[Is the game dying?]

Hello for those who are interested in about weather the game is dying in a very slow way i made a new theat asking players if they would start the game once again from the scratch.

 

Most of the replies i had was that almost everyone would totally not, beside one single guy who said that he found the game enjoyable in finding friends, which i have to admit is very nice becouse is hard to meet non toxic players in this game. In my opinion a game can be cosidered dead once it stop welcoming new players and it survive in giving stuff for real money ( the biggest example being trove which was gently explained in the post above). If you guys can give a serius replay and not flaming each other it would be helpful to understand this situation more. About this thread becoming toxic bewtween users i have to admit that it happened i my self think that i was a littel bit nervouse while talking to the user called HateME because he was continuously saying that the game have no problems in terms of player but the discussion itself diden't get personal maybe a few other users felt more offended and replay in a more drastic way. I really have to admit that this thread diden't brought up how to solve this issues but at leasi i understand more this situation, it was very helpful for me and i want to thank you guys(every singe one of you) for replaying.

[Is the game dying?]

8 minutes ago, SalemK said:

I think the post title is a little misleading. From reading the replies in this thread, it doesn't seem to be about whether or not the game is dying but more so how the decisions that ncsoft makes affects the longevity of bns... That's probably why you're receiving replies like the game isn't dying because people usually respond to the post title without reading the content.

Is not that misleading because this decisions really affect the game population which implies a game to bleed(die) but i edited times ago the main topic in order to give an explanation to new users. After trying to explain the real reason behind that word "dying" some people diden't quite catch that so was better to say it in the first place( section: Edited later). ty anyway for the reply.

[Is the game dying?]

4 minutes ago, Manowarr said:

so stop bullshitting me   the only difference maybe is that i have true cosmic soul which wont cost 500$ , and yeah i do play on 6 characters +  6-7 hours a day . f2p players are right about their complain and us veterans  who support ncsoft needs to stop to lie to them and say the game is f2p and u can catch up , cause they can't simple as that ...

 

by the way u triggered me when u lied about your friend , don't do that and say always the truth  , no need to defend ncsoft at all 

TY Manowarr is nice to see at least someone wants to take actions.

[Is the game dying?]

27 minutes ago, HateMe said:

you have no idea what you are actually talking about.....

compared to 1-1,5 years ago now its sooo much easier to get materials and to upgrade than it was before. The price ration from gold to ncoin was much much higher so buying gold was very expensive. Lag and FPS issues are something else. not to mewntion 90% of lag issues is your own ISP, as for fps, its a big part of what CPU oyu have and most people have bad ones so its only naturally they will esperience fps loss.

 

I am not saying the games has no problems because its far from the truth, what i am saying is people overdramatize things so much that its beginning to be pathetic.

I actually have one friend who started playing i believe it was what....4-6 months ago and he is not at aransu 5 with maxed accessories and Hongmoon heart. He just needs to upgrade his soul more and he has not spent a dime on the game asside the monthly premium fee. You can easily upgrade and catch up, as you can farm everything you need in-game, it will just be a bit more time consuming. And if you do that the only gold you will need is for the upgrade costs as you will have everything else from farming.

I want to apologize if i have hurt you in any way maybe sometimes i don't fully express my self in the right way but all i wanted to say is getting harder appeling to new players and is getting closed to the same playerbase. Going like this in my opinion is not either healthy for the players either for NCSOFT, hoping that they will realise it soon and will take actions. In my personal experience this game gave me more disappoints, maybe newest patch they make some changes that i like but we have to admit that this game is not so perfect. I have a high-mid gear PC and i spent quite a lot and we have to say that is really bad optimazied even with a nice processor you won't have a satble fps. About the accusation i made on defending NCSOFT i edited that in the main topic now you can see and it wasn't personally but in general. I guess i will take a long pause of the game from now on waitng for a new patch maybe it will be batter. By the way me too i get aransu 3 without spending money besides my premium subscrition but is how u said ,time cosuming i have no possiblity to farm more even if i want to and i'm miles way from even having the least requirments for TT.

[Is the game dying?]

9 minutes ago, Junamaki said:

Why start discussions like this and then when someone doesn't agree with your opinion you say they're defending NCsoft or white knighting. No one here is saying NC is perfect and that they make good decisions, I agree with half if not all of the points you mentioned about them.

 

I just don't agree with the part about the game dying because I always see full channels in a lot of areas on my server, I never had a problem finding groups for dungeons, faction chat is always active, and I've visited the starter zones a few times and see a couple new players running around during the day.

 

Obviously your experience is different from mine or otherwise you wouldn't have made the topic but just because some don't agree doesn't automatically mean we're defending NC. 

Maybe i was a littel upset abut that simple answare "the game is not dying." and about defending NCSoft was not a simply affermation about this unsatisfactory answers from that users but a general tought about people arguing in other topics like one i was reading was "Do you want to remove all the F2P?" where people defending NCSOFT for last patches when they nerfed the gold. I totally said that the game is clearly years ayway from dying but the game now is closed to the same playerbase, if new players don't come is pretty simple to deduce that in a near future even that playerbase will leave and the game will slowly die. New players need to face bad game optimization, bad servers, maintence delays and not have the posibility to have a decent gear withot sell a kidney, and u guys come to me to say that the game is not dying, dying is a long term problem that will not seem obvious right now but going like this u will clearly see the changes coming.

[Is the game dying?]

57 minutes ago, HateMe said:

i actually know at least 6 players who are free to play and are currently at aransu stage 6, with maxed out BT accessories, bracelet, tiget soul, legendary mystic and soul badge.

And they did not spend  money on this game. well one of them bought 10 rng boxes, but still...everything else they acomplished themselves, by participating in events, taking part in clan runs and runs with friends. So it is possible and perfectly doable. When they need help they ask for it and people gladly help. If you behave like a jerk no one will help you.

Getting through aransu 6 is a pretty laborius work and require a high ammount of gold and materials, so i can deduce that those players are playing for more than 1.5/2 year. Times ago was not that hard beeing an free to play, the exchange rate were higher so trove keys and boxes was really cheap to buy through gold. By free to play I'm referring to those players that are new and haven't spent money yet and don't want to, they have no possibillity of getting at least a smooth start and the game itself is not worh playing for lag and fps issues so nowadays no one will consider giving a chance at this game. I really don't understand why u keep deny the presence of problems in this game, maybe u made this persona "HateMe" and want to disagree with anyone, i don't know but denying the fact there are no problems means that the company will not cosinder our opinions and bad desicions are made. If the company don't care about the game and even the players don't care then who is supposed to care? Giving that exaples and justify the game by telling is a korean mmo will not help neither the players neither the company, at least try to use youre brain and make ideas about improving the game istead of justify everything and not taking a side. Even if you suggest bad ideas who cares at least u try to improve this game that we all here i guess we love and play.

[Is the game dying?]

11 minutes ago, Ren36 said:

Depends on the point of view - compared to other games this game still has a moderate population, though we can probably expect another server merge in the coming future, at least for EU.
If we talk about open world PVE, then yes this aspect is dead. World bosses are a thing of the past, they even took out Black Wyrm.
Open world pvp? - Yes this too, the game can´t handle these kinds of large scale battles with the current engine and 1 shot game-system
=> even if both players have the same gear, it fails on the ping or balance of both classes

6v6? - More than dead, it doesn´t exist for the vast majority of gamers. Be it Arena-players, who are only interested in PVP, but are capped behind gear that is only available through PVE or players, who can´t catch up, even through intensive PVE sessions up to 6-9 hours a day, unless they invest cash into this game.
PVP? - Though it is gear equalized, it fails on the class balance, since the beginning of this game and the release of some classes it remained rigid, with summoner being the bottom class from the beginning to the end.

PVE? - Though 1,1k AP is not needed for alot of dungeons, the urge to clear dungeons and kill bosses without regard to mechanics still remains. Being trapped in a run and wasting time, due to the vast gap between many players and fast paces patches, turned this game into a race
Raid? - Capped behind gold, gear, ping, class balance, dps & class compositions(12 Members: 2 WL, 2 BB, 2 Gunner(reset/high dps class), 1 Tank, 2 6s PT iframes, 2 Healing classes(SF/SUM), 1 w/e

 

Thanks for the replay, i said that the game is years appart form dying and it still has a nice ammount of population but is inevitable that the population will decrease eventually if NCSOFT will continue to disappoint us with bad organization and nerfing free to play players. The point of the topic is to cooparate with people to solve this issue but the response of the players totally upset me. I'm really glad to see at least one person give his opinions on the topic and not simply say "This game is not dying, u fool".

[Is the game dying?]

48 minutes ago, SilverFoxR said:

Try going to Celestial Basin and attempt to change channels at any given time. Normally, you'll be unable to, because almost 90% of the channels are full. If you want to do the CB events, you pretty much need to be staked out at the location ahead of time or watch the event boss die in about 1 minute to the mob of people there. And lord help you if you want to find another channel with a still-living boss. Before you can say "any alive?" they've been wiped out.

 

You tell me the game's dead... like I haven't heard that before... from every online game I've ever checked out. Hey guys, my guild in WoW lost 3 members... is the game dying? No. The game is not dying. Maybe your clan's dying... but the game is still going. It's not a "defense" - it's the same response to the same knee-jerk reaction I've heard countless times.

 

So, to the person who asked this question this week... and the week before... and to the ones who'll inevitably ask next week, the game is not dying anytime soon. If you're so scared of it happening, go jump off to another online game that will be "dead" in a week by your definitions, only to prophet that game's doom and jump to the next. And so-on.

I'm not telling you that the is dead, i'm telling you that the game is dying (slowly losing population after the year). The Celestial Basin example is pretty stupid due to many players compete for the world bosses and let's be real here the bosses has a low ammount of hp so it need maybe a few people end game to clear it relatively fast. The point of the all topic was not arguing about if the game is dead or not, but to solve this issues is decreasing the population of the game. It seems like u weren't been following previus conversation with other players and u were not aware in what i really meant by "the game is dying?"

[Is the game dying?]

41 minutes ago, HateMe said:

In all honesty....there really is no problem. This is a korean mmo, its mean to be grindy, that means you should farm your materials and use it to progress. Let me give you an example: players complain about moonstone crystals, i myself used up all  i had to upgrade my weapon, and after a week, by just doing my normal dailies and farming basin for 1-2h a day i am at 250+ moonstone crystals again. I farm ST because it gives me elysian orbs very often. I do 6v6, and quite often there arent even many whales there so you can actually win, then again i do have low tier pvp gear so i am not a complete liability to people and that gets me 50+ moonstones per 2-3 days.

 

the gold nerf on weeklies isnt even that significant, since you can easily make that gold back with approx 5-10 ST runs.

Is not about the grid stuff, this game has clearly some issues when it come to organization and not supporting free to play players. You once again deny the problem itself. And the gold nerf was not only on weeklyes i was talking about the gold nerf over this 4/3 patches. For a new player he will not be able to do ST at least for really long perdiod of time, ST is the newest dungeon and many lobbies has extremlt high requirments, even with 1100 ap depend really on the mood of the lobby's leader or if they want to make their own lobbies if thier gear is not good enough no one will enter. Grinding in this game once u are end game is pretty easy but not for new players.

[Is the game dying?]

48 minutes ago, HateMe said:

They could have quit for multiple reasons.  I see daily actually new players joining, even joining my clan. so as many as them leave, new ones come to play.

Truth be told this game does not have a real end game, so most players take a break once they achieved what they wanted and then come back once a new patch hits. Its always been like this. People dont do HH, DD or RT simply because there are easier and faster alternatives for dailies, and those 3 dungeons are simply not rewarding. Thats why people spam ST because it is currently one of the best profitable dungeons. I myslef rather do Basin daily (thats 1) Mushin20 / Outlaw island (thats 2) and say shattered masts / TOI (thats 3) and tada dailies done without going through the F8 lobby cancer. Does that mean the game is dying because people choose to complete dailies differently? No.

 

Servers are still crowded, more than enough lobbies in F8....multiple channels inc ertain areas also prove there are a ton of players here still so this game is not dying. so many people shout "oh ima quit because blablabla" and then long behold they are still there playing. Just cause someone says something , especially in faction chat you should never believe it since that chat is 99% full of crap.

No one is defending ncsoft here however people that actually are objective, acknowledge the fact they asside for some bad decisions, they actually made a lot of good changes going forward.

 

You can say the game is bleeding / dying the moment we wont be getting any new content, as for now i would say this game is still one of the most populated and active ones.

Maybe i was expresing my self in a wrong way, by the title "Is the game dying?" was a littel eye catchy so i tought to use it, what i was trying to say with my topic is that due to new patches with this nerfs on gold we can all agree, hopefully, that the game is not appealing anymore to new players. The game is really far away from shutting off and it can take several years, but with all this disappointments from the NCSOFT is inevitable that in a long period of time, can take years too, the game will constantly decrease in population. The purpose of the topic is not to encourage people to leave but instead is to cooparate to try solving this problems that is killing (bleeding) the game, that's the reason i get mad at people who claims there's no problem because going like this the game will have no future. We need to help improving the game since the company itself don't try to agree with us unless they can get more money out of it.

[Is the game dying?]

2 minutes ago, Granger said:

Dying? I dont think so, but its definitively bleeding.

Yeah, bleeding is a more suitable word for this situation. Thanks.

[Is the game dying?]

1 hour ago, Junamaki said:

A decline in population doesn't equal the game is dying to me. People say this about every game that it is dying.

A costant decline in population is equal to a game to die, by the "game is dying" is just a pretext to say that due to recent updates is become really hard for a new players to come. If new players won't come that mean the playerbase will be the same till even them will leave the game. I know that the game will be aliave for still a few years but after no one knows what will happend.

[Is the game dying?]

8 minutes ago, Crickateer said:

I dont see anyone directly defending their actions in this topic. In fact they'd probably agree with you that a lot of the changes are just downright dumb (e.g. naksun moonstone bundle drop rate nerf that they still deny even though theres pretty much clear evidence of it at this point). What they are denying is that the game is dying. Sure the population isn't what it was like near launch but look at ANY game at launch. It gets a massive population burst at first then it dwindles and stabilizes like what has happened with this game. With how they have been releasing new content like dungeons and raids I doubt it will die anytime soon. However...they seriously do need to look at their server and optimization issues..TT near impossible with the lag atm

By defending NCSOFT actions I meant that they deny the fact that the population is decreasing. It may not seems at the first look but by scrolling through forum/redit/ faction chat people is really leaving the game that make me sad. I know they still relese content and it will take several years to shut the game but by the "game is dying" i meant the long term problems is cousing new and old players to leave. I was scrolling to other forum's topics about the recent nerfs and it seems that many expireced players doesn't realise yet how much of a big deal is it. This game game tend to support only expireced players (whales) and either the players and company tend to not care about. Don't get me wrong but i love this game and in my opinion if new players won't come that could be the end of it.

[Is the game dying?]

19 minutes ago, HateMe said:

This game is far from dead. Plus it summer, people take vacation, plus some are waiting for a new patch , but no point asking if the game is dying because its not. Wasnt dying 2 years ago, isnt dying now.,

 

44 minutes ago, SilverFoxR said:

This question is pretty much asked at least once a week. The game isn't "dying".

Yeah maybe this game is not dying that explain why my guild which had 98 players melted to half because people were raging on the game, maybe that's the reason every low level character i see it has legendary triangle gems, maybe that's the reason some times in high tier dungeons like HH DD RT when are not dailyes challage only a really few people do, i guess people talking in faction and forum about leaving the game is just a pure joke, no? I don't understand why people still try to defend NCSOFT for this nerfing and bad organization when this game at this point has no future, this game is clerly dying i can the diferenze in population from 2 years ago to now. People just don't want to face reality now

[Is the game dying?]

Disclaimer (The purpose of the topic is not to encourage people to leave but instead is to cooparate to try solving this problems)

Hello guys recently scrolling through the forum, asking friends, guild mates even fuction chat i came to realise that this game is slowly losing players. We have to admit that every single patch this game is going even more pay to win than was actually used to be. Years ago this game was in top charts on bests mmo, this game has a quite interesting main story the combat is really well made and the graphics is still gorgeous but this game is ruined but this hard policy on nerfing free to players every patch. But why people leave this game, there's some reasons:

1) every single wednesday the maintenance take to long and has even delays, is hard to believe that NCSOFT is a big company with others massive mmo like Aion and they take can even more than 8 hours for a simple maintenance, don't get me wrong i'm not an expert but i don't know how others massive games with bigger population can do a maintenance in 30 min max 1 hour and this game which is made in multiple instaces, not even a huge open world, take hours.

2) the servers are pretty bad, i have a good internet connection with 11 ping on other games but this game on my internet have a stable 100-120 ms, i know that is pretty smooth but sometimes it can get on 150-170ms and after every single maintenance the ping is 200ms+, wednesdays are quite unplayable.

3) This game is poorly optimized and i know that's the problem with all bns aroud the world and they are trying to upgrade the graphics, but if u add this problem with the servers problem and nerfs i don't even understand why i'm still playing this game.

4) The free to play option died, imagine yourself just starting the game and u almost finished the main story, with that gear of 950-1000 ap u can't do many dungeons all u can do is EC DT NF and NS if u find a carry run, this is about 20/25 gold so you're daily incame could be around 30-40g, as a new player aiming for the 1100 ap for not getting kicked out of dungeons how are you supposed to do without selling your kidney and buy some trove keys. That's the main resons there are no more new people, and this mean the game is dying.

5) Whales leave the game too, even whales without using the credit card again upgrading high end gear can take a long period of time and sometimes upgrading stuff is not worth it, for exaple take the VT necklaces, they need 4 premium stones every upgrade and once is maxed the gain in dps is so worthless.

 

Edited later:

Maybe i was expresing my self in a wrong way, by the title "Is the game dying?" was a littel eye catchy so i tought to use it, what i was trying to say with my topic is that due to new patches with this nerfs on gold we can all agree, hopefully, that the game is not appealing anymore to new players. The game is really far away from shutting off and it can take several years, but with all this disappointments from the NCSOFT is inevitable that in a long period of time, can take years too, the game will constantly decrease in population. The purpose of the topic is not to encourage people to leave but instead is to cooparate to try solving this problems that is killing (bleeding) the game, that's the reason i get mad at people who claims there's no problem because going like this the game will have no future. We need to help improving the game since the company itself don't try to agree with us unless they can get more money out of it.

 

Guys if u have to say that the game is not dying at least try to use elebarote arguments to justify that opinion, non use simple examples like Celestial Basin has so many channel or is a korean mmo so the game supposed to be like that. In my opinion this game is really bleeding (nice word writed by a fellow player down here) and will still lose population at a costant rate if we are not stop this hemorrhage with good ideas or the company make a miracle patch, we need to stop this bleeding and not let the game die by blood(players) loss. One explanation for those who don't read the entire conversation, by "dying" i mean the long term problems not that the game now has a littel population but an hypothetical universe where no mesure is taking to cover the loss and since new players won't come is easy to deduce that even old playerbase some time soon or later will eventually leave.

 

About me accusing players below of defending NCSoft was not a simply affermation about this unsatisfactory answers from that users but a general tought about people arguing in other topics like one i was reading was "Do you want to remove all the F2P?" where people defending NCSOFT for last patches when they nerfed the gold