consider almost any MMO with tradeable endgame gear as P2W because you could simply buy gold from Chinese bots and do the exact same thing.

 

A true P2W game has advantageous content/powerups that are locked to non-paying players. I've played a few before, online card games are especially guilty of this.

[Zuldar]

This is one of the least offensively p2w games I've seen in a while.  The only thing I might worry about is the golden revitalizer, although usually it's unnecessary (most problems are due to a lack of dps meeting enrage timers rather then survival, and this item won't really help those who die quickly anyway).  You could argue that premium gives you extra gold being p2w, but unless you're doing all 40 dailies every single day you could always make up the difference by doing a few more before logging.

 

Mostly it's convenience and time savers; extra storage, faster xp, brilliant keys.  Being ftp though is still fairly easy, even without any of the paid benefits you can be fairly competitive in under a week.  One important caveat, the boxes earlier with random items could have tipped the scales towards the p2w territory, particularly being able to get soul stones out of them.  They don't seem to be available anymore, so we'll have to see how they go from here.

 

I'd even go so far as to say there really isn't much worth buying from the store, even premium has only a few uses (mostly the wardrobe function).  The costumes are too pricey to be worth the money, the consumables unnecessary in current content, materials are easily farmable, and my inventory space has not really been a problem with the free pouches you get plus a few more from free hongmoon coins.  Pretty much the only things that have interested me are a few premium months and some character slots (although as a ftp you could always just make a new account).

 

I feel they missed the point of microtransactions.  When I see a costume for $20 I start to compare that to what I could get instead, if I instead got 2-3 costumes, some xp soups, and maybe a few other convenience items dropping $20 would seem pretty good.  As is I'll just treat it as a p2p game, buy my sub, and mostly ignore the store; just not really anything worth buying in it.

[Enamour]

This thread makes me cringe lol.

[Cetra]

17 minutes ago, DrowningEarth said:

By that definition, you could consider almost any MMO with tradeable endgame gear as P2W because you could simply buy gold from Chinese bots and do the exact same thing.

 

A true P2W game has advantageous content/powerups that are locked to non-paying players. I've played a few before, online card games are especially guilty of this.

Sure, any game that you can get end game gear from whatever currency runs the game would work in this way.  Games that you can't get any gear by any means from the result of currency are best.  Blade and Soul Weapon and Accessory upgrades are driven by gold which is not only purchasable through gold sellers (if you want to get banned) or passively through NCoin to Gold sales.  Some people are okay with that, it doesn't do it for me.  I'm also tired of the MMO genre in general so the direction this game took for me made it easy to quit a month in.  BDO IMO is not an "Answer" to BNS either, that game will suffer a similar fate.  Best option for me is to stop playing MMOs for a least a few years or until huge changes are made to the way they work.

Best of luck to whoever is still enjoying the game though.

[DrowningEarth]

4 minutes ago, Cetra said:

Sure, any game that you can get end game gear from whatever currency runs the game would work in this way.  Games that you can't get any gear by any means from the result of currency are best.  Blade and Soul Weapon and Accessory upgrades are driven by gold which is not only purchasable through gold sellers (if you want to get banned) or passively through NCoin to Gold sales.  Some people are okay with that, it doesn't do it for me.  I'm also tired of the MMO genre in general so the direction this game took for me made it easy to quit a month in.  BDO IMO is not an "Answer" to BNS either, that game will suffer a similar fate.  Best option for me is to stop playing MMOs for a least a few years or until huge changes are made to the way they work.

Best of luck to whoever is still enjoying the game though.

I can see what you're saying.

 

IMO, the bigger concern about this game isn't necessarily P2W, but the linearity/narrow scope of endgame content, along with a few quality of life issues (i.e. premium not worth it, HM store costumes non-transferable on account). If anything, those factors will kill the game before P2W does.

[gewd]

This game is pay 2 win in pve and open world pvp.

 

Most people on these forums won't admit it because most of the people who realized this already left.

 

Let's take for example blackwyrm's claw which is the best in slot ring and goes for 500g. This is about 50 days worth of dailies and if you spend all your gold on this, you cannot upgrade your other equipment. Then there's also the faster res and windwalk ability.

 

Pay 2 progress faster can be considered pay 2 win if it takes too long for the free player to farm best in slot items.

 

Think about this for example, if you can buy something from the cash shop in 10 seconds what takes a free player 10 years to farm, would you consider that pay 2 win or pay 2 progress? 

[Chicken]

If by pay to win you mean anyone able to buy massive amount of Ncoins and use the currency trader to convert it to gold and then buy legendary box and all the materials required to upgrade, then yes.

 

PVP, not so much pay to win.

[Cetra]

2 hours ago, DrowningEarth said:

I can see what you're saying.

 

IMO, the bigger concern about this game isn't necessarily P2W, but the linearity/narrow scope of endgame content, along with a few quality of life issues (i.e. premium not worth it, HM store costumes non-transferable on account). If anything, those factors will kill the game before P2W does.

Definitely, I'm only touching on the "p2w" aspect.  There's so many problems with this game aside from that.  For someone such as myself that has been playing these games for years, I've simply learned to not put myself though it anymore.  Waiting patch after patch with promises (or not saying anything at all like ncsoft) to fix stuff..  Nah, other games to play and fun things to do IRL.

[deadmesa]

Anyone who thinks it is is just bad at the game and/or lazy. Period.

[Cetra]

2 hours ago, Chicken said:

If by pay to win you mean anyone able to buy massive amount of Ncoins and use the currency trader to convert it to gold and then buy legendary box and all the materials required to upgrade, then yes.

 

PVP, not so much pay to win.

Sure, if you can stomach the overpopulation of summoners and horribly balanced arena mechanics.  People fanboying will defend them but the meta has been established and it doesn't take long to realize almost every matchup acts itself out as to be expected.  Also, the increase in hack sightings in arena people are using to get to plat+.  Most not interested in PVP at all but to farm soulstone bags, drop rating and farm again.  The whole game is getting exploited and the only changes I'm seeing are different cash shop costumes.