nemein

wardrobe should be free already

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Korene   

I still don't get how it matters... if a game is F2P or P2P ? EITHER way if the people who are paying and subscribing monthly LEAVE. The game is going to die ANYWAY... why would they keep the servers up with no money coming in. Doesn't matter... when the people who are paying leave the game goes down. There is no way to stop that from happening unless the people who spend money... are happy that's just it. All this "if it goes p2p the servers will die, F2P will leave"... okay and? Their grinded in game currency couldn't keep the game up ncsoft needs real cash. Those every now again purchases aren't gonna keep the game up either. NCSOFT needs steady income.

 

Back to topic: Wardrobe is fine where it is... unless premium users get account wide costumes through an account wide wardrobe( THIS ISN'T GONNA HAPPEN, LETS ALL BE REAL HERE) then it's fine. Want wardrobe, pay for it. All these people talking about they need to store the FEW ncoin purchase costumes they will purchase. That's not even enough to crack the big iceberg of the people who are actually subscribing MONTHLY compared to your let me buy here and there purchases.

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There has to be SOOOMEEEETHINNGGG that premium gets that you don't get.  Get a job.  $15/month is like eating one meal out.  Once a month.  F2P whiners you ruin everyyytthiinngg.

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Takara   
14 minutes ago, Sethniel said:

 

 

Have you seen successfull p2p MMOs in Europe or NA other than WoW? I haven't. Most of the MMOs lack of players and dying because of it. Or they make a little money, but they vegetate. I think most of the p2p MMOs in the west are doomed. NCSOFT knows that, just look at their games: AION, GW2 (b2p), Wildstar.

 

FFXIV is pretty successful to this day.

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Korene   
4 minutes ago, Takara said:

 

FFXIV is pretty successful to this day.

Exactly... people don't mind paying sub when the producers+devs give a flying hoot about the game. Even though i don't play much because blade and soul... I paid my sub up for a  full year so i can craft and enjoy my ffxiv community <3

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Sethniel   
6 minutes ago, Takara said:

 

FFXIV is pretty successful to this day.

 

It was overstatement for a little bit. But I think my statement has a point. :)

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Hitokiri   
27 minutes ago, Sethniel said:

 

 

Have you seen successfull p2p MMOs in Europe or NA other than WoW? I haven't. Most of the MMOs lack of players and dying because of it. Or they make a little money, but they vegetate. I think most of the p2p MMOs in the west are doomed. NCSOFT knows that, just look at their games: AION, GW2 (b2p), Wildstar.

 

EVE Online

 

Lineage II  when it was p2p

 

Darkfall

 

Diablo 3

 

The Elder Scrolls Online

 

Final Fantasy

 

Guild Wars 2

 

WoW

Edited by Hitokiri

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Sethniel   
28 minutes ago, Hitokiri said:

 

EVE Online

 

Lineage II  till it was p2p

 

Darkfall

 

Diablo 3

 

The Elder Scrolls Online

 

Final Fantasy

 

Guild Wars 2

 

WoW

 

No offense, but I said p2p. Diablo 3, Gw2, Elder Scrolls are b2p. EVE online, WoW, LII are old games. They were the foremost. People won't leave them because of the time they invested in those games. And Eve Online's playerbase is dropping (however it's a great game). And there is no alternative for Eve...

I don't know Darkfall, sorry. My bad.

 

Your list is almost empty.

Edited by Sethniel

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Hitokiri   
24 minutes ago, Sethniel said:

 

No offense, but I said p2p. Diablo 3, Gw2, Elder Scrolls are b2p. EVE online, WoW, LII are old games. They were the foremost. People won't leave them because of the time they invested in those games. And Eve Online's playerbase is dropping (however it's a great game). And there is no alternative for Eve...

I don't know Darkfall, sorry. My bad.

 

Your list is almost empty.

 

Ok show me successful f2p games.

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ZigZack   
45 minutes ago, Takara said:

 

FFXIV is pretty successful to this day.

they had to shut that game down and rebuild the whole game that = total fail so you can't really say FF 14 did good.

now A Realm Reborn is doing alright.

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Sethniel   
8 minutes ago, Hitokiri said:

 

Ok show me successful f2p games.

 

Why should I? You said that NCSOFT should have chosen p2p system in the first place. That's why I said that they knew p2p mostly dies in the old continent and in NA. They learned it with Wildstar and Aion. There was no playerbase, without playerbase people won't pay monthly subscription.

 

But if you ask about f2p games... There is LoL, or Dota2, Smite, or Tf2 (it was b2p to be honest).

 

You didn't asked that, but about successful f2p mmorpgs (like BnS)...  that would be a tricky question.

Edited by Sethniel

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Tsono   
3 hours ago, TheRealBronx said:

Not gonna debate this any further. It's pointless.

 

You won't get wardrobe unless you pay for it. Don't wanna pay for it? You don't get it. Does this upset you? Then quit. There's nothing more to say really.

no one is saying they dnt wanna pay for it but it sure as hell aint worth $15 monthly.. stop twisting our words. only the OP is asking for it for free quote him and only him... not only that i pay for this game, just not for premium membership, my money not good enough unless i sub (hence the perks you only get if yur subbed) the real issue is their f2p model... i spend money to unlocks perks but unless i sub these perks do nothing for me,. its a slap in the face "hey we appreciate yur support, in exchange you get these fancy perks, but theres a catch you need to pay monthly for them.. wtf?

Edited by Tsono

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Serial   
6 minutes ago, Sethniel said:

You didn't asked that, but about successful f2p mmorpgs (like BnS)...  that would be a tricky question.

 

Because they all try to do what BnS is doing, remove features from the f2p player to force them to pay the premium.

The games you mentioned all learned that this is not a successful business model, they learned that they should give enough value to both paying and free customers because free customer doesn't mean people wont spend money, on the contrary, LoL is making millions and millions on cosmetics only.

 

You can also mention CS:GO, its b2p but the cost is very low ($15 same as one month of bns premium since its the only ncoin pack you can buy) and the game is a huge hit with people spending a lot on weapon skins etc.

 

NCSoft made a mistake locking the wardrobe, you can have better premium incentives without it being pay to win and also without removing a feature from you free players. They just need to get together and come up with new ideas for premium, I'm not saying its easy, because its not, but they need to do it.

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Tsono   
1 hour ago, TotalHavoc said:

There has to be SOOOMEEEETHINNGGG that premium gets that you don't get.  Get a job.  $15/month is like eating one meal out.  Once a month.  F2P whiners you ruin everyyytthiinngg.

you ppl and yur premium non sense is really starting to annoy me.. premium does not make you first class.. ive put a decent amount of cash into this game as a "f2p'er" aka no stupid star buy my name.. but i guess that dnt mean anything to you or ncsoft, if im not subbed im second class garbage dnt matter if i feed you money.

 

you pay $15 a month for premium 

i pay $15 a month for costume or something else 

 

WTF is the deference? im a paying costumer.

Edited by Tsono

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Yui   

I hardly think the premium is a failure, It seems a lot more of a success. Sure there is a vocal minority of players who feel they were entitled  to the wardrobe but I would say on a whole the response to this "Terrible Decision" has been very mild. The other issue is that there is no good way to argue that you "Need" the storage which makes it a want and not a necessity.  The wardrobe didn't even exist in the original BnS release, it was added at a later time and everyone survived by using the bank tab that is cheap to unlock.

 

You can live without it, It doesn't give power, and it merely frees up bank or inventory space for the optional cosmetics that costumes are. So you can whine all you want but the only person being unreasonable is yourselves. You only claim it is hurting them and have no actual reason for you to be entitled the feature. Anytime you say "Players would do X" or "Players are not going to Y" you are realistically just making up whatever you think is right. Here is a good example

Players will not buy premium if the wardrobe is a free feature, this will lead the game to lose money and NC Soft will be forced to increase prices on all shop goods and possibly need to make special premium only features that make it worth while. What I just said is all just made up... kinda like the arguments presented in 90% of this thread. 

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GnatB   
6 minutes ago, Tsono said:

you ppl and yur premium non sense is really starting to annoy me.. premium does not make you first class.. ive put a decent amount of cash into this game as a "f2p'er" aka no stupid star buy my name.. but i guess that dnt mean anything to you or ncsoft, if im not subbed im second class garbage dnt matter if i feed you money.

 

you pay $15 a month for premium 

i pay $15 a month for costume or something else 

 

WTF is the deference? im a paying costumer.

 

Uhm, actually, I'd have to argue premium does make you first class.  I'd imagine that's pretty much the whole point of the name PREMIUM.  He's paying $15 for first class treatment, you're paying $15 for a costume.  Airplane traveller A pays $50 to get bumped to first class.  Traveller B pays $50 for a checked bag.  Would traveller B expect to get first class treatment?  Nope.

 

27 minutes ago, Sethniel said:

You didn't asked that, but about successful f2p mmorpgs (like BnS)...  that would be a tricky question.

.

SWTOR.  4th most profitable MMO in the world for 2014.

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Naunet   
29 minutes ago, Tsono said:

you pay $15 a month for premium 

i pay $15 a month for costume or something else 

 

WTF is the deference? im a paying costumer.

 

Exactly. And guess what - that $15 a month in costumes you spend earns you Premium Points! That... do you no good whatsoever unless you spend an additional $15/month on a subscription. The current model is a big "f you" to customers who spend money in the cash shop, even though $15 is $15 regardless.

 

Again I assert that Premium Point bonuses need to be UNLOCKED and NOT tied to subscription status. People would still have to invest to get them, but you don't end up with a system that screws players who choose to spend their money in the cash shop instead of subscribing.

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I feel the game as a whole is worth paying a monthly sub to support it and I get perks because of it. 

If you enjoy the game and want to see it succeed then choose the premium service as your support. Mostly everything in the CS can be bought by just crafting Hongmoon coin so one could get away without paying anything for a costume they really like. 

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17 hours ago, GnatB said:

 

Uhm, actually, I'd have to argue premium does make you first class.  I'd imagine that's pretty much the whole point of the name PREMIUM.  He's paying $15 for first class treatment, you're paying $15 for a costume.  Airplane traveller A pays $50 to get bumped to first class.  Traveller B pays $50 for a checked bag.  Would traveller B expect to get first class treatment?  Nope.

 

You do realize that with most airlines the bulk of the cost of the flight is borne not by your First Class passengers but by your economy seats?  (Then again, too many airlines today forget that fact too— which I assert is the chief reason behind why they're ailing.)

 

I was about to offer another interpretation of this analogy, but decided against it.  I am wasting my time.  Rather I will say that I don't think Premium subscribers are willing to even consider the fact that some of the so-called perks they think they are buying are actually features of the game that should have been included regardless, and that therefore Premium subs should have instead been given true perks to warrant their subscribing to said service.  These premium subs who reject any suggestion for change are simply blinded by misguided elitism and relying on false perks rather than seeing how we're all being scammed.  Perhaps they just cannot conscious the possibility that they are deceived.

 

(What's next? Paying rental on your very weapons? Or restricting gamepads to Premium only?)

 

But if — a big IF — NC West's business model is to actually rely on the paid subscribers to form the bulk of their income, rather than the sales of items in the Cash Shop by all customers, then the First Class players are really being milked as if they are just mindless cows, while everyone else is just an afterthought.  

 

 

 

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We are paying for features so the game can avoid becoming pay2win like BnS China and BnS Taiwan.

 

A company will always prefer foreseeable revenue compared to inconsistent and occasional one-off purchases.

 

Edited by Furholden

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Civic26   

It is always wonderful to see people earning money or people in NA and western EU in general to shout at people that can't afford to pay all the time for games, calling them plebs, kids and other ridiculous insults.

I am for now a premium user, I really enjoyed start of the game, so I decided - ok devs did a great job, I'm enjoying this, I bought a student bundle and after a week I decided, well it's quite a lot of money but I will give it another month. So I gave them about 20€. I can hear all those western people now snort and roll their eyes but you don't realize that EU for example is not an united market and while working person in germany can just throw 200€ for games out of the window every month, I for example live in a country where some hard working people earn 300€ for whole month and although I'm doing better than those people 60€ for a tripple A game is a month worth of food. (This is just an explanation.)

So now when I'm really enjoying the game and have right now already 40 or something costumes in the wardrobe, I'm just dreading the time when my premium ends, because I already know that I just won't be able to prolong it in the foreseeable future. As much as I would like to support the devs.

 

This is the reason why I (as now premium member) also think that the wardrobe as a crucial feature of the game should be made available, maybe not for free entirely, but at least one time pay-wall. Or as soon as you reach rank 2 or 3 premium, then you have it unlocked even without premium. It shows that you already supported the game somewhat and would make sense not only for users, but maybe the company itself.

Edited by Civic26

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Tupan   

The good part in EU is,if you want you can go work somewhere else and have the same sallary like the others do.

People doesn't chose where to be born,but they chose where to live.And aside of Romania and Bulgaria noone else in EU work for 300 euro per month,or atleast that's what I remember.

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Civic26   
9 minutes ago, Tupan said:

The good part in EU is,if you want you can go work somewhere else and have the same sallary like the others do.

People doesn't chose where to be born,but they chose where to live.And aside of Romania and Bulgaria noone else in EU work for 300 euro per month,or atleast that's what I remember.

 

That would be called economic migration and that's something you really don't want to promote anywhere anytime. It causes issues in the original country and in the target country. Solves nothing and the other thing is: those countries in the west already have issues with their own people, I really don't think they are waiting for people from poor countries with open arms welcoming them and offering them to upgrade their way of living. That would be called pseudohumanism and way to the end of EU. (But that is just offtopic to the original issue.)

Edited by Civic26

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Tupan   

If you are eductated person speaking the language of the targeted country you will be fine.Skilled employees are seeked everywhere.

 

I would not care much for the goverment.Isues? C'mon ther goverments care only about how to steal more and more milions,most of which from EU itself the rest ammount is from ther own citizens.Would care less for em like ever.Most of the people in this countries goverments are millionaires with few busineses and everything is based on ther decision and projects are taken from ther friends or to who pay the most.

To get good job you have to pay unless you IT - they are the gods there geting 5-10x of what everyone else get.

 

You know what I find retarded? Food in top countries to be cheaper then in the poorest one.Fuel also.And so on.

Edited by Tupan

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