Movement, combat and pvp:

[Tjaranis]

 

Movement, combat and pvp:

 

First of I been playing ncsoft games for a long time, back from early L2 days ^^

The games I really liked was L2 then Aion(mostly Aion, was awesome for its time). I didn’t like GW2 because of their slowdown in combat and their downing system, which both killed pvp fun for me, and I disliked wildstar because the combat just felt boring, and was neutral to gw1 since I only played it till max and stopped.

 

Now one major thing I found in most open world mmo’s is that the ability to be able to disengage a fight is KEY for a good player.

If you cannot disengage a fight you will die, it is only a matter of time  before the swarm eats you.

In L2 you could simply run, since speed where the same, in aion you could just run again speed was the same, and this brought to it some really interesting fights both for ganking and for straight pvping, as it allowed the players to both decide “is this a fight I want to engage in” and to know when to disengage “do I have to disengage now to survive, or there is coming an enemy zerg I better run now or I will die”.

 

Now in B&S you cannot disengage, it is nearly impossible. You are slowed down so much in combat that it feels like you are suddenly stuck in tar and it takes a long time from the last attack has hit until the slowdown is removed. You can’t use your sprinting/movement skills while in combat either.

This together means disengaging from multiple opponents is not possible (one will simply hit while the other wait a bit and then get out of combat and can ALWAYS reach you).

You cannot run if you see a zerg coming, neither if you are in pve or pvp, because of this big slow, while the zerg is moving at full sprint, roughly 4+ times faster than you can, and you cannot disengage and get out of combat fast enough to be able to sprint.

 

This means ANY fight you take is to the death, and you cannot engage in “hit and run” or low numbers vs large numbers, because once you engaged it is impossible for you to be able to run from the zerg that will overrun you.

I personally feel like this is a huge backsteps from aion and even l2.

 

The slowdown in cambat is too much, it is slowing the movement in combat to literally a crawl which just doesn’t feel right.

And the lack of anyway to either avoid a fight while grinding or avoid getting zerged while pvping, or to simply know when you are outmatched and therefore disengage in good time, is highly decreasing the strategy of the combat and especially of group combat.

 

I know this is so deep in B&S that it will not be changed at all. But I wanted to mention it because I find it such a HUGE negative compared to Aion and in general when thinking of the impact it has to the kind of pvp you will see and be able to do.

 

I do hope that the devs will take it to mind and if not possible to change this aspect of B&S then at least keep it in mind for the next project.

I think ncsoft generally improve on good concepts and remove bad and they generally do a REALLY good job. This is one of those rare cases where they really didn’t obtain that, instead they took a bad concept and forced it upon their else awesome game.

 

EDIT:

I should come with a solution to the issue of cause:

Since it is highly unlikely combat speed can be changed (because doing so would break a lot of balance stuff with aoe range reaction time etc), the main issue is the inability to disengage and to always be run down once engaged in combat by someone.

This could be fixed simply by allowing sprint skills to get activated in combat, and having it have a CD if you did this:

 

Meaning:

1: I am in combat and I can see zerg coming;

 

2: I start sprinting instantly in the opposite direction;

 

3: I am now immune to be pulled into combat by attacks for the next 5 seconds; (to avoid instantly pulling into combat). NOT immune to hard CC which will break your sprint, stopping you from escaping (classes got skills that makes them immune to CC for a short while, and should use this if they want to be sure).

 

4: My Sprint ability is now on a 10sec CD, meaning that if I stop sprinting or get pulled into combat within the next 10 seconds I can’t sprint instantly again.

 

_______________

I think such a fix could highly change the issue’s the slowdown in combat has, and add positive plays to both pve and pvp on many area’s, while keeping in style of other ncsoft games with loved pvp gameplay ^^

[MrHahn]

I must agree with you. I have played Lineage 2 for a really long time and went to AION NA.

I dont know much about BnS, i am very new to this game, but i have already engaged to a PvP and yeah, its impossible to escape from a fight...

[Nolia]

Well just fight then not much you can do.

 

[StarZero]

Cowards run, real martial artists fight to the death.

[Tjaranis]

4 hours ago, StarZero said:

Cowards run, real martial artists fight to the death.

i real master knows which fight is worth dying for, only a fool thinks all fights are the same.

 

:P

[Raggok]

I've always been more annoyed by people who run from 1v1s that they initiate when they start losing rather than getting zerged down.  Although, both are annoying.

 

There needs to be risk when you initiate a fight.  Too much mobility removes risk from the game in small scale open world PvP, IMO.

[Tjaranis]

20 minutes ago, Raggok said:

I've always been more annoyed by people who run from 1v1s that they initiate when they start losing rather than getting zerged down.  Although, both are annoying.

 

There needs to be risk when you initiate a fight.  Too much mobility removes risk from the game in small scale open world PvP, IMO.

if you do a LOT of PvP zerging will be a FAR bigger problem than you having to lockdown a player so he doesn't escape ;)

 

when every fight is always to the death it takes away a major part of the PvP strategy and tactics.

personally i think it highly hurts the overall enjoyment of the vast majority of pvp'ers

[StarZero]

5 hours ago, Tjaranis said:

i real master knows which fight is worth dying for, only a fool thinks all fights are the same.

 

:P

Sounds like a coward to me.

 

You smell like a coward boy 

[Kutsuu]

Yeah I hate it how this game doesn't play like other games that I like. I think they should revamp it to be more like everquest because that's the game that I like and they did it right. 

[Emeth]

I used to play aion and, to be honest, every skill that made u stand still while casting was a buzz kill. Probably this is what ncsoft was trying to 'fix'. Now, i did no pvp in bns so i might be wrong. I just hope i won't find myself being forced to play a rigid class that has to stun lock the opponent to win a fight.

[Nicannacus]

On 1/18/2016 at 7:44 AM, Tjaranis said:

if you do a LOT of PvP zerging will be a FAR bigger problem than you having to lockdown a player so he doesn't escape ;)

 

when every fight is always to the death it takes away a major part of the PvP strategy and tactics.

personally i think it highly hurts the overall enjoyment of the vast majority of pvp'ers

I have to disagree with you, I DO however like the sprint CD idea of 10sec's, but being immune to pulls is going to far, if you try to run, and then get pulled back, then you didn't strategically plan your escape, so you should be punished for it.

[PoltergeistPH]

Blade and Soul is a group based pvp mmorpg, not a pew pew game thing..

All classes have their abilities to counter an attack, anyone should use it wisely..

You should know your limitations..

 

-SgtArms

[Twiko]

On 18-1-2016 at 4:22 PM, Raggok said:

I've always been more annoyed by people who run from 1v1s that they initiate when they start losing rather than getting zerged down.  Although, both are annoying.

 

There needs to be risk when you initiate a fight.  Too much mobility removes risk from the game in small scale open world PvP, IMO.

Agreed fully c;

[Tjaranis]

6 hours ago, PoltergeistPH said:

Blade and Soul is a group based pvp mmorpg, not a pew pew game thing..

All classes have their abilities to counter an attack, anyone should use it wisely..

You should know your limitations..

 

-SgtArms

B&S is a 1v1 focused and balanced game mate -.- not a gvg...

and games which is gvg focus have a heavy emphasise on the ability to disengage and regroup.

On 19/1/2016 at 0:38 PM, Nicannacus said:

I have to disagree with you, I DO however like the sprint CD idea of 10sec's, but being immune to pulls is going to far, if you try to run, and then get pulled back, then you didn't strategically plan your escape, so you should be punished for it.

i did say hard cc should break your sprint ^^ what i meand was that damage shouldnt break the sprint and make you move in slowmotion as you do in combat now ^^

 

On 19/1/2016 at 9:33 AM, Emeth said:

I used to play aion and, to be honest, every skill that made u stand still while casting was a buzz kill. Probably this is what ncsoft was trying to 'fix'. Now, i did no pvp in bns so i might be wrong. I just hope i won't find myself being forced to play a rigid class that has to stun lock the opponent to win a fight.

they still have several skills that root you and i agree getting rooted was always annoying, however just slowing us to a crawl in pvp constantly is just as annoying imo.

when that is said removing the ability to disengage or to avoid getting zerged when fighting really got nothing to do with whether or not you where rooted on skills.

 

-----------------------

when the game starts getting a lot of pvp going anyone who love small scale or solo openworld pvp is going to whine, because there is no escape from the giant zerg blob, and you can never engage a battle without one side being fully dead and respawning, no forth and back battles for this one

[StarZero]

As a reminder to all of you, this game was not created by NC soft. None of its systems were. It has been out in asia for around 4 years and is one of the most popular games on the market. NC soft just manages the US servers. Movement doesnt need a change.

[TheKoR]

I'm not a max lvl yet but I've played Korean beta and from what I,I've  all seen and most knkw this games not really about group fighting. This is more small scale 1v1 scenarios and such group fighting unless it's pve or about combining ways with others on how to combo or focus other players down isn't gonna happen much.

 

The game has almost no large scale pvp. Yes there are battle grounds and arenas and faction pvp but there isn't anything like Tera's guild vs guild or alliance (I for one  hated alliance bevause repetitve and stupid but felt GVGs when done well were intense large battle experiences) as such the main focus in BnS  is 1v1s  and not on group if you engage a large number of enemies as one person  in blade and soul unless your enemies are just collectively terrible and stupid or under lvled greatly most likely you are going to get your ass handed to you by the grabs or beat downs of other players.

 

Group pvp is essentially just building  a combo off one other person while just grabbing ccing and controlling the battle field.   I haven't seen alot but from what I've seen this games mostly just about stunning grabbing and beating the shit out of the person with combos. Again great for 1v1s but group pvp  one vs three that person stuck in combat going up against three people  is gonna die there chances of winning against three or two more people drastcially low to nearly impossible as they are gonna grab, stun, and kd the hell out of that poor soul.

 

In a way its a step back from Teras pvp Imo. while the pvp  in tera was not really balanced well in  since things like reapers , gunners and brawlers came into the existence of the game  (brawler sooo op...) And the fact of ping issues  so whoever had the higher ping generslly won I feel the pvp was still stronger if not a bit more  wellly  crafted then BnS for group and possibly 1v1 but never the less this games still satisfying so enjoy it for what it is.