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Make Founder Pack rewards show up for every new character.

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Amateur   
 

Hi there,

 

I know a lot of you have weighed into this particular request and I just wanted to step in to let you know that we are hearing what everyone is saying and the suggestions that are being made. We have been and continue to discuss internally the comments of the community. Some suggestions are legally unfeasible (such as adjusting the number of consumables offered), while others have good points.

 

When we make our decision, please know that it wasn't a decision made in a vacuum and that we did listen to what the community said. You are not being ignored, and we appreciate all suggestions that come our way.

 

I will gently remind you that we did indeed specify on our Founder's Pack page that items (even costumes) were for a character. This is seen in the hovertip over the line item (we used the singular "your character" not the plural "your characters") as well as provided this item in the FAQ:

Are the costumes, accessory, and weapon skin in the Master Founder’s Pack available for all characters I create on my account?

You can redeem your Founder’s Packs benefits only once, but all items included in the Founder’s Packs can be shared between all your characters on the same account. Note that in the case of the Weapon Skin and consumable items , these can only be used once so choose wisely which character to use them on.

Please also be aware that the majority of the items in the pack are items that can be purchased through the in-game store. We provided NCoin within the pack so that any additional consumables desired for other characters can be purchased with the NCoin in the in-game store.

Both replies. 

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Bezerko   

 

 
 

Both replies. 

 

 

Lol.  I spend almost 6 weeks following this topic and somehow missed those replies made the last couple of days.  Go figure.

 

Well I'm glad they finally answered it and it's being reviewed.  Nothing worse than complete silence on such a big issue.

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Fael   

Attention NCSoft:

We little people would appreciate an official response to this thread one way or another.

Thanks

I lol'd :D

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Jem   

Honestly, that response just make it sound like nothing will be changed.

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Dragon Trade pouch is understandable.

 

But the costume.... It isn't really nice, I personally don't like it, it just isn't appealing to me. I used the Transcendence for less than one minute and took it off let alone the cowboy costume (extremely ugly). And mailing the costume only cost at most couple silver, it is really nothing once you reach higher lvl. Couple silver at lvl 45 dailies is like couple copper. So I don't understand the fuss about this thread.

 

The potions they gave, I haven't touched it. The hammer they gave, I haven't touched either because I never ran out of hammer. This thread impressed me how it get to 34 pages.

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Jaywell   

5 new character's with so much already given is actually quite a lot to ask. All those dragon pouches, key's and potions, FOR EVERY character up to the 5 you ORIGINAL make is a lot. Sure from a consumer's stand point you want more, and I personally really do want more, but you also have to respect the fact that you chose to buy the founder's pack, and basically supporting them of YOUR choice. Now I'm not saying it's your fault, but you can at the very least try not to be entitled to more than you already have. 

 

The beta solely exists to test the game's content, (lag + latency which NCSOFT NEEDS to hope on ASAP or else all the ping reliant classes are going to be impossible to play), and you're buying into a demo. NCSOFT is it's own sovereign company, it doesn't need to follow the outline of other companies. Like I've said before, I too would like to receive maximum goodies, but what right do I have to demand this? 

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Malvolio   

Dragon Trade pouch is understandable.

 

But the costume.... It isn't really nice, I personally don't like it, it just isn't appealing to me. I used the Transcendence for less than one minute and took it off let alone the cowboy costume (extremely ugly). And mailing the costume only cost at most couple silver, it is really nothing once you reach higher lvl. Couple silver at lvl 45 dailies is like couple copper. So I don't understand the fuss about this thread.

 

The potions they gave, I haven't touched it. The hammer they gave, I haven't touched either because I never ran out of hammer. This thread impressed me how it get to 34 pages.

 

Ah the "I don't care about anything and it doesn't bother me defense." Well with that argument we must all be wrong pack up the thread boys this guys opinion has decided for us.

 

Seriously though you and a few before you came all this way to post nothing constructive to the topic other than "No big deal". Maybe it wouldn't be 34 pages had people only posted if they wished to contribute to the topic

 

You didn't use the potions, you didn't use the hammers, you didn't care for the costumes. You just argued for not buying a founders pack at all as it makes no difference. 

 

Me personally I believe for some the masters pack is of great value its easily worth the money. But for those who buy founders packs for the convenience items they will be in for disappointment we were misled by every previous founder program not nickle diming their founders.

 

The per dollar value has been broken down if a set "bang for buck" value is all you care about its worth the buy. But if you were expecting the bag space and convenience items on every character get a refund.

 

If it were me I would make the convenience items weapon skins and bag slots per character and please everyone and sell more packs instead of getting greedy and nickle diming founders. Theres no short supply of unlimited digital items and account flags the assumption is people will make alt characters and buy bag space and the like but I believe it only lost them money.

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Yamyatos   

Ah the "I don't care about anything and it doesn't bother me defense." Well with that argument we must all be wrong pack up the thread boys this guys opinion has decided for us.

 

Seriously though you and a few before you came all this way to post nothing constructive to the topic other than "No big deal". Maybe it wouldn't be 34 pages had people only posted if they wished to contribute to the topic

 

You didn't use the potions, you didn't use the hammers, you didn't care for the costumes. You just argued for not buying a founders pack at all as it makes no difference. 

 

Me personally I believe for some the masters pack is of great value its easily worth the money. But for those who buy founders packs for the convenience items they will be in for disappointment we were misled by every previous founder program not nickle diming their founders.

 

The per dollar value has been broken down if a set "bang for buck" value is all you care about its worth the buy. But if you were expecting the bag space and convenience items on every character get a refund.

 

If it were me I would make the convenience items weapon skins and bag slots per character and please everyone and sell more packs instead of getting greedy and nickle diming founders. Theres no short supply of unlimited digital items and account flags the assumption is people will make alt characters and buy bag space and the like but I believe it only lost them money.

 

He did contribute. Stop being a dick to a person who doesnt share your opinion lol. 

For the dev's it's important to know how many people want something in perspective to the people who dont want or dont care about this topic. Not saying that this is a minority (well technically it is. Forum users in general are a minority), but dev's have to know if it's worth it implementing a feature that let's say only 10% really want. Just as an example.

 

That means, every post is important. If for you "being constructive" only means to write what you want to hear and progress the topic in the direction you want it to progress, well good job at suppressing the right of free speech and making all kind of discussion and statistics worthless. Welcome back to the dark age.

A thread with hundreds of (exclusively) positive posts demanding something is worthless if you dont know how many people dont care or are against it.  

 

I kinda agree with the topic of this discussion, at least with most of the points made - but could we maybe stay fair and not just instantly call people out just because they have different opinions and dared to do what forums are there for: posting them.

Edited by Yamyatos

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Naunet   

but what right do I have to demand this? 

 

You are the consumer. It's your job to make sure the deals your getting are in your favor. And the precedent set by pretty much every single other pre-order bonus/founders pack system in other MMOs is absolutely relevant. NCSoft is not operating in a vacuum, and they have games to compete with.

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The problem is that people are thinking linearly. 1 costume is clearly worth 10 dollars, so if a person got 1000 costumes, they should pay 10 000 dollars. Ignore the fact nobody would use 1000 costumes, you should pay for the imaginary value.

 

Do a person who have 5 characters play 5 times as many hours per day as others? No, they divide the time up so each character is played less. So a person getting 50 dragon pouches get 100% use from them if they play one character. A person who get 50 dragon pouches on one character but play 2, get 50% out of them. A person who plays 7 characters get 18% out of it. Why are these people paying the same master pack fee if they get as little as 20% the value out of it in some cases?

 

But if it was 50 pouches per character, it would suddenly be that a person who plays 1 character and a person who plays 7 characters get 100% master pack benefits. You are not up to 700% the benefit of another person just because it is an all-char bonus. It just means you don't drop below 100% compared to single character people.

 

This means for NcSoft that giving an account wide pack bonus encourage playing more characters which equal more months, paying more premium and buying more cash shop items. It is pure profit to just expand the items account wide. It is dumb to stare themselves blind on the assumption that people would go buy potions in cash shop on day 1 to build their own master pack manually if they are not given it. NcSofts goal should be to make as many people as possible make 7 characters. If handing out a few freebies help reaching that goal, it will be all worth it in the long run.

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I'm still thinking NCsoft expects the western release to sink down a hellish hole and so they are trying to get the most money they can out of the white knights before they have to pull the cord. Quite a few of their decisions don't make much sense for a game expected to stay around for a long while.

 

Hope that's not the case, but you know...not much reason to hope that until they actually change something.

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TSLlolz   

Well, since there is still no change/official word on this, and neither on the costume prices, I'm gonna go ahead and refund my founders pack. I don't find it acceptable that we only get the Masters rewards on ONE character, and yes I mean both the costumes, skins, and the dragon pouches. Keys and vouchers are understandable, but say what you may, in my opinion the costumes and dragon pouches should be on all new characters, untradable ofc.

 

 

I'm still thinking NCsoft expects the western release to sink down a hellish hole and so they are trying to get the most money they can out of the white knights before they have to pull the cord. Quite a few of their decisions don't make much sense for a game expected to stay around for a long while.

 

Hope that's not the case, but you know...not much reason to hope that until they actually change something.

Yeah I too have been feeling this. Hope we're wrong tho

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Naunet   

Cheers to you, TSLlolz, for sticking to principles.

 

Again y'all, if you want NCSoft to change their mind, requesting a refund is the only clear way to force their hand.

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The problem is that people are thinking linearly. 1 costume is clearly worth 10 dollars, so if a person got 1000 costumes, they should pay 10 000 dollars. Ignore the fact nobody would use 1000 costumes, you should pay for the imaginary value.

 

Do a person who have 5 characters play 5 times as many hours per day as others? No, they divide the time up so each character is played less. So a person getting 50 dragon pouches get 100% use from them if they play one character. A person who get 50 dragon pouches on one character but play 2, get 50% out of them. A person who plays 7 characters get 18% out of it. Why are these people paying the same master pack fee if they get as little as 20% the value out of it in some cases?

 

But if it was 50 pouches per character, it would suddenly be that a person who plays 1 character and a person who plays 7 characters get 100% master pack benefits. You are not up to 700% the benefit of another person just because it is an all-char bonus. It just means you don't drop below 100% compared to single character people.

 

This means for NcSoft that giving an account wide pack bonus encourage playing more characters which equal more months, paying more premium and buying more cash shop items. It is pure profit to just expand the items account wide. It is dumb to stare themselves blind on the assumption that people would go buy potions in cash shop on day 1 to build their own master pack manually if they are not given it. NcSofts goal should be to make as many people as possible make 7 characters. If handing out a few freebies help reaching that goal, it will be all worth it in the long run.

 

Playing 7 characters is a matter of choice, nobody force you to do it, so complaining about how you get 18% benefit from the pack when you choose to play 7 characters yourself is rather ridiculous. You should might as well request for 9 since we will be getting WL and Qi Master later after launch. The Master Pack is already giving out way too much, it's worth more than its original value of 125$. That 90$ 7200 Ncoins and 3 months premium membership alone is already more than 125$. Anything else is just extras. 

 

Your comparison of how a person playing 1 char getting 100% benefit from it better than a person playing 7 chars getting 18% benefit out of it is a false comparison. Nobody. Nobody forces you or asked you to play 7 characters. It is your choice. So you rather accept the fact that it is because of your preference to play 7 chars to get 18% benefit from the pack or invest more in it. This is not NCsoft's fault.

 

People might be thinking linearly, but the problem is that you are thinking greedily. Well, I can't blame people for being greedy. Once they have already more than enough, they will start to ask for more. It's never enough.

 

Ah the "I don't care about anything and it doesn't bother me defense." Well with that argument we must all be wrong pack up the thread boys this guys opinion has decided for us.

 

Seriously though you and a few before you came all this way to post nothing constructive to the topic other than "No big deal". Maybe it wouldn't be 34 pages had people only posted if they wished to contribute to the topic

 

You didn't use the potions, you didn't use the hammers, you didn't care for the costumes. You just argued for not buying a founders pack at all as it makes no difference. 

 

Me personally I believe for some the masters pack is of great value its easily worth the money. But for those who buy founders packs for the convenience items they will be in for disappointment we were misled by every previous founder program not nickle diming their founders.

 

The per dollar value has been broken down if a set "bang for buck" value is all you care about its worth the buy. But if you were expecting the bag space and convenience items on every character get a refund.

 

If it were me I would make the convenience items weapon skins and bag slots per character and please everyone and sell more packs instead of getting greedy and nickle diming founders. Theres no short supply of unlimited digital items and account flags the assumption is people will make alt characters and buy bag space and the like but I believe it only lost them money.

It's funny how you blame NCsoft for being greedy when they give you already much benefit from the pack for more than what it is worth. Yes, NCsoft might be greedy and money cash grabber sometime but it is to keep this game running for everyone to play. But do me a favor and don't exclude yourself from the list of greedy people who want more than what is already enough given. 

 

Well, since there is still no change/official word on this, and neither on the costume prices, I'm gonna go ahead and refund my founders pack. I don't find it acceptable that we only get the Masters rewards on ONE character, and yes I mean both the costumes, skins, and the dragon pouches. Keys and vouchers are understandable, but say what you may, in my opinion the costumes and dragon pouches should be on all new characters, untradable ofc.

 

 

 

 

That's good to hear.

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Shekinah   

I would like the founder weapon skin to not be a consumable item. The reason is that by knowing that it gets consumed I don't reall feel like using it in the first place. Those founder costumes and weapon skins are there to show everyone: "Look here. I am here since the beginning." Be honest, NCSOFT and we all know it's there to boast around others.

The costume can be equipped and unequipped however I like and thus can be used as long as this game exists. But that doesn't apply to the weapon skin. If I find a weapon skin that I like more I am doomed to destroy my founders skin. That's quite the punishment as for every other weapon skin I can go and farm/buy the formerly skin if I want it to revert. But with the founder weapon skin it's like: "You want it back? Nope, no chance. Why did you even use it before knowing all weapon skins existing?"

 

I am totally fine with the account bound but tradable costumes, the one-use dragon pouches and everything else. Please, I know the release is in just one month but please make the weapon skin not consumed in the process.

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Playing 7 characters is a matter of choice, nobody force you to do it, so complaining about how you get 18% benefit from the pack when you choose to play 7 characters yourself is rather ridiculous. You should might as well request for 9 since we will be getting WL and Qi Master later after launch. The Master Pack is already giving out way too much, it's worth more than its original value of 125$. That 90$ 7200 Ncoins and 3 months premium membership alone is already more than 125$. Anything else is just extras. 

 

Your comparison of how a person playing 1 char getting 100% benefit from it better than a person playing 7 chars getting 18% benefit out of it is a false comparison. Nobody. Nobody forces you or asked you to play 7 characters. It is your choice. So you rather accept the fact that it is because of your preference to play 7 chars to get 18% benefit from the pack or invest more in it. This is not NCsoft's fault.

 

People might be thinking linearly, but the problem is that you are thinking greedily. Well, I can't blame people for being greedy. Once they have already more than enough, they will start to ask for more. It's never enough.

 

Did you miss the whole point? The more characters made, the more moments do someone need to buy from the cash shop. It is in NcSofts own interest to encourage playing many characters to max the need of cash shop purchases. It also means people stick around for up to 7 times as long time, keeping the servers alive and interesting. It is very much optional, but if we choose 1 character, the best option for current master pack, it means the minimum profits for NcSoft in the long run.

 

The benefit calculates are true, but you don't have to read it in a dollars. You can view it as customer satisfaction and enjoyment. Do you want your customers to be 20% happy or 100% happy? And I don't think it counts as greedy if you want to enjoy the game fully. (Although it literally costs money to have more than 2 classes in this game)

 

Personally I would be playing 3-4 characters with the master pack as it is. If it was all character bonus, I would be playing 7. That is roughly double the spending we are talking here based on something as simple as the conent in the founders packs. It is NcSofts own decision now if they want to earn x2 for all future, or stick with x1 money from me. It will be too late to change their minds later if they didn't like getting 100% profits instead of 200%. For my own wallet, I actually hope NcSoft are greedy and poor at management so they keep the founders as it is. I want to save money by not being fooled to spend more. I just have this nasty habit of giving out free economic advice.

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Zackary   

Make them character bound, I don't care. However what I do want, since I paid a premium, is to have every one of my character get the special items upon creation. Say I try out a class I don't like and I already used my items, I want to be able to delete that character, and create a new one.

 

I want my founder pack items on that new character. I don't want to muck around with expensive(early game expensive) mailing fees and restrictions, I don't want to worry about bound weapon skins, I don't want to worry about ANYTHING. I just want the exclusive items I paid for to show up on the new character and get into the game. Many other games have this working without any problems.

 

Is this too much to ask? It would make everyone happy. Is there some kind of issue with doing it like this?

this would be greatly appreciated. I payed for master tier...almost 200 bucks for a free to play game. I want my shit, and i want it on every character i make. 

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If it were me I would make the convenience items weapon skins and bag slots per character and please everyone and sell more packs instead of getting greedy and nickle diming founders. Theres no short supply of unlimited digital items and account flags the assumption is people will make alt characters and buy bag space and the like but I believe it only lost them money.

 

There are people who were put off enough to not buy the packs due to these restrictions and even those who have refunded/still considering it. Offsetting this under the presumption that people who bought packs will make alts thus buying more character bound items is rather shady considering they are the ones willing to support the game to begin with. It's almost as if they see these fans as sheeple ready for fleecing.

 

If they were to give them to each char it costs them nothing, they will lose a potential profit from the % of those who bought a pack and buy items for multiple chars; but will that be enough to recoup loss of initial sales/refunds?

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Sounds like people who don't own a founder's pack are saying that giving more is unfair/unnecessary, while those who got the most expensive option want to see more for their buck. I think there was a calculation done on how much the pack is actually worth (estimated and based on Taiwan server prices I think).

 

In my opinion it does make sense to see more than one set of beneficial stuff. Maybe have it so we can 'retrieve' it from the mailbox for each new character we make but limited to maybe a certain amount (so we can't exploit it). Would be nice to see at least two characters have the benefits of master pack. For those buying masters pack, it's apparent they will get two characters at the start when they reserve a name. Why not at least give it to the number of names reserved. I think it would be fair that Disciple Pack owners get one set of goodies for their one name reservation (or two if you count the double regions), and Master Pack owners get two set of goodies for their name reservation.

 

I mean honestly it would be awesome if NCSoft offers an account-wide bonus, but it's unlikely if they haven't said a single word on a thread that has over 35+ pages worth of discussion lol. Premium levels are nice and all, but even those are kind of lame to be honest. Would be cool if they offered more aesthetic upgrades per premium tier so people are rewarded for higher tier upgrades. Can only say that the windwalk animation was worth it and you can get that with premium level 1 lol.

 

P.S. - Who was the one that decided the ugly founders costume? It's so ugly I kind of want them to just give me a costume voucher of my choice lol... I almost feel like they gave the founders pack the worst skin that no one ever bought on other servers.

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bug   

Glad to see this thread's still alive. I really hope that NCWest recognizes how many people really want this change and does something about it.

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Zackary   

Are costumes one-time use, or are they account-bound?


Both the Quick Draw and the Transendence costumes are account-bound, meaning you can share the costumes between characters on the same account via the in-game mail. You can send the item to other characters on that account, but you cannot trade or mail the item to other players.


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bug   

 

Are costumes one-time use, or are they account-bound?

Both the Quick Draw and the Transendence costumes are account-bound, meaning you can share the costumes between characters on the same account via the in-game mail. You can send the item to other characters on that account, but you cannot trade or mail the item to other players.

 

Costumes are account bound but require paid ingame mail to send them from character to character. Also if you lose them once you lose them forever.

 

Titles are one time use, pouches are one time use, weapon skin is one time use, all the other items too.

 

I just wish new characters would automatically get the costumes/titles/weaponskins and make the dragon pouches account bound.

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