Mage

Blade and Soul is being censored despite them previously saying otherwise.

Recommended Posts

Katsura   

well all i can say is some of us and i know a majority know there is a Certain mob that has a  Swastika Sign and maybe they didn't or did cencored it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rahaya   

Considering I myself posted a detailed breakdown of what was changed in the main storyline, no, those are not the only parts changed. Zy, just stop.

 

There are only two changes to the main story quest:
1. The time travel being changed to 'clairvoyance', a perhaps unnecessary change but not in any way related to censorship
2. The Lycandi elder being changed to be ageist instead of sexist - which, honestly, is a change that I don't really see the point of but is so minor I can't be arsed to decry either way
 
The rest of the story, including all the major story beats, are exactly the same.
 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Killian   

well all i can say is some of us and i know a majority know there is a Certain mob that has a  Swastika Sign and maybe they didn't or did cencored it

https://www.flickr.com/photos/49337086@N07/4525274963

Not saying you don't know the difference, but if they really changed it because people couldn't be assed to learn the difference between an ancient symbol and nazis well...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Zofi   

I swear, if they start removing swastikas because of Nazi influence, that will be a low blow to the game.  Swastikas have a lot more history than just the Nazi's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Little J   

I swear, if they start removing swastikas because of Nazi influence, that will be a low blow to the game.  Swastikas have a lot more history than just the Nazi's.

I believe Youmukon, French CM for NCSoft has already mentioned in a B&S general thread on 4chan that they are going to get those swastika symbols removed, eventually before launch. His reason being that "Most people in the western world have very little knowledge of Buddhism or Hinduism and will jump straight to thinking it represents Nazism.

Sad, but understanable.

Edited by Little J

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Killian   

I believe Youmukon, French CM for NCSoft has already mentioned in a B&S general thread on 4chan that they are going to get those swastika symbols removed, eventually before launch. His reason being that "Most people in the western world have very little knowledge of Buddhism or Hinduism and will jump straight to thinking it represents Nazism.

Sad, but understanable.

Man that's really sad.  :(  No wonder so many people are so uneducated if they're never exposed to something they have to actually research for five minutes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shy0   

I believe Youmukon, French CM for NCSoft has already mentioned in a B&S general thread on 4chan that they are going to get those swastika symbols removed, eventually before launch. His reason being that "Most people in the western world have very little knowledge of Buddhism or Hinduism and will jump straight to thinking it represents Nazism.

Sad, but understanable.

 

sad? yes, totally. understandable? absolutely not.

 

how can you accept something like this? a person with common sense would think, "why have they put a potentially offensive symbol into their game?" and do a bit of research google it, satisfy him/herself with an answer and carry on playing.

 

what's the point of having a highly-evolved brain if you don't use it?

 

please note, all instances of "you" in this post are not directed at any specific person, they are just generalised "you"s for rhetorical effect.

 

if ncwest are really going to dumb down their game this much and remove symbolism that some people can actually appreciate just to suit the ignorant masses, i'm leaving. i'm not supporting a game publisher that promotes and enables stupidity by censoring other peoples' hard work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1. In this case the changes weren't made by the writers who created the culture.

2. Is that really a bad thing? The story should have ups and downs for your charcter in order to make it more compelling and believable.

3. And this is related to BnS how?

1. Yes, obviously. I already addressed this. They were hired by the company, they're the ones doing the work. Once again, I must remind people that this is a commercial product, not a work of art. Feel free to continue complaining about it if you wish, but something tells me you're barking up the wrong tree.

2. You missed the point of that line. Yes, that's exactly what I was saying. The CHARACTER is supposed to experience lots of ups and downs. I was saying that players who have trouble differentiating in-character and out-of-character will often only accept ups for their character because they see the downs as insults or slights against their person.

3. I thought it was obvious, but okay: that was an analogy to the game story itself mistreating the female player's sex and turning them off of the game that way. Mind you, I don't believe that the quest was so terrible that it would have done so to a significant degree, but then I also don't believe the original was something so great that it's worth preserving in its original form.

 

Their "compromise" seems to have pissed off their core fans. The writting team should be fired. They not only butchered parts of the story, but even when they stuck to the original they made the dialogue nonsensical and cringeworthy. I would not be surprised if their hiring was the result of quotas.

That last line is pretty damn insulting.

Believe it or not, the forums do NOT make up the bulk of any fanbase, core or otherwise. I once erroneously believed this, but you know what happened when I actually went ahead and polled people?

Yeah, nah, the forums are indicative of NOTHING. Only that there are a handful of people who really want to be heard. That's it. The forums are one of the absolute worst places to gauge the general timbre of any player base, because MOST PLAYERS ARE JUST PLAYING THE GAME.

Don't let the 'overwhelming' consensus here get to your head. I would not be surprised at all to see the majority of the player base is in the 'what's the big deal?' camp, not the 'ALL CENSORSHIP IS IMMORAL' camp.

 

Considering I myself posted a detailed breakdown of what was changed in the main storyline, no, those are not the only parts changed. Zy, just stop.

I missed that. My apologies.

To address that, the other changes aren't that big either (the mayor line and guard lines are extremely minor overall) and the naming change is an overall naming change, not a story change.

Actually, I do agree with others that the naming change was completely unnecessary, as is the change to mash all names together into a single name instead of having separate first and last, etc. That's something I'm sure lots of us can agree with.

a bunch of sissies

Just quoting this for posterity.

"Sissies" has to be one of the weakest insults I've ever seen. Feels like I'm back in 1999.

Edited by Zyrusticae

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You just forgot that the millenial are a bunch of sissies bitching about everything, their brains being disabled since the first grade. Therefore, they don't know about Google or Wikipedia.

Well, I wouldn't say they don't know about it. More like they just don't know how to use it in any way other than to strengthen their own bubble.

Sigh, I barely fit in as millennial. Well, I have a lot of experience with how to deal with the nonsense, at least...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vivien   
 

I believe Youmukon, French CM for NCSoft has already mentioned in a B&S general thread on 4chan that they are going to get those swastika symbols removed, eventually before launch. His reason being that "Most people in the western world have very little knowledge of Buddhism or Hinduism and will jump straight to thinking it represents Nazism.

Sad, but understanable.

 

...they must think their entire audience for this game are uneducated.

Just because the game has the symbol of swastika in its contents, it doesn't mean that the developers enforce Nazism.

I understand that the people in the western hemisphere would think of Nazis as the first thing that comes up in their mind when they see the symbol if you don't have much knowledge in Asian religion, but come on it's *cricket*ing 2015 almost going to 2016 now.

Just like Shy0 said on their post, if one wonders why there's a symbol in the game that they know as something associated with Nazis, look it up.

Search what the real meaning of swastika is. We live in modern world, don't know something? GOOGLE IS YOUR FRIEND.

But no, they need to cover up our eyes and babysit our minds because they don't think people can handle such thing.

Not surprised though, after seeing how many lazy people who doesn't even bother reading up that *cricket*ing Closed Beta FAQ that could have the answers they seek and just going on to create multiples of same threads with same questions, (it clearly says [Read First] and it's even on the *cricket*ing top of the page of this forum), I don't think they believe our brains have the capacity to understand anything...

I can see that some people might take offense to the symbol itself even by just looking at it.

But for me, I don't really care if the swastika is in the game whether I have the knowledge of its origin or not as long as it doesn't actually try to enforce the negative image in a good way. But I guess that's just me speaking for my opinion :l

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...they must think their entire audience for this game are uneducated.

Just because the game has the symbol of swastika in its contents, it doesn't mean that the developers enforce Nazism.

I understand that the people in the western hemisphere would think of Nazis as the first thing that comes up in their mind when they see the symbol if you don't have much knowledge in Asian religion, but come on it's *cricket*ing 2015 almost going to 2016 now.

 

It's not about them thinking the audience is uneducated or anything. It's just that this game wouldn't be able to be published in some countries like Germany if it has swastika signs in it. This is pretty much the only thing they can't help but to censor. All the other censorship is idiotic, but this one I can understand if they want to release in the west. Just the law in some countries.

 

Also, screaming "IT'S 2015" isn't really an argument and will make you look almost just as silly as Zyrusticae, who can't form proper arguments based on logic instead of emotions either without falling back on pure semantics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also, screaming "IT'S 2015" isn't really an argument and will make you look almost just as silly as Zyrusticae, who can't form proper arguments based on logic instead of emotions either without falling back on pure semantics.

kek

Seriously tho, I have to go to semantics because apparently a lot of posters don't even know the basics of fiction writing... which I'm not too surprised about because, yeah, creative writing isn't exactly the most popular career path. Still, it really behooves people to educate themselves about the basics if they're going to engage in a conversation about this subject. Otherwise, we get exactly the kind of silly back-and-forth BS we see here.

(also reminder that 'I disagree' does not mean 'my opponent MUST be illogical and emotional!', but you know, whatever)

Edited by Zyrusticae

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Killian   

It's not about them thinking the audience is uneducated or anything. It's just that this game wouldn't be able to be published in some countries like Germany if it has swastika signs in it. This is pretty much the only thing they can't help but to censor. All the other censorship is idiotic, but this one I can understand if they want to release in the west. Just the law in some countries.

 

Also, screaming "IT'S 2015" isn't really an argument and will make you look almost just as silly as Zyrusticae, who can't form proper arguments based on logic instead of emotions either without falling back on pure semantics.

 

I was actually curious about this since I don't know anything about German law, but I found "The swastikas on Hindu, Buddhist, and Jain temples are exempt, as religious symbols cannot be banned in Germany." And since the ones in game are obviously not the Nazi versions, would it really hold ground to cut them out? I'm really wondering now, maybe a German player could answer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vivien   

It's not about them thinking the audience is uneducated or anything. It's just that this game wouldn't be able to be published in some countries like Germany if it has swastika signs in it. This is pretty much the only thing they can't help but to censor. All the other censorship is idiotic, but this one I can understand if they want to release in the west. Just the law in some countries.

 

Also, screaming "IT'S 2015" isn't really an argument and will make you look almost just as silly as Zyrusticae, who can't form proper arguments based on logic instead of emotions either without falling back on pure semantics.

 

Naw, I didn't post to have arguments with anyone, only posted to just throw my opinion out there.

I posted something to just express my opinion in quick and now it's an argument?

There are enough arguments going around in this entire thread as it is.

I don't think I screamed out about it being 2015, rather only used *cricket*ing >.> (ok I may have screamed on GOOGLE but hey, if you don't know how to use google search by now, then I will scream at you :c )

Screaming would be like that guy who wrote an entire long wall of text with caps on another thread below xD

Don't associate me with Zyrusticae with just one line of what I said, I don't think I've fallen that low.

 

Well if they're censoring that for EU server, then I can understand that. I guess the CM who talked about that is the French CM so there's that.

But I don't really see it THAT necessary for NA server release.

In the end, it's NCWest who's doing the work deciding what should be censored and what shouldn't be.

As much as I don't agree on many things they've done, nothing we can do about it (hence why I stopped making any posts with question regarding to localization on that pinned thread on top).

Edited by Vivien

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Little J   

sad? yes, totally. understandable? absolutely not.

 

how can you accept something like this? a person with common sense would think, "why have they put a potentially offensive symbol into their game?" and do a bit of research google it, satisfy him/herself with an answer and carry on playing.

 

Common sense is simply not as common as it should be these days.

As many have pointed out, people are just too freaking dumb or lazy to find out these things out on their own and would rather get upset instead.

I don't want to accept it, but what can we do? Ignorant people will always be ignorant and sadly they have the most money.

Edited by Little J

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Naruto   

 

Not only is this censorship, but they are hiding away cultural aspects of the eastern areas. They are insulting the players, the creator of the quest, and ultimately changing and removing the culture, history, and folk lore of the eastern part of our would.

...

They don't want the world of Blade & Soul to be westernized, they just want it translated. 

 

 

once again for the Senioir Writer of "Blade & Soul" and his team

(he just deleted my comment in his "Open Discussion" right after he started his topic, about that i don't want westernized version but just translated version.)

 

We don't want the world of Blade & Soul to be westernized, we just want it translated!!!

Edited by Naruto

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

(also reminder that 'I disagree' does not mean 'my opponent MUST be illogical and emotional!', but you know, whatever)

It does in your case, seeing as all the arguments you've been throwing around that haven't been semantics have been stuff like "but women have had it bad FOR CENTURIES and therefore this censorship makes sense or something!" or "The content was GROSS! Ban this filth!". Those aren't arguments based on logic, but purely based on emotions.

 

 

I was actually curious about this since I don't know anything about German law, but I found "The swastikas on Hindu, Buddhist, and Jain temples are exempt, as religious symbols cannot be banned in Germany." And since the ones in game are obviously not the Nazi versions, would it really hold ground to cut them out? I'm really wondering now, maybe a German player could answer.

I think they're just erring on the side of caution. They probably also want to avoid the "This game has swastikas on their weapons!" kotaku-clickbait articles.

 

 

Well if they're censoring that for EU server, then I can understand that. I guess the CM who talked about that is the French CM so there's that.

But I don't really see it THAT necessary for NA server release.

The NA and EU releases are the same in every way. They won't be making different builds just for this.

Edited by Greenecat

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

once again for the Senioir Writer of "Blade & Soul" and his team

(he just deleted my comment in his "Open Discussion" right after he started his topic, about that i don't want westernized version but just translated version.)

 

We don't want the world of Blade & Soul to be westernized, we just want it translated!!!

 

 

Speak for yourself. You don't want it westernized. I do. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vivien   

It does in your case, seeing as all the arguments you've been throwing around that haven't been semantics have been stuff like "but women have had it bad FOR CENTURIES and therefore this censorship makes sense or something!" or "The content was GROSS! Ban this filth!". Those aren't arguments based on logic, but purely based on emotions.

 

 

I think they're just erring on the side of caution. They probably also want to avoid the "This game has swastikas on their weapons!" kotaku-clickbait articles.

 

 

The NA and EU releases are the same in every way. They won't be making different builds just for this.

 

I know that they are. I said I can understand why for EU server but I feel it's unnecessary for NA.

Hence why I said on the latter that as much as I don't think it's necessary, nothing we can do about it because it's gonna happen anyway since works are being done in same way for both.

I should've said NA audience rather than making it sound like I was separating the 2 in different server matter, English isn't my first language and sometimes I can't make best sentences to express what I'm trying to say :l

Opinions are just opinions, I do not wish to start another pointless argument on this thread as this has gained 19 pages in just 1 day now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will definitely laugh when Julia will blow out in the game

 

"OMG look at these cow udders, that's sexist ! Make her as flat as a lyn !"

Edited by Lichtsaule

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vivien   

I will definitely laugh when Julia will blow out in the game

 

"OMG look at these cow udders, that's sexist ! Make her as flat as a lyn !"

 

There's already someone talking about everyone making cow udder females on that "Show off your characters" thread,

I can't wait to see what his response will be ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cherish   

Here is the post made by Rahaya stating the changes in the storyline quests

 

I won't support this censorship or these changes, no matter what. Same goes for the svastika

 

The few little changes to the storyline and graphics are not going to be changed to appease you.  Your support or lack of, is of no consequence to NCsoft as you are one of the few, not one of the many.  For the majority of us as shown in this thread the changes just dont affect us as they are not game breaking.  Not all of us have bothered to play the game on other servers and to us the changes just arent there as we feel we are seeing our original version right now.  Only option you have open to yourself is to walk away if you find it so game breaking. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Naruto   

I cannot fathom why a small team of writers was allowed to force their tastes on the entirety of the NA audience and I find that fact that they were not only allowed, but directed to do so incredibly disappointing. There is absolutely no reason an M rated MMO needs to read like a children's book.

 

The world isn't perfect, lets not pretend that it is.

Not just the entirely of the NA audience and not even Europe but all world which speak english will play this Blade and Soul version.

Why these writers allowed to force their tastes for all players in our world?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does in your case, seeing as all the arguments you've been throwing around that haven't been semantics have been stuff like "but women have had it bad FOR CENTURIES and therefore this censorship makes sense or something!" or "The content was GROSS! Ban this filth!". Those aren't arguments based on logic, but purely based on emotions.

*headdesk*

And you're going to tell me your incessant need to defend the original content is PURELY logical and rational and NOT AT ALL an emotional knee-jerk reaction to change?

Come on, people. Who are you fooling? I'm not the one who's resorted to base insults repeatedly over the course of this thread. At most, I've been snarky and sarcastic (because I would definitely lose my sanity otherwise).

This might shock you, but: fiction writing is not an exact science. There is no magic formula for creating a great story. There are guidelines, there are examples you can use as precedent, but ultimately what a writer puts down on a page or types into a computer are their collective experiences filtered through their imagination and put into a single coherent work.

You can argue that all censorship is wrong, sure, but this itself is not a logical argument, because there are in fact, rational (sales-figures based reasons) to engage in censorship, and the reaction to censorship in and of itself is very frequently not based on any sort of rational logic, but the exact kind of knee-jerk reactionism that's all over this entire thread.

All of that is just particularly silly in light of the fact that fiction writers very frequently just 'go with their gut' in the end. They feel things out. Just in the same way the writing team felt this is wrong and ultimately rewrote the quest because of it.

You guys like to make fun of my use of "toxic masculinity", but this post is like a perfect example of what I'm talking about when I mention it. You refuse to admit that emotions are something worth listening to. You refuse to even consider the possibility that you, yourselves, are subject to emotion as well. It's nonsense. You're HUMAN, not a ROBOT. No one is going to be perfect here. Don't act like you are.

Not just the entirely of the NA audience and not even Europe but all world which speak english will play this Blade and Soul version.

Why these writers allowed to force their tastes for all players in our world?

Because they got hired.

And not you guys.

Edited by Zyrusticae

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.