Remove the bid system.

[Goji]

34 minutes ago, Rekun said:

Bidding hurts the economy because there is no taxation. The money used in the bid will never go away but there will always be an influx of money coming in. Prices will rise because of this fact and eventually people will purchase gold to meet the demands of the in game economy and this will hurt the players by extension because the value of money will decrease and prices will sky rocket either forcing players to grind repetition or purchase more gold to compete. Which do you think people will do in earnest?

 

There will always be inflation, but I'm not sure why this makes the bidding system bad.  If anything a bidding system helps curb the effects of inflation on people who don't have a lot of gold.  Unreasonably high inflation bids means an unreasonably high cut of Gold for everyone who loses.  It's redistribution, and will likely be the reason players don't have to resort to purchasing gold from sellers as often, if at all.  Your rewards from not bidding will always be proportional to how inflated the worth of the items has become.  You can keep up with inflation by simply not bidding until you've caught up. 

[Ripperino]

Signed, there are other means of gold sinks they could employ. The standard roll system should be implemented.

[Jayrune]

41 minutes ago, Silfi said:

I disagree. The bid system can add gold into the system. If nobody bids on the item, it is destroyed and the basic value of the item (though small) is distributed among all party members.

 

This kinda sounds like the current generation that demands all there things NOW. If you don't get them NOW, you throw a hissy fit. If you are really that desperate for gold faster, by all means, buy from gold sellers. Heaven knows there are plenty to choose from. I will gladly report you for gold buying and you can watch the ban come at you. Or you can farm for your gold/items like everyone else. You might even find that there is a sense of accomplishment that you worked hard and got your reward.

 

Please note that I am only lvl 35. I have not seen these higher gold bids, though I do not doubt there are there. I prefer this system as I play this game for the dungeons and the pve content. I find joy in running dungeons over and over, it's calming to me.

the auto selling that comes with no bids is no different than a greed roll that gets vendored other than it's distributed among the party.  while technically true that it generates money, it is neither more or less than would come from a need/greed system.

 

 

24 minutes ago, Rekun said:

Also this. What's stopping someone who bought 200,000,000 gold from gold sellers for 20$ from just bidding and putting all that money up into circulation? Would you honestly sink that much gold into keys and seals?

@Rekun your arguments are moot as the flaw you are claiming is present in the bid system is present in the need/greed system, neither is a gold sink. you are presenting 'logic" that presumes a disadvantage over an alternative that is not there.

There is nothing that prevents someone who buys millions of gold from putting it into circulation via the market, once again the disadvantage you are trying to present is not there. 

 

 

12 minutes ago, Ripperino said:

Signed, there are other means of gold sinks they could employ. The standard roll system should be implemented.

gold sinks aren't actually a factor in this as neither the bid system or the need/greed system are a gold sink.  

[Yui]

It is no use Jayrune, they don't understand. Knowing forum posters too, even if he feels he may be wrong, he is going to keep fighting it. 

[Tanall]

24 minutes ago, Ripperino said:

Signed, there are other means of gold sinks they could employ. The standard roll system should be implemented.

Well, you already indirectly pay for weapon repairs. And directly pay for fast travel. There is also the possibility that they are expecting to have to banhammer goldsellers and accounting for the deflation that causes (Anyone remember the mega-banhammering from FFXI?)

[Kuroshikon]

1 hour ago, Rekun said:

Also this. What's stopping someone who bought 200,000,000 gold from gold sellers for 20$ from just bidding and putting all that money up into circulation? Would you honestly sink that much gold into keys and seals?

That's not how gold selling works. The gold from gold sellers doesn't come from thin air it needs to be farmed. Given this game, like archeage, was lazily given a crappy anti-hack system slapped on (Koreans are bound by their national ID number or something when they play mmos hence why they don't need anti-hack) there will bots farming the gold but it will still take time.

 

Other methods are hacking player accounts and selling that gold, but this also technically takes time to crack passwords through programs. This is why it is better to have you password as a short sentence, the length matters these days not how hard it is to manually guess.Though the most common way of getting hacked these days is actually by gold sellers hacking third party forum accounts, most people use the same password for various forum accounts as they do for game accounts.

 

Gold selling is a business and they wouldn't sell the gold incredibly cheap for no reason. You will typically find the prices slightly (but enough for it to be worth it) lower than the most efficient method of converting £ to gold through the official cash shop. The prices will also fluctuate with the health of the ingame economy.

 

The goal of gold sellers is to make as much money for the time spent farming that gold not simply destroy the economy for no reason.

[Rekun]

33 minutes ago, Jayrune said:

the auto selling that comes with no bids is no different than a greed roll that gets vendored other than it's distributed among the party.  while technically true that it generates money, it is neither more or less than would come from a need/greed system.

 

 

@Rekun your arguments are moot as the flaw you are claiming is present in the bid system is present in the need/greed system, neither is a gold sink. you are presenting 'logic" that presumes a disadvantage over an alternative that is not there.

There is nothing that prevents someone who buys millions of gold from putting it into circulation via the market, once again the disadvantage you are trying to present is not there. 

 

 

gold sinks aren't actually a factor in this as neither the bid system or the need/greed system are a gold sink.  

Do you really want to compare a need/greed system to this one? Let's do that for the sake of my 'argument'. Let's go with World of Warcraft since that's got the longest standing economy in mmo history. If you need/greed on a rare item in Warcraft the item will be bound to your account to prevent trades. (This is fair.) The item generally sells for 4-20 gold at a vendor. I may be being generous. I haven't played since Cataclysm.

 

The bid system on the other hand depends on how much gold was bid. If you bid 40 gold and the gold is divided among 4 members each will get 12-13 gold. Each party member gets more gold depending how much was bid. 400,000,000 gold will give each party member upwards of 120,000,000. In a game that's free to play and massively transaction based this situation is bound to happen.

 

I get the impression that you think goldsinks are the cause of inflation. In which case you shouldn't be trying to debate this because you really have no sense of what you are talking about here.

 

I'm done trying to cure you of your shortsightedness. I'd appreciate if you actually brought up valid counter-points to my argument but you can't even understand what I'm trying to say here or how it even impacts you.

[Jayrune]

32 minutes ago, Rekun said:

Do you really want to compare a need/greed system to this one? Let's do that for the sake of my 'argument'. Let's go with World of Warcraft since that's got the longest standing economy in mmo history. If you need/greed on a rare item in Warcraft the item will be bound to your account to prevent trades. (This is fair.) The item generally sells for 4-20 gold at a vendor. I may be being generous. I haven't played since Cataclysm.

 

The bid system on the other hand depends on how much gold was bid. If you bid 40 gold and the gold is divided among 4 members each will get 12-13 gold. Each party member gets more gold depending how much was bid. 400,000,000 gold will give each party member upwards of 120,000,000. In a game that's free to play and massively transaction based this situation is bound to happen.

 

I get the impression that you think goldsinks are the cause of inflation. In which case you shouldn't be trying to debate this because you really have no sense of what you are talking about here.

 

I'm done trying to cure you of your shortsightedness. I'd appreciate if you actually brought up valid counter-points to my argument but you can't even understand what I'm trying to say here or how it even impacts you.

Your entire line of posts is claiming that a bidding system for dungeon loot distribution is bad, given the only alternative that anyone has even brought up is the need/greed system it is the only alternative that is up for discussion.

 

You have been bringing up red herring arguments in your subsequent posts that have no bearing on a dungeon loot distribution system and claiming them as reasons why a bid system for dungeon loot distribution in specific is bad.  You've been insulting everyone who has bothered to point out that these points you brought up are not related to dungeon loot distribution by implying that a non-existent connection is somehow obvious while simultaneously claiming your done posting multiple times as you continue to respond with more thinly veiled insults and misinformation.

 

I would hope that your last post really is your last, but you have already shown you cannot help yourself.  at this point i can only hope other posters are not misled.

[Lephar]

Anyone who thinks the bid system (at least as it was implemented) is good is a troll or dumb/ignorant.

Anyone who says that every game they've played had a bid system is a troll+liar, I've played a ton of MMOs and literally only BnS had it.

 

1. GW2's mob tagging system is the best, you can't argue this, discussion end. You tag mob, you get quest credit. You tag mob, you get loot. Your loot doesn't affect anyone but you.

2. The fact that trolls can bid up items you clearly want even though you can't use it and they can't trade it is absolutely *cricket* broke, and theoretically easy to fix (if item is untradeable, only allow class to bid unless nobody of class in party. probably like 3-4 lines of code FFS.)

3. As above would in theory be fixed by trolls running out of money - do you think they care? It screws new players and makes the game look bad. I spent thousands of gold on siege trolling in GW2 and that never stopped me!

 

I would agree that the system is at least "passable" if you weren't able to troll items you can't even use or trade, but in any case, it's garbage-tier game design that ArenaNet already has a fix for.

[Talis42]

+ 1 for eliminating it

[KLover]

I have no problem with this system. Yes sure trolls will always try to bid higher to get higher share of golds at the end, but thats how it works.  It has been around for years, and to be honest, this was actually one of the ways for people to get more money in game. When I playing in CN servers, I get tons of golds after these auction. It's not much of an issue comparing to queue times or bots spamming in chat lol. 

[Spyroxion]

Holy... This is still going on? :D
Whats the point for going on and on about this? This system has been out for years at other servers. It is tested far longer than at our servers. It has been proven working. It is not going to change here. Like you guys who say against it, you haven't even played for a week. Like server is one week old for headstarters meanwhile KR/TW server are 3 years old with this system and they ain't gonna change shit because of your whining and not understanding the game.  
There is no point of continuing this, no matter what arguments you have to say. Don't like it? Leave then, I don't think NCsoft will have problems with few people leaving, couple of people off the queue + less headache is better

[Mishi]

1 hour ago, Spyroxion said:

Holy... This is still going on? :D
Whats the point for going on and on about this? This system has been out for years at other servers. It is tested far longer than at our servers. It has been proven working. It is not going to change here. Like you guys who say against it, you haven't even played for a week. Like server is one week old for headstarters meanwhile KR/TW server are 3 years old with this system and they ain't gonna change shit because of your whining and not understanding the game.  
There is no point of continuing this, no matter what arguments you have to say. Don't like it? Leave then, I don't think NCsoft will have problems with few people leaving, couple of people off the queue + less headache is better

Oh it's still going because people think "bidding" is the only option for partys. 

 

Though in reality I personally wont run unless bidding is going on.

That way even if I don't win an item with bidding, I can still make a profit. 

[xcr]

If you actually do this ncsoft im done with this game, look what thoese fools did to your game already they said no pay to win items what did that leave the free to play users a restricted play experience compared to Taiwan, was that a good idea nope it wasnt look at the shit storm raining down in the forum becouse of all the troubles that have caused, you took measures to keep the economy of the company on a steady and safe path becouse people didnt want pay to win items well i can tell you this Taiwan had the perfect f2p client you managed to ruin it by listening to thoese people in this exact thread for example.

 

People dont realise how good the pay to win model is that Taiwan had, non premium free users had the experience of their life time, like myself there thanks to all the paying users that wanted to support ncsoft by different reasons, but i guess people dont see it from that point of view and who are you to judge people that want to get ahead, that whole system was helping the non paying users aswell by providing additional cash flow for NCsoft so thoese restrictions wherent needed that are in place now compared to Taiwan.

 

Yes i played for slightly 2 months straight on Taiwan grinding everyday being a completly new player, ultimate gale and hm7 almost 8, now that tells something.

 

The vast majority in this forum that made thoese suggestion you have adopted to in the first place to begin with ontop of that this thread, they have probably never played this game before or experienced it at end game content on Taiwan and have the audacity to come telling what you should remove or nerf in the game compared to Taiwan, they will eventually leave this game after appyling thoese changes to your game and leave you in a sinking ship like they always have done with other games, at that point there is no reason for me to play either and i will leave with them even thought it wasnt my intention to since this wasnt what i was expecting.

[AceNinja]

this system aint fair period. unless your a botter 

[Spyroxion]

7 minutes ago, AceNinja said:

this system aint fair period. unless your a botter 

 

And may I ask whats your experience in this game? I mean how long have you been playing? Whats your lvl? Have you tried other servers that has been going for years?

[AceNinja]

1 minute ago, Spyroxion said:

 

And may I ask whats your experience in this game? I mean how long have you been playing? Whats your lvl? Have you tried other servers that has been going for years?

umm how long. i heard of this game since 2009 wait for it till now. i have played close beta from korea and till now. lvl at 25. as for server why should i move from server to server. unless i know alot of friends that play in another server.

[AceNinja]

Just now, AceNinja said:

umm how long. i heard of this game since 2009 wait for it till now. i have played close beta from korea and till now. lvl at 25. as for server why should i move from server to server. unless i know alot of friends that play in another server.

so long have you been playing this

[Spyroxion]

2 minutes ago, AceNinja said:

umm how long. i heard of this game since 2009 wait for it till now. i have played close beta from korea and till now. lvl at 25. as for server why should i move from server to server. unless i know alot of friends that play in another server.

 

I don't really understood that enrgrish but you KNOW game since 2009, knowing about isn't knwoing the game it self... So you are lvl 25, you haven't even lvl'ed up til lend and you are making statements about game? ok then

[AceNinja]

ohh forgot to say i have a full time job and when i get out i have to queue for a few hours to play but my play time aint long nor i want to put money in a game so i can have a shorter queue time with full of botters. if i had time like i did back then i would have max level and earn most of the stuff with friends. also my grammers not that great so sorry about that but as for this game i have known about it and played it before it even went to the us. i was happy when they annouce it when it was going to be transleted over here but it still took years and that time i was playing the game already. 

[Spyroxion]

1 minute ago, AceNinja said:

ohh forgot to say i have a full time job and when i get out i have to queue for a few hours to play but my play time aint long nor i want to put money in a game so i can have a shorter queue time with full of botters. if i had time like i did back then i would have max level and earn most of the stuff with friends. also my grammers not that great so sorry about that but as for this game i have known about it and played it before it even went to the us. i was happy when they annouce it when it was going to be transleted over here but it still took years and that time i was playing the game already. 

 

So I hear excuses... Yeap bringing up excuses to discussion really helps you to prove your point..
Yeah got nothing to say to you then if I'll only hear excuses of "i don't have time to play" which only proves that you don't have enough experience in this game

[AceNinja]

well it looks like you have alot of wait time and play time on your hand. if you read closely i have as much experience if you were to max level out a char. also this game been out a few years ago if you didnt know

[Spyroxion]

4 minutes ago, AceNinja said:

well it looks like you have alot of wait time and play time on your hand. if you read closely i have as much experience if you were to max level out a char. also this game been out a few years ago if you didnt know

I will quote my self for exact same page as we are now.

1 hour ago, Spyroxion said:

Holy... This is still going on? :D
Whats the point for going on and on about this? This system has been out for years at other servers. It is tested far longer than at our servers. It has been proven working. It is not going to change here. Like you guys who say against it, you haven't even played for a week. Like server is one week old for headstarters meanwhile KR/TW server are 3 years old with this system and they ain't gonna change shit because of your whining and not understanding the game.  
There is no point of continuing this, no matter what arguments you have to say. Don't like it? Leave then, I don't think NCsoft will have problems with few people leaving, couple of people off the queue + less headache is better

 

[Mishi]

32 minutes ago, Spyroxion said:

 

And may I ask whats your experience in this game? I mean how long have you been playing? Whats your lvl? Have you tried other servers that has been going for years?

I've played JP/TW/and RU.

Been waiting on BnS for years. 

 

The bidding system is fine, everyone wins, even those who do not win the items get money from the person who won.

 

That means:

Person A won the item, so they pay out money.

People B,C,D,E,F get to gain money.

 

So A spends money lessening the money they have, and the rest in party gain money.

[Spyroxion]

1 minute ago, Mishi said:

I've played JP/TW/and RU.

Been waiting on BnS for years. 

 

The bidding system is fine, everyone wins, even those who do not win the items get money from the person who won.

 

That means:

Person A won the item, so they pay out money.

People B,C,D,E,F get to gain money.

 

So A spends money lessening the money they have, and the rest in party gain money.

 

Erm I am for this bid system, I was asking AceNinja, I know that on this topic people who are against it are some low lvl people who haven't even tasted endgame