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The Hate for Summoner


Geraton

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Since everyone is complaining about every class, it means the balance is all right then :p (little phrase for those who understand sarcasm)...Okay, as a summoner I can feel the pressure of other people telling me offensive stuff and I m not even one of those facerollers or mockers when it comes to pvp. I admit that summoner is a bit more op as it is supposed to be, but people, everyone is singing angelic tones about upcoming 50 lvl content, and it seems its still not enough. People want some "meanwhile nerf" for specific classes and 90% of these prayers are aimed on summoner. I would ask for one thing only, please, if you come with your statements about this class, consider the other classes as well. I would say the same stuff about your classes you say about summoner. Summoner is a class supposed to be a hybrid of all classes, which means he has a little of everything. You say summoner has a lot cc, high dps, can go invisible, and a stupid cat. Well from all that stuff I would agree on the cat thing, because excluding cat it would be the same for all other classes (not even saying that without the cat the summoner is complete trash and to be good summoner you must learn to control 2 characters instead of 1) . If all the ideas from people about nerfing this class would be done, the summoner wouldnt even exist obviously.  And most of the time I can see these statements addressed from classes like Destroyer, Sin or LBD...it seems like they hate the fact they cannot kill summoner faster way than using perma stealth, insane dmg, cc and spin the hell out (which usually takes less than 10sec to go down from 100%). I am not offending mentioned classes, Im just asking them to consider their abilities as well when it comes to such a deep comparation or blames about one class being more op than another ;) Thanky for a word and now Im just expecting some hard a.s.s kicking replies :) 

 

P.S: Everyone have a beautiful rest of the Valentines day and do not let the game make you upset (at least not today) :D

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The only thing i consider op about him is the healing.

Iam playing lbm and summoner.

As Lynblademaster you cant outdmg him. The heals are to strong combined with the stalltechniques the class has. This is why hes countered so hard by destro and kfm, because those bascially 100-0 him, and if they cant he will just heal up. The cat heals for 30% in 18 seconds while it has 8seconds invulnarable. The summoner can leech 20% of the hp every 24 seconds.

And if you play against summoner you have to do a lot of things right, dealing dmg to both, roll out of ALL KD if you dont cat sit on your face + sunflower takes tons of hp away and yea, no pressure means hes healing up again.... You have to be carefull while you grap him or the cat will knock you down. You are forced to take specific less dmg air combos or the cat will knock you down. You are not allowed to hit dandelion or he wil reset cds and stall more till heals up. Cat can be E'ed midair when its thrown with X. Targeting system will screw you when he sits on his unconsious pet.

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How come a silly cat can bypass the invulnerability frame one has in air?

If this is not a bug and its intended, then summoner is broken imo.

 

If I get atatcked by several mobs in pve, once im in the air, i take no damage from them. But a cat, and in pvp nonetheless, can damage me.

 

Also, whats up with the unbreakable grapple the cat has while the summoner shits away half of your HP pool?

You think this is just a bit OP? I call it broken beyond reason.

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Well about pet as youve already said, Ive met a lot of good players who made my pet unconcious/stunned etc and then I was just a piece of cake for them, moreso some players who can play their classes well can kill both cat and summoner himself.  Im not saying that cheap phrase "learn to play" I agree summoner is stronger, but while he excels at dps and healing, he is weak at evasive skills and escaping. Once I waste my escape skill, Im or dead, or lucky enough to be so aggresive to win :D And we cannot talk here about crowd control or something, certain classes have so much escaping skills that even having cooldown 5 seconds on Grasping roots wouldnt make them snared for 1-2 sec. Snare is nothing compared to frequent stuns from other classes like kfm/sin or destroyer, since snare can be canceled by more spells than stun. But well , the 50 lvl content will bring out some balancing stuff for others which means the classes will be more equal, since the legendary skills of other classes offer much bigger boosts than the ones of summoner. Im actually wondering how people are gonna deal with warlock if summoner makes so huge problems atm. Im not informed about what form does it comes out with, but that class is well known to be more op than the remaining classes put together :D And thanky for sharing your experience in your replies ;)

P.S: drago, Im not even sure if cat is possible to usually reach a target who is not standing on a solid platform. Cat has one skill called Play Time that hits target who is in the air, later version will provide this skill with additional knockup :x But it might be possible, since these iframes got limited immune for limited time, that the caster makes certain impacts on you so the cat's hit will break your immunity and cause a damage. Not sure about this, honestly, havent had any luck yet to experience this :x If it is not supposed to happen (if the description of your skill says so) then yea it might be some bug then.

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scammener is joke :) as detro i don't have any problem burst them both down or just burst scammener depend on how scammener play whit cat, as FM use E open devine sleep cat burst scammener :) just that easy :) 
ONLY unbalance whit scammnere is what they fix whit warlock, pet should have time limit and scammener should summ pet in fight NOT start fight whit pet

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2 hours ago, dragoshan said:

Also, whats up with the unbreakable grapple the cat has while the summoner shits away half of your HP pool?

You think this is just a bit OP? I call it broken beyond reason.

 

It is breakable..... . Getting grabbed from the cat while having no trinket up is the same as getting caught by fury destro combo(100-0), kfm stun lock (100-0), lbd full combo + cheese (100-0), stealth assa with no way to kick him out /or the full combo on non summoner(100 ~ 40), force master freeze+stun combo (100-30) or full bm combo with 4 legendary (100-0). Pls do not post again about balance until you are at least high gold.

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15 hours ago, Vanjanja said:

scammener is joke :) as detro i don't have any problem burst them both down or just burst scammener depend on how scammener play whit cat, as FM use E open devine sleep cat burst scammener :) just that easy :) 
ONLY unbalance whit scammnere is what they fix whit warlock, pet should have time limit and scammener should summ pet in fight NOT start fight whit pet

 

14 hours ago, Nholan said:

 

It is breakable..... . Getting grabbed from the cat while having no trinket up is the same as getting caught by fury destro combo(100-0), kfm stun lock (100-0), lbd full combo + cheese (100-0), stealth assa with no way to kick him out /or the full combo on non summoner(100 ~ 40), force master freeze+stun combo (100-30) or full bm combo with 4 legendary (100-0). Pls do not post again about balance until you are at least high gold.

 

Finally some people with a rational insight :) I mean, people think that any noob can play summoner and do well. Nothing like you can see people playing their class right, and those who still miss something of it. People think that all the summoners are noobs, there just cannot be possibly anyone who might be really good at this class. I always see topics highlighting other classes with statements like "good kfm can...good sin can...good fm can..." but when it comes to summoner, its always like "fking stupid nooby op summoner can"...its like nobody playing summoner has the right to be good at it and so simply winning against other classes...Im not any pro summoner or so, but I understand this class quite well and I still get my a.s.s kicked against certain people (not classes, but PEOPLE). And to be honest, I experienced many times that cheap mocking or facerolling of other summoners even on my own, so I know why people hate summoners that much. But do not blame all summoners just because they kill you for the faction quest or something. If theres a summoner spam-killing you and saying "you are noob" or something, well, they are some real dishonor for this class :x ;) I mean, this madness around summoner is just ridiculous, and I tell you why. Im more than 110% sure that if summoner would be taken out of this game (which, we know is not gonna happen), people would find another class after this one (possibly destro) and ask for tons of nerfs. And seeing how people complain about summoner skills lol...so what am I supposed to do then? Just to make someone happy I should use right click only, so the battle is more fair or wut...My brain stops at this point :x  Thank you all for your replies, for all of them ;) 

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1 hour ago, Geraton said:

 

 

 

Finally some people with a rational insight :) I mean, people think that any noob can play summoner and do well. Nothing like you can see people playing their class right, and those who still miss something of it. People think that all the summoners are noobs, there just cannot be possibly anyone who might be really good at this class. I always see topics highlighting other classes with statements like "good kfm can...good sin can...good fm can..." but when it comes to summoner, its always like "fking stupid nooby op summoner can"...its like nobody playing summoner has the right to be good at it and so simply winning against other classes...Im not any pro summoner or so, but I understand this class quite well and I still get my a.s.s kicked against certain people (not classes, but PEOPLE). And to be honest, I experienced many times that cheap mocking or facerolling of other summoners even on my own, so I know why people hate summoners that much. But do not blame all summoners just because they kill you for the faction quest or something. If theres a summoner spam-killing you and saying "you are noob" or something, well, they are some real dishonor for this class :x ;) I mean, this madness around summoner is just ridiculous, and I tell you why. Im more than 110% sure that if summoner would be taken out of this game (which, we know is not gonna happen), people would find another class after this one (possibly destro) and ask for tons of nerfs. And seeing how people complain about summoner skills lol...so what am I supposed to do then? Just to make someone happy I should use right click only, so the battle is more fair or wut...My brain stops at this point :x  Thank you all for your replies, for all of them ;) 

ONLY this that you CAN'T is 3v3 if enemy are 3 scammeners

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Ok I agree, but I will try to say as simple as possible...guys, you want the devs to change the whole mechanics of class...since NCwest follows koreans, I could be the one of these trolling fkers to say "just keep crying, nothings gonna change anyway" but Im not like that because I try to discuss this as a normal being, but most of the time I get the replies in the level of kid who learns to swear (example - stfu, fk you noob and etc), well, I dont even need to care of this thing, I would just keep playing and let everyone else cry, but as you can see there are few people who are interested to discuss and explain you that its not everything about having one sh1tty cat... But you should remind yourselves that most of the time its YOU who offend us, then you are suprised there are troll summoners...Ok, just remove summoners, Ill make spinning destroyer, or perma invisible assassin, Ill rather play these less hated classes than seeing everyone going mad while faction questing and saying FK YOU NOOB even though they attack me first...

and Vanjanja, if I should make up some realistic suggestion to solve that 3v3 out, it would be to allow only 1 player of each class being in the team (any combination but not more than 1 of same class) ;) So no 3 summoners or stuff like that would appear there. (not sure if its possible though, also I believe some people have already came out with the ideology to nerf summies while in 3v3) :D

P.S: Little reminder,  the whole blame should be aimed to the company behind this game, for making such mechanics, not the players who play the most hated class. Actually, Im really surprised that people do mind sooo much here, since most of the players played other versions of BnS as well. Its like...this version is a rarity from other versions, or each version was unbalanced by a certain class, when it was at the patch NA/EU is currently using ? :x explain me, I havent played other versions :D 

Thank you for your replies ;) 

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Great post, and good effort.  Also pointless.  2 errors.

 

One, you say you're a summoner.  Never do that.  You're trying to initiate a legit logical argument.  That ain't gonna happen with the saltiness of other classes (which are unwarranted unless you are BM).  For the record, I'm an 1800 summoner main...with a 2k FM alt.  

 

Two, you concluded that the big issue is the summoner's mechanics.  Wrong.  They don't want mechanics.  Most players don't even want parity or PVP balance.  They just want summoners deleted, or in League terms, Riot'd until they're irrelevant.  They want their BM Kirito or their Ass Snake or whatever to be winners.  Summoners aren't popular, and they difficult initial challenges for the most popular classes (BM and Ass/KFM afterwards iirc).  Destroyers, the early counter to summoners, are also historically underrepresented.  

Summoners have a high skill floor, and a button mashing sum will beat a button mashing Ass/BM.  Statistically, the most popular classes are Ass/BM, and the most likely skill level of a hater is "lower than button mashing."  Even in gold or plat, I see people stop mashing... just to directly attack my curled cat or my Ice Sheath.  And with hundreds of summoner games and less than 50 FM games, I might be an oddity, but summoners have huge issues in higher elos.

 

Just do some research.  Go to BNStree.  Go look for the amount of summoner CCs, escapes, and track their cooldowns and focus cost.  Then look at a FM or LBD.  Then look at a Dest/LBD counter mechanics and its comparative cooldown and focus cost.  And then look at an Assassin's stealth mechanic and theorize its own cost and availability.  Summoners fall quite short especially compared to my FM.  I don't know if NC will balance around high level or low level, or even balance at all.  But good luck trying to get respect from losers, no matter what class you play.

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21 hours ago, Nholan said:

 

It is breakable..... . Getting grabbed from the cat while having no trinket up is the same as getting caught by fury destro combo(100-0), kfm stun lock (100-0), lbd full combo + cheese (100-0), stealth assa with no way to kick him out /or the full combo on non summoner(100 ~ 40), force master freeze+stun combo (100-30) or full bm combo with 4 legendary (100-0). Pls do not post again about balance until you are at least high gold.

Wrong on so many levels, just proves you play a summoner and want to remain OP.

I dont bother playing against summoners in arenas so I just stand there, watching the little hemorrhoid bump around with its fancy *cricket*.

And when its cat grabs me, all the buttons are grayed out. L2P issue?

 

Think again

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26 minutes ago, KatHead said:

 

Teach me this combo please !

Right now BM have the lowest burn. Furthermore even if this was somehow true, which it isn't trust me I have said skills. You need to get your HM skills to pull it off. While other classes are basically given high burst. So you need to max everything out, get lucky or drop a crap ton of gold on your Hm skills. While a LBD can burn without, Destroyer and fm.

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Thank you guys for all your reasonable replies ;) And yes, I admit summoner is quite unbalanced at the moment. I didnt say anything about summoner being bashed for no reason, I just mean everyone complains about summoners far too much, because there is so many complains about this class like they were gods who cannot be killed. I havent heard of anyone from other versions who would complain about this class so much and it is the SAME game, just a small differences, but skills and etc are all the same (depends on the current patch of the server, cause yea, asians are far in the future with this game). The thing is, most of the players who played other versions know how to deal with the classes, but the newcommers who started here think they can rule without a hours of practice. ;) I was just thinking about the thing how everyone wants to nerf summoner, so after update for 50 lvl content, summoners would be at the current position of BMs (as everyone says its quite sh1tty atm). That would be a rapid change isnt it ? :) As I said, it is not the players fault who enjoy summoner or something, and thats why I came out in the first line that me myself am the summoner, so I dont have to hide myself in the bushes and secretly highlighting this class. I agree with all you just said, but Im still wondering how many people will remain here to complain about summoner even after 50  content is out. I strongly believe that this hate aimed to summoner will be quickly transformed into Warlock hate. Because, some people say that summoner is an easy opponent already. Someone, who will remain with his opinion that summoner is stupidly op even after the mentioned upcoming content, theres not a problem with summoners but somewhere else. Ive never experienced something as unsatisfied as this community here :D I am sorry if it sounds offensive to anyone but... nah Im abusing that line too often, noone cares anyway. I stopped playing this game because I got bored, but the game wasnt the primary factor, the community was. The more polite I tried to be, the worse I got back. And if people do not understand this game is about learning techniques and practicing, no wonder that everyone complains about certain class after 1st lost duel...If this is gonna keep the way its going, then AMEN not only for summoner, but whole this game :D  Well guys, I just hope that one day everyone of you will live in peace here and reach the feeling of finally balanced game ;) Until that, enjoy this closed beta version :x

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This thread is unreadable. Not for the thread's content, but because there's 1 guy typing endless walls of text.

 

Use the spaces where one paragraph ends, and the new one begins. Each paragraph should be 1 point you're trying to make, with each new point deserving its own paragraph.

 

Basic high school English class stuff.

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I dont gonna cry, about summoner being OP, etc. but need to say this: he is MEGA annojing, his damm cat can grab you, and its 1/2hp down for you (doesnt matter which class), and regen like hell. BUT!!! Without cat he die like pu**y. OFC im not saying he is 100% OK, but i dont gonna cry. I need to say this to ALL summoners:

 

All of players are already sick of hearing/seeing "I can solo this" from summoner at TAG, becouse its not cool guys.

 

BTW: not all wanna Kirito BM. In true if BM become Kirito like he gonna lose that flying swords of his. Lets add Kirito have many fans, but he have even more antyfans. Just look hot many SAO haters write SAO is bad etc. even though they dnt have any arguments. Personally i dont care about Kirito, and like SAO, but BM=Kirito? I think i gonna leave game then, becose SAO is TOTALY Diff than BNS.

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Yea I totally agree with all your replies, even with TheRealBronx, who could make his own thread about aknowledgement of how to make topics the right way, since Im not only one doing looong text blocks ;) people wouldnt reply if they were lazy to read ;D and yea, I dont mind if anyone skips some parts, its up to everyone ;) *paragraph end* + sorry for sarcasm, I just found possible occasion.

 

Every single game has got a class which is overpowered, but this game is so well done, that it requires more than just smashing every single button as other games do. Here, the players used to other games may fall very low if they cannot learn to use evasive abilities and counter attacks, because, thats the half of pvp here :x This is, in my opinion, essential problem for most of the people complaining, they expect the offensive strategy is the best, while this game says the opposite ;) 

 

The result: YES, Summoner is still more op compared to other classes and I hope people will be more satisfied once 50 content is out, anyway I would recommend one thing...just check the videos of these BnS champions and remind yourself the fact they were the same regular players when they started. I think it sounds much better, when someone who is willing to practice says "I learnt to beat this class, its no problem now" instead of spending hours of forums to complain, while they could be practising in the arena ;) And one thing people forget: Do not expect everyone to be playing same way ;) You can meet FM who just figured out how to use keyboard combined with mouse, and later on you can meet FM who will make a roasted chicken of you. The same goes for summoners, even though they require 1% combos and some effort ;)

 

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Alll I see in this forum is summoners defending themselves like

.

"You should do this and block this!"

"While snaring and blah blah and dodge!"

"You guys whine too much!"

"It's not that hard to beat us!"

.

Perhaps summoners should wear our shoes and experience realizing you're up against a summoner 

knowing that you're going to lose not because of who has higher skill level, no, but how outclassed 

you are against them. And when the summoner has finally beat you, you pray to whatever diety to

queue against someone that doesn't need to roll their face onto their keyboard to win only to match 

up against another summoner. The struggle of the mid gold region: facing against 70% summoners 

25% blade dancers and the very unique 5% people who play other classes. It's horrible seeing a defeat

knowing that a summoner got to where they are in their placements due to their 2v1 kit. 

I've maxed leveled my FM, Destroyer, and a high gold assassin but kept my summoner

at level 25. I refused to touch it because I know how it feels to lose to one of them but sometimes I feel like

going to summoner because at the end of the day, the other classes complain while summoners laugh while 

they make soulstones rain... 

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Thank you for your replies guys ;) I appreciate the interest to look at this problem and discuss about it ;) 

 

2 hours ago, domjii said:

 

Alll I see in this forum is summoners defending themselves like

.

"You should do this and block this!"

"While snaring and blah blah and dodge!"

"You guys whine too much!"

"It's not that hard to beat us!"

.

Perhaps summoners should wear our shoes and experience realizing you're up against a summoner 

knowing that you're going to lose not because of who has higher skill level, no, but how outclassed 

you are against them. And when the summoner has finally beat you, you pray to whatever diety to

queue against someone that doesn't need to roll their face onto their keyboard to win only to match 

up against another summoner. The struggle of the mid gold region: facing against 70% summoners 

25% blade dancers and the very unique 5% people who play other classes. It's horrible seeing a defeat

knowing that a summoner got to where they are in their placements due to their 2v1 kit. 

I've maxed leveled my FM, Destroyer, and a high gold assassin but kept my summoner

at level 25. I refused to touch it because I know how it feels to lose to one of them but sometimes I feel like

going to summoner because at the end of the day, the other classes complain while summoners laugh while 

they make soulstones rain... 

 

About the first part, I thought you posted to wrong forum firstly :D Because I couldnt find any of the 4 examples you got there, well, maybe the one about complain obviously :x  Im sorry if it is how you understood it. The whole "defending summoners topic" is about reminding you, that no other thing than train yourself is out there for you, until the next content comes out. Devs have absolutely different problems, they even still cant solve that problem where messaging(?) requires NCcoins to unblock (or wut was it). Do you think that tons of complaining topics will make them nerf this class? I highly doubt about it, since they absolutely pay no attention to this problem and prepare the game for (obviously) late release of content 50, which requires mini patches meanwhile.

 

On the other side, I absolutely agree on your second paragraph, because I experienced summoners as well, and despite Im one of them, I agree they are much stronger than other classes. I saw it while doing dungeons where I could taunt whole wave of mobs on myself and kill them. So, to remind you once more in my 1000th reply :D Im NOT defending summoners, Im just trying to tell you the cruel fact, that summoner is NOT gonna be nerfed until silverfrost content.

 

2 hours ago, Ari-Shadow said:

I hate summoner player when they say "All classes are OP" and when they don't realize how OP is cat.

 

 

Its funny to me because...lol Im offensing my own class and saying its stupidly op, and people, just because they are used to hate summoners, still think Im actually defending it by any possible ways :D Cant find any logic in there. The advice to practice, practice and practice still remains, because this game is not about summoner only. Once your classes are boosted, you need to learn its new techniques everytime. Or do you think you will get naturally better just because of nerfing other class/boosting the one of your own ? :) Just give it a little time to think about it, because once the new content is out, or by any minimal chance summoner gets nerfed even before silverfrost content is out, you are not supposed to complain anymore, because if you do, it just means you wasted the time to complain instead of practising and nothing has actually changed for you ;)

 

Piece to everyone, have a great evening/day ;)

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10 hours ago, Geraton said:

Its funny to me because...lol Im offensing my own class and saying its stupidly op, and people, just because they are used to hate summoners, still think Im actually defending it by any possible ways :D Cant find any logic in there. The advice to practice, practice and practice still remains, because this game is not about summoner only. Once your classes are boosted, you need to learn its new techniques everytime. Or do you think you will get naturally better just because of nerfing other class/boosting the one of your own ? :) Just give it a little time to think about it, because once the new content is out, or by any minimal chance summoner gets nerfed even before silverfrost content is out, you are not supposed to complain anymore, because if you do, it just means you wasted the time to complain instead of practising and nothing has actually changed for you ;)

 

Piece to everyone, have a great evening/day ;)

Summoner will never get nerfed.

This game don't nerf easy classes.

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i only really have one thing to add to this, i made a summoner to prove a point, and my level 25 summoner got up to rank 1700 (mid gold?) yeh that's pretty stupid. if that is not broken i honestly don't know what is, oh and the win ratio was around 80%, not broken my ass lol.

Forgot to mention, no i am not good at all with summoner, it is just that stupidly easy ...

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