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so, are all costumes gonna be like this?


AceMaster

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I'd just like to point out that mr. Hyung Tae Kim is one of the best clothing/character concept artists/designers in the industry - an objective assessment by many who know their stuff and know what to look for and how and know how to objectively gauge the quality of the design/presentation. His ability to make absurd combos that go together and to play with materials and styles in ridiculous ways and somehow make that puzzle stand on its own is probably the best when it comes to any contemporary professional artist.

This is objective and feel free to ask any professional - if it's not someone's cup of tea, that's perfectly fine, but it's also irrelevant if we are to gauge it.

Is he perfect? Hell no. He had major problems in anatomy stylization which he eventually overcame, but his earlier pieces are lacking in that department. For example. I am also fairly sure he wouldn't make a good environment concept artist. But when it comes to clothing design and mixing fantasy with high fashion, there's no one better. Also, he became a monster in stylization and skewing anatomy, I wouldn't say on par with Ingres or the like, but hey if he doesn't stagnate, who knows.

 

The game was made with that in mind - in the sense that the whole point was that the clothing and character design atmosphere was individualized towards emulating his style in 3d 1:1. Which they did an amazing job of, as you can see in the character editor: specific anatomy stylization still works, even with faces and even if we stretch the limits of the character editor.

 

Now, this maybe doesn't have much to do with this thread's notion per se, but I think it's important to point out the magnitude of his influence, craft and commanding position in the art team - AND the notion that the game was pretty much anxiously expected among people in the industry, so we could just see with what he would come up with, even if the game was complete sh-t. Similar to how people can't wait to see new stuff from Djurdjevic, but for different reasons, obviously.

 

But, the whole point of the costume design, anatomy stylization etc. was to have HTK stamped all over it. It's more of a testament and a compilation, than being hired to do professional work and tweak it accordingly. I didn't work on blade and soul, but I have a feeling that they pretty much approached him with a "please, do whatever you like, pls" attitude, rather than "listen, this is the project, we would need this, this and this blablabla".

 

Therefore, I am not going to delve into the discussion at hand, but just wanted to hop in and say that maybe for a blade and soul specifically, it's kind of off point to point out how the outfits are similar in approach, design (or even "level and direction of sexualization" or whatever is the new buzzword for something that's sexy) and feel in a game that figuratively offered itself as an homage. For people who follow those things and are artists or maybe mere enthusiasts even, something like that was the main selling point of the game. 

I'll make an exaggerated example, but just to use a hyperbole to make a point - imagine having a lotr-based game and noticing that there aren't many dragons there or that it lacks a skaven-like faction or something. Maybe the game as in, the product, would indeed gain by addressing those points, but I can't imagine players wishing that in the first place. And it would kinda beat the purpose.

 

This game has HTK plastered on it, and even the derivative new costumes that we see, still follow the guidelines, even those from launch contests or fan art. It's one of the staples of the game - no matter how out of place it might sound to say that for a high profile "soulless" title like this.

 

 

That said, as I've mentioned, this hasn't got much to do with the premise of the topic, but I thought I could shed some light about the whole outfits/setting/women notion.

We don't know, they could stray away for the western version in future costumes, for all we know. Still, that is something I wouldn't want to happen. Maybe in blade and soul 2, with a different art director and the different approach to design and the different place of said designers in the hierarchy.

I understand the notion of being a player and/or a customer, but when it comes to some things, I would rather abstain from them than disturb the notion with my preferences. Blade and soul is one of the VERY rare AAA titles which actually had this kind of "non-juggernaut" approach when it comes to one of the aspects (character and outfit design and styliation). Which I think is something very rare and very valuable and should not be tweaked and tampered with for the sake of one's preferences.

I am absolutely sure that 99.99% of you is going to disagree, but that thing alone makes this game something a bit more than a pure product, which is, again, very rarely seen in high profile games (especially multiplayer-oriented) and should be "cherished" if anything. Even if you hate it as it is in that department.

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Jut to add my two cents on this, on the other side of the coin. I play with male characters. However, I am also quite frustrated about the costumes - because outside of male gon, male costumes are very conservative. The costumes often have long coats or baggy pants to cover thighs / buttocks. If something is showing, it's arms / or in few rare cases the abs. I would really, really love to have more sexy / cute variety for male characters. (and yes, before anyone mentions it - I have "my angel" for my jin. It's awesome costume.)

 

However, if there are players with female character that would prefer the conservative baggy pants / long coats, and player with male character that would honestly like to see more skin/ tighter clothes... would it be impossible to remove the gender lock to costumes? Or give non genderlocked versions to cash store? 

 

No, I don't know anything about coding or animation design. However, to give you an example, in Saints Row 4, all the costumes and cosmetic items had no genderlock. It was a game similar to Blade & Soul in that the player had option to adjust the body type to certain decree, and there were a lot of costumes/cosmetic packs you could buy as additions to the game. But like I mentioned, there was no gender lock. I could make a male character and have him wear leggins and tank tops, miniskirts, stockings and what not. However, at the same time my friends had option to dress their female characters into more pragmatic "fighter" look.

 

As I see it, there are plenty of serious and pragmatic "fighter" costume designs available, but they are for locked for male characters only. (Ofc, there are cute options for lyns). Would it be absolutely out of question to solve 2 issues at the same time? Give the non-sexualised looks for female characters - and the sexy and cute options for male characters, at least through future cash shop items?     

 

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2 minutes ago, Aerasani said:

 

And yet it is harmful as oodles of research has shown.  Viewing women as objects depersonalizes them and devalues them.  That is a fact that no one should deny.  This leads to viewing women as lesser which leads directly to the sexism we see in the world today.  The biggest hypocrites are those who look at the past and say how wrong it is that women were viewed as property and yet perpetuate the constant devaluing of women in current society.  Ever wonder why *cricket* is so prevalent?  That comes from the disconnect between a woman's body and her personhood.  This disconnect is created by all the media we have depicting woman's bodies as objects for the viewers pleasure.  It is a problem and it needs to be curbed.

Well, i like looking at pretty girls everywhere i can, but even so i'm not viewing them as lesser. I never thought that this actually is a thing, the disconnect between body and personality. As i see it, what attracts us to each other is the look of a person (sure one can don't really like the look of the other, but with time one can fall in love with other because of personality) and then we get to know each other. Without the sexual drive, we would be extinct.

 

I think there is no problem with female sexualization, there is a problem with society. We can't raise our children properly, the world is getting worse and worse. Well i can't raise children yet, i'm 17, but i grow up in the already sexualized world and still i give females proper respect. I even admire them. Watching sexy game characters, well... watching anything with sexualized females won't change it, because i was raised properly, thanks to my parents.

 

But this is just my point of view. Girls are cool.

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6 minutes ago, Aerasani said:

 

Have fun continuing to perpetuate a world in which women are oppressed then.  I'm sure your female family and friends are so proud!

 

And the game is here in the US.  We have every right to complain about it seeing as NCSoft does have input into the game as the foreign publisher.  There have already been edits and they can do more.  Plus there is the fact that no matter if these issues generate in a different country they are now directly effecting this country so I have every right and duty to talk about it.

I really hope you get payed well then... just kidding. ;)

 

I agree, you have all the right to criticize it, you also have the right to not play/watch the game, but you have no right to judge it or demand changes - that's where your rights end and the rights of the creators begin. See how that works?

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I make jewelry and do sculpting with polymer clay and I have been really inspired by some of the jewelry and costume designs in this game.  I just told my family that I am thinking about making some jewelry that features each Hongmoon weapon of each class and add the embellishments from some of the jewelry I see in this game.  I also want to make a collection of the Lyn race as little statues!  

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2 minutes ago, Wintermaul said:

So a few things I have an issue with in this.

1. You are suggesting that something ON A VIDEO GAME affects the real world view.. interesting... Do you also believe if I play need for speed I will race? OR if i play GTA I will go on a murder spree? Curious

2. You are playing an ASIAN VIDEOGAME, have you not seen Dead or alive? Tera? I dont need your kind ruining the video game industrial when Companys already are.

3. You say these make people Discredit women, So what about the Women WHO SAY "I can wear what i want doesnt mean Im asking for it?" Do I fall under a worse catergory because I play a game and w/ one revealing piece of clothing? but its okay for that girl on the street to say its okay and shes good, she loves her body? Sound like a double standard.

4. I will point this out again THIS IS A ASIAN MMO, a majority of its customer base is MALE they like females with those cloths as well as lolis.

5. I have yet to see a PERSON Who acutally plays one of these games go out and OBJECTIFY a women, but more over treat her with respect, What do you say to that?

 

 

 

1. Of course it effects the real world.  These things do not exist in a vacuum.  They effect culture and culture effects them.  You seem to not understand psychology at all honestly.  While no, you are not going to go out and slaughter people because you did that in a video game you may, and probably will, be more used to violence.  Though the effect of violence in video games is far outstripped by the actual violence that goes on in the world so it's not really relevant.  

2. It's an Asian videogame ported to america.  What's your point?  It exists here and it effects us here.

3. That is completely different and it saddens me that you can't see that.  A woman has a choice in what she wears.  We don't have a choice in the depictions of women that treat us as objects.  

4. The only reason the majority of the customer base is male is due to sexism.  The majority of people who play video games are female.  Almost half of all MMO players are female.  They just play games that threat them like people such as FFXIV which is ALSO an asian MMO and yet treats it's females much better and not like objects.  

5. Then you're not paying attention and/or do not know what objectification is.  Objectification is rampant.  Every male who plays this game for the sexy women is objectifying women.  Every.  Single.  One.  

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26 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

Yea yea, I heard all that in buckets over the last couple of years - believe whatever you will, I'm not here to challenge your slanted education, however - it still doesn't change the fact that judging art from foreign cultures with "western" glasses on, is everything from hypocritical to narrow minded and xenophobe... take your pick there.

 

So it's xenophobic to judge another person's culture based on common practices? I can't comment on the rampant victimization and abuse of women in Saudi Arabia because I'm foreign? That's silly. Just because I'm not a part of a particular culture does not mean I cannot form an opinion of it. Nor does it make me xenophobic or narrow-minded if I view the practices of one culture to be undesirable.

 

Nor am I saying that my culture is any better and that I judge from a pedestal, because I challenge the same issues within my own culture. The point is that this type of objectification of women is universal and it shouldn't be. It does not accord with the values I believe make a decent and just society. However, to call someone xenophobic because they find male-designed, scantily-clad women sexist is ignorant and ignores a wider issue.

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If you don't like it that much, ask the devs to have or allow the option to use China's "Harmonization" patch that alters most of the female costumes.

 

Here is an example: 


Keep in mind, this should be an option and not a forced change on everyone. I for one like how my characters look in the outfits because it is my preference. There are some outfits where the change is welcome but for the most part, should be optional.

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29 minutes ago, Sumerechny said:

Well, i like looking at pretty girls everywhere i can, but even so i'm not viewing them as lesser. I never thought that this actually is a thing, the disconnect between body and personality. As i see it, what attracts us to each other is the look of a person (sure one can don't really like the look of the other, but with time one can fall in love with other because of personality) and then we get to know each other. Without the sexual drive, we would be extinct.

 

I think there is no problem with female sexualization, there is a problem with society. We can't raise our children properly, the world is getting worse and worse. Well i can't raise children yet, i'm 17, but i grow up in the already sexualized world and still i give females proper respect. I even admire them. Watching sexy game characters, well... watching anything with sexualized females won't change it, because i was raised properly, thanks to my parents.

 

But this is just my point of view. Girls are cool.

 

I'm glad your parents seem to have taught you well.  Unfortunately, the same can't be said for a lot of people.  Sexism exists and the objectification of women directly creates that sexism, along with other factors as well.  To deny the effect of objectification is to deny the sexism that still takes place in the Western world.

 

29 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

I really hope you get payed well then... just kidding. ;)

 

I agree, you have all the right to criticize it, you also have the right to not play/watch the game, but you have no right to judge it or demand changes - that's where your rights end and the rights of the creators begin. See how that works?

 

Except that even if I don't play or watch the game it still effects me.  That means that it's still within my rights to protest such things.

 

22 minutes ago, totmacher said:

 

 

O hey look!  Someone who really doesn't get it!  Skimpy outfits are not the problem.  The extreme prevalence of skimpy outfits is the problem.  

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10 minutes ago, Asuka said:

I'd just like to point out that mr. Hyung Tae Kim is one of the best clothing/character concept artists/designers in the industry - an objective assessment by many who know their stuff and know what to look for and how and know how to objectively gauge the quality of the design/presentation. His ability to make absurd combos that go together and to play with materials and styles in ridiculous ways and somehow make that puzzle stand on its own is probably the best when it comes to any contemporary professional artist.

This is objective and feel free to ask any professional - if it's not someone's cup of tea, that's perfectly fine, but it's also irrelevant if we are to gauge it.

Is he perfect? Hell no. He had major problems in anatomy stylization which he eventually overcame, but his earlier pieces are lacking in that department. For example. I am also fairly sure he wouldn't make a good environment concept artist. But when it comes to clothing design and mixing fantasy with high fashion, there's no one better. Also, he became a monster in stylization and skewing anatomy, I wouldn't say on par with Ingres or the like, but hey if he doesn't stagnate, who knows.

 

But, the whole point of the costume design, anatomy stylization etc. was to have HTK stamped all over it. It's more of a testament and a compilation, than being hired to do professional work and tweak it accordingly. I didn't work on blade and soul, but I have a feeling that they pretty much approached him with a "please, do whatever you like, pls" attitude, rather than "listen, this is the project, we would need this, this and this blablabla".

 

That's not objectivity, that's cultural relativism.

 

Now, this maybe doesn't have much to do with this thread's notion per se, but I think it's important to point out the magnitude of his influence, craft and commanding position in the art team - AND the notion that the game was pretty much anxiously expected among people in the industry, so we could just see with what he would come up with, even if the game was complete sh-t. Similar to how people can't wait to see new stuff from Djurdjevic, but for different reasons, obviously.

 

If the game was bad I wouldn't play it. It can look as pretty as it wants but if it has bad mechanics I'm not going to invest my time into it.

 

I'll make an exaggerated example, but just to use a hyperbole to make a point - imagine having a lotr-based game and noticing that there aren't many dragons there or that it lacks a skaven-like faction or something. Maybe the game as in, the product, would indeed gain by addressing those points, but I can't imagine players wishing that in the first place. And it would kinda beat the purpose.

 

This game has HTK plastered on it, and even the derivative new costumes that we see, still follow the guidelines, even those from launch contests or fan art. It's one of the staples of the game - no matter how out of place it might sound to say that for a high profile "soulless" title like this.

 

You're right, that was exaggerating. The presentation of dragons is far removed from that of women (one being based on fictional creatures). I think BnS could very well sell itself without the input of HTK. MMOs aren't designed to be a personal wardrobe.

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6 minutes ago, SabreIshi said:

If you don't like it that much, ask the devs to have or allow the option to use China's "Harmonization" patch that alters most of the female costumes.

 

Here is an example: 

Keep in mind, this should be an option and not a forced change on everyone. I for one like how my characters look in the outfits because it is my preference. There are some outfits where the change is welcome but for the most part, should be optional.

 

Some of those outfits look so much better "censored".  Sometimes the amount of skin shown with some of the outfits actually detracts from it aesthetically.  You can tell when an outfit is made specifically to show skin rather than to look the best it can.

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4 minutes ago, Aerasani said:

 

1. Of course it effects the real world.  These things do not exist in a vacuum.  They effect culture and culture effects them.  You seem to not understand psychology at all honestly.  While no, you are not going to go out and slaughter people because you did that in a video game you may, and probably will, be more used to violence.  Though the effect of violence in video games is far outstripped by the actual violence that goes on in the world so it's not really relevant.  

2. It's an Asian videogame ported to america.  What's your point?  It exists here and it effects us here.

3. That is completely different and it saddens me that you can't see that.  A woman has a choice in what she wears.  We don't have a choice in the depictions of women that treat us as objects.  

4. The only reason the majority of the customer base is male is due to sexism.  The majority of people who play video games are female.  Almost half of all MMO players are female.  They just play games that threat them like people such as FFXIV which is ALSO an asian MMO and yet treats it's females much better and not like objects.  

5. Then you're not paying attention and/or do not know what objectification is.  Objectification is rampant.  Every male who plays this game for the sexy women is objectifying women.  Every.  Single.  One.  

1. Okay got it you think Killers are made from video games as well. GOT It. People can determain the diffrence between Fiction  and reality.

 

2. This is an Issue, and I don't think you understand the gaming culture very well. Dead or alive is my prime example LInk

 

3. So let me get this stright, You want me as a person of my own choices to be made to have the choice THROWN onto me to deny my right to have a character of my choosing on a VIDEOGAME PIXELS MIND YOU, because you dont want woman Sexualized, But it is okay for a woman to go the beach and Sexualize herself infront of everyone because it's her choice? What about the people who made that clothing? I'm sensing DOUBLE STANDARDS everywhere. Don't sue me for holding the door open for you.

 

4. INCORRECT, The majority of the gaming population IN ASIA (as i said) IS male. Therefore the games are customized for them and NOT YOU. This game was brought to the US because people wanted it, and IF you are right and FEMALES are the majority they will RUIN this choice and further choices to allow anything that ISNT WORLD OF WARCRAFT (Which has some VERY slutty transmogs) to rain supreme. Also you say females are the majority but 7/10 groups i get there is 6/6 males and then 1/6 females in the 3/10 groups. so where are the stats in that? Links my mate, provide them.

 

5. I will raise you a question Do you think Smite objectfies women?

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1 minute ago, Lyrebon said:

That's not objectivity, that's cultural relativism.

 

No, it's objectivity. There are laws, levels and measures in art by which you can gauge these things quite effectively, which are objective and consistent throughout the cultures.

 

Audiences might receive things differently but that has nothing to do with the fundamental objective position of one's work.

 

The fact that I absolutely can't stand Dali has absolutely nothing to do with quality of his work. Also, that fact doesn't limit me in objective assessment of his work either, as I know what to look, how to look and have the experience, both in theory and in practice. It also has nothing to do with me being a cool person or whatever - there are many areas I don't know anything about.

 

 

8 minutes ago, Lyrebon said:

If the game was bad I wouldn't play it. It can look as pretty as it wants but if it has bad mechanics I'm not going to invest my time into it.

 

And you shouldn't. My notion addressed a different point.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Lyrebon said:

You're right, that was exaggerating. The presentation of dragons is far removed from that of women (one being based on fictional creatures). I think BnS could very well sell itself without the input of HTK. MMOs aren't designed to be a personal wardrobe.

That has nothing to do with my point. 

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Sigh.. I knew this would happen. All the OP wanted was for less-sexualized costumes to be released here and there and that's totally fine, but then of course as expected someone has to come in with "they're treating (pixels) women like sexual objects!".

 

3c9.gif

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28 minutes ago, Gamerchick said:

I make jewelry and do sculpting with polymer clay and I have been really inspired by some of the jewelry and costume designs in this game.  I just told my family that I am thinking about making some jewelry that features each Hongmoon weapon of each class and add the embellishments from some of the jewelry I see in this game.  I also want to make a collection of the Lyn race as little statues!  

It is nice to see someone inspired by the designs and not pushing either "custimur" or social agenda. I wish you all the best in your endeavors:)

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While I certainly understand the vexation with the sexualized aspect...I have to admit that most MMO's are "no returns" policy when it comes to costumes. And you can end up not liking a costume that isn't sexualized, just as much as you can end up not liking a costume because it is sexualized. So it's not the overt sexualization that's really the issue, it's simply that you want to be able to return the costumes once you've bought them. 

 

And most MMO's don't allow that. I found that the Viewing room for this game is better then most as it comes to comparing the costumes to how they would look in the game. They even provide multiple backgrounds to compare contrast and lighting. Is it perfect? No, but then again no dressing room would be. I think that outside of literally allowing a player to try the costume for a few days in the real environment.

 

That's a possible option. Make costumes returnable for 2-3 days, and then they automatically bind. But, most f2p MMO's rely on costume purchases heavily to make up for those who are playing "on the house". This ones no exception. and Most MMO's aren't into allowing players to return a costume once worn. makes for allot of complexity when it comes to stuff like that, and I think most MMO's rely on the natural aspect of a player being hooked on the game to keep them as a "customer". 

 

Having said all that, this game (unlike others) actually has a system that allows you to craft costumes, and salvage others...not a bad attempt at giving us more options. sure it's not as fast as we'd like...but then again, costumes are their "cash cow" so I'm not surprised that they haven't give us a system to completely replace costume purchases. That would be detrimental to the games financial security.

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6 minutes ago, Asuka said:

It is nice to see someone inspired by the designs and not pushing either "custimur" or social agenda. I wish you all the best in your endeavors:)

Totally agree. This is the first game in a long time that I've been really impressed with their costume designs. I don't like them all, but they're all quite detailed, and very classy looking...and the selection has plenty of options. 

 

And for the first time in awhile, I'm happy that an asian game has a Loli class that actually has decent clothing. I like my little people to look like little people :) and not a 6 yr old girl dressed up for pervy uncle mort.

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Just now, Wintermaul said:

1. Okay got it you think Killers are made from video games as well. GOT It. People can determain the diffrence between Fiction  and reality.

 

2. This is an Issue, and I don't think you understand the gaming culture very well. Dead or alive is my prime example LInk

 

3. So let me get this stright, You want me as a person of my own choices to be made to have the choice THROWN onto me to deny my right to have a character of my choosing on a VIDEOGAME PIXELS MIND YOU, because you dont want woman Sexualized, But it is okay for a woman to go the beach and Sexualize herself infront of everyone because it's her choice? What about the people who made that clothing? I'm sensing DOUBLE STANDARDS everywhere. Don't sue me for holding the door open for you.

 

4. INCORRECT, The majority of the gaming population IN ASIA (as i said) IS male. Therefore the games are customized for them and NOT YOU. This game was brought to the US because people wanted it, and IF you are right and FEMALES are the majority they will RUIN this choice and further choices to allow anything that ISNT WORLD OF WARCRAFT (Which has some VERY slutty transmogs) to rain supreme. Also you say females are the majority but 7/10 groups i get there is 6/6 males and then 1/6 females in the 3/10 groups. so where are the stats in that? Links my mate, provide them.

 

5. I will raise you a question Do you think Smite objectfies women?

 

1. That's not the point at all. What we design in media is indicative of the cultural attitudes we're accustomed to. Violence is included in media because we're attracted to violence, we find it exhilarating and empowering. The objectification of women comes from thousands of years of gender divide in which men have always been the dominant, and the continued projection of women as something to leer at in media is the problem. So many times I've walked into a forum thread where someone has commented, "check out those boobs", or some form of sexualized comment. While that's not bad in itself, as physical attraction is perfectly human and instinctual, it's that so many people allow for the victimization of women because of these attitudes expressed through media. The idea that it's the woman's fault for dressing "inappropriately", meaning she "must want it", is just one example.

 

The problem isn't sexy outfits, it's that they mostly come from a society that has accepted and treats sexism less severely than it actually is. Keep the outfits, what I'm challenging isn't your right to wear them, I'm challenging your awareness of the issues surrounding them.

 

2. DoA Extreme I take issue with. I refused to play it because it was basically just jiggle physics. Team Ninja developed an entire physics system for the breasts alone.

 

3. The difference is relative. No woman would walk down a busy high-street in a bikini. You go to the beach with the purpose of getting a tan. BnS features outfits I would only wear to bed/for a sexual partner that can be worn at all times, everywhere.

 

4. And don't you see that as an issue? That something is specifically tailored to the prevalence of sexism in society?

 

5. I have no idea what Smite is so I can't comment.

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1 minute ago, Wintermaul said:

1. Okay got it you think Killers are made from video games as well. GOT It. People can determain the diffrence between Fiction  and reality.

 

2. This is an Issue, and I don't think you understand the gaming culture very well. Dead or alive is my prime example LInk

 

3. So let me get this stright, You want me as a person of my own choices to be made to have the choice THROWN onto me to deny my right to have a character of my choosing on a VIDEOGAME PIXELS MIND YOU, because you dont want woman Sexualized, But it is okay for a woman to go the beach and Sexualize herself infront of everyone because it's her choice? What about the people who made that clothing? I'm sensing DOUBLE STANDARDS everywhere. Don't sue me for holding the door open for you.

 

4. INCORRECT, The majority of the gaming population IN ASIA (as i said) IS male. Therefore the games are customized for them and NOT YOU. This game was brought to the US because people wanted it, and IF you are right and FEMALES are the majority they will RUIN this choice and further choices to allow anything that ISNT WORLD OF WARCRAFT (Which has some VERY slutty transmogs) to rain supreme. Also you say females are the majority but 7/10 groups i get there is 6/6 males and then 1/6 females in the 3/10 groups. so where are the stats in that? Links my mate, provide them.

 

5. I will raise you a question Do you think Smite objectfies women?

 

1. Do you have issues with reading comprehension or did you just stop reading after the first sentence?  That is not what I said at all.  Please go reread what I said and try to actually understand it this time.

2. I've been a part of gaming culture for decades and MMOs specifically for almost a decade.  I understand gaming culture very well thank you.  So you see an issue with games not being released that extremely objectify women?  Really?  I personally don't.  And if it makes the Asian creators of the games actually think when they're unable to release in the Western world then that is fantastic.

3. You also seem to misunderstand.  The issue is not skimpy clothing.  The issue is a prevalence of skimpy clothing with very little choice outside of it.  The point of this is CHOICE and CONSENT.

4. You never said customer base in Asia.  You said customer base which includes every country it has been released in.  My point still stands about sexism.  The reason why the majority of the video game base in Asia as a whole is male is due to the sexism in those countries.  

Link to most recent study on gender in video games.  The percentage of females who play MMOs fluctuates between the low in this link (33%) and over 45% dependent on the study and the game itself.  Like this game probably has a low female player base while a game like FFXIV probably has a very high one.  Also, I'm not basing anything on World of Warcraft.  I'm comparing it to another Asian MMO that has one of the biggest populations in the world, FFXIV.

PS. A lot of female gamers play as male to avoid harassment that is very prevalent in games like this.

5. I've played SMITE like once; if that.  I can't judge it without playing it.

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5 minutes ago, Aerasani said:

Except that even if I don't play or watch the game it still effects me.  That means that it's still within my rights to protest such things.

Of course - and other people have all the right to ignore you and/or call you a self important, reactionary child that takes it's believes about the world from people just as clueless as itself, for it. Alas, both actions - just as the depiction of women in games (or any other form of entertainment for that matter) - shouldn't be, and aren't of any real consequence.

 

Don't get me wrong - societies are influenced by their art, there is no doubt about that, but art (in the widest sense) is also an expression of culture, and as such has a reason for being as it is... if the culture changes, the art changes accordingly. So, if one really wants to bring about societal change - which a small but VERY vocal minority (about 18% in the US right now) claim to want to do - attacking the art is really not going to help anyone.

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12 minutes ago, Deshadi said:

Sigh.. I knew this would happen. All the OP wanted was for less-sexualized costumes to be released here and there and that's totally fine, but then of course as expected someone has to come in with "they're treating (pixels) women like sexual objects!".

 

So it's alright for people to say that "no women should be sexualized" but not for me to say the opposite?  I did not start this discussion.  Others sexism did.

 

3 minutes ago, WarBaby2 said:

Of course - and other people have all the right to ignore you and/or call you a self important, reactionary child that takes it's believes about the world from people just as clueless as itself, for it. Alas, both actions - just as the depiction of women in games (or any other form of entertainment for that matter) - shouldn't be, and aren't of any real consequence.

 

Don't get me wrong - societies are influenced by their art, there is no doubt about that, but art (in the widest sense) is also an expression of culture, and as such has a reason for being as it is... if the culture changes, the art changes accordingly. So, if one really wants to bring about societal change - which a small but VERY vocal minority (about 18% in the US right now) claim to want to do - attacking the art is really not going to help anyone.

 

Hmmmm.  So scientists who study this type of thing for a living are "just as clueless" as I am?  That makes so much sense!

 

Just because you deny the consequence doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

The effect goes both ways.  Society influences art/media and art/media influences society.  Did you know that women only started shaving their legs in part due to a targeted marketing campaign by Gillette started in the late 1910s?  Gillette wanted to make more money but they couldn't find a way to make men buy more razors.  So they began a targeted marketing campaign to open up a new source of income from women.  This was matched by women's fashion suddenly talking about "smooth legs and underarms" and so our views of hairless women were born!  Source

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As it seems, SJW with absolutely no idea what this game was / is and really have no clue to the inherent contradictions of their 'oh it's sexism' and 'empower women' cries while at the same time trying to shame anyone who thinks the human body (and person) is a beautiful thing are polluting this thread.  One can only hope that NCSoft doesn't compound their error of the 'localization team' (a sick joke BTW) they hired by listening to these people.

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