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Aluvis

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I am getting allergic to the AMD-fanboyism to be honest.

 

Now, if AMD could make a good gaming cpu at competitive price, then I´d recommend AMD as much as you would. However AMD has been losing for a decade to Intels faster, and more effecient cpus. It´s not a claim - it´s common knowledge and general consensus that any google search will lead you to.

 

@Yxion recommends AMD A10-6800K , which is a quadcore cpu that loses to and old Intel i3-4130, Slow single-threaded performance.

 

Amazon UK prices AMD A10-6800K at £105.49 http://www.amazon.co.uk/AMD-Processor-AD680KWOHLBOX-Technology-Virtualization/dp/B00CPLGGXM/ref=sr_1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1454068948&sr=1-1&keywords=A10-6800K+%2C

Amazon UK prices  i3-6300 at £105.00 http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B016FXR6XO/?tag=pcp0f-21

 

Prices are the same, so lets see a comparison on performance between the 2:

http://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i3-6300-vs-AMD-A10-6800K-APU/3536vs2936

Result summary : same priced intel cpu has

+ 50% faster effective speed. This result gets better when compared to gaming alone.

+ 34% faster single-core speed.

+ 48% faster OC potential.

+ Marginally newer tech

+ 53% more energy efficient

+ Considerably cooler (better oc potential)

 

And yes, all skylake chips can be overclocked with huge gains - even though its not a true k-series chip.

 

There´s no reason to discuss AMD VS INTEL cpu for gaming. Intel wins hands down with so huge margins that even amd-fans has admitted and accepted this fact. AMD may come with a comeback (let´s hope yeah?) - but right now, budget range or not - intel has the best cpu´s for gaming.

 

 

 

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Yxion its fine to compare a APU to  most intel consumer CPU's because  intel cpu are a cpu and gpu as well. iris pro IGPU is more powerful then any apu gpu and skylakes igpu is equal to all of the apu's graphics performance.

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13 minutes ago, Yxion said:

Only AMD CPU I recommend is the FX-9590

Trying to compare an AMD APU to an Intel CPU is impossible.

An APU is not just a CPU, but a CPU-GPU combined.

 

People compare AMD chips to Intel chips everyday - every minute. Even AMDs and Intels own crew do it on a daily basis - nothing impossible about it.

Even though a Ferrari and a Volvo are different car-brands, doesn´t make it impossible to have a little race. Ferrari obviously wins hands down to the superior tech and raw horsepower. It´s the same with Intel and AMD at the moment (sadly).

 

FX-9590 doesn´t even have as good gaming performance as the cheaper i5-4460. FX-9590 is priced around 200 USD and so is i5-4460. One of the most respected tech-forums on the web, had a discussion about this very chip, where a senior moderator states, that he recommends going with the cheaper and better intel-rig.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2578435/intel-4460-amd-9590.html

 

Reason why I never would recommend the FX-Series is

1) They are priced horribly

2) Core-by-core they have bad performance compared to similar priced intel cores

3) They draw too much power

4) They have lower tolerance to heat than intel cores and their idle temp is higher than intel.

5) Throttle issues at overclocking, making it harder to maintain a good overclock without a custom loop liquid cooling system (which only the enthusiant overclocker should do)

 

 

NB. You seem to throw around the term APU alot. I ignored it the first times, as you´d always be preferring to use a dedicated graphics card for gaming and never an APU.

 

You do know that basically every Intel CPU has a integrated graphics - except the workstation line of cpu named XEON and perhaps the i7-xtreme yeah?

 

APU and integrated graphics means nothing when you´re not using it, and you have a dedicated graphics card like a Radeon or nVidia card.

Makes no sense, you keep mentioned it.

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I have:

 

AMD FX 8350

ASUS CROSSHAIR V FORMULA Z

16GB GSKILL RIPJAWS 2133MHZ

ASUS XONAR ESSENCE STX SOUNDCARD

2X GEFORCE 660GTX SLI

ASUS VG248QE LCD

WINDOWS 7

 

I get around 110 ~ 119 fps most of the times and 55 ~ 70 fps in crowded areas

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9 minutes ago, Victorion said:

 

People compare AMD chips to Intel chips everyday - every minute. Even AMDs and Intels own crew do it on a daily basis - nothing impossible about it.

Even though a Ferrari and a Volvo are different car-brands, doesn´t make it impossible to have a little race. Ferrari obviously wins hands down to the superior tech and raw horsepower. It´s the same with Intel and AMD at the moment (sadly).

 

FX-9590 doesn´t even have as good gaming performance as the cheaper i5-4460. FX-9590 is priced around 200 USD and so is i5-4460. One of the most respected tech-forums on the web, had a discussion about this very chip, where a senior moderator states, that he recommends going with the cheaper and better intel-rig.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2578435/intel-4460-amd-9590.html

 

Reason why I never would recommend the FX-Series is

1) They are priced horribly

2) Core-by-core they have bad performance compared to similar priced intel cores

3) They draw too much power

4) They have lower tolerance to heat than intel cores and their idle temp is higher than intel.

5) Throttle issues at overclocking, making it harder to maintain a good overclock without a custom loop liquid cooling system (which only the enthusiant overclocker should do)

 

 

NB. You seem to throw around the term APU alot. I ignored it the first times, as you´d always be preferring to use a dedicated graphics card for gaming and never an APU.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2230&cmp[]=2014

 

Yeah no thanks....

the A-Series from AMD are not dedicated cpus. they are meant to be a budget cpu/gpu combo solution for compact systems that either dont have the space for a gpu via pci-express or dont need it.

 

Also, I could care less about  power draw, i have a platnum rated psu, led monitors, led lights in my house, energy efficient appliances, i think one power hog cpu is allowed. hell i even drive a civic

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1 minute ago, Yxion said:

 

You have no idea what to look for. Stop trying to give other players the impression that you have, Your advice is misplaced, incompetent and wrong.

Even if you got heated up argueing with me - at least respect the experience of a Senior Moderator from TomsHardware, that clearly describes the superiority of going Intel over AMD FX-9590.

 

 

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4 hours ago, Aluvis said:

Specs:

 

OS: WIndows 10 Home Edition

CPU; AMD A4-5400 APU

GPU; Radeon HD 7800 Series

Mobo, Model: MSI, FM2-A75IA-E53 (MS-7792)

Hard-Drive: Samsung 850 EVO 120GB SSD

Memory: 8GB DDR3 RAM

Nice, you already have the optimal hard drive and RAM. :) So just focus on upgrading the motherboard and CPU only.

 

Hows your budget on upgrading? The priority is always CPU + motherboard, however you need to consider balancing the upgrades with your GPU as well. Although AMD HD7800 is a top tier at its time and provide no issue on giving decent graphics, this series is quite an old GPU. Even if you can afford for, let say, Intel Core i7 6700, that's really waste your money in overall since the GPU will bottleneck. Unless you plan to upgrade in stages (CPU + mobo first, GPU later), its better to buy the best CPU for your AMD HD7800 series. High end AMD FX series or any Intel Core i5 4th gen will do.

 

In short, The recommendation is not changed, but I can assume dropping the A10 6800K, RAM upgrades, SSD and Intel 6th options:

1. Buy AM3+ motherboard + FX-8350 or better 
2. Buy socket 1150 motherboard + Core i5 4460 or better

3. Buy socket 1150 motherboard + Core i7 4790 first, and upgrade the graphics later (at least AMD R9 280x or GTX 970 to match)

 

Please remember that even Blade and Soul is CPU dependant, upgrading PC is not for Blade and Soul only, consider other games / apps as well (unless that's your PC only purpose) :)

 

I'm lazy to participate in AMD + Intel wars like some of you guys. But please, stay on the topic. Simply telling "this CPU is good, those are bad" and so on are not helping the thread starter, but instead showing your stupidity.

 

And last but not least, this is Blade and Soul we're talking about. Very poor in gaming optimization, majorly because of using old DX9 and UE3. That's why even the powerful PC (i7-6700k processor, 3000MHz DDR4, GTX Titan X) can touch even 13 fps due to the game poor performance and stability (link here). Blame the game and developer, not the CPUs and specs.

 

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1 minute ago, Victorion said:

 

You have no idea what to look for. Stop trying to give other players the impression that you have, Your advice is misplaced, incompetent and wrong.

Even if you got heated up argueing with me - at least respect the experience of a Senior Moderator from TomsHardware, that clearly describes the superiority of going Intel over AMD FX-9590.

 

 

Tom's Hardware is nothing more than a PC tabloid that gets endorsements to push whoever is paying them more money. They have been and always will be biased.

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4 minutes ago, shadowzephyr said:

Nice, you already have the optimal hard drive and RAM. :) So just focus on upgrading the motherboard and CPU only.

 

Hows your budget on upgrading? The priority is always CPU + motherboard, however you need to consider balancing the upgrades with your GPU as well. Although AMD HD7800 is a top tier at its time and provide no issue on giving decent graphics, this series is quite an old GPU. Even if you can afford for, let say, Intel Core i7 6700, that's really waste your money in overall since the GPU will bottleneck. Unless you plan to upgrade in stages (CPU + mobo first, GPU later), its better to buy the best CPU for your AMD HD7800 series. High end AMD FX series or any Intel Core i5 4th gen will do.

 

In short, The recommendation is not changed, but I can assume dropping the A10 6800K, RAM upgrades, SSD and Intel 6th options:

1. Buy AM3+ motherboard + FX-8350 or better 
2. Buy socket 1150 motherboard + Core i5 4460 or better

3. Buy socket 1150 motherboard + Core i7 4790 first, and upgrade the graphics later (at least AMD R9 280x or GTX 970 to match)

 

Please remember that even Blade and Soul is CPU dependant, upgrading PC is not for Blade and Soul only, consider other games / apps as well (unless that's your PC only purpose) :)

 

I'm lazy to participate in AMD + Intel wars like some of you guys. But please, stay on the topic. Simply telling "this CPU is good, those are bad" and so on are not helping the thread starter, but instead showing your stupidity.

 

And last but not least, this is Blade and Soul we're talking about. Very poor in gaming optimization, majorly because of using old DX9 and UE3. That's why even the powerful PC (i7-6700k processor, 3000MHz DDR4, GTX Titan X) can touch even 13 fps due to the game poor performance and stability (link here). Blame the game and developer, not the CPUs and specs.

 

 

Thanks for getting the thread into the correct line again. While I agree with mostly everything you said, I´d comment that i5 is all you really want for BnS and general gaming too.

While a few titles may see smaller gains from more than 4 threads - the titles are few and far between and the gain going above 4 threads is too small to justify a higher CPU price.

 

Budget wise the options is to go for

1) i5-4460 with a cheaper mobo.

2) i3 or i5-6xxx @ 3.2 Ghz or higher, Like i5-6500 perhaps. Pair it with Evo 212 cooler and a Z170 mobo and start overclocking.

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6 minutes ago, Luffs said:

If your getting an AMD then wait for the new Zens because it will require a new AM4+ mainboard too

 

AMD Zen is mapped for Oct 2016 - and like nVidias Pascalbased GPUs, I wouldn´t be surprised to see it being postponed.

Right now it´s only rumours, and it´s likely to be the last attempt from AMD to get back into the fight with Intel. So I would advice not to get your hopes up.

 

Getting a skylake cpu right now, is a good choice. Look at the i5-2700K which is 4 year old CPU from intel. Still going strong and able to run any tripple A titles out there without sweat. Chances are that skylake wont get outdated for the next 4-5 years either.

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if your crazy like me you can always do something like this but  it is in no what ever needed

CPU: intel i7 5930k

mainboard: ASUS x99 Sabertooth

ram: Corsaire LPX DDR 2666 32 gig quad channel kit

Cooling: Custom water cooling loop

Storage: Intel 750 NVME SSD 1.2 TB assorded WD blacks for mass storage all games on the intel drive

GPU: 2x EVGA SC 980ti with EK water blocks.

soundcard: Soundblaster ZXr

cooling partlist: xspc raystorm cpu block
xspc rx 480
Xspc ex 480
Xspc ex 240
x2 Ek acetal full cover titan x blocks
x 14 bits power revolver rigid compression fittings
x4 xspc 90 rotary fittings
1 xspc male to female g1/4 
1 alphacool male to male 90
1 bits power valve
xspc photon + d5 combo
x16 phobya eloop 1800 rpm
x2 phanteks own hubs 
PSU: evga supernova 1000 p2
Ogre sleeving 

 

Monitors: LG 34UM95-p 3440x1400 IPS, 2x Acer K2272hul  2560x1440 IPS screens

GJzwETF.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Sudako said:

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/sunako/saved/#view=4jjTwP

along with 20$ USD for  window 7 upgraded to window 10 from reddit microsoftsoftwareswap

@Yxion far better then any thing you can build with you so called AMD build

 

While I think the general build is okay - you want either a H-series mobo (non-overclocking) or a devils canyon cpu (k-series) for overclocking.

Going non-k cpu and paying for overclocking capabilities on the mobo doesn´t match up.

 

@Sudako

That´s a workstation rig I am guessing, especially with that chunk of high frequency ram. Impressive though - water blocks is interesting too. I´ve got the m.2 950 Pro from Samsung - but I gotta admit jealousy to the intel m.2. ssd.

980TI in sli - wondering if it can handle 8K?

 

 

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Victorious general yes iw ould go with a B series bu7t most  people playing games want the extra USB 3.0  where as B and H series only suppor 2 ports + 2 usb 2 some have more but thats what the intel chipset support natively

 

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43 minutes ago, Victorion said:

 

Thanks for getting the thread into the correct line again. While I agree with mostly everything you said, I´d comment that i5 is all you really want for BnS and general gaming too.

While a few titles may see smaller gains from more than 4 threads - the titles are few and far between and the gain going above 4 threads is too small to justify a higher CPU price.

 

Budget wise the options is to go for

1) i5-4460 with a cheaper mobo.

2) i3 or i5-6xxx @ 3.2 Ghz or higher, Like i5-6500 perhaps. Pair it with Evo 212 cooler and a Z170 mobo and start overclocking.

Thank you Victorion. Yes, while I do agree that buying i5 is the best option for the thread starter, I'm just giving all options. :) Also, for lower cost, I'm not saying that i3 is bad, but considering Blade and Soul we're talking about and the need of new motherboard, I drop this idea and selecting AM3+ CPU instead. Any 6th gen Intel CPU can be dropped as well since OP has DDR3 ram already.

 

In other words, either AM3+ quad core CPU (8350 up to 9590) for lower cost, or 4th gen i5 CPU (4460 up to 4690) for the optimum. The most expensive, but the best is always 4th gen i7 (only 4790 as of now) with high end latest graphics of course, not only Blade and Soul but for any games / apps.

 

Oh, for anyone else who care, maybe I forgot to tell you my background. Graduated with degree in IT with decent result, and currently working in IT company (under software development field) for past few years dealing with close to hundred million USD IT projects. Not comply to any, but in fact my company is nearby AMD Development Centre (just ~100m from my office). To be fair, I have two PCs each have Intel and AMD CPUs, and I love both.

 

Of course there's even better person than me and I'm still not enough experience, but at least I know what I'm talking.

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First of all, your anchor will be your GPU after CPU, but put that aside for a second.

 

As for your questions:

Q1: (not 100% certain) DX 9, probably. With DX11 and the upcoming DX12, the extra cores can be utilized and you will see a performance gain.

 

Q2: I don't really get this question. Loading time is usually based on your HDD/SSD; and obviously faster disk loads faster. Gameplay, however, takes into consideration of basically every component of your system, but just to simplify the most effective boosts: RAM speed, CPU performance (since faster doesn't mean better), and GPU performance. Those are the most easy ones to tweak with (overclock).

 

Q3: Even if you are not gaming, a big yes. You might not want to get a part that is old or will be considered old soon. Quad-core processors(let's not talk about 6 and 8 and more cores for the sake of this thread) will have a noticeable boost in speed and basically every way unless you use programs that utilize single/duel core speed like AutoDesk.

 

Q4: I'd say if you are planning on Intel i-series, get the latest one which is Skylake since they use LGA 1151 socket which will be the socket type for the 7th gen; just a bit future proof. If you are not considering spending 500 bucks on Skylake, i7-4790k and i5-4690k are probably the best. Personally I'd go for i7 because DX12 is coming out. 

If you are planning an AMD cpu, go for FX-series. They are cheap but still runs well, not to mention the boosts when overclocked. FX-series don't have integrated GPU (so all power is for CPU) in them but since you have a discrete video card (or the one you mentioned is in APU?) that's not a big deal. Check CPU Benchmark too see what CPU you like. 

 

 

Now, the next problem you'll face is probably the GPU. I had a HD7850 overclocked (I cranked to voltage to the max, not a good thing to do but anyway, I got good speed outta that and it still works after 3 years), still when running some GPU heavy maps the stuttering was really bad, and because of that I got myself a 980ti as Christmas present to celebrate the launch of BnS.

 

Edit:

Oh, another thing popped into my mind, and it's my biased opinion, please don't take it very seriously. I wouldn't get AMD A-series; had one (A10-5800k), it was probably not so good that every time I tried to push its speed, it just didn't. Plus it wasn't powerful enough to handle BnS, and you probably don't want a integrated GPU in your CPU taking up its power unless you don't have a discrete video card.

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4 minutes ago, Sudako said:
7 minutes ago, Sudako said:

Victorious general yes iw ould go with a B series bu7t most  people playing games want the extra USB 3.0  where as B and H series only suppor 2 ports + 2 usb 2 some have more but thats what the intel chipset support natively

 

 

 

If you refer to my questioning about pairing an i5-4590 cpu with a z97 mobo, then alot of non z97 mobo sports onboard USB 3.0 headers.

Gigabyte GA-B85M-DS3H-A for less than $40 is an example.

http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=5346#sp

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4 minutes ago, ScarletAcacia said:

First of all, your anchor will be your GPU, but put that aside for a second.

 

As for your questions:

Q1: (not 100% certain) DX 9, probably. With DX11 and the upcoming DX12, the extra cores can be utilized and you will see a performance gain.

Q2: I don't really get this question. Loading time is usually based on your HDD/SSD; and obviously faster disk loads faster. Gameplay, however, takes into consideration of basically every component of your system, but just to simplify the most effective boosts: RAM speed, CPU performance (since faster doesn't mean better), and GPU performance. Those are the most easy ones to tweak with (overclock).

Q3: Even if you are not gaming, a big yes. You might not want to get a part that is old or will be considered old soon. Quad-core processors(let's not talk about 6 and 8 and more cores for the sake of this thread) will have a noticeable boost in speed and basically every way unless you use programs that utilize single/duel core speed like AutoDesk.

Q4: I'd say if you are planning on Intel i-series, get the latest one which is Skylake since they use LGA 1151 socket which will be the socket type for the 7th gen; just a bit future proof. If you are not considering spending 500 bucks on Skylake, i7-4790k and i5-4690k are probably the best. Personally I'd go for i7 because DX12 is coming out. 

If you are planning an AMD cpu, go for FX-series. They are cheap but still runs well, not to mention the boosts when overclocked. FX-series don't have integrated GPU (so all power is for CPU) in them but since you have a discrete video card that's not a big deal. Check CPU Benchmark too see what CPU you like. 

 

Now, the next problem you'll face is probably the GPU. I had a HD7850 overclocked (I cranked to voltage to the max, not a good thing to do but anyway, I got good speed outta that and it still works after 3 years), still when running some GPU heavy maps the stuttering is really bad. 

Very nice writeup there, ScarletAcacia.

 

Yes, taking the 6th gen is always a good option. However, he may need to check the budget due to overall increase in cost (e.g. motherboard & good DDR4 RAM). Not issue on that; then why not. ;)

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1 minute ago, shadowzephyr said:

Very nice writeup there, ScarletAcacia.

 

Yes, taking the 6th gen is always a good option. However, he may need to check the budget due to overall increase in cost (e.g. motherboard & good DDR4 RAM). Not issue on that; then why not. ;)

You are absolutely right shadowzephyr, my mistake I should have mentioned that as well. Thank you for bringing that out.

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As long as you arent needing to use AVX2 insctructions skylake is great but when using AVX2 in high cpu usage right now  the cpus get incorrectable errors that will bluescreen the system. the microcode update has been release by intel but only MSI has released a Bios update with it so far.

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