• Content count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

Posts posted by PatchKid

  1. On 4/1/2016 at 11:07 PM, Sokucu said:

    Better disable jump from arena.It adds nothing but more desync.

    This is a dumb idea because jump is used for more than desync.  For example, it's used for kiting movement for skilled players.  Run forward facing away from your opponent, jump turn and attack, turn back continue forward momentum.  It is much faster movement than back-peddling like a nub.  Secondly, it has defensive value for opponents that land attacks at your back (like assassins).  Jump and spin 180 allows you to defend your back since the game still sees you facing the direction you started when you jumped, which means you can use *skill* to defend yourself in very specific situations.


    Unfortunately, BNS doesn't support 3D hitboxes, and your attacks are designed to hit targets attached to the ground.  I don't think this is an issue they can fix without a major overhaul to hitbox mechanics.

  2. Strongly disagree with using elbow strike instead of counter.  Main reason - can't use it while the assassin is in stealth ( and that's the main time you want to use counter vs a sin ).


    OP here are some tips to help you stand a fighting chance:


    1. Take Ice Guard.


    There are many ways to use Ice Guard vs an Assassin.  For starters, it knocks them out of stealth.  You can totally change the pace of the fight.  Many assassins like to charge at you, jump, and pop into stealth at the beginning of the fight.  I love to Ice Guard right after they do that.  They will often SS to remove the root, putting them against the wall, chase with C, they will F, then use comet strike daze and make sure you land X (searing blow).


    2. X should be specc'd for CC, not PvE damage


    After you hit them with X, they will probably flashbomb escape because at this point you've put them in a precarious position.  If they don't, use Z and continue to 3RF them.  They will eventually escape because you're stun-locking them at this point.  If they do escape, X will knock them down while they're in stealth, and knock them out of stealth.


    3. 180 degree Counter.  You want normal counter.  I prefer the far right tree because it gives you immunity to the next attack / CC for a short time after successfully countering.  The trick here is when the assassin is in stealth, they will try to Shiruken you.  If you counter it, you can avoid being stunned from their stealth leap-to-the-back attack.  If you don't counter it, then you need to start doing 180 counters.  This is Jump, Turn 180 in the air, Hit Counter before you land.  What this does is causes their leap-to-the-back stun to be countered, and you will often (50% of the time) knock them out of stealth.


    Decide if you have a blue buff assassin or a Lotus escape.  For blue buff, try to draw tab and stun lock.  For Lotus escape, you'll want to try to wear them out and use your meteor slam with air combos to draw the fight out.  The more often you can delay them the better because they will escape stun lock much easier.


    Never charge an assassin!!!  They will wood block counter you (putting them into stealth).  Unless you're using flying slam or flurry (C), you want to watch for their counter to end before charging them.

  3. OP - I think you're stuck in the 100-0 playstyle...  This is probably not the best strategy vs a Sin.  Fight a Sin more by being technical.  Use your air combos, meteor slam, and draw the fight out longer.  The longer you keep them out of stealth and wasting their escapes on things like ground&pound, the better.  Sins rely heavily on timing their combos.  Any interruption to that timing will work wonders.  Whittle them down piece by piece and remember to use counter while they're in stealth.


    Also, be sure to use the jump + 180 degree turn + counter tactic after they use their shiruken.  This gives you a high % chance to block their daze from stealth when they hit you in the back and can knock them out of stealth completely throwing off their timing.

  4. 3 hours ago, Ra9eQuit said:

    As someone who reached Gold easily with every class (last preseason against no bots, so I dont get shit for that) under LvL 30, some even under Lvl 20, I can only say that skill beats Level every time until Platinum rank. But I researched and extreme high amount of information about the game, so I dont suggest you to do it unless you want to spend around 100 hours of only studying. Summoners have the strongest Low Level, Destroyers the strongest Mid Level, and at Max Level everyone is good. 

    I don't disagree with the premise, but a couple classes (KFM and BM) don't have access to some of the most crucial abilities they need until near 45 (or at 45?).  There definitely are a few classes that are gated for arena due to skill access (not necessarily skill points) until they hit 45.  And BM really shines after it gains the level 50 HM skill, if I remember correctly.

  5. You can't disable jumping in the arena, it serves an incredibly valuable SKILL BASED purpose.


    Jumping to create "de-sync" is something of an exploit (in that you're exploiting a bad game design function), but that's not the value to jumping.


    All the people saying jumping serves no purpose really need to "git gud".  Jumping serves many many purposes.


    1. For ranged DPS classes it allows them to kite and gain distance by jumping, turning, and landing abilities while in mid-air.  You retain your forward momentum, but can still land attacks while moving.


    2. For melee classes it allows them to use defensive abilities against opponents that strike from behind while gaining distance to use specific abilities, or just in general.


    (there are many more reasons to use jumping in PvP, but they are more class-specific niche reasons and these two are more general)


    Example - KFM countering an assassin in stealth.  Face the assassin, jump turn 180 degrees, press counter, and repeat - this tactic allows you to counter their teleport / daze-from-stealth skill that hits the back of the opponent.


    There's dozens more examples of where jumping combined with proper skill timing is essential in top-tier PvP.  Should the de-sync abuse continue?  Maybe not, but disabling jumping is not the solution.  Fixing the lag and removing the targeting restrictions is the better fix to that issue.

  6. While the agility buff is super strong in PvP, it's pretty easy for just about any class to avoid giving free agility to KFM.  Just stop attacking them for 1 second after they dodge E/Q and then they have a long CD (like 15 seconds?) of waiting for the ability to E/Q again and you won't give them agility.


    Of course, if you're a summoner or a spinning maniac, then you have to be really fast to stop stacking agility, but most other class can just pause for 1 second to avoid stacking agility buffs and giving them 6s of evasion.


    Sort of like how everyone tells people to just wait .5 seconds after dest/LBD spinning to avoid getting deflected.  The main difference is that a PvP KFM is going to need you to swing at them after an E/Q so they can land a stun, and then they can hurt you...  KFM damage is pretty sad when the target is not stunned or dazed (at least in PvP).

  7. I disagree about increasing the CD.  The duration should be decreased.  Scroll through the CCs in the game and find another CC that locks someone down for 5 seconds and doesn't break on damage.


    Summoners only strongest CC just lasts a little too long.  3 seconds would be more appropriate.  The number of hits you could deal would be reduced, and require a lot more skill and timing to land solid damage during that time frame.

  8. 31 minutes ago, Kanosaki said:

    If they spin, SS > LB (pierces defense + knockdown, works until you reach low plat in new season), then comet punch if they roll back (if you don't know how to do tech chase, google it up).

    If they force grip you, do not use freeze unless you got stabbed by their blade or you are out of Iframe to use if he drops you later(SS/QE).

    train your timing against their spin, dont use counter/attacks on first 0.5 second of spin (you can use it after the 0.5 sec deflect timer to gain immunity to daze and stun).

    becareful when spamming counter, some lbm spec for guard break, if they guard break you, immediately spam your SS/QE button ASAP.


    I appreciate the tips.  Here's a couple quick follow-up questions:


    What is the CD of their grab + blade ability?  I find that if I freeze the first attempt, then the freeze is on CD for the second attempt, so they will eventually get to use their crazy blade attack that does around 50% of my HP.


    What's the best way to capitalize on TAB escape with a BD?  I find C to be unreliable as it too often gets deflected, and BDs don't allow you to stand next to them - plus I can't quite get timing of Triple Kick to work.  It does basically nothing.


    Also, I heard you should use Triple Kick on BDs often to disable charge skill because they have some kind of gap closing ability that is painful?  Even though they'll be immune to the stun portion (while spinning) it will prevent them from performing some important ability?


    Just now, Duniak said:

     It's mathematically impossible to get to gold in less than 9-10 matches assuming you win all. I needed 10-0 on 3 chars to get to exactly 1600. Stop lying silver scrub.

    Ok, I went 15-0 before I actually lost a match to a BD.  Stop being a scrub who can't beat bronze bots...

  10. 58 minutes ago, Kanosaki said:


    I have solid tips for kfm, the other class, just my hypothesis:

    Note: this is against summoner that uses resist hack BUT spams sun flower every 1 second.
    Note2: finish off the cat first, they won't help their cat, but looking at a bot's puss y is annoying


    Method 1: use your QE and then time your triple click to right when they gonna FIRE THEIR SUNFLOWER (this need some practice, but not hard to pull off), you will get a stun in at the right timing (only 0.5 sec vulnerability frame per sunflower), once your triple kick stun lands, do your 3rf combo WITHOUT USING DAZE CC, they will roll back and you gotta do it all again.

    Method 2: keep running in circle and counter their sunflower UNTIL they use their dandelion, they are vulnerable while it's up, triple kick it, use your STUN only 3rf combo (don't use DAZE CC).

    Use your spin/block to deflect them until they use dandelion, then use cancel defense skill no their dandelion and proceed with stun only combo.

    I will upload a video of fight against summoner if i ever meet them


    Thanks for the tips, it will help to combat hackers since I think our #1 ranked summoner right now is abusing this hack!

  11. 5 minutes ago, Emya said:


    Larger HP doesn't always translate to a win when timer expires. Had a matchup with an assassin where he's at less than 20% HP while mine is more than 50% and he still won that round where he just kept going invisible/ running away and tossing some grenade stuff.


    Not sure about total damage immunity tho... XD


    The win goes to whomever does the most damage.  If a summoner does 5% of your HP in the first 10 seconds and they are immune to all damage because of the hack that allows them to spam invisibility, if you manage to get to timer they will win simply because they did the most damage overall...

  12. These guys completely mess me up.  I've finally found ways to fight against assassins making the fight more interesting and less 1-sided.  Still not guaranteed to win, but it's more about who times their skills better - but I'm probably 1/10 wins vs LBDs at this point.


    They always guaranteed to land 20% air combo out the gate.  I've tried SS, Q/E, flying opening - whatever.  No matter what I do, they will always get the opener on me and do 20% of my HP.  After this, my strategy is basically to try and knock them on their ass as much as possible.


    Unfortunately, they have superior escape abilities allowing them to escape my knockdowns, use TAB escape to get out of a second knockdown, then go invulnerable and keep me immobilized (daze, looooong air combo, grab, then run & spin) long enough to negate any effort put forth to draw out the TAB escape and get them into a bad stunlock situation.


    On top of the above struggles, I am constantly getting dazed by their spin because the timing to land any attack in between spins seems to be shorter than the duration of their "deflect".  The fact that they can deflect + daze when I use counter is total bullshit IMO considering my counter skill is supposed to make me resist daze and stun after successfully countering.


    Final frustration is that I usually will train into the non-daze version of TAB escape because I need it for their grab.  The first grab, I can freeze out of, but the second grab they will destroy me if I don't have TAB escape trained to break grab - and that means I lose a valuable CC countering mechanic...


    So - what's the strategy here?  I don't think I can get the timing on these guys to work...

  13. 4 hours ago, 886180_1452550525 said:


    Reddit deleted my post. So here it is. Basically just run in circles and they'll miss all their sunflowers. I'm not sure if you can do it on another class but maybe it'll help out. 


    Shameless plug: Follow my strim!!


    Won't they win at the timer because the bot is immune to being attacked (fade in and out of invis + resist every attack) and you're probably going to take a smidgen of damage prior to circle straffing them?

  14. 9 minutes ago, Emya said:


    > Do summoners have some sort of innate stun resist that I should be aware of? If so, how do I get around this?

    Summs have skills that render them "invincible" for 5 hits or status effects for X seconds at the cost of their cat's HP, I think the skill is called True Friend (a certain spec of it)


    You mentioned that this was yesterday, maybe its just the ranking just reset? And you've been matched up to some summ who might have had a high ranking or lots of experience already prior the reset.


    As for the match where cat was left to die, there are some players that can gauge that he/she can kill you, especially if they figured that you'll focus on the cat alone first while summ himself is unleashing lots of damage to you. Sometimes, if summs make the cat ball-up, most often you'll divert your attention from the cat to the summoner himself (cuz you don't want it to heal)... and if he's already dishing out lots of damage near you, the cat is a small price to pay (at least if summ can take your HP down to around 10%, he can manage without a cat IMHO).




    So, I don't think you faced a real person / summoner player.  There is currently a hack in the game specifically for summoners that allows them to fade in and out of invisibility and be 100% immune to all attacks.  This hack is being used by a handful of summoner bots.  They will auto-face you, and spam 3 abilities with no CD while fading in and out of invisibility making every attack you attempt "resist".  Additionally, they will ignore their cat and let it die because it does not add to the automated routine.

  15. For the first question - that's a shiruken and you will sometimes avoid it with SS.  However - when they do hit you with it (glowing dagger in your back), do the following:


    1. Jump

    2. Turn 180 degrees while in the air

    3. Hit counter


    What the shiruken does is allow them to teleport to your back and daze you.  If you're constantly jump / spin / countering you can often counter this move and avoid being dazed.  I've been practicing this after watching a video guide on it, and it really works amazingly well.  Has changed the pace of the fight dramatically and reduces the time the assassin gets to spend in stealth.


    Secondly, do not use approach skills like the ones you've mentioned!!  Basically, the assassin is expecting you to try to close the gap between them.  They will do a wavy hand motion, which is a counter, and their counter puts them into stealth!  The only approach skills I ever use against assassins are flurry and flying slam .  Flurry will get countered for the first hit, but it will continue to follow them while they are stealthed and the second and third hits will land removing stealth and dazing them.  Flying Slam cannot be countered (as long as you have trained 2 points in the skill), and will hit them.  I assume the reason they're getting into stealth after your Flying Slam is either you're not using the variety that knocks them into the air, and you're attacking after it, or they're using a cooldown to get into stealth.


    NOTE - Most assassins will use this incredibly annoying skill to change places with you when you use Flying Slam which will stun you and allows them to get into stealth.  Though that is not 100% the case.



    To pull assassin TAB escape, I will often try to get them into the air and then use Meteor Slam.  When you get them into that position, they will frequently blow their TAB escape.  If they do not - use #4 and break their arm because it will disable their ability to counter (and prevent them from getting a stealth opportunity) for the next 6 seconds.  This gives you a good opportunity to land some solid combinations and triple kick them.


    Also, if you keep right up next to the assassins as best as possible, you can usually draw their counter.  Triple kick them when they counter and they'll frequently blow their TAB escape to get away.


    There's no guaranty you won't get wrecked by an assassin, but you can at least make the match much closer if you focus on core skills like avoiding shiruken attacks, saving your TAB for the best times, and keeping the assassin from staying in stealth the entire match.

  16. I was thinking various classes were just way too strong, but as I've been training and gaining skill in the game it's really just lag.  All the classes are playable, and all of them are competitive (for the most part, it seems).  The only time certain classes start to become "OP" is when the lag becomes significant and that particular class is just blessed to suffer less from the lag.


    Summoners are the primary example.  Their cat does not experience lag.  It continues to automatically do it's thing regardless of lag.  The healing skills are not tied to aiming abilities at opponents, which makes them incredibly easy accomplish, even when lagging.  Their counter skills actually benefit when lag is around because if you are watching for them, you sometimes don't see it appear until it's too late.  In the end, the Summoner itself is not powerful, but it suffers less in a laggy environment than other classes which rely on timing skills very accurately.


    BDs are the same.  They often benefit from lag because it can slow down timing of their opponents attacks, which ultimately leads to many more deflected attacks and many more dazed targets which are susceptible to being hit with an air combo.  This is almost a perk when the game is so often laggy.  It isn't a flaw in the class itself, but does demonstrate just how majorly latency impacts gameplay.  When you only have a small window of opportunity to land an attack while the target is spinning, and latency adjusts your reaction time just enough to miss those windows, you will find it nearly impossible to stop a BD.


    I think BM is one of those classes that suffers the most in laggy situations.  KFM is up there also.


    Oddly, I would argue that Assassins don't suffer as much in lag because (if they're good) they're controlling the pace of the fight and can chose when to strike.  Of course, when you have sin vs sin - it's going to probably end up favoring the combatant with the best latency.


    I've also noticed that my lag changes depending on opponent (not class).  I'm guessing this has to do with EU players on NA servers?  Sometimes I'll have 80ms up to maybe 120ms, and then jump into the arena with someone and it spikes and sits around 240-270ms.  When it's in the lower numbers, I can stand toe-to-toe with just about any class.  I noticed that my latency is probably higher 75% of the time when monitoring, and that's just the company's failure.  They really need to work hard to address the latency issues as priority #1.  I imagine the class complaints will continue to roll in, but they'll be far less supportable when you fix the horrendous server issues.  For me, this is a gating issue.  I don't see myself as ever being competitive because I will never have the ability to respond accurately and timely to compete at the highest level.


    When I watch my character stuttering when spamming the S key, or failing to activate Q/E when my target is visually right next to me - or when TAB activates the wrong skill because the enemy is somehow at a different distance than the distance meter is showing -- I will just about throw my mouse out the window (poor mouse, it's holding up for now)...

  17. 17 hours ago, Payway15 said:

    I was just minding my business when someone on the opposite guild that was a WAY higher level than me was 2 shotting me with shurikens. Can you please make this stop.

    Like limit it to where they can only kill you once every couple minutes



    Press 3 after you're killed.

  18. 4 minutes ago, Elfae said:

    Again, is a deflected attack a considerable successful attack?


    BD's spin deflect any damage for 0.5 second. If you hit the moment he spins, and damage bounce back to you, when that happens did you hit or miss?


    A simpler test on the definition of "on Counter" is to test the focus gain. Do you gain focus if no body hits you? And do you get focus if you hit no body, assuming you able to counter but miss the hit?


    Yes, if the attack is blocked by counter, whether the damage lands or not you still get focus and buffs.  Another good example is when a destroyer or an assassin use their iFrame attack that makes them resist everything, you can still activate counter buffs and get focus when you counter during those attacks.


    In the end, the counter is blocking the attack, reflecting damage, and if the damage doesn't land it is irrelevant.  The fact that blade dancers and destroyers can bypass the daze resistance is still very buggy.  Unfortunately this is NCSoft's forums, so there's no one that will ever read this except the players.  If there are other KFM players who have checked into this issue in the past (as I imagine it's been around for years), then maybe they have some dev feedback, but it definitely looks broken.

  19. The best tip is if they manage to stick you with a shiruken (dagger sticking out of your back blinking), do a jump + 180 turn + counter repeatedly.  You'll counter their next stun probably 40-50% of the time, and that can really throw them off.


    Also, I actually freeze the assassins that start the fight with stealth immediately.  They charge, *poof*, and I freeze them.  Totally breaks their initial momentum, and you can easily get in either a flurry or a triple kick stun to make them waste a precious flashbang escape.


    If I can get them triple kicked right out the gate, I usually just SS right away.  If they don't flashbang, then F and smite them into the air and then TAB to grapple them with meteor slam.  NOW they might flashbang, and you'll eat it, but it will draw out their TAB escape early in the fight.  If they don't, use 4 and break their arm so you they won't be able to counter for the next 6 seconds.  Then start Q/E and stun them.  The point is to force an early flashbang escape.  Yours is still ready, so when they do their next obvious stun-lock combo, you TAB, daze them, and then when they step back follow-up with FLURRY.  Don't charge into them, or use comet strike - it's going to get countered.  FLURRY will follow them and re-daze them.


    That's when you 100-0 them if you can, or do like 70% at least.

  20. 13 minutes ago, Elfae said:

    What's with you simpletons' logic?


    And do you considered a counter that couldn't hit its target a successful counter? Most of the buff require to successfully blocked or counter. So do you think a deflected attack a considerable successful attack? If not, then you would not receive the buff you were promised.


    I question your logic, so resorting to name-calling is genius.  And yes, I believe you play a blade dancer...


    Either way, the question remains.  Why does Counter inflict a Daze when you're supposed to be buffed for 2 seconds after successfully countering.  No where does it say that dealing the damage applies the buff.  Not to mention, if I Counter while a blade dancer is resistant to all attacks, I still get buffed by the Counter even though it did not damage.


    Similar to how when I counter an Assassin in stealth, it doesn't remove their stealth, but it gives me all the buffs from Countering.  In fact, if I successfully Counter an Assassin using their sneak attack, I don't get dazed or stunned!  Amazing!  Yet somehow, countering a Blade Dancer or Destroyer's spin causes me to get dazed or stunned.


    Broken?  Sounds broken.

  21. This is not a whining thread.  This is a bug inquiry.  You have no clue what you're talking about.


    1 minute ago, Elfae said:

    And you can't use your Q/E then triple kick them instead? If your counter doesn't work then figure out something that does instead of whining. KFM got plenty of tools to put spinner on the ground.


    No, I'm sorry I can't Q/E and triple kick them when they spin spam because they are immune to stun.  I especially can't Q/E them after trying to counter because 90% of the time it lands a deflect for no reason at all except that the game is bugged.  You are the one trolling a perfectly reasonable thread asking a question about why the mechanics of the game - which are clearly spelled out - do not seem to be working.


    I'm guessing you're a blade dancer and really don't like when people question how the class operates because frankly the ability to deflect into a daze passive / defensive abilities is 100% broken.  Argue with me all day long.  No one who actually reads the abilities is going to agree that it makes sense to allow Counter, Block, Parry or any other defensive skill to trigger daze.


    Especially when the ability in question makes you resist daze to begin with.


    Also, this isn't just about blade dancers.  This happens against Destroyers as well.  They're not nearly as annoying because they don't immediately get to Air Combo you for 20% of your HP after it happens, but it a deflect daze after a defensive counter - especially when the skill specifically gives you a buff to protect against being dazed - sounds like a bug.


    Now quit whining about people identifying broken mechanics in a game that definitely has a bunch of them.  You whiny whiner!

  22. 26 minutes ago, Elfae said:

    This is not a technical error. You need to read and understand your skill carefully.


    KFM counter can be considered offense skill depending on which upgrade you use. Look at the tags below the skill chart, it will list which category the skill fall in.

    The only first and left branch of KFM counter is defensive only. The rest of the 3 upgrade route are "Offense-Defense." This is why you can get deflected with you counter BD too quickly.


    To avoid deflect, wait 0.5 second after they start spinning then counter. A sure way to counter is to use your KFM Q/E which are the best dodge compared to all classes in game.


    So now hopefully you can calmly evaluate your skills before raging about it.



    Do you have a clue what you're talking about, or did you just ignorantly reply to the thread without actually reading anything...


    I'm using the first branch.


    Counters a frontal attack for 1 sec

    Deals 18 ~ 21 [1.50] damage on Counter

    Generates 3 Focus on Counter

    Increases Defense by 100% for 8 sec on Counter

    User is resistant to Stun, Daze for 2 sec on Counter

    Decreases the cooldown of Searing Palm by 1 sec on Counter


    Now, why does this ability generate a deflect when it does absolutely nothing until the swords or axe spinning into it causes it to reflect damage?  The 2 second resist to Daze should automatically kick in.


    It's extremely buggy.


    Also, how the hell is tree's 2 and 3 offensive?  The stun is REACTIVE.  Once again - it doesn't activate until you actually counter an attack.  And the 3rd tree adds threat to the counter.  Why is this so hard to grasp?


    If you're using elbow smash, that isn't counter.  It's not the same ability.  It has a new name, new icon, and it actually attacks.