Mage

Blade and Soul is being censored despite them previously saying otherwise.

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They aren't that 'big' because they are more restricted on how and how much they can change the main story line. They cannot edit cutscene material or change game 'direction' as in make new objectives or new quests. However, the fact remains that much of what was changed was completely unnecessary, and in my opinion, 100% of it worse than what was there before. You can't tell me the writing team was uncomfortable with the mayor being a cunning bad guy. Scoobie Dooifying him accomplished , what, exactly?

 

Dumbing down the story. I'm severely tempted to do a complete run through of beta, and the Taiwan client side by side and list every single change that is outside the reasonable limits of translation. Did you know quite a few sidequests edited NPC personalities so that most instances of the hero being tricked, bried, intimidated, or was apathetic too in the sidequests were also rewritten? So we get a near flawless hero, and bland side quests.

 

The thing is, this quest is a 4 part chain. The issue with it is in the very last part. They could have rewritten it for a more palatable message. Easily. Instead, the entire thing was rewritten. The Swan Maiden reference made it into Aion too, which tells me that folk tale either popular or more known. They removed everything, and considering the nature of the other changes (spurious, unnecessary, at point ill thought out) leaves me feeling less than charitable.

 

By all means, if it's that offensive change it. However, don't be surprised when I think that someone saw the opportunity for taking more liberties with the source material than necessary, and is hiding behind 'It made me uncomfortable!' as a blanket justification.

 

It's funny how the most interesting posts, those dealing with how this particular change is only the result of a much larger problem - a localization team whose purpose from the get go has been to not do an accurate translation but instead a "close enough" one, localization team that was not part on NCSoft until recently ago and thus has different sensibilities than the rest of the company. The overall quality of the game has been brought down by this team, and I just can't fathom why something of this sort is happening.

 

You people are just busy discussing gender politics while the actual problem goes glossed over: almost none of the text present in the game, yellow quests aside because those were out of their jurisdiction to change (which leads me to believe that this team wanted to rewrite even more of the text, but were forbidden to do so, much to their dismay), is accurate to that of the original.

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Rahaya   

I am fairly certain it's because this entire project is rushed. Other MMOs have alphas that last for weeks to months, and they use them to test multiple builds and iron out changes. 'Alpha' for us was a publicity stunt for two weekends. Then 'Beta' in which more founder packs are sold to the populace and again, no actual testing of the game itself. There is supposedly multiple script builds. We won't see the finalized version until launch, conveniently after it's too late to refund packs for anyone wanting to see if anything at all has been done with any part of the game.

 

Wanting NA/EU to be part of the world tournament scene is the given reason for why we have an unbalanced lvl 50 patch in lvl 45 content. However, NCSoft also said that they won't be assisting NA/EU with that at all. Regional tournaments and such has to be created and managed by the community. They set a goal but won't help you reach it.

 

In short, low budget. Low priority. It was straight out said that the writing team will do what they want because new players won't know any better. New players won't know the game they are playing could have been better. That it was better.

 

Enjoy the localization!

Edited by Rahaya

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Kirsche   

As far as I'm aware they apologized for the censorship of Elin afterward and didn't care if anyone used tools to uncensor

It's more of a don't ask don't tell sort of thing. They don't care if you use the uncensor mod or other visual mods, voice mods, or even a DPS meter. However, if you talk about it in chat and someone reports you, they have to give you a stern talking to about the ToS. Not sure if they're even still giving out temp bans for it. I've had many visual mods on my client since the beta and I've never had any issues.

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Xenire   
In short, low budget. Low priority. It was straight out said that the writing team will do what they want because new players won't know any better. New players won't know the game they are playing could have been better. That it was better.

I've had this impression the entire time but it's completely expected. I honestly think one of the only reasons NCsoft finally decided to bring the game over is because there is a chance it will grow the esports scene which they would profit greatly from. It seems apparent they are spending the least amount of money possible to make that happen as it's all practically on a whim in the first place.

Course the truth is, NCsoft has been taking an extremely cheap cost cutting approach to Blade and Soul since the 2.0 patch. Despite the success of the game they increased priority on pseudo-content to cut costs and increase profit at the cost of western localization and most all casual players. It's honestly amazing that the game is still doing okay in Korea considering their austere handling of the game after it became successful.

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I just want to clarify something: this started out as some guy complaining about censorship and when people told him "yea, i can see why they censored it" this turned into a debate about larger gender issues because whether you agree with the editing of the quest or not, a big portion of people posting here cannot even acknowledge that sexualization of women exists or does any harm and this refusal to acknowledge is what in particular pushed me personally over the edge in this thread.

 

It's impossible to explain in a single sitting how big of an impact things like skimpily dressed characters in tv, movies, games, etc had on me growing up surrounded by these images and portrayals and observing my male friends and family members responses to these images. Growing up seeing women treated differently based on their sexual desirability, and then "coming of age" and seeing how I was treated reinforced what I saw as a kid and made me think "despite what my parents tell me, this is the way the world is." Add in learning how to have sex from watching highly degrading internet porn (where most kids these days learn it) -- by the time a girl is ready to start having sex she has it deeply ingrained in her that she's basically a cum dumpster whose purpose in life is to please men sexually and that above her career or other accomplishments her looks (and chastity and somehow, though contradictory, her ability to sexually please a man) are still the most important things about her. It wasn't until my mid twenties that I really felt like I was able to say "no" to things that I didn't want to do sexually because I was finally learning that what I want as a human being mattered just as much as what some man wants.

 

Men are gonna read this and laugh and make insults to me about this, but that's just going to prove my point that none of you have even the slightest comprehension of how severely your gender affects your life experience and perception of self and how degrading and negative all these "little things" that are "no big deal" collectively are when you are a female. It's hard to not get emotional when someone is essentially telling you that your life experiences don't mean anything and that things that have hurt you are entertaining. 

 

So really, you males, and the few females, saying misogyny is no big deal and it's ok in the game because it's fiction need to check your privilege. 

 

< Female, Reading it, Laughing to your face. check your entitlement, find something worth while to *cricket* about.

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Purple   

Bingo, Diagonally, lets see if i can fill the entire card, between Zy and Queen dipshit its looking pretty good.

This card was filled night #1

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This had better be the best bait this side of the net

because I refuse to believe a person who has these thoughts actually exists.

 

Welcome to SJW Feminism, we have pamphlets over here, please do your best not to poke them or they will post to their blog about how a sexist pig dared touch their holyness. do be warned they see themselves much like gods, and have the egos to back it up. it is best to just ignore them and let them think you actually care about their world view, if you say any thing against it they multiple like a virus and then will set out to try and attack you, while this is even more hillarious, they do often times result to vigilante "justice" otherwise known as assault. so be sure to have the police on speed dial when dealing with them.

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it is best to just ignore them and let them think you actually care about their world view, if you say any thing against it they multiple like a virus and then will set out to try and attack you

Look up "Protein World", They just mocked the SJW's attacking them and gained more sales in 1 week than they had seen the previous year. The solution is not to lay low and pretend to humor them, it's to out-right ridicule them as loudly and as publicly as possible. There are tremendous rewards in doing so, as polls show 70% of the US agrees political correctness has gone too far and is cancer.

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EroGG   

1. Yes, obviously. I already addressed this. They were hired by the company, they're the ones doing the work. Once again, I must remind people that this is a commercial product, not a work of art. Feel free to continue complaining about it if you wish, but something tells me you're barking up the wrong tree.

2. You missed the point of that line. Yes, that's exactly what I was saying. The CHARACTER is supposed to experience lots of ups and downs. I was saying that players who have trouble differentiating in-character and out-of-character will often only accept ups for their character because they see the downs as insults or slights against their person.

3. I thought it was obvious, but okay: that was an analogy to the game story itself mistreating the female player's sex and turning them off of the game that way. Mind you, I don't believe that the quest was so terrible that it would have done so to a significant degree, but then I also don't believe the original was something so great that it's worth preserving in its original form.

 

That last line is pretty damn insulting.

Believe it or not, the forums do NOT make up the bulk of any fanbase, core or otherwise. I once erroneously believed this, but you know what happened when I actually went ahead and polled people?

Yeah, nah, the forums are indicative of NOTHING. Only that there are a handful of people who really want to be heard. That's it. The forums are one of the absolute worst places to gauge the general timbre of any player base, because MOST PLAYERS ARE JUST PLAYING THE GAME.

Don't let the 'overwhelming' consensus here get to your head. I would not be surprised at all to see the majority of the player base is in the 'what's the big deal?' camp, not the 'ALL CENSORSHIP IS IMMORAL' camp.

1. Actually it is a work of art. The fact that it is being moneytized doesn't make it not art.

2. Then the issue lies with the player and not the story. This is a M-rated game not a daycare center, if you take anything bad that happens to your character as a personal insult you probably shouldn't be playing this game and instead get help for your mental illness.

3. As you said yourself it's not something that's awful or needs changing. You meet a tribe that values strength above all else and views you as weak because of your sex. You then prove yourself and earn their respect. I would argue that the story empowores women.

 

Also I said core fans not most players. The way I see it the community can be divided into three groups. The core fans who want the game to be how it was intended by the original developers, the majority who don't really care about the game enough to even know about the changes and the SJWs who care more about their ideology and their feelings than the game.

Edited by EroGG

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And the Core Fans are the ones who usually make up the hard-core community that financially and technically feeds the game.  They're the ones that create raiding guilds and make up the core e-sport demographic.

Alienating them is the fast-track to a fizzled launch.

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Cherish   

OMG don't you guys/gals ever sleep :D

 

I keep reading this thread because I think it is highly amusing from both sides putting forward their arguements.  I just had to google what SJW stood for as I had no clue in Australia Ive never heard the term used.  Political Correctness mmmmhhh...... I have to agree it has gotten way out of control.  I know that, I understand that but I also understand why the changes were made. 

 

I remember back when I was playing Fiesta Online many years ago, ONE person complained about the blood spatters on the monitor as you killed mobs and it was removed from the game.

 

I remember an npc in Aion who pretty much invited me back to his hotel room for a night of fun and debauchery.

 

I also remember another npc in Aion who suggested if I had time to kill he was more than happy to keep me company.

 

All of those things I had a giggle over as I read them, I remember madly whispering my mates and repeating the dialogue to them and we all laughed.  I do beleive Political Correctness is over the top and is making the world a much harder place to live in.  I also understand that NCsoft knew that it would only take a couple of people to complain about that quest and the shit would hit the fan.  I sympathise with you the user who feels badly done by because of the changes and I also feel for NCsoft's position.  And just to clarify I just checked and nothing has altered while reading this thread I am still definately of the female variety.

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Hiei   

To be honest I think this whole debate is riddled with to many ideologues, as I have made it clear earlier I have far more respect for camp that's against censorship period. An have very little respect 3rd wave feminists & SJW's pushing a censorship agenda. I still don't think either side is particularly realistic.

 

From what I understand there has been very little editing to the source material of this game. What has been edited might of been for all the wrong reasons. But we're kidding ourselves if we think these few things are seriously going to impact our enjoyment. These's are quests that a lot of people skip anyway, a lot don't even pay attention to the story. 

 

Furthermore a good story has never been the foundation of a great MMORPG. It's the core gameplay, art style & depth of content that'll make of break this title. Story is of course important, but I remain unconvinced the SJW's have done nearly enough damage to make the experience much less enjoyable.

 

My take away is honestly... Let them think they won, it'll stop them hurting themselves & others in the long run. It's true ultra political correctness is destroying our education systems & degrading our media. However fighting a massive battle over a few quest edits isn't worth the effort. You'll never get 100% of the pie, we have to share this game with these fools sadly. 

 

Better to take 95% an let them revel in their mindless joy about how they censored a tiny portion of the overall experience. Although I doubt this debate has any real impact on the story honestly.

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Estribo   
My take away is honestly... Let them think they won, it'll stop them hurting themselves & others in the long run. It's true ultra political correctness is destroying our education systems & degrading our media. However fighting a massive battle over a few quest edits isn't worth the effort. You'll never get 100% of the pie, we have to share this game with these fools sadly. 

 

Better to take 95% an let them revel in their mindless joy about how they censored a tiny portion of the overall experience. Although I doubt this debate has any real impact on the story honestly.

 

One vote among tens of thousands is only one vote, but it's only by casting your vote that one can potentially become ten thousand.

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Purple   

Sorry to but-in

Is this about outfit censorship?

Wow did they lie about outfit censorship :0

Game content, quests ect

Edited by Purple

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Ryjian   

Holy crap, you people have nothing to do with you're lives do you? You complain about the most stupid things ever no matter how small. Do you ever go outside? Do you people even have a job other than sitting at the computer concocting up complete non-sense to spew on the forum boards? I'm sorry, but iv'e seen many threads across many MMO's with people complaining about the most retarded shit. It reminds me of someone complaining about an in-game item on FFXIV "Shark Fin Soup" because it had to do with killing sharks. Pathetic.

 

I'm going to leave this here from 2-3 years ago when they first addressed this situation.

 

"Due to ESRB guidelines, however, our marketing material must abide by a different set of considerations than the final product. This is why Blade & Soul's rating is listed as "pending." It is NCSOFT West's intention to accurately depict the game in its original, unaltered form, with only minor adjustments for gameplay considerations. In short: We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim and a studio such as Team Bloodlust. Rest assured that we love Blade & Soul as much as you do, and any modifications to the marketing material are not indicative of our plans for the final content."

 

http://2p.com/5122e97461fcd05020b71396_1/Blade--Soul-Will-not-Censor-The-Game-For-The-West.htm

 

That line that says "We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim", Basically means the art work, designs of outfits, character models, environment, etc. That ONE side quest they altered was their minor adjustment for "Gameplay Considerations".

 

To think everyone is going ape shit over a damn side quest and screaming "Omg this Side Quest was altered! It ruins my whole gameplay! I Quit!"  Seriously guys, c'mon. I'm sorry i'm being very full out frontal about this but like i said, this is very pathetic. Anyway, i'm still going to enjoy BnS and not cry foul over a damn sidequest that i will never see again unlike my character, outfits and such.

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BullsI   

I find this thread amusing. Both sides have some absolutely abysmal arguments and frankly the thread is mostly derived of "You've turned to insults because you have no argument so I'm going to insult you as well" repeated over and over. That said, I find the below post beyond hilarious, but it does highlight an issue so I thought I'd dissect it a bit. I mean, who doesn't love putting a little more fuel on the fire.

oh yea, and before I start...  I'm caucasian, and I'm a heterosexual male; feel free to ignore my arguments due to that fact.

☑ privilege.

 

I just want to clarify something: this started out as some guy complaining about censorship and when people told him "yea, i can see why they censored it" this turned into a debate about larger gender issues because whether you agree with the editing of the quest or not, a big portion of people posting here cannot even acknowledge that sexualization of women exists or does any harm and this refusal to acknowledge is what in particular pushed me personally over the edge in this thread.

 

 Clearly, no male ever gets sexualized.  No one (or at least no one's post i bothered reading) has denied sexualization.  In fact, many of them have pointed out that the whole game tends towards sexualization.  I submit that it's actually of both sexes.  Is this causing any sort of harm?  I don't know.  I don't even think that's the question that needs to be answered as a mature adult should be able to separate fantasy from reality.  Fantasy is morally ambiguous precisely because its meant to separate us from reality and even challenge our view of morality.  Let's say they had left the quest in as it was originally created.  Lets also say you don't ignore the text like I probably would have.  You play the quest and find it's content disturbing.  What this actually means is your morality was challenged.  You feel disturbed because you realize this isn't something you would want in your life.  Hell, just this thread is proving its a decent discussion point.  To bad its degenerated so rapidly and ridiculously.

 

It's impossible to explain in a single sitting how big of an impact things like skimpily dressed characters in tv, movies, games, etc had on me growing up surrounded by these images and portrayals and observing my male friends and family members responses to these images. Growing up seeing women treated differently based on their sexual desirability, and then "coming of age" and seeing how I was treated reinforced what I saw as a kid and made me think "despite what my parents tell me, this is the way the world is." Add in learning how to have sex from watching highly degrading internet porn (where most kids these days learn it) -- by the time a girl is ready to start having sex she has it deeply ingrained in her that she's basically a cum dumpster whose purpose in life is to please men sexually and that above her career or other accomplishments her looks (and chastity and somehow, though contradictory, her ability to sexually please a man) are still the most important things about her. It wasn't until my mid twenties that I really felt like I was able to say "no" to things that I didn't want to do sexually because I was finally learning that what I want as a human being mattered just as much as what some man wants.

I so badly want to mock this with a "So... you do <user your imagination>?" but I'll refrain purely because its filtered out and I don't feel like bypassing the filter.

 

What we see here is a classic example of allowing access to mature content before reaching a maturity level that the separation of fantasy and reality can form.  While not completely eliminated, this would easily be mitigated by parents actively filtering and monitoring what there kids are ingesting and just in general interacting and discussing, and teaching there kids.  I mean, parental ratings exist for a reason...  If you ACTUALLY believed your whole purpose in life was to have a dick in you till you were 20, I hate to say it, but you have some REALLY, REALLY, shitty parents.  On the other hand, if you were just trying to get the hot guys to pay attention to you and/or just in general garner attention from the teenage male population, then who do you really think was perpetuating sexualization, gender stereotypes, etc.  If you answered both of you, then we're on to something!

 

Men are gonna read this and laugh and make insults to me about this, but that's just going to prove my point that none of you have even the slightest comprehension of how severely your gender affects your life experience and perception of self and how degrading and negative all these "little things" that are "no big deal" collectively are when you are a female. It's hard to not get emotional when someone is essentially telling you that your life experiences don't mean anything and that things that have hurt you are entertaining. 

 

So really, you males, and the few females, saying misogyny is no big deal and it's ok in the game because it's fiction need to check your privilege.

I'm just throwing this out there, but most the laughing and mocking is coming from your presentation, not the lack of comprehension of your argument or even disagreement of it. That's the problem with a lot of these arguments. The people leading them come across as attention seeking trolls and there arguments get lost in the presentation even if the points they are making are valid. For instance, do you REALLY think males don't get affected by gender perception?.. really?.. REALLY?.. To use a common and slightly blatant one, how about "real men don't cry".

So yea, I think I just got triggered :P

Ok, enough of that, I don't feel like going further in any of those discussions. I don't mind the fact they changed the quest because they were uncomfortable with it. I mean, it doesn't really translate well from eastern humor to western humor. I think they missed a great opportunity to flex there writing muscles though. I think it should have remained as a humorous morality story instead of the modification that made it a "feel good" type story. I don't really have a good idea how they would have accomplished that though, which is probably why I'm not a writer. hah

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My take away is honestly... Let them think they won, it'll stop them hurting themselves & others in the long run. It's true ultra political correctness is destroying our education systems & degrading our media. However fighting a massive battle over a few quest edits isn't worth the effort. You'll never get 100% of the pie, we have to share this game with these fools sadly. 

 

Better to take 95% an let them revel in their mindless joy about how they censored a tiny portion of the overall experience. Although I doubt this debate has any real impact on the story honestly.

Give them an inch, they take a mile. 

This outlook facilitates entryism for these ideologues

Edited by plasmacutter

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Ishtar   

Holy crap, you people have nothing to do with you're lives do you? You complain about the most stupid things ever no matter how small. Do you ever go outside? Do you people even have a job other than sitting at the computer concocting up complete non-sense to spew on the forum boards? I'm sorry, but iv'e seen many threads across many MMO's with people complaining about the most retarded shit. It reminds me of someone complaining about an in-game item on FFXIV "Shark Fin Soup" because it had to do with killing sharks. Pathetic.

 

I'm going to leave this here from 2-3 years ago when they first addressed this situation.

 

"Due to ESRB guidelines, however, our marketing material must abide by a different set of considerations than the final product. This is why Blade & Soul's rating is listed as "pending." It is NCSOFT West's intention to accurately depict the game in its original, unaltered form, with only minor adjustments for gameplay considerations. In short: We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim and a studio such as Team Bloodlust. Rest assured that we love Blade & Soul as much as you do, and any modifications to the marketing material are not indicative of our plans for the final content."

 

http://2p.com/5122e97461fcd05020b71396_1/Blade--Soul-Will-not-Censor-The-Game-For-The-West.htm

 

That line that says "We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim", Basically means the art work, designs of outfits, character models, environment, etc. That ONE side quest they altered was their minor adjustment for "Gameplay Considerations".

 

To think everyone is going ape shit over a damn side quest and screaming "Omg this Side Quest was altered! It ruins my whole gameplay! I Quit!"  Seriously guys, c'mon. I'm sorry i'm being very full out frontal about this but like i said, this is very pathetic. Anyway, i'm still going to enjoy BnS and not cry foul over a damn sidequest that i will never see again unlike my character, outfits and such.

https://forums.bladeandsoul.com/forums/index.php?/topic/139206-what-did-you-do-to-the-story-spoilers/

 

Everyone Play Along!

 

dd73NsH.png

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Holy crap, you people have nothing to do with you're lives do you? You complain about the most stupid things ever no matter how small. Do you ever go outside? Do you people even have a job other than sitting at the computer concocting up complete non-sense to spew on the forum boards? I'm sorry, but iv'e seen many threads across many MMO's with people complaining about the most retarded shit. It reminds me of someone complaining about an in-game item on FFXIV "Shark Fin Soup" because it had to do with killing sharks. Pathetic.

 

I'm going to leave this here from 2-3 years ago when they first addressed this situation.

 

"Due to ESRB guidelines, however, our marketing material must abide by a different set of considerations than the final product. This is why Blade & Soul's rating is listed as "pending." It is NCSOFT West's intention to accurately depict the game in its original, unaltered form, with only minor adjustments for gameplay considerations. In short: We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim and a studio such as Team Bloodlust. Rest assured that we love Blade & Soul as much as you do, and any modifications to the marketing material are not indicative of our plans for the final content."

 

http://2p.com/5122e97461fcd05020b71396_1/Blade--Soul-Will-not-Censor-The-Game-For-The-West.htm

 

That line that says "We are not planning to censor or alter the actual in-game content you have come to expect from an artist such as Hyung-Tae Kim", Basically means the art work, designs of outfits, character models, environment, etc. That ONE side quest they altered was their minor adjustment for "Gameplay Considerations".

 

To think everyone is going ape shit over a damn side quest and screaming "Omg this Side Quest was altered! It ruins my whole gameplay! I Quit!"  Seriously guys, c'mon. I'm sorry i'm being very full out frontal about this but like i said, this is very pathetic. Anyway, i'm still going to enjoy BnS and not cry foul over a damn sidequest that i will never see again unlike my character, outfits and such.

 

Not only this side quest, I suggest you to read the whole thread instead of saying bullshit.

Edited by Lichtsaule

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AttacKat   

FFXIV ...

and XIV only has a T rating, in comparison to BnS's M.

The same FFXIV ARR that is produced by a Japanese crew, and thinks it was okay to have a whole race being only female that are sex slaves and whores when it was introduced ... 

 

Yeah. I played it for a while and I am glad I got banned on that forum because I called the producer a liar. I know I don't support that company anymore.

 

Personally, I would seriously question those parents who do allow their kids to play that game. How respectful are their children towards other human beings?

 

TERA and FF14 conspicuously avoided censorship and they're the most successful MMORPGs on the market.

 

 

I don't think so. http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/square-enix-mmo-trio-fails-to-muster-1m-subscribers/0143457

Edited by AttacKat

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